X2014 Good, or Bad?

[Tornado]

There is literally no reason to restrict it more than it was in GT5 when competent lobby options would instantly make its problems as a troll car moot.

 

[sparkytooth]

Sounds like all cars. Ban?

Then I guess no cars should be allowed in the game, because every car is overpowered compared to another, and every car is about as realistic as the X1.

How are all the machines overpowered in the game? They are all separated from each other in terms of performance points, Horse power or weight if you don't want to deal with the PP system. You cannot race a Civic against an FGT if you want a fair fight. In a room, the host can limit certain vehicle parameters, of course no models are built equally and they all have different driving dynamics from one another. And sometimes these customizable parameters are quite limited in their own right.

Also, an 8G plus machine that can go over 450kmh with a V6 engine producing 1500HP and a huge fan attached to it is not my idea of a practical race car. It doesn't even exist to begin with.

Utterly bad game design that serves no purpose.

With GT5 you can already limit them by restricting PP or HP/Weight, mostly in race rooms. But they really should be in a class of their own as Dan mentioned, it's not a bad idea to have an option to separate them from the really high powered machines. This would make way for X1 only rooms, which can give the machine an actual use.

Because the X cars have nothing to do with idiots online and the point of the game is racing.

This machine can only really race against itself, it far outmatches every other car in the game. And to be honest, not everyone can drive this thing effectively. Otherwise it's quite useless and extremely obnoxious.

Good, unlocking cars is boring. Racing cars is fun, so the X1 shouldn't requiring unlocking.

Wrong, it would be more gratifying to put the disk in and drive whatever. I got the car by doing the challenges. You can check my trophy date. I don't care. It was a waste of time when I could have had the car for no effort.

This machine should be a bit challenging to obtain, atleast in GT mode.

Part of playing GT is working yourself up from just a few grand of credits, winning all sorts of historic and interesting machines along the way. And then start collecting cars with your hard earned cash from racing so you can build a giganto garage. The other part is obviously racing, but the X1 isn't that much useful for racing anyways. It should be a hard to access machine, limited to a certain high level event, enduro or completion percentage.

Pointless.

I like having something to work for in a videogame. It keeps me playing until the end. It was quite a pleasant surprise the time I got the 25% and 50% completion machines in GT4

I was disappointed that I couldn't win anything interesting in GT5 though, I could basically buy everything if I had the necessary credits. It turned A-spec races into a waste of time as nothing interesting could be obtained from it like in the older games

 

[Exorcet]

How are all the machines overpowered in the game? They are all separated from each other in terms of performance points, Horse power or weight if you don't want to deal with the PP system.

And the X1 isn't?

You cannot race a Civic against an FGT if you want a fair fight.

You can, you just need to handicap the FGT.

In a room, the host can limit certain vehicle parameters,

Which is why the X1 is the hardest of all cars to use to ruin a race.

Also, an 8G plus machine that can go over 450kmh with a V6 engine producing 1500HP and a huge fan attached to it is not my idea of a practical race car. It doesn't even exist to begin with.

So?

I'm still waiting to see why the car isn't realistic. Fans have been around forever. 450 km/h cars have been around even longer. 1500 hp engines aren't unheard of. Newey might have been taken things and used the best case, but nothing on the car to me seems outright impossible.

With GT5 you can already limit them by restricting PP or HP/Weight, mostly in race rooms.

Which is all that is necessary and solves every possible problem. PD just needs to provide more options.

But they really should be in a class of their own as Dan mentioned, it's not a bad idea to have an option to separate them from the really high powered machines. This would make way for X1 only rooms, which can give the machine an actual use.

No this is a completely backwards idea. It's like saying that LMP's should only be able to race LMP's. Or that Skylines should only be able to race Skylines. No. The host chooses what goes. I don't need you telling me how to run a race, especially if what you're suggesting provides not a single positive benefit to anyone.

The X1 (and all cars) should be allowed anywhere, unless the host says no. If a hosted wanted, they should be able to set up a room for all cars (including X1) except for the Mazda Miata. Why are they banning the Miata? Because the host has final say.

This machine can only really race against itself,

I've raced it against LMP's in a fair race, so that isn't true. There is also a video on Youtube where one is raced against a Fiat 500 in a fair race. Like any other car, it can race against any other car and there is no reason to issue pointless limitations on it. In fact pointless limitations should be avoided everywhere in the game.

it far outmatches every other car in the game.

If it was gone, the FGT would far outmatch. If the FGT was gone the LMP's would far outmatch... the Lotus Elise would far outmatch...

And to be honest, not everyone can drive this thing effectively. Otherwise it's quite useless and extremely obnoxious.

Every car in the game.

This machine should be a bit challenging to obtain, atleast in GT mode.

If we're not forced to touch GT Mode at all, fine.

Part of playing GT is working yourself up from just a few grand of credits, winning all sorts of historic and interesting machines along the way.

It doesn't have to be. This part should be optional and only done voluntarily.

the X1 isn't that much useful for racing anyways.

It has the same use as every other car. I've raced it against other cars. I've raced it against itself. It never felt any different than racing anything else.

It should be a hard to access machine, limited to a certain high level event, enduro or completion percentage.

This is a good way to make it not useful for racing. Just make it so that no one can get it.

I like having something to work for in a videogame. It keeps me playing until the end. It was quite a pleasant surprise the time I got the 25% and 50% completion machines in GT4

You can still have this, there just needs to be a separate mode for unlocking things. I like simulators because driving is fun. I don't anticpate being able to afford a 2000 car garage in reality any time soon, so have 2000 cars for $60 at no effort is quite appealing. I don't want to spend $60 putting myself to sleep by making a useless credit counter go up. I'd like to drive.

I was disappointed that I couldn't win anything interesting in GT5 though, I could basically buy everything if I had the necessary credits. It turned A-spec races into a waste of time as nothing interesting could be obtained from it like in the older games

A-Spec can only ever be a waste of time as far as I'm concerned, but I realize that others have different opinions. As long as both sides can be satisfied, I think PD should try to accommodate them.

 

[Dan]

So?

I'm still waiting to see why the car isn't realistic. Fans have been around forever. 450 km/h cars have been around even longer. 1500 hp engines aren't unheard of. Newey might have been taken things and used the best case, but nothing on the car to me seems outright impossible.

Why did you ignore the part about the car being able to pull 8G's in a turn? Fighter jets pull 8G's and the pilots are almost at the point of blacking out. Yes, they have G-suits which inflate certain parts of the suit to prevent the pilot from going unconscious. This is impractical for a racecar. Pulling G-forces this high on a track with lots of turns in a race would leave the drivers with serious injuries. The human body is not capable of handling this kind of abuse.

And I haven't even spoke about the crash scenarios (which there will be). The fan on the car is only useful when the car is extremely close to the ground. Say you ride up against the curbstones on the Nürburgring GP course. When you lift the car off the ground, the fan is useless and when you're doing 120 around a hairpin turn, the outcome won't be pretty. What if you're doing 250 MPH down a straightaway and your brakes fail? Yes, it's happened with prototype cars in the past doing 200 MPH, but in a very small car like the X1 with a large canopy overhead, you'll fly through the canopy and die.

 

[Exorcet]

Why did you ignore the part about the car being able to pull 8G's in a turn?

Alright I'll address it. Heavily restricted F1 cars already pull 5 g. They are not even at the limit of fanless downforce because underbody design is restricted as are the amount of types of wings They are also open wheeled which provides even further problems for downforce. Tunnel cars alone, without fans and with early wings dominated F1. Fan cars alone dominated F1. A ground effect/closed body/fan car isn't going to be limited to F1 performance.

Fighter jets pull 8G's and the pilots are almost at the point of blacking out.

Yes, they have G-suits which inflate certain parts of the suit to prevent the pilot from going unconscious. This is impractical for a racecar. Pulling G-forces this high on a track with lots of turns in a race would leave the drivers with serious injuries. The human body is not capable of handling this kind of abuse.

They just did handle it in the above videos. Air Racing is probably a good template for X1 racing.

And don't forget that the car never has to pull 8 g in the first place. I don't know why everyone simply ignores that fact.

And I haven't even spoke about the crash scenarios (which there will be). The fan on the car is only useful when the car is extremely close to the ground. Say you ride up against the curbstones on the Nürburgring GP course.

Why are you there. Tell me why the X1 has to be in that situation at all. I hope for next year F1 cars are designed to be safer when they rally race, I don't think they would survive hitting a sand dune at 200 mph.

When you lift the car off the ground, the fan is useless and when you're doing 120 around a hairpin turn, the outcome won't be pretty.

Where are these numbers coming from? Also realize that the more downforce you have, the harder it is to leave the ground. Even after you've left the ground, you can still have downforce.

What if you're doing 250 MPH down a straightaway and your brakes fail? Yes, it's happened with prototype cars in the past doing 200 MPH, but in a very small car like the X1 with a large canopy overhead, you'll fly through the canopy and die.

You could ask Mercedes Sauber, or Auto Union. They've done 250+ mph runs. I could ask why the X1 would be on a straight long enough to go that fast. I also wonder what makes the X1 automatically eject people through canopies.

 

[Samus]

Tires have always been my biggest issue. Do tires exist that could handle the performance of the X1 lap after lap? Certainly not any tire that could be considered 'soft' anyway.

 

[SilverFire]

Unless, of course, you were using Bridgestone tires. In all reality, though, no kind of tires can handle the speed and performance of a X1.

 

[Exorcet]

Tires have always been my biggest issue. Do tires exist that could handle the performance of the X1 lap after lap? Certainly not any tire that could be considered 'soft' anyway.

They could be thrown away after 1 lap. That's what happens with entire engines in drag racing.

 

[Samus]

They could be thrown away after 1 lap. That's what happens with entire engines in drag racing.

But that doesn't happen in GT5. If we're talking about how feasible it is to do what the X cars do in game, on a real track, then it's not very realistic is it?

Are there tires in the world that would allow the X cars to lap the Nurburgring in under 4 minutes?

 

[Exorcet]

But that doesn't happen in GT5. If we're talking about how feasible it is to do what the X cars do in game, on a real track, then it's not very realistic is it?

Are there tires in the world that would allow the X cars to lap the Nurburgring in under 4 minutes?

GT has tons of problems. You can do 24 hour races in F1 cars. You can do 24 hour races in F1 cars and finish the race with no gas, you just won't win.

I don't know if such tires could exist, I don't think they could, but as far as I know the 4 minute lap time comes from GT5, which is a very poor source for "actual" X1 lap times.

 

[RACECAR]

Tires have always been my biggest issue. Do tires exist that could handle the performance of the X1 lap after lap? Certainly not any tire that could be considered 'soft' anyway.

Closest I can even think of is the ones used on Land speed cars as they seem to withstand the constant loads sustained at or close to Mach 1.

 

[Exorcet]

Closest I can even think of is the ones used on Land speed cars as they seem to withstand the constant loads sustained at or close to Mach 1.

They're chunks of metal. Impractical.

 

[Samus]

GT has tons of problems. You can do 24 hour races in F1 cars. You can do 24 hour races in F1 cars and finish the race with no gas, you just won't win.

Yes this is true but including a car that just physically couldn't perform the way it does in game is quite different IMO.

I don't know if such tires could exist, I don't think they could, but as far as I know the 4 minute lap time comes from GT5, which is a very poor source for "actual" X1 lap times.

Well the lap time isn't as important as the performance and driving is. I'm not sure what other sources you have for the virtual X cars given they're only in GT5.

Closest I can even think of is the ones used on Land speed cars as they seem to withstand the constant loads sustained at or close to Mach 1.

That's only straight line though, I'm thinking of the huge lateral loads they would be taking, lap after lap as they do in GT5.

 

[Exorcet]

Yes this is true but including a car that just physically couldn't perform the way it does in game is quite different IMO.

This wouldn't be a fault of the car, more of the physics engine. The X1 is as "bad" as all the other cars in the game. Reliability means nothing, grip levels are hard coded (so cornering, braking, and accel are no where near accurate). Ride heights don't seem to do anything for aero, and aero of the car isn't adjusted when it's at a significant yaw angle.

The X1 has problems in GT5, but they're mostly the same problems all other cars have. Lowly street cars and older vehicles probably wouldn't stand up to any serious racing, but they can drive all day at 100% of their performance without issue.

Well the lap time isn't as important as the performance and driving is.

People do bring up laptimes quite often though. I agree with your statement. Weight transfer does not exist for any car in GT, nor do true grip values, or brake fade, or reasonable suspension, or aerodynamics.

I'm not sure what other sources you have for the virtual X cars given they're only in GT5.

The only source would be simulators since the car doesn't exist. GT5 however isn't a good enough simulator to tell you anything. If you wanted to know how the X1 would perform, you would simulate it on something that was actually designed for maximum realism. Every product that is today started off as something that only existed on paper/computer. Even in that initial state you could say many things about those products.

The X1 isn't defined as "pull 8g, go 300 mph, and stop from 200 mph in 300 ft". It has a mass, downforce, drag, power and power curve, etc.

We can't see all of these things or how their values were determined, but there are plenty of ways to realistically define them. Depending on what engine you put them in, you will get different results.

In any case, there isn't anything unreasonable about a high powered fan car. F1 isn't the limit of car performance, and all the technology in the X1 has been seen in F1 or other sports basically.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Alright I'll address it. Heavily restricted F1 cars already pull 5 g. They are not even at the limit of fanless downforce because underbody design is restricted as are the amount of types of wings They are also open wheeled which provides even further problems for downforce. Tunnel cars alone, without fans and with early wings dominated F1. Fan cars alone dominated F1. A ground effect/closed body/fan car isn't going to be limited to F1 performance.

And don't forget that the car never has to pull 8 g in the first place. I don't know why everyone simply ignores that fact.

Why are you there. Tell me why the X1 has to be in that situation at all. I hope for next year F1 cars are designed to be safer when they rally race, I don't think they would survive hitting a sand dune at 200 mph.

Where are these numbers coming from? Also realize that the more downforce you have, the harder it is to leave the ground. Even after you've left the ground, you can still have downforce.

You could ask Mercedes Sauber, or Auto Union. They've done 250+ mph runs. I could ask why the X1 would be on a straight long enough to go that fast. I also wonder what makes the X1 automatically eject people through canopies.

5g is not 8g. Of course it doesn't have to pull 8g. Doesn't have to pull 5 g either. Doesn't have to pull 1g. You could put a lawnmower engine in it and let your granny drive it too. How does that bear any relevance to taking this fantasy machine anywhere near it's designed limits in the real world? Answer: it doesn't.

Why are you in the position of being on a curb at 200+km/h and losing most of your downforce in the blink of an eye? It's called driver error. Your head weighs 160lbs. Your body weighs more than half a ton. Mistakes will happen much more often than they would at much lower speeds and g-forces. Given that most of the downforce in the X1 comes from the fan suction and once the car gets up on the curb a lot of that suction and therefore downforce will disappear, if you are anywhere near the limits of the car, you will crash.

 

[Exorcet]

5g is not 8g.

Right, but 8g isn't necessarily an arbitrary number. 5 g would be a lower bound.

Of course it doesn't have to pull 8g. Doesn't have to pull 5 g either. Doesn't have to pull 1g. You could put a lawnmower engine in it and let your granny drive it too. How does that bear any relevance to taking this fantasy machine anywhere near it's designed limits in the real world? Answer: it doesn't.

Putting a lawn mower engine in it has no relevance correct. Building tracks for the car instead of assuming it has to drive on all existing tracks even if it doesn't make any sense does.

Why are you in the position of being on a curb at 200+km/h and losing most of your downforce in the blink of an eye? It's called driver error.

It would be huge error if the track had no curb and the car physically couldn't reach 200 km/h on the track.

Your head weighs 160lbs. Your body weighs more than half a ton. Mistakes will happen much more often than they would at much lower speeds and g-forces.

Air racing exceeds X1 forces handily. There have been zero fatalities.

Given that most of the downforce in the X1 comes from the fan suction and once the car gets up on the curb a lot of that suction and therefore downforce will disappear, if you are anywhere near the limits of the car, you will crash.

There doesn't need to be a curb. If the fan loses suction, the rest of the car can make up for it. Active aero. It would only cost some drag. The car itself could also prevent you from exceeding its limits.

 

[CC570]

Air racing exceeds X1 forces handily. There have been zero fatalities.

False

 

[Sixflags48]

I like the idea of the X1, but I kinda wish it wasn't so darn fast. I would like something between the speed of the LMP1 cars and the F1 cars that looked like the X1, but with monthly updates to the cars aero and drivetrain. We would also need some other cars to rival it. It could be like a virtual F1.

Edit: Unless it would compete with the vision GT cars

 

[sparkytooth]

And the X1 isn't?

The X cars are over 970PP machines. No machines reach this level, and if they do, they're still easily crushed by the X1's sheer performance capability. The X14 is surely going to be even more ridiculous, even more aerodynamic and faster. Making it even more overpowered than the last two machines.

You can, you just need to handicap the FGT.

Your common streetcar cannot match a machine that is built for racing. No matter how big the handicap your FF Civic will not match an MR Formula 1 lookalike car that has gobs of aero and is built for racing.

Which is why the X1 is the hardest of all cars to use to ruin a race.

The lack of options to limit machines allows this car to compete at 900pp+ levels. Some :censored:hat the other day pulled a detuned X1 on everyone else's FGTs. GT needs more precise options in online lobbies and hopefully GT6 is fixing this.

So?

I'm still waiting to see why the car isn't realistic. Fans have been around forever. 450 km/h cars have been around even longer. 1500 hp engines aren't unheard of. Newey might have been taken things and used the best case, but nothing on the car to me seems outright impossible.

Fan cars have existed, but 1500HP V6s require serious Dark Magic to even be believable. You're also forgetting that this thing is a deathtrap without the right equipment and no tyres are able to withstand the abuse this machine puts on them. The Veyron had a special tyre specifically designed to be used at speeds of 240+ MPH, but they still wear out quite fast and are very expensive. The Veyron SS is limited to 254 MPH because the tyres can't withstand further abuse. The X1, with 1500HP and the ability to corner at speeds of over 200KMH murders tyres twice as fast. And being a racecar, you want to race it right? It would be twice as expensive as an F1 car to race on the tyres alone if the magical wonder tyres are ever possible for this machine. And still you'd have to throw them away every lap under abuse from the car, or you'd be driving your coffin. Totally impractical as a racecar with current technology.

No this is a completely backwards idea. It's like saying that LMP's should only be able to race LMP's. Or that Skylines should only be able to race Skylines. No. The host chooses what goes. I don't need you telling me how to run a race, especially if what you're suggesting provides not a single positive benefit to anyone.

You can't compare mere streetcars to LMPs and F1 cars. The X1 sits on top of all these cars and there isn't really a comparable machine performance wise. LMPs usually compete against each other or with Group C cars (GT5 even has an option to limit the races to these machines only). Skylines, like all other normal street cars can be compared with machines with similar power levels and performance, not a spaceship.

The X1 (and all cars) should be allowed anywhere, unless the host says no. If a hosted wanted, they should be able to set up a room for all cars (including X1) except for the Mazda Miata. Why are they banning the Miata? Because the host has final say.

Sure, but the host isn't usually the smartest person in the lobby. A good room usually finds a balance between the PP classes and drivetrains, as well as power levels for the machines and permitted tyres. They usually just make the X1 moot anyway. But with the current options in GT5, we can't pick specific cars to ban from the room.

I've raced it against LMP's in a fair race, so that isn't true. There is also a video on Youtube where one is raced against a Fiat 500 in a fair race. Like any other car, it can race against any other car and there is no reason to issue pointless limitations on it. In fact pointless limitations should be avoided everywhere in the game.

That's the biggest load of Poppycock I have ever heard on GTP.

If it was gone, the FGT would far outmatch. If the FGT was gone the LMP's would far outmatch... the Lotus Elise would far outmatch...

No because you can limit all the machines you want. As I said before, we should have more options for limiting cars. And the X1 is a special kind of fast.

Disclaimer: These are options peoples, open to the host.

Every car in the game.

Not every car in the game is as obnoxious as the X1, probably the Tank Car and the Veyron but this is the king of trolling as far as online goes. And little timmy can't really handle cornering that hard and reaching such top speeds.

If we're not forced to touch GT Mode at all, fine.

You can still have it in Arcade if you want to drive it that bad.

It doesn't have to be. This part should be optional and only done voluntarily.

Half of the game's soul would be lost in my eyes and it wouldn't be as fun as it used to.

It has the same use as every other car. I've raced it against other cars. I've raced it against itself. It never felt any different than racing anything else.

I just can't find much of a use for it outside of a track car and occasional picture machine. It's frowned upon online so much already.

This is a good way to make it not useful for racing. Just make it so that no one can get it.

Not necessarily super hard. You can get it by either completing a certain set of events, by golding S license or through a special event. Not having it given away to you just because. It keeps little Timmy from getting into uber obnoxious mode.

You can still have this, there just needs to be a separate mode for unlocking things. I like simulators because driving is fun. I don't anticpate being able to afford a 2000 car garage in reality any time soon, so have 2000 cars for $60 at no effort is quite appealing. I don't want to spend $60 putting myself to sleep by making a useless credit counter go up. I'd like to drive.

Don't get me wrong, I love driving but I also want to challenge myself by getting all sorts of machines through my own troubles.

A-Spec can only ever be a waste of time as far as I'm concerned, but I realize that others have different opinions. As long as both sides can be satisfied, I think PD should try to accommodate them.

I personally prefer getting cars GT4 style. PD should strike a balance. How, I dunno.

 

[Exorcet]

Well I can't figure out where multi quote went but:

My bad on air race safety record, I was referring to Red Bull Air Racing specifically.

On the X1 being too fast, power limiter and weight ballast can fix this. The car is very fun to drive at minimum PP

sparkytooth: It doesn't matter what the X1's PP is, it's like all the other cars. Some cars outclass other cars, that's natural. In fact the PP gap between the X1 and most other things makes it the least troublesome car in the game. Don't want it in? Use PP limit.

You also don't know anything about the 2014 car, which in GT6 may be far slower than the GT5 version while having much better stats.

Yes, you do just need to handicap the FGT. Have it start a lap behind or whatever you need to do. Any two cars can have a fair race and there is no reason to put limitations on those races just because some people don't want to participate in them.

30 years ago 1000 HP V-6's were running around in F1. 1500 isn't a total fantasy. The Veyron has 240 mph tires yes. This isn't relevent to the X1 in either GT or real life though.

What I said about "classes" makes perfect sense. If you think the X1 should only race the X1 then why not just let the game take all freedom from you. If you select an LMP it will prevent anyone else from picking anything but an LMP. Pick a Skyline, and everyone else is forced to do the same. Sounds fun.

You can call it poppycock it doesn't make it less true. I've had fair races with LMP cars while driving X1's. It doesn't take much imagination to figure out how.

Timmy is a scapegoat. I'd almost be willing to bet that many of the trolls are people who can afford the DLC on their on. The X1 is a car I've never had a problem with. It's hard enough to even find one online. The king of troll cars is any car that can enter your race lobby. More often than not, this means the X1 isn't it.

 

[sparkytooth]

About the V6s, I don't follow F1 to know but 1500hp+ (My X11 has 1530) from a V6 seems kinda ludicrous. The tyres are relevant in real life if you want it to exist as there currently aren't any tyres that can take the abuse the Xcar puts on them, GT5 because it barely has a tyre model.

About the PP system, it's broken, PD only takes into account the basic stats such as HP, Weight and Aerodynamics in a car to assign it a PP value. You can just as easily detune an X1 to 900pp in a 900pp room like the one I was in and destroy everyone just as easily. It can't enter many lower PP classes though, whew.....

The X14 might only just have improved aero over the 2011 car, which classes it up even further in the PP chain and cornering speed/tyre murder. We don't know yet, most likely not slower than the last car.

And you're ignoring the fact that I stated that limiting machines to certain cars and classes should be an OPTION, not forced, that's why you have a host in the lobby that can regulate this or turn it into a circus depending on how he runs the room. All PD needs to do is expand upon the OPTIONS already available in GT5; fix the PP system, more precise classification of the machines, allow more OPTIONS in vehicle selection and limitations. Of course these should be OPTIONS, in no way am I trying to force it.

The Fiat 500 race sounds absolutely stupid unless you're screwing around with a buddy.

I also guess you've never been to a cruise, TGTT or drift lobby.

 

[Johnnypenso]

@sparkytooth I think you've hit the nail on the head with lobby options. GT6 definitely needs more ways to control all levels of cars in open lobbies instead of hosts having to police by observation. Things like toggling on and off car types like Race Car, Production Car, Tuner Car, Concept Car etc. And within each category also limit it to certain types of cars. Production cars, JDM only or Nissan and Honda only or whatever combination you prefer.

With proper parameters for inclusion and exclusion it would take care of any and all troll cars at the hosts discretion, unlike now, where it's generally either PP or Weight/HP or handful of other rarely used limitations around manufacturers and a couple of car types/series, which is too broad a focus to cover all types of racing.

Once that's done, you'll just be left with the trolls...lol..but at least they'll be in an equal car.

 

[sparkytooth]

@sparkytooth I think you've hit the nail on the head with lobby options. GT6 definitely needs more ways to control all levels of cars in open lobbies instead of hosts having to police by observation. Things like toggling on and off car types like Race Car, Production Car, Tuner Car, Concept Car etc. And within each category also limit it to certain types of cars. Production cars, JDM only or Nissan and Honda only or whatever combination you prefer.

With proper parameters for inclusion and exclusion it would take care of any and all troll cars at the hosts discretion, unlike now, where it's generally either PP or Weight/HP or handful of other rarely used limitations around manufacturers and a couple of car types/series, which is too broad a focus to cover all types of racing.

Once that's done, you'll just be left with the trolls...lol..but at least they'll be in an equal car.

Precisely. PD must also fix the current PP system, they shouldn't simply assign a single value to a machine out of HP/weight and Aero, they should also take into account the parts installed, the handling characteristics of the machine, lateral Gs, the torque and RPM values and many more things that define a single machine, then you can have really close racing with no NSXs and Bimmers ruining your fun and turning it into a Cheapfest.

 

[RandomCarGuy17]

I'm fine with the x2014 personally. Sure, it could be one more troll car to add to the mix, but it's nothing compared to the hybrid chaos I deal with on GT5 online already. I'm curious on how fast it'll be compared to its predecessors.

 

[SonicCharmeleon]

I think it should definitely be really hard to get so noobs can't get it.

 

[eran0004]

Why did you ignore the part about the car being able to pull 8G's in a turn? Fighter jets pull 8G's and the pilots are almost at the point of blacking out. Yes, they have G-suits which inflate certain parts of the suit to prevent the pilot from going unconscious. This is impractical for a racecar. Pulling G-forces this high on a track with lots of turns in a race would leave the drivers with serious injuries. The human body is not capable of handling this kind of abuse.

And I haven't even spoke about the crash scenarios (which there will be). The fan on the car is only useful when the car is extremely close to the ground. Say you ride up against the curbstones on the Nürburgring GP course. When you lift the car off the ground, the fan is useless and when you're doing 120 around a hairpin turn, the outcome won't be pretty. What if you're doing 250 MPH down a straightaway and your brakes fail? Yes, it's happened with prototype cars in the past doing 200 MPH, but in a very small car like the X1 with a large canopy overhead, you'll fly through the canopy and die.

I can recommend this for further reading, on high G's in racing: http://csel.eng.ohio-state.edu/voshell/gforce.pdf

When it comes to blacking out, it's an issue in airplanes and banked corners, because the G's push you down in the seat and the blood gets pushed down from the head an into the legs. In a non-banked turn, blacking out is not an issue, but instead the neck is subject to heavy forces from the head and the helmet (which can be taken care of to some degree by designing neck support).

The human body is best suited to sustain horizontal G's, like when you're accelerating or deccelerating in a car.

Further on, high G's for a short period of time (like a narrow corner) is better than high G's for a long period of time (like the long banked corners of a NASCAR oval, or the Route X in GT5.

So X1's raced on NASCAR ovals would probably not be a good idea. X1's raced on circuits with narrow, unbanked corners (such as the road course on Twin Ring Motegi) might be better, because most of the G's would be from accelerating and braking, while cornering only occurs for short periods of time and with long straights between each corner.

As for the crash scenario, one could argue that wings are more dangerous than fans, because wings only work when the car goes forward. Catch a spin and you lose all downforce. The fan works in all directions, as long as the car stay near the ground. The fan also works at all speeds, while the effect of wings increases with speed (which also means that if you stay in the draft behind another car, your wings lose some effect, while the fan doesn't).

As for flying through the canopy, one must assume that the driver is wearing a seatbelt. F1 cars has neither roof nor canopy and drivers are very rarely flying through the air. Speeds of up to 500 km/h would require bigger runoff areas,
but racetracks has been changed continously as safety requirements have evolved, so it's not impossible that the same could happen in an X1 scenario.

So given the right type of track, adequate neck support and sufficient runoff areas, I'd call the X1 a plausible racing machine.

 

[snowgt]

About the V6s, I don't follow F1 to know but 1500hp+ (My X11 has 1530) from a V6 seems kinda ludicrous.

Next year there will be 1.6l V6's in Formula 1 that will put out about 700hp with a single turbo (and an additional electric system adding more power). And that's with a lot of restrictions as to what they are allowed to do and what not to keep it from becoming too expensive to build them. The X2010's engine was perceived to be a 3.0l Twin Turbo with no restrictions imposed on it. Yes, this can have 1500hp.

Not that I'm a fan of this car or ever want to drive it again.

 

[eran0004]

Next year there will be 1.6l V6's in Formula 1 that will put out about 700hp with a single turbo.

And the Renault EF15C used in the Lotus 98T (Ayrton Senna, anyone?) developed 1200 to 1300 BHP back in 1986. 1.5 liter turbo V6.

 

[GMHV8]

As rediculous and pointless as that car is I think it would be fun to have a 2014 version just for fun, it can be a fun car to an extent.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I can recommend this for further reading, on high G's in racing: http://csel.eng.ohio-state.edu/voshell/gforce.pdf

When it comes to blacking out, it's an issue in airplanes and banked corners, because the G's push you down in the seat and the blood gets pushed down from the head an into the legs. In a non-banked turn, blacking out is not an issue, but instead the neck is subject to heavy forces from the head and the helmet (which can be taken care of to some degree by designing neck support).

The human body is best suited to sustain horizontal G's, like when you're accelerating or deccelerating in a car.

Further on, high G's for a short period of time (like a narrow corner) is better than high G's for a long period of time (like the long banked corners of a NASCAR oval, or the Route X in GT5.

So X1's raced on NASCAR ovals would probably not be a good idea. X1's raced on circuits with narrow, unbanked corners (such as the road course on Twin Ring Motegi) might be better, because most of the G's would be from accelerating and braking, while cornering only occurs for short periods of time and with long straights between each corner.

As for the crash scenario, one could argue that wings are more dangerous than fans, because wings only work when the car goes forward. Catch a spin and you lose all downforce. The fan works in all directions, as long as the car stay near the ground. The fan also works at all speeds, while the effect of wings increases with speed (which also means that if you stay in the draft behind another car, your wings lose some effect, while the fan doesn't).

As for flying through the canopy, one must assume that the driver is wearing a seatbelt. F1 cars has neither roof nor canopy and drivers are very rarely flying through the air. Speeds of up to 500 km/h would require bigger runoff areas,
but racetracks has been changed continously as safety requirements have evolved, so it's not impossible that the same could happen in an X1 scenario.

So given the right type of track, adequate neck support and sufficient runoff areas, I'd call the X1 a plausible racing machine.

The fan only works perfectly when the car is in close proximity to the ground. Break contact, lose downforce, fly off the track at 300 km/h, although it's possible the car could be equipped with some kind of "autoslowdown" device that might avoid that.

The biggest issue for me is that I would thing the cornering speeds would be so great, combined with the tremendous loads on the body, quite in excess of F1 g forces, that would make the car undriveable at it's limit for any sustained period. I just don't think human reaction times are that good. Can it be driven, yes? Slow it down, put a rev limiter on it, detune the motor, have a top speed limit and of course you could motor it around a track. But then you're just moving at F1 speeds or a little better and that doesn't really mean anything, we already know that can be done. I just don't think it could approach anything close to it's potential in real life.