Your thoughts about "standard" vs. "premium"

[CoolColJ]

Well you know none of the PC sims have even 200 cars....?

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Well would you rather have 200 really detailed cars only, or the 200 cars + 800 more?

It's a no brainer, and not many other games have that many cars of the same detail as well. It's a bit like GT3 in that regard, new engine, new console and it had 150 cars. GT1 had like 170 odd, but you notice the 2nd game on each console had a massive leap in content. History repeating itself, but each generation gets harder to create the content due to rising details, resolutions, demands and expectations

Even then I still haven't collected more than 100 of the 700+ cars in GT4. Hell I haven't even driven half of them!
So it's cool to be able to get a chance to do so in a better game engine again on the positive side. GT4 's flickering and jaggies give me headaches! Most of the cars I wouldn't be bothered driving anyway, unless I actually owned them in real life. Various FWD hatches and sedans, and shopping trollies

At least the aftermarket wheels you add to the other 800 cars will be highly detailed GT5 editions, not like flat discs in GT4

Though I find it odd, they couldn't retrofit high beams on the standard cars, it suggest they actually modelled proper high beams off each light in the Premium cars, rather than slapping on a generic high beam

 

[daus26]

Some of you guys are insane. I honestly think PD is doing us a favor with getting 800 cars over to GT5. If I had a choice between just over 200 cars or 200 cars WITH 800 beautifully enough, exterior-modeled cars, I'd take the second choice hands down, especially on the fact that I've been dealing with it for the past 13 years.

The thing is, the premium cars is the standard that PD and Kaz wants in GT5. If they focused on getting interiors on all 1000 cars, that standard would be much lower, in fact probably horrid. Think about the 800 cars as a favor, otherwise we'd be just getting 200 cars, which isn't that much imo, since they vary a lot in types like road, Le Mans, F1, Nascar, and Rally.

 

[alucard0712]

Agree.
Today game takes like 10-20 times more time than PS2 era - judge yourself.That's why many companies making "engines" for game-devs.To save time.

 

[Tomaz]

Also why we need this instead of decent cockpit for another 2 cars?

Exactly!

I really dont care how cars looks behind my seat, Im not driving it looking back, im driving it looking FORWARD!

Really ****ed up thing!

 

[SonicVolcano]

Over 200 cars which are fully detailed are a lot, to be honest. Hell, I'm used to playing games like TDU which "only" feature 90 cars (which is basically enough for me). It would still be fun driving those other 800 cars, since I've only played GT5.

Maybe Kaz has some more surprises in stock for us. You never know. In addition, I haven't read a clear statement that standard cars don't support cockpit view.

Yeah, first post here

 

[GTDutch]

NEWSFLASH: KY loves the skyline so much that he decided to make 50 Premium versions of it in GT5 👍

i will find that hilarious if true while also being a little disappointed if the repetition in premium models is too great. I do expect a little repetition though (nascars for instance). But still im confident that PD will provide a good cross spectrum of vehicle types and vintages for all the cockpit lovers out there. But at the end of the day, Ive not played GT5P or the other new cockpit console games so as long all the cars have consequences attached then im very happy with the GT5 ive seen so far and ill continue to enjoy it (probably moreso) as i have for GT1-4, cockpit or no cockpit.

btw, i voted for wishing PD didnt get our hopes up, the no cockpit deal was a bit of a surprise.

 

[McLaren]

The Difference is, Dan Greenawalt is arrogant, Forza 3 is good but it is far from being "definitive". Kaznouri Yamauchi is respectful, he once mentioned that he has played GT's rival games. He could have been rude, but he was always respectful when talking about them... unlike Dan & Che who took every opportunity to slate GT.

Uh, no. Last I checked, Dan actually revealed that GT was the inspiration for him to guy out & buy a 3000GT because it drove so well in the game.

GT fans, as someone said, are so quick to give Turn10 crap & let Polyphony get away with it. 👎

 

[daus26]

Uh, no. Last I checked, Dan actually revealed that GT was the inspiration for him to guy out & buy a 3000GT because it drove so well in the game.

GT fans, as someone said, are so quick to give Turn10 crap & let Polyphony get away with it. 👎

You also gotta remember the part where he also said PD is old school and has pass the baton to him and the FM series.

 

[X-Power]

Uh, no. Last I checked, Dan actually revealed that GT was the inspiration for him to guy out & buy a 3000GT because it drove so well in the game.

GT fans, as someone said, are so quick to give Turn10 crap & let Polyphony get away with it. 👎

... which he later said wasn't a very good car and blamed GT.

 

[JohnBM01]

I'll vote later. I think a lot of people are going to be disappointed in that only so many cars get the whole premium treatment. I think we'd be waiting until 2015 or 2020 if PD were continually hard at work making every last car Premium spec. I like to look at this as a tough decision for PD to make since cars were taking so long. If the game was any more delayed, more and more people would forget of GT5's existance. More people would probably think the polar ice caps will completely melt before GT5 is released. To me, 200 Premium cars is better than 20. While I love cockpit view, I'm not extremely worried that not all cars will have this treatment. I'm not going to only focus on one aspect to determine what an ENTIRE game is about. A lot of people are looking at GT5 along the line of... "The Real Reverse Lights Simulator." Whatever happened to the racing? Whatever happened to the innovations GT5 provides that GTs past haven't featured? Face it- 700+ cars with this Premium treatment would take even longer for this game to be released. It's a tough decision to me rather than all out laziniess. Like I said in another blog- think of EA Sports games re-hashing most of the same content, but do you hear people complaining to the high heavens about any serious evolution?

If there's one thing I worry about with cars from the Standard vs. Premium aspect, it's tuning. We have no real idea what the tuning front will bring for GT5, but I want to wonder how the eventual tuning options will affect how cars are tuned in Gran Turismo 5. Will there be things like makeshift rollcages? Something of a GT wing? Rendered upgrades for cars (like a proper racing muffler for a street car)? That's what I want to learn in the coming months about this game involving the Standard cars.

One last note- it may be a tough move not to apply Premium treatment for all the cars, but I think (in fears of getting a negative reaction) this is a smart move. Do you think PD would properly and accurately re-create the exterior and interior of a 1990 Honda CR-X, a Honda Odyssey (regardless of the year), a Beetle RSi, or any car like that? And I don't think it's like we're going to seriously miss any of the GT cars of the past. There weren't many complaints when the Team Oreca Viper in GT4 was basically ported from GT3. It's not a popular thing for me to say, but it's smart to include these Standard cars. Having 200 Premium cars is still much better than only 20, 2, 100, or even just ONE Premium car.

In the future, I think PD needs to either find ways to re-create car interiors and cars quicker or maybe not try to seek absolute perfection with everything in the game. They can downsize without downsizing too much to where the game would run on a PlayStation 2 than a PS3. Maybe another aspect to downsizing in the graphics and details department would be including more cars to race on a track. I think it will probably be decades to where we'll see a Gran Turismo game having anything like the very first GTR featuring up to 70 or so cars to a track.

A lot of variables, but I think this is a smart move by PD. It would take too long to do every last car in Premium spec. Question is, how will PD try to overcome these shortcomings, and will these shortcomings be the deal-breaker in the long run? I'm thinking big picture here.

 

[Devedander]

You also gotta remember the part where he also said PD is old school and has pass the baton to him and the FM series.

I think it was more along the lines of GT wasn't inovating anymore and he wanted T10 to take what GT had started and continue it with new features and inovations that the genre needed.

And if you look at where we are today I think FM has done that in some key ways and has created a sepereate experience in the same genre that is very enjoyable and also got the ball rolling again on inovation both for FM and GT.

I honestly don't think we would have seen some of the key features we are seeing in GT if a fire wasn't under PD's ass from how impressive FM was.

Granted it didn't turn out to be a GT killer but I think FM has earned a decent amount of respect for what it has accomplished and spawned some much needed competition.

 

[daus26]

I think it was more along the lines of GT wasn't inovating anymore and he wanted T10 to take what GT had started and continue it with new features and inovations that the genre needed.

And if you look at where we are today I think FM has done that in some key ways and has created a sepereate experience in the same genre that is very enjoyable and also got the ball rolling again on inovation both for FM and GT.

I honestly don't think we would have seen some of the key features we are seeing in GT if a fire wasn't under PD's ass from how impressive FM was.

Granted it didn't turn out to be a GT killer but I think FM has earned a decent amount of respect for what it has accomplished and spawned some much needed competition.

If that's the case, then it'd be true, but only in the online community part and the customization. Other than that, not much innovation from FM3.

Still, to say GT is completely old school is like saying the GT franchise is done and FM is going to take over. He even said that not knowing much what GT has up in store. In the end it's GT that raises the bar and innovative experience like dynamic night racing, Rally, F1, Nascar, and so on.

 

[cicohipe]

I think it was more along the lines of GT wasn't inovating anymore and he wanted T10 to take what GT had started and continue it with new features and inovations that the genre needed.

And if you look at where we are today I think FM has done that in some key ways and has created a sepereate experience in the same genre that is very enjoyable and also got the ball rolling again on inovation both for FM and GT.

I honestly don't think we would have seen some of the key features we are seeing in GT if a fire wasn't under PD's ass from how impressive FM was.

Granted it didn't turn out to be a GT killer but I think FM has earned a decent amount of respect for what it has accomplished and spawned some much needed competition.

Agreed. But damn i hate that Dan Greenwhalt guy... I mean ffs it's For-za not Fort-za

 

[McLaren]

... which he later said wasn't a very good car and blamed GT.

Proof of that, please. He said things got ugly, but he never blamed GT.

 

[II IVORBIGUN II]

I voted DLC packs after release.

Have to say im personally not that bothered. After what I have seen and read from E3 im delighted with how GT5 is shaping up.

I will say though that after reading some of the comments on this forum if the GT planet community was responsible for developing GT5 the game would never be released!

 

[Pakt Sardine]

Ugh.

In my opinion, I think we obviously haven't seen everything yet. I have a feeling what's to come is going make this cockpit issue fade. Personally, I'm just glad to have a fresh, new GT game. Am I disappointed? Sure. Then again, I don't know what PD went through in the last five years, so I'm not going to make assumptions.

 

[TokyoDrift]

As much as I don't really care, I think the fact that there is a separation of car classes is not good for the series. They would have been better off making all 1000+ cars to the same level of detail, with cockpits, mechanical damage, and whatever "panel damage" the licensing will allow. Also, quite why standard cars don't have high-beam lights is beyond me. I could understand it if they didn't have lights at all, but they do. Clearly they made a decision there to not give standard cars high beam in order to further justify the "Premium" tag on the others. Bad move.

 

[Rattlehead]

Personally, I think it would be better it they were not wasting time on 800 old-detailed cars and focused on creating about 100-200 additional premium cars instead.
And the rest followed in the form of DLC.
That would be optimal in terms of time needed to do this work, but maintaining Premium detalisation for every car.

 

[Hiroke]

I'm not sure what PD was thinking. It's almost as if the standard cars are there just to up the car list to the 1000 mark. I'd much rather have less cars, say 400, all with premium levels of detail or perhaps 600 cars with not quite as much detail as the premium models but all with interior view. Either way a single standard would have been much better.

After getting accustomed to the interior view in GT5P, the exclusion of said view from the standard cars was one of my biggest concerns with GT5, however it's just something we have to accept. I already decided that I'm not really going to bother with the standard cars. Hopefully additional DLC premium models will be available in future.

 

[Sturdy]

Though I find it odd, they couldn't retrofit high beams on the standard cars, it suggest they actually modelled proper high beams off each light in the Premium cars, rather than slapping on a generic high beam

The 'Standard' lights don't actually cast any proper light onto the track, only the high beams are proper lights that light things up.

Watch the standard cars montage to see what I mean, mainly the clip with the Le Mans series cars (Bentley Speed 8 for example).

This might mean standard cars can't do night rallying (as that's simply too dark to do without proper lights) or that the cars don't have proper lights on stages that aren't properly at night? I'm unsure to be honest.

I haven't read this pointed out anywhere so thought I'd chuck it out there...

 

[gtracedriver]

Actually I am still confused about this standard vs premium cars

We can't race against premium and standard cars right ?

How many max number of premium cars we can have in a race, 16 like with standard cars or is it limited to 12 or 8 cars ?

Also I think they will have some cockpit view and the standard models will look great because after driving premium cars going back to standard will be like playing a different game

 

[phosphor112]

I don't think I would have mind as much if the gap of the level of detail between both types wasn't so large. Like TokyoDrift mentioned. Why not add all high/low beams to ALL cars... I mean, it's like they really got side tracked and didn't pay attention to how much time they had to get all this done. Yes the standard cars look really good regardless, but they haven't included much of an upgrade to the cars at all other than going from the old game engine to the new one.

I can understand the whole thing though. GT3 had what... 300 cars? GT4 had 700+. It'll probably the same thing with GT5 and GT6, but reviewers will definitely knock this game down for not having them all the same, regardless of level of detail.

Agreed. But damn i hate that Dan Greenwhalt guy... I mean ffs it's For-za not Fort-za

It's Fort-za. It's an Italian word. Though the "t" sound shouldn't be as powerful as they make it out to be.

 

[Stevisiov]

Actually I am still confused about this standard vs premium cars

We can't race against premium and standard cars right ?

How many max number of premium cars we can have in a race, 16 like with standard cars or is it limited to 12 or 8 cars ?

Also I think they will have some cockpit view and the standard models will look great because after driving premium cars going back to standard will be like playing a different game

I certainly hope we can!

I wouldn't worry too much, there already seems to be a video of 16 premium cars on the nurburgring, there no reason why they couldn't fit 16 standard cars.

My opinions on the whole standard/premium thing, is that I am not all that bothered. The standard cars actually look pretty good in general, its really not such a big a deal as some people are making out.

 

[Sannyasin]

Well my thought on all this is pretty simple

All cars will have driving camera(inside the car)
200 cars will have fully designed cockpits that can me deformed
800 cars will only have the dashboard and some others basics things...so this 800 cars won't have the seats(when you look back) or the other things when you look left or right.

 

[phosphor112]

Well my thought on all this is pretty simple

All cars will have driving camera(inside the car)
200 cars will have fully designed cockpits that can me deformed
800 cars will only have the dashboard and some others basics things...so this 800 cars won't have the seats(when you look back) or the other things when you look left or right.

Makes a lot of sense, but they'd still have to model a somewhat accurate cockpit, even if it is lacking detail. It's not like they can throw a generic cockpit into EVERY car. Would seem very... low quality.

 

[CAMAROBOY69]

They have 2 options at this point.
1. Bump the game another year or 2 and make ALL the cars premium.
2. Release the game in November and continue to update the game making more and more of the cars premium.

Regardless if only 20% are premium and 80% are not then the game is still not finished.

 

[Sannyasin]

Makes a lot of sense, but they'd still have to model a somewhat accurate cockpit, even if it is lacking detail. It's not like they can throw a generic cockpit into EVERY car. Would seem very... low quality.

Ye true. Well I'm still buying this game anyway. Just hope that Hachi-Roku is a premium car

 

[Paolosev91]

Cockpit view is the view of SIMULATION
no cockpit view means that only 20% of cars will be really fun to drive, and the other ones will not have "personality". Personally I think I will only drive that 200 cars in the final game. Think about rfactor, gtr2... is there any car without an internal view? No, because they are simulation games. Gt will be played by a lot of only joypad users, wich will like much to use external view and look at that beautiful modeled car, spinning through the circuit... but people like me, who want a simulation game will be TOTALLY DISAPPOINTED, and will only buy premium cars in the game. Imagine that you are used to cockpit view, then you have to buy an Honda Civic to complete the Civic cup, and you have to drive with the hood cam! It will be so fucxxxng disappointing

-edit-
I can't believe that cars like the low-hp cars from gt5 prologue are premium cars, they will be downgraded to standard cars, but they have a cockpit view! I am sure that they didn't calculate heavy damage on city cars, so, what about their pretty nice cockpits? Will they throw them away? Or did they calculate complex damage on city cars just to make them be premium cars? That's an important point I think.

 

[Zimmerd]

There are a lot of options available..
But the only condition for me is : NO DELAY

 

[STJ88]

I would be happy with a 2 year delay if we get 1000 premium cars!