Why such hostility towards PD?

  • Thread starter Thread starter brandon6i
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Everyone was expecting too much from this game.
For many reasons that probably we'll never know, there are some flaws.
But thats not a reason to blame PD.
Who ever believes that PD didnt do their best isnt thinking straight.

When this game was released, everyone was trying to find mistakes, flaws, negative things......to a koukou level.
They didnt played the game. they havent even done a lap...but they were spending their time and whats left of their brain to find mistakes in GT5.

No other game was under so much fire even before release day.
(and dont say that its cause it took 5 years to Develop.....see diablo, and lets see if it will be criticized soooo much).

There is no perfect product , or will be, especially when it will have to be criticized by 6.000.000+ users and the majority of them kids.
 
sdf
Everyone was expecting too much from this game.
For many reasons that probably we'll never know, there are some flaws.
But thats not a reason to blame PD.
Who ever believes that PD didnt do their best isnt thinking straight.

When this game was released, everyone was trying to find mistakes, flaws, negative things......to a koukou level.
They didnt played the game. they havent even done a lap...but they were spending their time and whats left of their brain to find mistakes in GT5.

No other game was under so much fire even before release day.
(and dont say that its cause it took 5 years to Develop.....see diablo, and lets see if it will be criticized soooo much).

There is no perfect product , or will be, especially when it will have to be criticized by 6.000.000+ users and the majority of them kids.

No one can argue about this comment right here. Pure truth.
 
No one hear has to be reminded of how long the game took since that's practically common knowledge, but said development time made fans very impatience with them and demanded that the game released as soon as possible, which was a valid complaint. So I believe development time contributed to that factor.

This in turn only increased the hype of the game to insane levels. Expectations went from excellent to being the best Gran Turismo game period when compared to previous titles. When the game was released and people found flaws with it, well, it lead to seeing threads like this.

Considering how long it took for the game to release on the PlayStation 3, I don't think we'll be seeing the sixth title on the console. As such, while some people may disagree about it being a bad game, the volume of complaints regarding it is actually a good thing as it requires Polyphony Digitial to listen to us, so while I don't see it go away entirely, it should gradually subside into being the exception instead of the norm with stuffs like this only happening maybe once or twice but not on this magnitude.

I'm not saying either sides are totally right on this, both make valid arguments that I agree with, just that there's a very strong fault line between the complainers and the people who defend the game, which should hopefully weaken.
 
sdf
Everyone was expecting too much from this game.
For many reasons that probably we'll never know, there are some flaws.
But thats not a reason to blame PD.

Toyota released a bunch of cars that had to be recalled because the gas pedals stuck and several people got killed. But that's not a reason to blame Toyota

PD designed this game from the ground up and built it. If you don't blame them for the flaws, please tell me who you do think is responsible?
 
Toyota released a bunch of cars that had to be recalled because the gas pedals stuck and several people got killed. But that's not a reason to blame Toyota

PD designed this game from the ground up and built it. If you don't blame them for the flaws, please tell me who you do think is responsible?
Go away, everyone is fed up of debating with you.
We get it, you don't like the game.
 
No one can argue about this comment right here. Pure truth.
I will argue with that comment, because I find it to be generalizing things and people.

Ask youselves why so many people were trying to find flaws in this game. Because all of them are idiots who don't have anything better to do? Everything has flaws, but noone cares as long as the product itself is good. If it isn't, people will start nitpicking, it's completely natural. I could even argue that the sheer amount of complaining is a sign for lack of quality, that people were not seduced to shut up and play because there simply wasn't enough substance to be played.

I'm absolutely sure that PD gave their best, but given the result, I must question the goals they set themselves in the first place. See premium cars as an example. They look awesome in the game and have an unparalleled amount of details. Yet, as it shows, they consumed so much time that PD had to take shortcuts elsewhere. I understand that Kaz wanted the cars to be like this, I would have too if I had had the choice. But if it ain't doable in time, you must find shorter and more efficient ways to achieve your goals.
 
Using Diablo 3 as an example, last game was out in 1999/2000 - But there is a different development team working on the 3rd game compared to the 2nd. The game went under a lot of fire simply due to the type of lighting and colour used in the E3 demo for D3, the expectations for it are high, but blizzard has not started hyping it much yet, we shall see in the future but i fully expect the release to come under a lot of criticism by fans when it is released, even if it is incredible. Big game releases often do.
 
Go away, everyone is fed up of debating with you.
We get it, you don't like the game.
He's right though, so be a pretend moderator somewhere else.
 
Go away, everyone is fed up of debating with you.
We get it, you don't like the game.

Give me a reasonable answer to that question and I promise I will do my best to never respond to another post of yours again. Otherwise you're just trolling.

Answer the question...
 
I must have missed the memo where we decided to see how many different threads can have the same crap in them. I mean, really?
Because net-whining is the new black. :sly:

Considering how long it took for the game to release on the PlayStation 3, I don't think we'll be seeing the sixth title on the console. As such, while some people may disagree about it being a bad game, the volume of complaints regarding it is actually a good thing as it requires Polyphony Digitial to listen to us, so while I don't see it go away entirely, it should gradually subside into being the exception instead of the norm with stuffs like this only happening maybe once or twice but not on this magnitude.
Frankly, I'd be fine with this. GT5 has shown that you can push the PS3 really hard in just about every aspect: graphics, physics and sound, but only so far. While it looks better than most PC games and races similarly to some PC sims, the graphic glitches hurt the impression of the game for many. Trying to put real time lighting and 3D on this engine seem to have pushed it a bit too far.

For this reason, and because we want even more for GT6, I think the next game should be on the PS4. Tweak GT5 with more tracks and cars - tracks first, more race events, better online and a few patches, and the complainers will come crawling back to finally enjoy it. Meanwhile, we'll enjoy watching it grow before our eyes. And GT6 can finally blow us away with a much more powerful piece of hardware which can finally hope to deliver Kazunori's dreams.
 
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Toyota released a bunch of cars that had to be recalled because the gas pedals stuck and several people got killed. But that's not a reason to blame Toyota

PD designed this game from the ground up and built it. If you don't blame them for the flaws, please tell me who you do think is responsible?

The way the economy works: if a company makes a bad product, people won't buy it, won't buy anything of them in the future.

Can you follow the rules of the economy instead of trying to bore everyone to death with hysterics about some unimportant rule.
 
Its not like they physically slapped you in the face. We've all played games that were overhyped and/or unfinished upon release but you can't give them credit for at least trying to reach their goals after release? While in the meantime you're blasting them for things you don't understand, or know the full story about? (Car licensing issues, outside pressure to release the game, anything Sony may have nixed or demanded, just to name a few) Kaz stated it would be a work in progress, so it shouldn't be a surprise if some things are quirky.

To me its obvious that they're taking a new direction with this game, and I'd like to see where the finish line is, so to speak, before I stamp this game with a failing grade.

Please keep this thread civilized and constructive. My questions are genuine and in no way meant to be offensive. Speaking from your heart is welcome, just please use the fire extinguisher on your way in. ;)
When you are in a GT forum and get laughed because you say that you are happy with the game, get trolled or criticized every time you show the strong points, and get clapped every time you bash the developer you know something has changed in this community, and is not because the game is not perfect but because some people like to over react to make things much worse than they are. The same people work the inverse when they talk about its favourite games, nothing new but now they are more than ever.

Funny enought I'm sure more than 50% of the forum is happy with the game but they make a lot less noise and don't care about discussing but enjoying what they have.
 
I guess those people are playing instead of whining.
 
The way the economy works: if a company makes a bad product, people won't buy it, won't buy anything of them in the future.

Can you follow the rules of the economy instead of trying to bore everyone to death with hysterics about some unimportant rule.
I'm curious, but what exactly is your point?
 
I'm curious, but what exactly is your point?

That's the way it works around here. If someone says something that you don't like, no matter how logical, you just come back with 'If you don't like it, don't play it' or some nonsensical statement designed to sound logical, but is really meaningless.

That way no one can argue with it...
 
If someone says something that you don't like, no matter how logical, you just come back with 'If you don't like it, don't play it' or some nonsensical statement designed to sound logical, but is really meaningless.
It usually depends on how much you spam the boards, and your attitude...
 
Does anybody remember who said that the last delay was to make the GT5 driving experience "perfect", and that the game would "exceed expectations"? GT5 has been hugely hyped up by PD/Sony, how could anybody who enjoyed previous games in the series say that it's all players' fault for their disappointment because they expected too much?
 
having to create a game of our own before complaining?

i would agree 100%...if the game was free.

which it ISN'T.

exchanging money for a product holds an unspoken guarantee that it has a minimum of QUALITY.

what this means is that we have a RIGHT to criticism.

yeah, some people go too far. that's a downside to freedom. however, i have confidence that most people who play this game are capable of rational thought. with that in mind, seeing this amount of complaints about GT5 does NOT motivate me to get this game.

PD needs to put someone on the crew who has experience in GAME DESIGN.

it's much like Star Wars. it's a great movie series but the last 3 ones had serious issues.
 
I'd say that any company that can release a game like GT5 in its debut form, and subsequent patches that cause so much grief and hostility within a forum community such as what I've seen here at GTP, deserves all the hate it receives.

I've honestly never seen a forum for one game have a member base so divided, and openly hostile towards each other as this one is. :(
 
I'd say that any company that can release a game like GT5 in its debut form, and subsequent patches that cause so much grief and hostility within a forum community such as what I've seen here at GTP, deserves all the hate it receives.

I don't think it's so much hate as it is frustration. The old timers have a lot of time and a lot of themselves invested. Ever not get what you want for Christmas? You don't cry about it, you glass it over for the sake of the folks and pretend everything is all right. They want to believe everything is fine and their investment is validated. The new guys come into this and see what a mess this is and sometimes loudly and maybe sometimes too loudly complain. On top of that, you get a certain number who just want to start a fight. PD is acting a bit bipolar on updating the game and fixing what was wrong, so that just adds to the situation. It's just a LOT of frustration...




I've honestly never seen a forum for one game have a member base so divided, and openly hostile towards each other as this one is. :(

Indeed... 👍
 
I'd say that any company that can release a game like GT5 in its debut form, and subsequent patches that cause so much grief and hostility within a forum community such as what I've seen here at GTP, deserves all the hate it receives.

I've honestly never seen a forum for one game have a member base so divided, and openly hostile towards each other as this one is. :(
Really? That makes the company deserving of hate, because it has 'fans' who are this ridiculously immature, and aren't afraid to show their immaturity publicly?

I've never seen a 'community' so embarrassingly immature. I feel sorry for PD having to deal with them -- they act like PD has killed their grandmothers. Drama queens, for sure.
 
I've honestly never seen a forum for one game have a member base so divided, and openly hostile towards each other as this one is. :(

You've clearly never visited the WoW forums...
 
Sorry for this very long xxs post.

Toyota released a bunch of cars that had to be recalled because the gas pedals stuck and several people got killed. But that's not a reason to blame Toyota
Honestly......That must be the worst example that you could give.

PD designed this game from the ground up and built it. If you don't blame them for the flaws, please tell me who you do think is responsible?
As i said already "we may never know".
Do you honestly believe that PD wanted to release a game with flaws?
They wanted all this heat? They released GT5 on purpose with mistakes?
or you think they are useless?
Not to mention....... that in 5 years many things change, and they may have changed their plans 1000 times for 1000 reasons.

I will argue with that comment, because I find it to be generalizing things and people.
No you (not in person) generalizing things when you say PD sucks.
When PD has released Over the top games and for 5-6 flaws in their latest release you call them useless.

Ask youselves why so many people were trying to find flaws in this game. Because all of them are idiots
Cause is GT..... and Yes cause some things you must be real loony to even spend 1sec to find them and even more to troll about them.
who don't have anything better to do?
Yes, cause i play GT from GT1 release, and games in general over 20 years and when i get a game the 1st thing that i want to do is to "play it", not to find mistakes.

Everything has flaws, but noone cares as long as the product itself is good.
GT5 is more than good, all the flaws in this game is outside the track, on the track is the best racing game ever made, and in a racing game that is what matters the most.
After a year no one will remember the flaws or compare GT5's "Home Page" with another racing game home page, what you'll compare is the driving experience.

If it isn't, people will start nitpicking, it's completely natural.
in that level ....No its not natural.
Many games weren't good and had high expectations and had/have many mistakes/bugs/errors etc etc but none was nitpicked sooo much and for sooo long.

I could even argue that the sheer amount of complaining is a sign for lack of quality, that people were not seduced to shut up and play because there simply wasn't enough substance to be played.
But to troll and complain for every useless thing that does not feat your taste .....well thats a goood GT5 substance.

I'm absolutely sure that PD gave their best, but given the result, I must question the goals they set themselves in the first place. See premium cars as an example. They look awesome in the game and have an unparalleled amount of details. Yet, as it shows, they consumed so much time that PD had to take shortcuts elsewhere. I understand that Kaz wanted the cars to be like this, I would have too if I had had the choice. But if it ain't doable in time, you must find shorter and more efficient ways to achieve your goals.
The game is enormous, from everything on the track.... to the car collection, the info/description for 1000+ cars, the paints, the name of each paint, the online, the museum cards, the horns, the photo mode and the list goes on and on.......
who cares about all that?
let me ask who cars for all that useless. nonsense, details that some people complain and troll? that some will never notice.........and the funny part is that they cock around "i found a mistake in GT5!"
oh really? you should get an oscar or a noble?

You cant expect a game with all this aspects (i think thats the right word) to be perfect and be done in 5 years.

To be real and honest....the actual flaws/mistakes are 2, that the 1 triggers a chain of problems.
The problem is Lack of races (including the rally races)........cause of that the XP and the low cash system fails...Cause you have to re-race 10000 times the same races, to gain money and XP......plus+ no races = short game.....especially compared to previous GT's.

The other one is stages/tracks from previous GT's, Apricot Hill, Midfield etc etc .....For me that was the worst thing they've done...... (and i had high hopes for SSR11 :grumpy:.).....anyway.......

To close this up, see GT5 day 1 and now 3 months later.
I dont think that PD sucks or doesnt know what is doing.

@Interceptor
Nothing personal mate, you just gave me the opportunity to say some things. :)
 
Respectfully,


sdf
Honestly......That must be the worst example that you could give.

But accurate... :)


sdf
As i said already "we may never know".
Do you honestly believe that PD wanted to release a game with flaws?
They wanted all this heat? They released GT5 on purpose with mistakes?
or you think they are useless?
Not to mention....... that in 5 years many things change, and they may have changed their plans 1000 times for 1000 reasons.

No, I don't believe they wanted to release the game as is (was). I do believe there was probably a conversation in the PD boardroom that included the phrase 'If we lose Christmas, we go bankrupt.' Remember, this is their flagship product. After almost 6 years of development and it still not being ready yet, losing that Xmas money would have been disastrous. Everything else that PD does with the Gauges thing for Nissan, the racing, everything depends on this one product. The pressure had to be intense. Even prologue was obviously an attempt to put people off because of delays in development.


sdf
You cant expect a game with all this aspects (i think thats the right word) to be perfect and be done in 5 years.

You certainly can. Maybe it would need a patch or two, but not on THIS level. Ever play Flight Simulator? Try modeling 24,000 airports in every country in the world and the entire world terrain modeled to within 30 meters (even less in the next edition). Add auto-generating scenery, modeling water, seaplanes, even aircraft carrier landings. Then of course, there's real-time weather and clouds. Oh, yeah and make it so players can build their own planes then add them into the game.

GT5 is a fantastic game, and the physics are very cutting edge, but everything else, but the modeling, the scenery, everything else is industry standard. I give it it's props for being beautiful and having that cool effect when the cars go by in the grass, but...

sdf
To be real and honest....the actual flaws/mistakes are 2, that the 1 triggers a chain of problems.
The problem is Lack of races (including the rally races)........cause of that the XP and the low cash system fails...Cause you have to re-race 10000 times the same races, to gain money and XP......plus+ no races = short game.....especially compared to previous GT's.

Lack of content is easy to fix. Add-on content is something to look forward too. I would def go for a DLC pack that had more NASCAR tracks, Watkins Glen, Sebring, St. Pete... Kaz doesn't seem to care for American tracks.

The rest I agree on, especially with the EP and cash.
 
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You certainly can. Maybe it would need a patch or two, but not on THIS level. Ever play Flight Simulator? Try modeling 24,000 airports in every country in the world and the entire world terrain modeled to within 30 meters (even less in the next edition). Add auto-generating scenery, modeling water, seaplanes, even aircraft carrier landings. Then of course, there's real-time weather and clouds. Oh, yeah and make it so players can build their own planes then add them into the game.

dont forget that a PC games have no hardware limitations . can be released asking minimum requirements 32gb ram DDR12 and 1Tb HDD space :S and no one will complain about it.
PD had to squeeze power out of ps3.
Example: Santa monica studios have said that just a few months before GOW3 was released they found a way to squeeze 25%? 35%? (something like that) more power out of the ps3, but cause they were in late stage they couldent use it.
PC games doesnt have that problem. they add staff and then they tell you go buy a 2000euro gfx card.
Everything plays its parts. ;)
But to be honest..... if kaz had no limitation ........GT5 would have been released.....around 2035 years. lol
 
I don't agree with the aggressive posts, requiring, demanding, saying they must do this, they must do that to make the game good...

Just because you bought it doesn't mean you have the right to complain... or better, you have the right, but your right doesn't imply you can diminish a beautiful hard work they've done. Tell me another game as big as GT5? With "only" 200 premium cars... with only 9 x 5 = 45 events, with only everything but flying...

The game is awesome, and of course as everything in life, will get better with some rounded edges. And think about what they have done with our feedback! They are doing what we ask... they are listening...

Want a comparison? Go go the Codemasters forum and tell something bad about F1 2010. You are banned in 1 second! They got all the complains, all the feedback, and release a note saying they will implement the changes in F1 2011... they release one ridiculous patch, and that's it, told us to go ... ourselves.

PD might had some rushed to release GT5 by Sony's demands, but they are polishing and make our dreams come true. Stop complain and go race buddys!
 
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