1.05 Satisfaction Poll

[Furinkazen]

@Famine There are major problems with online leagues. This is what i've experienced:

~Random grip losses at certain corners - driver takes turn exact same as other laps, and yet they lose all grip.

~Servers are a major bugbear. Rooms freeze for no reason. The entire game lags and skips for ALL people concerned, forcing a new lobby to be created.

~Invisible cars - on GT5 you couldn't see each other on both ends. On GT6 one person can see someone who can't see them. Pretty severe and in need of patching.

~Physics changes - at 5% surface water dry racing tyres grip better than they do in the dry.

~Game sound looping and dissapearing.

~Constant disconnections, worse than Gran Turismo 5.

 

[Famine]

This is what i've experienced:

Nope. Literally never come across any of those things. In fact it's been more stable than GT5 for me and our regular lobby.

When you say "servers", are you sure you mean servers? GT6 is peer-to-peer - so although some data is exchanged with servers (presumably local SCE ones primarily rather than PD ones), the lion's share is as straight line between the consoles as it can be. Which is useful when you plug seven of them into the same switch

In all honesty, I didn't even read all of this. This topic isn't important enough for me to read a small novel.

But important enough for you to keep responding...

I seen that you mentioned you've had no problems with online leagues, and I assure you people that set up leagues of any length - would agree with me that it certainly makes it hard.

Since we have had no issues, I offered to compare notes to see if we could come up with a solution. I also suggested it may be localised and SCEA may be able to help you if you call/e-mail them.

You know how I feel toward the topic, and regardless of how much you twist what I say, it won't change.

I haven't twisted or altered a single word you've said. I merely asked you a question, to which you responded with an wholly inappropriate response and a smiley.

You know what the majority of people want.

Actually, no. No-one does really - but I already made that point, presumably in a bit you didn't read.

 

[MOTORTRENDmitch]

Since we have had no issues, I offered to compare notes to see if we could come up with a solution.

Refer to the "notes" Furinkazen just posted.

I haven't twisted or altered a single word you've said. I merely asked you a question, to which you responded with an wholly inappropriate response and a smiley.

ok
Allow me to do the same -

 

[Tornado]

I'm satisfied with the update for no other reason than is assuages my concerns about the "GT6 to be abandoned for GT7" rumor.

 

[MOTORTRENDmitch]

Your whip, what is it?

Hint:
Drivetrain- FR
6-Speed Manual
American
More power than a C7 Corvette.

EDIT: YES!!

Found it!!

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/post-a-pic-of-your-real-car.14747/page-246#post-8442096

 

[4everdelayed]

All of this would be shut up partly if PD fixed online. The glitches and errors still remaining are pretty visible, yet they won't fix them.

Bro it's your fault bro. Plenty of information online regarding the bugs. Even if you didn't know, it's your fault for not looking it up. You should have known better bro. Stop complaining. Don't you get it? Geez.

 

[OdeFinn]

I was expecting PD to fix current problems, nothing more. That's what they failed.
Having some old GT5 options back in GT series won't compromise lack of fixing problems on current product.

Big promises for upcoming updates isn't the issue, but bugs on current version are.

 

[Furinkazen]

Nope. Literally never come across any of those things. In fact it's been more stable than GT5 for me and our regular lobby.

When you say "servers", are you sure you mean servers? GT6 is peer-to-peer - so although some data is exchanged with servers (presumably local SCE ones primarily rather than PD ones), the lion's share is as straight line between the consoles as it can be. Which is useful when you plug seven of them into the same switch

You obviously haven't played enough then Famine. And it isn't isolated problems on my end. You are lucky. And if you want more information... Hmmm... I could ask @V8-Johnboy @rolo912011 @Scaniabebe @gokartman78 @Gedi69 and a ton more that as well

EDIT Forgot the tyre glitch when lobby is set to 1 mandatory stop -it randomly only allows comfort tyres to be equipped.

 

[LVracerGT]

@Famine- I don't have much time to respond, but I would like to politely point out that you seem to be shrugging off the problems with GT6 just because you don't have them. Just because this is the case doesn't mean they don't exist for a lot of people, and it has been documented wholly here as such.

Also, you seem very willing to point out that it's our fault for getting worked up over a small update, but you are ignoring (seem to be anyway) the fact that we get worked up based on what PD and Sony tells us, and also what they don't tell us, if you get what I mean.

It's a double edge sword I know, but in this case I believe it's sharper on PD/Son's end.

Edited for typos, grammar.

 

[ace004]

When PD stated there would be a course maker, community features, and monthly track dlc my group of friends thought we would have it by now. It's not unreasonable to think these features that some were in gt5 would take less than 3 months to implement. My friends have now stopped playing gt6 because it's becoming stale to them, and it's starting to irritate me as well. We customers have a right to be pissed and PD was very misleading in the features they promised. I'm mostly mad because half the people on my friends list aren't playing anymore and I blame that on PD.

 

[twitcher]

Nope. Literally never come across any of those things. In fact it's been more stable than GT5 for me and our regular lobby.

When you say "servers", are you sure you mean servers? GT6 is peer-to-peer - so although some data is exchanged with servers (presumably local SCE ones primarily rather than PD ones), the lion's share is as straight line between the consoles as it can be.But important enough for you to keep responding...Since we have had no issues, I offered to compare notes to see if we could come up with a solution. I also suggested it may be localised and SCEA may be able to help you if you call/e-mail them.I haven't twisted or altered a single word you've said. I merely asked you a question, to which you responded with an wholly inappropriate response and a smiley.Actually, no. No-one does really - but I already made that point, presumably in a bit you didn't read.

I'm not questioning your statement that you haven't had issues with the online aspect of GT6 yourself, but I think it's pretty fare to say, based on what has been brought up on GTP, as well as my own experience, that there are a LOT of people who have a LOT of issues with online.

Our drift team hosts a weekly drift lobby on Thur nights, something we've been doing for a few years now. Yes, there were connection issues with GT5, but not nearly as bad as with GT6.

- lobbies routinely freeze, forcing everyone to leave and the lobby to be remade. This seems to happen most often when either starting a race, or just after a race finishes. This is extremely annoying when you can't save the replay of the race you just did (replay being the only reason we run "races" in a drift lobby).

- Individual people frequently have the game freeze on them while entering or exiting a lobby. I've also had the game lock up on me while simply navigating the lobby menus. The mouse refuses to move and just sits there with the spiny "loading" icon.

- I see people, along with myself, get randomly disconnected from lobbies far more frequently than in GT5. I see hosts losing connections during races on the regular, something that was far more rare in GT5.

- and perhaps the worst is the lag that occurs every time someone enters or exits the track. I have no idea how this affects grip racing, but it's almost game breaking for drifting. Imagine being in a lobby with 15 other people, who are all testing and tuning their cars...30 seconds doesn't go by without someone joining or leaving the track. And mid drift, that split second of lag is enough to consistently wreck even the best drivers...pretty much 100% of the time if tandems and trains are occurring.

 

[Famine]

You obviously haven't played enough then Famine.

Probably true!

And it isn't isolated problems on my end. You are lucky. And if you want more information... Hmmm... I could ask @V8-Johnboy @rolo912011 @Scaniabebe @gokartman78 @Gedi69 and a ton more that as well

I'm sure, however you need to bear in mind that if they share lobbies with you they will encounter the same problems whatever the source of it. I bet if I joined your regular group, I would too... It doesn't really narrow it down too much.

EDIT Forgot the tyre glitch when lobby is set to 1 mandatory stop -it randomly only allows comfort tyres to be equipped.

As I said earlier, my regular group doesn't have the attention span for pit stops, so while some post-stop issues are well documented I won't encounter them.

@Famine- I don't have much time to respond, but I would like to politely point out that you seem to be shrugging off the problems with GT6 just because you don't have them.

Not at all - in fact I offered to help with them if I could and remarked that there are still bugs that ought to be patched...

Just because this is the case doesn't mean they don't exist for a lot of people, and it has been documented wholly here as such.

However, the opposite is also true.

The problem with P2P is it takes one person to have a sucky set-up and not know they do (or be convinced that they don't) and you all suffer. However, if the fault truly lies with the game or the console-to-home data, it'll manifest in a LAN situation - where all the consoles are connected to a single switch in the same physical location.

I haven't tried a decent sized LAN yet, but I will.

Also, you seem very willing to point out that it's our fault for getting worked up over a small update, but you are ignoring (seem to be anyway) the fact that we get worked up based on what PD and Sony tells us, and also what they don't tell us, if you get what I mean.

Not at all.

The fact is that the alleged incoming VGT car at Geneva and the infamous "February" update and Zahara track were never confirmed by official announcements. We had excellent information on the VGT car and an SCEA representative was the origin of the February update and Zahara information - it's very easy to see how one could work up some enthusiasm (I spent most of the 6th of March refreshing a motoring PR website for the latest press releases from Geneva) - but there was never an official announcement.

Not meeting your expectations is perhaps the gravest sin someone can commit without sticking something into you. But when your expectations are unfounded, a spot of introspection would not go unamiss. We know - we have fifteen years of knowing - that unless it's published by SCE on an SCE site (or press release - we never got one of those in this sintance), it's not reliable. Mind you, we also know that, on occasion, even that isn't reliable - most of us lived through GT4 launch deadlines whooshing past. When it's a source other than this it must be treated with the appropriate level of scepticism - which is why GTPlanet was careful to report it as we did, rather than confirming Zahara for February.

Perhaps it's because I'm very old that I rarely expect much and am occasionally pleasantly surprised, but often completely unsurprised.

the lag that occurs every time someone enters or exits the track

Actually, that one I've encountered, but not to any considerable degree - and honestly no worse than it was in GT6.

I have seen a car disappear from the track in front of me in a massive plume of tyre-smoke and screeching when the guy quit to the pit lane. That was quite disconcerting.

 

[Furinkazen]

Probably true!I'm sure, however you need to bear in mind that if they share lobbies with you they will encounter the same problems whatever the source of it. I bet if I joined your regular group, I would too... It doesn't really narrow it down too much.As I said earlier, my regular group doesn't have the attention span for pit stops, so while some post-stop issues are well documented I won't encounter them.

Consider however that @V8-Johnboy I actually haven;t raced with on GT6 and he has same. @Scaniabebe has issues in mine and his. Same as @rolo912011 . It's really difficult to work around. So it is not just me. And it urgently needs patching.

 

[ryzno]

To @twitcher 's post, same thing in Drag Racing. But instead of mid Drift, try waiting in a line of 10+ to only to line up, launch and at the same moment, someone comes out of the pits causing, sever bog between 1 or both cars, or a jump(forward or backwards) in 1 or both cars(due to data lag) creating a uncompetitive run.

 

[GTCHAMPION1]

I still cannot remove the rear spoiler on my Supra RZ... PS: I need to add another extra 150hp to my Supra RZ

 

[Famine]

Consider however that @V8-Johnboy I actually haven;t raced with on GT6 and he has same. @Scaniabebe has issues in mine and his. Same as @rolo912011. It's really difficult to work around. So it is not just me.

Indeed - though I didn't say it was. If your groups have someone in common, it could be that their setup blows and they don't know (or think it doesn't) - if not, it could be a common networking fault that people don't think of, or certain ISPs throttling or packet-shaping, or something else entirely.

It'd be worth some experimentation to find out where the issue is though. As I mentioned, if you plug all the machines into a single switch (as we do at a LAN) and the issues still occur, then it's definitely not a network issue and absolutely a game one. We've not had a UKGTP LAN yet this year (or this game ) but we will. We'll let you know (or invite you).

 

[xStretch-]

Didn't fix the main bug of the game (tyre bug) so no

 

[Furinkazen]

Indeed - though I didn't say it was. If your groups have someone in common, it could be that their setup blows and they don't know (or think it doesn't) - if not, it could be a common networking fault that people don't think of, or certain ISPs throttling or packet-shaping, or something else entirely.

It'd be worth some experimentation to find out where the issue is though. As I mentioned, if you plug all the machines into a single switch (as we do at a LAN) and the issues still occur, then it's definitely not a network issue and absolutely a game one. We've not had a UKGTP LAN yet this year (or this game ) but we will. We'll let you know (or invite you).

I've seem issues all over GTP and other topics. It's a widespread problem.

Didn't fix the main bug of the game (tyre bug) so no

^Again.

 

[Famine]

I've seem issues all over GTP and other topics. It's a widespread problem.

Indeed, but it doesn't come close to ruling out the PEBCAC issue - that's the nature of P2P gaming.

If the issue(s) exist(s) in a LAN-type lobby, it's the game. If they don't it's (some of) the users. We'll look at hurrying up a UKGTP.

 

[Furinkazen]

Indeed, but it doesn't come close to ruling out the PEBCAC issue - that's the nature of P2P gaming.

If the issue(s) exist(s) in a LAN-type lobby, it's the game. If they don't it's (some of) the users. We'll look at hurrying up a UKGTP.

I can also confirm the issues exist in a friends only lobby, which appears to function the same way as the personal lounges on GT5.

 

[Zlork]

@Famine : it has been great to read to you 👍

 

[LVracerGT]

@Famine - are there other popular titles that use P2P? GT5/6 is the only PS3 game I experience problems online, check that, only game period I experience regular problems online.

Again, it's been well documented by many people the online issues with GT.

 

[MOTORTRENDmitch]

I can't believe this is still going.. @Famine are you actually trying to say these bugs don't exist?

Let's pretend the people experiencing these bugs all have bad internet and that's the only reason they are experiencing them.

How is this still not PD's fault that they exist? In MANY races online, you see cars that don't see eachother driving through and overtop of one another and so one. Let's look at a much larger online game, say.. Call of Duty. Have you ever heard of CoD players not seeing one another because their internets don't match up properly? I'll answer for you - if it existed, you would hear about it.

PD needs to make their servers work better. In fact - today I went online (GT6) for about 5 minutes and got off right away because no one's mics were working. I went to multiple rooms to check it wasn't just myself, or that lobby. Nope, people were discussing it in the chat that they couldn't hear anyone.

There is ABSOLUTELY no argument against the fact, that Gran Turismo 6's servers, are unstable and NEED to be sorted out. When you have 6 of the 11 guys in a race all drop out at once (on more than one occasion), there is a problem.

Don't confuse this^ with complaining because it isn't. It's stating facts. It's not even my opinion, it's simply the case.

 

[iainoflo85]

I can't believe this is still going.. @Famine are you actually trying to say these bugs don't exist?

He's not saying that - he's saying they don't affect him first hand, that's all.

I could be completely naive and say that because I don't live in the Ukraine that the situation there doesn't exist because it doesn't affect me. But I'm not, it's the same with this.

 

[MOTORTRENDmitch]

He's not saying that - he's saying they don't affect him first hand, that's all.

I could be completely naive and say that because I don't live in the Ukraine that the situation there doesn't exist because it doesn't affect me. But I'm not, it's the same with this.

Not sure I understand what this means then.

If the issue(s) exist(s) in a LAN-type lobby, it's the game. If they don't it's (some of) the users. We'll look at hurrying up a UKGTP.

 

[Famine]

I can't believe this is still going.. @Famine are you actually trying to say these bugs don't exist

No. Where would you get that impression?

Let's pretend the people experiencing these bugs all have bad internet and that's the only reason they are experiencing them.

Why? How would that help?

How is this still not PD's fault that they exist? In MANY races online, you see cars that don't see eachother driving through and overtop of one another and so one. Let's look at a much larger online game, say.. Call of Duty. Have you ever heard of CoD players not seeing one another because their internets don't match up properly? I'll answer for you - if it existed, you would hear about it.

Tricky question. How the programming deals with the shortfall of information is certainly software oriented - but it's not to blame for the shortfall of information.

In COD, as mentioned below, you will often see completely different things on your screen and on the killcam when you die. The way the programming dealt with the shortfall of information is all on IW/Treyarch/Blizzard - but the shortfall itself isn't.

PD needs to make their servers work better. In fact - today I went online (GT6) for about 5 minutes and got off right away because no one's mics were working. I went to multiple rooms to check it wasn't just myself, or that lobby. Nope, people were discussing it in the chat that they couldn't hear anyone.

There is ABSOLUTELY no argument against the fact, that Gran Turismo 6's servers, are unstable and NEED to be sorted out. When you have 6 of the 11 guys in a race all drop out at once (on more than one occasion), there is a problem.

You need to understand what it is that the "servers" do. If you think it's "manage the information exchange between consoles during a race", you don't. If they did, everyone would experience well over a half second of lag (best case scenario) as all information goes to Fukuoka and back. The information exchange goes directly between the consoles along the shortest route it can find. Some leaks out to your local SCE farm to check you're still online, but it's a very small exchange.

And this highlights the issue. If there's 10 of you in a lobby, all geographically close with good stable connections, wired in to good ISPs that don't mess you about and you're joined by some gonk 8,000 miles away using satellite internet, guess what'll happen? Half of you will get dumped out of the lobby on the spot because you just introduced a weakest link in your P2P chain.

The same thing will happen if any one of the 10 of you suddenly experiences a jitter in your connection. Bam, out you go - and it's not always the "culprit" either. And yes, we used to get this all the time on COD.

I can also confirm the issues exist in a friends only lobby, which appears to function the same way as the personal lounges on GT5.

I'd have no reason to suspect they wouldn't. But I'm talking about having all the people playing in the same physical location connected to the same switch. With each console in an ideal setup and almost all of the traffic going directly from console to console through the switch, it just about completely eliminates local setups, firewalls and ISP throttling as culprits - so if the problems still exist, it's almost certainly the game and if they don't it's almost certainly a problem external to the game.

@Famine - are there other popular titles that use P2P? GT5/6 is the only PS3 game I experience problems online, check that, only game period I experience regular problems online.

Again, it's been well documented by many people the online issues with GT.

Actually quite a lot of them do - the most popular example being the Collar Doody games. But in games like that a lagging character is only ever about six feet away from where he "really"* is and the hitboxes move at many hundreds of feet per second - in racing games a half second lag could mean a location difference of over 300 feet depending on where you're racing...

*If you've ever played Collar Doody you'll have noticed that killcams can often show you being killed in a slightly different location to where you saw yourself and while you may have got three shots off at your attacker, the killcam shows none at all. Where you "really" are isn't necessarily where you see yourself - and I don't actually know what the reference for where you actually are would be (probably the "host" machine). It's a dark art.

Not sure I understand what this means then.

It means that in a LAN situation where all the consoles are speaking directly to each other through a switch in the same physical location, local network foibles are completely removed from the equation because no game information is sent to the internet. In that situation if the problems still exist, it is almost certainly the game that has the issue. If they do not, it is almost certainly local network foibles that are the issue.

I only have 3 consoles and 1 copy of GT6, so I can't carry out any meaningful test here. At a UKGTP LAN, where we have 8+ people in the same physical location, we can.

 

[iainoflo85]

Not sure I understand what this means then.

That's why he uses the word "if".

 

[Foxiol]

For a better online experience a racing game SHOULD have dedicated servers and no being P2P as in GT5/6. That´s the main problem here with the online aspect of the game.

Try any PC racing/simulator in where you can have your own servers and such, it works like a charm.

 

[Famine]

For a better online experience a racing game SHOULD have dedicated servers and no being P2P as in GT5/6. That´s the main problem here with the online aspect of the game.

Certainly that's a part of it - P2P is like the communism of gaming, whereas dedicated servers are the capitalism. You pay more for a better experience with dedicated servers, whereas P2P is only as strong as its weakest link - which is often pretty weak.

But it means highly localised and expensive servers. Sending global data to a single location in west Japan is untenably daft. Sending regional data to a single location in, say, Chicago (US) or Munich (Europe) is slightly more sensible but pretty silly if there's a group of you in Portland, Oregon trying to game together being hamstrung by physics. So you set up your own dedicated server in Portland - but then your mate from Bristol, UK wants to play and it all falls over again. P2P smoothes that out a bit - but still you're better off playing with folk in your own locale for the best experience.



In summary, I'd have liked a bigger update, but v1.05 brought some fun little changes and was a good minor update.

 

[TokoTurismo]

In summary, I'd have liked a bigger update, but v1.05 brought some fun little changes and was a good minor update.

Same here, although I wish it didn't last a whole month to come. But nonetheless, I like what this update brought to the table.