Would GT3 have been better without any American cars in it?

[scuderia229]

Originally posted by GoKents
Kinda American?

Im guessing you'r kinda dellusional?

The shelby is all American and one of the most important cars in sports history. The cobra changed the face of racing... just ask the people at ferrari.

I really actually miss the cobra racer from gt2. That was one of the best cars in the game. (that and the v12 jag. ?-15)

Anyway, I like some of the american stuff in gt. The c5r, the oreca, the z06 & grandsport, the cobra, and even the mustang at times. (that p.o.s mustang :curses: )

So yeah... Later.

I know the Cobra is an American made car, but it's deisgn (and design idea) has alot to do with late 50s European sportscars. If Carroll never raced a Aston Martin DB3 I would expect the Cobra to look alot different.

So my "kinda sorta" was refering to it's an american classic influenced from Europe.

Great car though, along with the GT40 "Ferrari killer"... some of the rare American "race" cars worth anything, especially of the ones in GT3.

 

[Kent]

Im just saying, true American race cars are not that rare to find. You just have to have an eye for them.

Also, if your gonna say that a cobra is kinda sorta american & based on the euro influence on shelby, than you might as well count italian ferraris as sorta german, thanks to the various times in motorsport history where designers from all of the various euro moto sport powers (germany, britian, italy), had influence on one another.
I think your better off admitting it... The cobra is a full blooded american.

Very few ideas in the world are completely origanal, and counting the shelby cobra as a euro knock off is just not acceptable. (imo)

but your right about alot of the stuff in your post. Shelby did take notes from the euro cars (just as chevy with the vette) and indeed, the cobra along with the gt40 made some real progress on the side of america in international racing.
... later.

 

[scuderia229]

Originally posted by GoKents
Im just saying, true American race cars are not that rare to find. You just have to have an eye for them.

Also, if your gonna say that a cobra is kinda sorta american & based on the euro influence on shelby, than you might as well count italian ferraris as sorta german, thanks to the various times in motorsport history where designers from all of the various euro moto sport powers (germany, britian, italy), had influence on one another.
I think your better off admitting it... The cobra is a full blooded american.

Very few ideas in the world are completely origanal, and counting the shelby cobra as a euro knock off is just not acceptable. (imo)

but your right about alot of the stuff in your post. Shelby did take notes from the euro cars (just as chevy with the vette) and indeed, the cobra along with the gt40 made some real progress on the side of america in international racing.
... later.

Well if you wanna get really picky...I'm speaking in general terms here

If it wasn't for Mercedes and Auto Union Alfa Romeo and Maserati would never have been motivated to make grand prix cars that could compete...Enzo Ferrari used to customize Alfas prior to real Ferraris.....Jag wanted to win at sports cars as did Aston Martin but the Italian cars were sexier (and more aero perfect AND more grunt)......blah blah blah

The Cobra IS an american interpritation of a European sports race car, just the same way as the DBs Astons and X/C series Jags are english interpritations of itlian sports race cars....

i agree nothing is original...wait there is Porsche...but then again the god old doctor was just working from...hahaha

I guess my distinction was that the Cobra has more to do with the euro sports cars that classic american hot rods (the archetype of american "race" cars)...thought cobra has a little to do with both.

The GT40 was the ferrari killer and it DID kill some ferraris in it's day and started because Enzo pissed ford off by calling off the buy out late in the game...The GT40 was ford interpritation of a ferrari.....yadda yadda yadda

we all know the stories.

But in GT3 the cobra AND both GT40s are great GREAT cars...plus I think the GT40 race car earns the distinction of "best sounding car"

So ya there are a few "american cars" in the game tht rock...but I have never driven a mustang, as soon as i get that dmn camaro or corvette I sell it and buy a decent car (usually a japanese race car or a clio or Lotus...or Zonda if I don't already have one)...I can deal with the viper race car but there are better FR race cars...and if you are going to drive a race car in GT3 make it a MR car anyway.....

hahaha

I've tried most cars in the game over the four times I have played it through (I just started my 5th play through with a logitech wheel nd using only MT transmission, talk about watching latimes die) but I always come back to maybe 10 cars I absolutely love, 5 of those cars I make sure are in my garage each time I play the game....none are american cars...only two are japanese.....

 

[DRIFT4EVA]

I love the sound of the Cobra in GT2. It turns out that while the GT-40 was winning races somebody changed the rules to try and stop them from winning. The rule they changed was the fuel capacity one.

 

[Super-Supra]

God, this is the greatest thread in the world.

Muscle cars own every other car.

 

[Cobraboy]

Originally posted by Super-Supra
God, this is the greatest thread in the world.

Muscle cars own every other car.

How so? I want at least 5 authentic reasons as to why you think that.

 

[Dave A]

The Shelby Cobra is an AC Cobra with an American engine. Carrol Shelby saw the AC obra's and though it would be nice to stick a bigger engine in one and the first Shelby Cobra was born, Shelby has just signed a new deal with AC for AC to carry on supplying Cobra chassis for Shelby to use. The Cobra is not a Euro knock off as is it a better performance version of the AC, and as AC supplies Shelby with the chassis it's stupid to call it that.

 

[Klostrophobic]

Wouldn't the game be better without any cars in it?

 

[Cobraboy]

Anyone ever compared the AC Ace to a Cobra? The chassis had to be beefed to to handle the V8, the only ties the Cobra has to is the shape of it's body and even then the body shape was affected due to the weak chassis.

 

[DRIFT4EVA]

What are we supposed to run around the tracks instead?

 

[Klostrophobic]

Sheep. Cobraboy is keen to the idea of riding sheep, I hear.

 

[Kent]

You know, if we are going to say that every car which has something in common with another car is a knock off , then we are never gonna be able to acredit anyone with designing anything.

Think about it...
a gt40 is a ferrari knock off.
So Im guessing that any time you "answer" a manufactures newest product you are just copying their idea?
How about we just recognize that all of these are different examples of "the car".

I just think it would be wiser of us to forget about saying who was copying what and instead say who mastered what.

The shelby cobra and gt40 were masterpieces of their era.

btw, you keep mentioning that the gt40 was a ferrari killer, but aren't you forgeting that the shelby cobra coupe ended up forcing ferrari out of racing in that specific class. (I think it was in the late 60's)

 

[DRIFT4EVA]

Or what about a horse and carriage or ride an ostrich. I know. go around the tracks on Pogo sticks.

 

[Klostrophobic]

Now you're just talking crazy. You should form a club with TurboSmoke.

Scotland sucks, and my father has never stepped foot on it's hideous soil.

 

[Dave A]

Originally posted by Cobraboy
Anyone ever compared the AC Ace to a Cobra? The chassis had to be beefed to to handle the V8, the only ties the Cobra has to is the shape of it's body and even then the body shape was affected due to the weak chassis.

In the 7 liter Cobra the chassis did have alot of work done to it back then but the first Shelby Cobra's used a 4.2s producing 165Bhp and then a 4.7 producing almost 200, thoes Cobera's had very little modifications to the AC other than the engine. Nowadays the chassis are all put together by AC and sold to Shelby as used. The Shelby is more than just a Brit car with an American engine but thats the simplification of it, it's a british design in the body but underneath it was mostly Shelby's work, even though it still used some AC parts, as you said they were heavilly modified. Now it's built as a joint effort by Shelby and AC but Shelby put the badge on it, all in all a great car that has versions on both sides of the pond equally as important as each other.

 

[DRIFT4EVA]

I know that my Dad worked in Scotland Yard over in England.

 

[TurboSmoke]

Originally posted by Klostrophobic


Scotland sucks, and my father has never stepped foot on it's hideous soil.

hehe...kinda sticks in your throad...dont it?

your grammar 'sucks' too...

 

[Exoticar]

Originally posted by scuderia229
I LOATH american muscle cars...I am not into japanese tuners either. As far as I am concerned in the game all the skylines, type-rs, corvettes, camaros, mustangs, evos, etc blow (they really blow actually).

I love my Subarus though! Give me any RUF over just about anything. The Zondas just rock. The TVRs are sick. Tommy Kiara is amazing...I do like my japanese race cars though. I like my WRC cars too. I like my Cobra (yes I know it is sorta kinda american) and I love my 187hp Mini...


Part of what rocks about GT3 is it offers alot for everyone no matter what your taste is. It IS scewed a bit to japanese cars but given the game IS from japan that is to be expected.

I personally would like to see some of the following...
-Classic 1950s Euro sportscars (jags, Alfas, Maserattis, ferraris, etc)
- Porshce 911's thru the years (40 years this year)
-More british cars (Vauxhall, Seat)
-More Italian cars (anything red)
-More German Touring cars (race car Audis...we have ALL the japanese supercars, why not)
-LeMans cars (vintage and current)

Oh and given I am a HUGE F1 fan give me post 2000 F1 cars...

FIA sportcar prototypes would be nice, both SR1 and SR2 classes

Well said!!

 

[Exoticar]

Originally posted by live4speed
The Shelby Cobra is an AC Cobra with an American engine. Carrol Shelby saw the AC obra's and though it would be nice to stick a bigger engine in one and the first Shelby Cobra was born, Shelby has just signed a new deal with AC for AC to carry on supplying Cobra chassis for Shelby to use. The Cobra is not a Euro knock off as is it a better performance version of the AC, and as AC supplies Shelby with the chassis it's stupid to call it that.

Sooooo refreshing to read from someone who actually knows what he's talking about !!

 

[mustangphreak]

HELL NO!

In fact gt3 could have used more american cars. I think gt3 has to many Japanese cars if you ask me. come on who needs nine different types of lancers. hoplfully gt4 will have more of the american muscle that i love.

 

[HsV_CoUpE]

Originally posted by mustangphreak
HELL NO!

In fact gt3 could have used more american cars. I think gt3 has to many Japanese cars if you ask me. come on who needs nine different types of lancers. hoplfully gt4 will have more of the american muscle that i love.

I like there being an EVO 4, 5, 6 and 7...but i also would have liked to see ALOT more not just american but every other nationality cars. You can't say "oh it's a lancer, why can't we just have an EVO 8 and leave it at that" because some people may love the EVO 6. The same also goes for a corvette though, if they are gonna include older lancers and skylines why can't they have older corvettes or mustangs? I think GT4 will be like GT2 in the fact it had a fair bit (i still feel not enough) of american muslce, lots of European cars and also had lots of old and new Japanese cars. I couldn't get enough of those cars from GT2 and still play GT2 these days.

 

[Davion Guard]

YOU FREAKING FOOLZ! Without American cars, such as ford for example, then there would be no ASTON MARTIN(not that they are great anyways), and without Chevy, (General motors), there would be NO MERCEDES!


A lot of American companies own the higher brands now. Not all of them, I know, but if Ford hadnt bought out Aston MArtin, there was a chance that Aston would close its doors to consumers, as they were not doing to well. But anyways, SOME American cars are good, and ive always fancied Vettes, best for your buck, but not nesiscarily in GT3.

 

[Drifting Thunda]

I think what a lot of people misunderstand is the respective purpose of the car to given areas.

Every region has every kind of car for the most part, but you can't help but notice how different areas work harder to produce different results. This is why America is just now making a production version of the Ford GT, it's first supercar, whereas Europe, Italy especially has more supercars than you have body hairs.

Japan has been the most efficient at making cars that surpass the common sports car, raising the bar just a little bit, at the cost of a crapload of money in some cases. Insurance on some of the Japanese's best sports cars is friggen nutz too!

America has made some really nasty bang-for-the-buck machines in the past decade or so. With the Cobra only costing a measly ~35k, you get a low 13s, 400 supercharged hp tarmac tearing pony! Sure, for less than that, about 30k, you can get an STi or Evolution, but the only thing that keeps them hanging with Cobras and LS1 fox bodies is AWD. In stock form the two rally-bred pocket rockets likely make mince meat out of the much heavier Cobra in autocross when both are in stock trim, but the as you add power, even with careful suspension tuning AWD kills the car in that also (IMO) and the domestics take the lead again. So although cars like the STi are cheap and absolutely awesome at rally, I think you get a better deal with the Cobra personally. However, if you raise the price range a bit and compare the Cobra to, say, an FD, the Cobra can't touch that almost no matter how you look at it.

Europeans are the ultimate masters of 40k+ dollar luxury and luxury performance cars. Their German sports cars such as Porsche GT3 and BMW M3 have made their way to a decent spot on everyone's awesome cars list. Narrowing Europe down to Italy, you have an unmatched number of supercars ranging from Lambos to Ferraris, and the UK seem to offer the most balanced cars of the bunch IMO, but at a very pretty penny!

So maybe it's just me, but I think all regions of the world are equal when it comes to how good the cars they make are, it just seems to me like Japan, America, and Europe are all focusing in different forms of the "sports car."

So when you knock Japanese cars or American cars or whatever, it doesn't even make sense to me because they all make some fine machines!

Just remember that Ford is the best make in the universe and you'll all be okay!

 

[TurboSmoke]

Originally posted by Davion Guard
there would be no ASTON MARTIN(not that they are great anyways),

driven one lately?


anyway, first you have to calm down, then you have to re-read the FIRST post that states in its first line that this was a JOKE...its not about American cars its about the good stuff PD left out....its just a rant...of course there are great American cars but you cant say that without brands like Chevy, Aston Martin would never have existed...

the manufacturers developed these two brands individually....perhaps from the same principles of the combustion engine...but independantly all the same..

also the internal combustion engine was invented by a German so you could say by your crazy logic that Chevy, Ford and GM wouldnt have existed without Mercedes, VW or BMW....forget timelines...

 

[Spin Bad]

Excuse me, but the Cobra, sorry AC cobra, was an european car beefed up with an american V8, and refined, until it became the car that it was.