x1 or no x1?

[MOTORTRENDmitch]

dont be ridiculous.. the X1 is a great car, people always want faster cars, and this is the faster car, just because A-Holes go in online room and annoy youm Gran Turismo isnt about to remove a car that postponed the game even further, just becuase some little whiney little girls dont like it..

 

[Ecchi-BANZAII!!]

Remove the crap from the game, so the X2010 has to go.

 

[mafia_boy]

Douping X1s ended months ago.

If you think that you are completely without intelligence. You can still dupe X1's via tickets, just like you can with every untradable car.

your flawed logic is based on elitism, the idea that the car someone else has hinders you, or the consideration that people will be morons online regardless of car.

pfft

No, my logic is based on experience and that experience is that 99% of the people who drive X1's are complete and utter muppets that can't handle their car and would rather spoil other people's good times by ramming them and acting like a general assclown in an online lobby, and you'll find that more people will agree with that logic than your "flawed" opinion.

 

[analog]

Perhaps the main issue I have with the X2010 is that it was designed (or imagined) from a purely technological point of view, what would be technologically possible without abiding to existing regulations but also without much consideration for what's still humanly possible to endure (and control) if it were to be actually build and raced in real life (Adrian Newey admitted that himself).
So it perhaps is very realistic in being the worlds fastest R/C car and instead of Red Bull it should probably be build by Tamiya.
Perhaps if they also took the human physique as another limitation or factor in the same way the laws of physics were the end result may be more interesting or feel more natural to drive in a videogame or simulator even if the outright performance would suffer obviously.
So it's an interesting intellectual exercise within the possibilities offered by a videogame, although I wish it were a bit more intelligently designed with the aforementioned considerations to make it an actual real life possibility and therefor perhaps more suited for a sim.
Driving it now is just hilarious but fun sometimes but never truly convincing to me, that darn Vettel challenge however is a 🤬 piece of 🤬.

 

[C-ZETA]

I'd keep the X2010 for the reason it's SUPPOSED to exist.

What if races had no regulations?

Even if it isn't realistic (and it isn't - because you really can't drive at 8G that fast) I'd keep it in the game. Of course if its sole purpose was to be an online ram bot then of course not, but it isn't, is it?

In short, I'd keep it but I'm neutral with it.

 

[DEATHSARTHE]

I have to say that's pretty ridiculous. Keeping a car out of a sim because it doesn't exist in real life.

...

So lets go ahead and throw in the Millenium Falcon and Voyager while we're at it. Oh also I think those motorcycles from Tron would make an excellent addition to the game as well.

Hmm, what other ridiculously stupid cars can I come up with that have no bearing in anything releavitely related to the auto industry, motor sports, Gran Turismo, and real life in general...

Hmmmm HMMMMM HMMMMMMMM. Let's throw this thing in too:






ZOOOOOOM!





It's Wonder Woman's invisible jet, but **** it's about as credible as an X1.

Anyway...

Look men... the question has been asked and it's been debated many times before and I'm sure the conclusion we should all come to if you're a rational human being of at least even a minute nano cell (i don't even know what this is) of intelligence is that it is super UNREALISTIC.

No, no... put your Windows calculator away, stop googling essays written by hard working physics majors just so you can sulley thier efforts in a terrible plot to plagerize their work to support whatever crackpot theory you have. No, I'm not interested in the 2J or Toyota 7 or whatever other crap you think you can pull into whatever insane arguement you want to make. In fact, I'd suggest you step away from the computer... go ride some roller coasters or something, go for a drive, do something recreational because to argue the point any further is needless and I would be quite worried about your outlook in reality.

Point: Gran Turismo has always been a game about realism, straight forward down to earth, stripped down unmatched realism. If there was anything we could've always expected from the most prestigious driving game on console, year-to-date, is that it would provide the most realistic driving experience. AND for about 80% of the cars it does that quite well... then you have 19% that is somewhat suspect... then that 1%... the X1... where it is just too damn ridiculous to take seriously.

Look...

GT5's physics work extremely well imitating realistic cars driving realistically... If anything, this is what the game is all about - the bread and butter right here. However, I think there are very hard limits in the parimeters of realistic cars driving realistically, because when the game does anything else outside of those parimeters the physics engine fails terribly. I think the game runs outside of the parimeters a lot, but it is never more apparent then when someone in an X1 goes charging through Nurb taking corners at 200mph. Where people find this "realistic" and "belonging in Gran Turismo" is far beyond me. Which is why I say... Go outside for a few hours. Go driving, take a road with some curves, go align yourself with reality for a few days. You aren't completely crazy yet.

👍

 

[Slash]

Personally, I would like to let it stay in the game. It has many good sides but at the same time it has many downsides.

It can be good for grinding B-Spec races which we all know. everyone needs that extra cash and XP for the game. However when people abuse it online is when we begin to have problems. Ramming is not acceptable, under any circumstance. When people with X1's come together, it can be extremely thrilling, the rush you get to constantly battle it out for the top spot. I will admit that at times I'll get a case of road rage when someone slams me into a wall to gain the lead, but that's what makes it fun. Trying to battle it out for that 1st place position when to you second place isn't good enough. I'll never forget the first time I raced SSR7 against numerous X1's...IT WAS A RUSH!

Even though it's not a real car, that doesn't mean it has to be taken out tof the sim. It was obviously added with good intentions, as you all know why it was even created. People that abuse it, you need to learn how to drive. Others that honestly earned it, all the power to you. Don't hate a car because if itself (if that makes sense to you).

That said, enjoy the car while its still popular and fun. When GT6 roles around, GT5 is going to begin to get old real fast and the X1 won't be any fun anymore, especially if there is a car faster in GT6...Who knows what Kaz has lurking behind closed doors...

 

[Oshawa-Joe]

...

So lets go ahead and throw in the Millenium Falcon and Voyager while we're at it. Oh also I think those motorcycles from Tron would make an excellent addition to the game as well.

Hmm, what other ridiculously stupid cars can I come up with that have no bearing in anything releavitely related to the auto industry, motor sports, Gran Turismo, and real life in general...

Hmmmm HMMMMM HMMMMMMMM. Let's throw this thing in too:

ZOOOOOOM!

It's Wonder Woman's invisible jet, but **** it's about as credible as an X1.

Anyway...

Look men... the question has been asked and it's been debated many times before and I'm sure the conclusion we should all come to if you're a rational human being of at least even a minute nano cell (i don't even know what this is) of intelligence is that it is super UNREALISTIC.

No, no... put your Windows calculator away, stop googling essays written by hard working physics majors just so you can sulley thier efforts in a terrible plot to plagerize their work to support whatever crackpot theory you have. No, I'm not interested in the 2J or Toyota 7 or whatever other crap you think you can pull into whatever insane arguement you want to make. In fact, I'd suggest you step away from the computer... go ride some roller coasters or something, go for a drive, do something recreational because to argue the point any further is needless and I would be quite worried about your outlook in reality.

Point: Gran Turismo has always been a game about realism, straight forward down to earth, stripped down unmatched realism. If there was anything we could've always expected from the most prestigious driving game on console, year-to-date, is that it would provide the most realistic driving experience. AND for about 80% of the cars it does that quite well... then you have 19% that is somewhat suspect... then that 1%... the X1... where it is just too damn ridiculous to take seriously.

Look...

GT5's physics work extremely well imitating realistic cars driving realistically... If anything, this is what the game is all about - the bread and butter right here. However, I think there are very hard limits in the parimeters of realistic cars driving realistically, because when the game does anything else outside of those parimeters the physics engine fails terribly. I think the game runs outside of the parimeters a lot, but it is never more apparent then when someone in an X1 goes charging through Nurb taking corners at 200mph. Where people find this "realistic" and "belonging in Gran Turismo" is far beyond me. Which is why I say... Go outside for a few hours. Go driving, take a road with some curves, go align yourself with reality for a few days. You aren't completely crazy yet.

👍

You make some great points. Gt5 is about being realistic/sim and needs to keep things as real as possibe.

...but what if there were no rules...what would a race car look like/ perform and all that (sorry, on my phone here).

I have been playing gt since gt1 on ps1 and proud of the fact PD pulled this off. Come on, we have a Vettel Challenge! And the fastest gt racers on the planet practice with the x1.

To finish, I have to say that I also like the idea of restricting a room both ways...option for no x1 AND x1 only baby! Keep everything else out.

All the guys and gals out there that have borrowed x1s over the last few days...get out and practice. Feel free to jump in my room online..."You Better Have Wings".

I'm not super fast, just having fun.

 

[Jubby]

Nothing personal Deathsarthe but...

...even a minute nano cell (i don't even know what this is) of intelligence is that it is super UNREALISTIC.

That's where I think you lost my confidence in your essay. I won't talk anything about anything scientific or mathematical:

Nothing is unrealistic about the X1, it's all possible. Heck, anything is, we just cannot comprehend somethings. Give the late Henry Ford a chance to see a video of the Ford GT, and he'd think the same thing. Uncommon, unproven, and ridiculous? Sure. Fun? Yeah, if you can appreciate it.

I truly think this discussion is really about whether someone can:
1) Appreciate possible innovation
2) Have fun with anything on wheels

Some people like things the way they are, and some people gravitate towards a single idea/item (one brand of cars, etc.). We'll always have the idiots that drive irresponsibly with cars they cannot really drive, so I immediately discard that. If you don't like the X1, come up with something else that you'd replace it with that doesn't exist yet. I can't think of a better idea. So, let's not subtract, how about we add?

 

[Exorcet]

...

So lets go ahead and throw in the Millenium Falcon and Voyager while we're at it. Oh also I think those motorcycles from Tron would make an excellent addition to the game as well.

Why would you put fantasy vehicles with no relation to reality in a sim? And how does anything you say advance the idea that the X1 does not belong in GT5? Hint, it does not.

It's Wonder Woman's invisible jet, but **** it's about as credible as an X1.

It's easy to explain how the X1 works. The jet on the other hand has no logical explanation. So no, they're no where close to each other in terms of credibility. The X1 is the only credible thing you've mentioned so far.

to argue the point any further is needless and I would be quite worried about your outlook in reality.

Why are you arguing?

And why is there no benefit to this argument when:

-New people who have never argued before can enter and learn new information

-I and others can continue to practice arguing.

the X1... where it is just too damn ridiculous to take seriously.

Only because one doesn't know what they're talking about can they make a statement like this.

You're entitled to your opinion, but your whole argument is just lacking.

"It goes 200 mph around a corner on the ring, therefore it's the same thing as a unicorn."

It does not work.

I myself agree that the car probably would not run Nurbugring as fast as it does in game. Extreme ground effect cars are very sensitive to ride height and it would be quite a challenge to keep the underbody of the car sealed under the harsh conditions of the Nring. The driver would probably need to slow considerably below the car's ultimate cornering limits to keep from flying off the bumps in the track. GT5 either doesn't capture this, or the issue was "solved" in the design of the car.

Another thing about the car is that it seems to overdrive its tires without consequence which is probably an issue with GT5 physics. Again, this does not mean the car's performance limits in game are anyway fantastic beyond belief. It just means that there are additional constraints on the technique that be used to drive the car. It's an issue with all the cars since the physics aren't perfect (and in some places very far from it) in the first place.

On a smooth track though, the capability of the X1 makes perfect sense. Any inaccuracies are more than likely to come from the GT5 physics engine than from the "unrealistic" design of the X1 itself.

 

[VspecZR1GT2RS89]

Perhaps the main issue I have with the X2010 is that it was designed (or imagined) from a purely technological point of view, what would be technologically possible without abiding to existing regulations but also without much consideration for what's still humanly possible to endure (and control) if it were to be actually build and raced in real life (Adrian Newey admitted that himself).
So it perhaps is very realistic in being the worlds fastest R/C car and instead of Red Bull it should probably be build by Tamiya.
Perhaps if they also took the human physique as another limitation or factor in the same way the laws of physics were the end result may be more interesting or feel more natural to drive in a videogame or simulator even if the outright performance would suffer obviously.
So it's an interesting intellectual exercise within the possibilities offered by a videogame, although I wish it were a bit more intelligently designed with the aforementioned considerations to make it an actual real life possibility and therefor perhaps more suited for a sim.
Driving it now is just hilarious but fun sometimes but never truly convincing to me, that darn Vettel challenge however is a 🤬 piece of 🤬.

^This.

You and C-ZETA are absoulety correct on the issue concerning the X1. The car was built on a concept idea of....

"What if there was no rules to F1?"

The answer is the X1. On a past post here I was involved discussing with a few who were interested about that car, it was about the drivers hand changing gears in a awkward way, but then we took it off topic a little to see who could qualify to drive the X1 and how much g's the human body can take, espically on F1 based tracks all the way to the 'Ring with corners are there in every turn after that last apex. But with all mad scientist ideas or inventions, some don't make it or can be quite dangerous, just look at the TVR Speed 12.

It could be created, but it may need a little bit of detuning and more tameable to the F1 drivers.

But I love the car , but hate the Szukua Challenge part .

 

[savage388]

Have any of you heard of the 2j it was remarkable and still is to this day and that car was built in 1970. So a car designed 40 years later using formula 1 technology and absolutely no budget issues. If someone gave Adrian Newey and red bull racing a billion dollars and told them to build the fastest race car in the world the x1 would be real. Hell they might come up with something more ridiculous. All the x1 is pd's and red bull's opinion of what a race car could be. Of course it should be in the game because it is a concept car and is no different than any other concept cars. For example take the Toyota ft-86 mazoria tuned car. Pd had absolutely no real performance data on it but they put it in the game, but because it doesnt do 300 miles per hour no one complains about it. So why do people have such an issue with an extraordinary concept car, after all have you ever seen an fgt in real life?

 

[klassykid9801]

I love the car it should be allowed, no its no a real car but if kind of gives you an image of what cars someday might be like.

 

[rocko100]

I love the car it should be allowed, no its no a real car but if kind of gives you an image of what cars someday might be like.

They kill you whenever you go around a turn (we've been arguing about this all day )

 

[Tonystew42]

I think the only reason the X1 is not realistic is because we don't have as high-tech safety equipment. Fighter jets are only possible because the pilot has a special suit made for the Gs, so who's to say that in the near future someone doesn't invent a suit that can do the same, only side-to-side? That's the major flaw in the design imo, but that and any minor flaws can and will be overcome in the future through the daily innovations in technology.

 

[klassykid9801]

Rocko i gave my oppinion and really theres nothing to argue about

 

[DEATHSARTHE]

Why would you put fantasy vehicles with no relation to reality in a sim? And how does anything you say advance the idea that the X1 does not belong in GT5? Hint, it does not.


It's easy to explain how the X1 works. The jet on the other hand has no logical explanation. So no, they're no where close to each other in terms of credibility. The X1 is the only credible thing you've mentioned so far.


Why are you arguing?

And why is there no benefit to this argument when:

-New people who have never argued before can enter and learn new information

-I and others can continue to practice arguing.


Only because one doesn't know what they're talking about can they make a statement like this.

You're entitled to your opinion, but your whole argument is just lacking.

"It goes 200 mph around a corner on the ring, therefore it's the same thing as a unicorn."

It does not work.

I myself agree that the car probably would not run Nurbugring as fast as it does in game. Extreme ground effect cars are very sensitive to ride height and it would be quite a challenge to keep the underbody of the car sealed under the harsh conditions of the Nring. The driver would probably need to slow considerably below the car's ultimate cornering limits to keep from flying off the bumps in the track. GT5 either doesn't capture this, or the issue was "solved" in the design of the car.

Another thing about the car is that it seems to overdrive its tires without consequence which is probably an issue with GT5 physics. Again, this does not mean the car's performance limits in game are anyway fantastic beyond belief. It just means that there are additional constraints on the technique that be used to drive the car. It's an issue with all the cars since the physics aren't perfect (and in some places very far from it) in the first place.

On a smooth track though, the capability of the X1 makes perfect sense. Any inaccuracies are more than likely to come from the GT5 physics engine than from the "unrealistic" design of the X1 itself.

And this ladies and gentlement... is of course the forum troll who will obviously argue about anything.

Of course you don't see my perspective.
Of course you don't relate to anything in my post.
Of course you're just gonna troll on.

Wonder woman's invisible jet = X1. If you don't see that, go outside and get fresh air.

 

[Onboy123]

And this ladies and gentlement... is of course the forum troll who will obviously argue about anything.

Of course you don't see my perspective.
Of course you don't relate to anything in my post.
Of course you're just gonna troll on.

Wonder woman's invisible jet = X1. If you don't see that, go outside and get fresh air.

Says the one who, from most of your previous posts that I've read, does nothing other than whinge and whine about things that, frankly, no one gives a 🤬 about. This is the person who complained the TGTT was too boring when that that was what the track is like in real life. This is also the person who decided a magazine wasn't worth reading because one of the segments wasn't to his liking. From my point of view, you're the troll here. Hating on things that most people can't care less about.

Haters gonna hate, I personally think the X1 is worthy of being in GT5. It's a showcase of what could be possible when there are no rules besides the laws of physics. What is it that you think is unrealistic? The 1500hp? The Porsche 917 could produce that much power. The fan? The 2J had that, as did a Brabham F1 car. Ever thought that it's not the car, but the fleshy bit controlling it?

You keep telling people to 'go out more', but if you're going to pick at things as small as like this, I suggest you do what you've been preaching and leave the house and take a stroll.

In the end, it's just a game, so just enjoy it for god sakes...

 

[GfxJG]

Says the one who, from most of your previous posts that I've read, does nothing other than whinge and whine about things that, frankly, no one gives a 🤬 about. This is the person who complained the TGTT was too boring when that that was what the track is like in real life. This is also the person who decided a magazine wasn't worth reading because one of the segments wasn't to his liking. From my point of view, you're the troll here. Hating on things that most people can't care less about.

Haters gonna hate, I personally think the X1 is worthy of being in GT5. It's a showcase of what could be possible when there are no rules besides the laws of physics. What is it that you think is unrealistic? The 1500hp? The Porsche 917 could produce that much power. The fan? The 2J had that, as did a Brabham F1 car. Ever thought that it's not the car, but the fleshy bit controlling it?

You keep telling people to 'go out more', but if you're going to pick at things as small as like this, I suggest you do what you've been preaching and leave the house and take a stroll.

In the end, it's just a game, so just enjoy it for god sakes...

 

[Shoogar]

Cars that aren't real being put in the game? I am pretty sure that GT4 had 4-5 of these. I say keep it. It shows that you've successfully completed the game enough to unlock the car of all cars. Then there's the challenges you have to do to unlock the car.

 

[C-ZETA]

Cars that aren't real being put in the game? I am pretty sure that GT4 had 4-5 of these.

GT4 had 2 I think, the FGT and the Nike One 2022, which was really odd Let me say...it's lightweight, not great top speed, 8 gears, looks like the window and roof of a car chopped off and scaled up, you can't use it in anything, has a strange sound, the driver's position would break your back and it's made by Nike, not Adidas. Who say Impossible is Nothing

 

[Exorcet]

Of course you don't see my perspective.

I do. You're having a kneejerk reaction to something that defies your common sense. The problem is common sense isn't worth anything next to cold hard facts and research.

Of course you don't relate to anything in my post.

What did I not relate to? To be honest I was going to make a much shorter post, but then I read it to myself and thought that it might be taken as rude or condescending so I tried to fix. But I guess I failed.

Of course you're just gonna troll on.

By confronting everyone who yells about the unrealisticness of the X1 without any scientific reasoning?

You are comparing a theoretical car based on the absolute limit of known technology to a see through plane made for a comic book hero. You cannot see what's wrong with that?

Wonder woman's invisible jet = X1. If you don't see that, go outside and get fresh air.

Just for your information, the day before I posted my first reply to you I drove 500 miles in one sitting. And it wasn't in GT5 or any game for that matter. And the day before that I was running CFD on configurations for an actual race car. I think I'm pretty firmly in touch with reality.

On the other hand, comparing the X1 to a magic jet gives me the idea that one doesn't really know what they're talking about, or that they're getting too emotional over this to discuss with a clear head. No offense, but maybe you need to step back and look at things from the beginning.

 

[bass264]

I do. You're having a kneejerk reaction to something that defies your common sense. The problem is common sense isn't worth anything next to cold hard facts and research.

What did I not relate to? To be honest I was going to make a much shorter post, but then I read it to myself and thought that it might be taken as rude or condescending so I tried to fix. But I guess I failed.

By confronting everyone who yells about the unrealisticness of the X1 without any scientific reasoning?

You are comparing a theoretical car based on the absolute limit of known technology to a see through plane made for a comic book hero. You cannot see what's wrong with that?

Just for your information, the day before I posted my first reply to you I drove 500 miles in one sitting. And it wasn't in GT5 or any game for that matter. And the day before that I was running CFD on configurations for an actual race car. I think I'm pretty firmly in touch with reality.

On the other hand, comparing the X1 to a magic jet gives me the idea that one doesn't really know what they're talking about, or that they're getting too emotional over this to discuss with a clear head. No offense, but maybe you need to step back and look at things from the beginning.

You owned him.

 

[Rdp616]

 

[Jubby]

Ever thought that it's not the car, but the fleshy bit controlling it? ... In the end, it's just a game, so just enjoy it for god sakes

That's worth quoting, but in reverse. I agree with the vast majority of your original post Onboy, but any true racer, fan, or car enthusiast knows that any car is capable of 100% and sims can give us that. In real life we'd all probably only be able to take any car (real or imagined) to 70, 80, 90, and maybe 95% its capability. Factors like physical conditioning, g forces, weather, and fear (and no one better debate this one) get in the way of the car hitting 100% its potential. So, we get to enjoy the marvel that these cars can give... and even the cars that may not exist (yet).

 

[bosnian]

It should be in the game....it WOULD be an honor to have the car if it weren't a bunch of 7 yr olds driving it. When the game first came out I'm sure it was like an honor to have it.....then came the sore losers. Douping glitching anything for them to get the car that makes them feel cool. Well thanks to you guys its not even cool to see because everybody else has it. I have 2 vettels a proto and the level 40. All earned.

 

[Onboy123]

That's worth quoting, but in reverse. I agree with the vast majority of your original post Onboy, but any true racer, fan, or car enthusiast knows that any car is capable of 100% and sims can give us that. In real life we'd all probably only be able to take any car (real or imagined) to 70, 80, 90, and maybe 95% its capability. Factors like physical conditioning, g forces, weather, and fear (and no one better debate this one) get in the way of the car hitting 100% its potential. So, we get to enjoy the marvel that these cars can give... and even the cars that may not exist (yet).

What, so to reverse it it'll be……um……

'Ever thought that it's not the car, but the game? ... In the end, it's just the fleshy bit controlling it, so just enjoy it for god sakes'

Like that?

 

[Gt5anticip8r]

I would have preferred to not have the X1 in the game, but I'm not going to whine for it to be removed, as it would be ludicrous for PD to do so.

 

[Heath_1]

After all the hard work PD put into it, some respect and appreciation has to be shown. Defenatly keep it.

 

[Jubby]

What, so to reverse it it'll be……um……

'Ever thought that it's not the car, but the game? ... In the end, it's just the fleshy bit controlling it, so just enjoy it for god sakes'

Like that?

Almost. Sorry I wasn't clear. What's wrong is not the car, but the driver. The cars are good, we humans only screw them up. So yes, "it's just the fleshy bit controlling it".