2012 Australian Grand Prix

[Pupik]

Ah, a new F1 season on GTP. Infected debates, name callings, delusional images of drivers abilities. I've missed it.

Just watch the races, that's what I do.

Still can't figure out why Kobayashi held out from making real effort in Q2. Perez had the gearbox issue, but...good showing to start off the season for both.

AMG Mercedes looks like they're going to be a force to be reckoned with.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Still can't figure out why Kobayashi held out fromn Q2

Maybe he just couldn't get a good lap together.

 

[Pupik]

Maybe he just couldn't get a good lap together.

He only did one flying lap, from what I noticed...a little early in the season to start resigning yourself to a lesser grid spot. Then again, I'm not aware if anything else gave him troubles in the pits.

I hate to say it, but there's that gut feeling Massa's days are numbered at Ferrari since meeting Bruno.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I hate to say it, but there's that gut feeling Massa's days are numbered at Ferrari since meeting Bruno.

It's difficult to judge Massa on one race, especially when the car is so awkward. Massa got his puncture when Ricciardo clipped him, and that was why he got tangled up in Senna.

Besides, who would replace Massa if Ferrari dropped him? Sergio Perez is the only driver who could really be a viable candidate, but the F2012 clearly being so dificult to drive, any potential replacement could very well refuse to race for Ferrari. Even those who are in Ferrari's development program.

 

[Liquid]

Besides, who would replace Massa if Ferrari dropped him?

Perez seems the most likely candidate. Who else is out of a drive... Nick Heidfeld? The longest of all longshots for me would me, logistics permitting, Rubens Barrichello. Being well into the twilight of his career, he wouldn't really be bothered about driving a duff car, but he'd still do a good job and almost certainly a better one than Massa.

But his IndyCar obligations have put a stop to that, so my bet would be either Heidfeld or Perez, if Ferrari do axe Massa early.

 

[Pezzarinho17]

Good race, but I couldn't believe the number of drivers on Friday and Saturday getting 2 wheels on the grass under braking? The cars aren't any wider...

I agree that the Maldonado / Grosjean collision was a racing incident, though I would hope that someone within Williams has a quiet word about leaving some room on the exit for a car that won't disappear. Only in that on another day he could be the one to come out worse. Likewise in the Lotus team to Grosjean about yielding rather than fighting a lost cause (at that particular corner, no more).

Vettel's pass on Rosberg was immense, especially for someone who cannot overtake. Would like to have seen what he would have done against Schumacher had that not been gifted.

Hamilton was very unlucky in the race, but he will have to find a better compromise if he is to wear his tyres faster than Button but maintain his race pace. On that front it is pointing towards Button this year who has a firm understanding of the degradation levels and will manage races as Vettel did last year as long as McLaren maintain Saturday form.

I expect a shuffle in the trend in Malaysia, with Red Bull and Ferrari not struggling so much with the lack of track surface grip since Sepang is a dedicated race track. Very excited for the season and hope that McLaren can steal a march with a pair of Lotus and Mercedes slowing down Red Bull (and Ferrari?) in the first half of the races.

 

[Liquid]

Vettel's pass on Rosberg was immense, especially for someone who cannot overtake. Would like to have seen what he would have done against Schumacher had that not been gifted.

For someone who other people say cannot overtake. He's not been out in front his entire career, y'know. He's always been able to race and overtake. But if he's already out in front, he doesn't really need to, does he?

 

[RTSolvalou]

Agreed (with pm). Massa will probably remain till the end of the year because no one in their right mind would want his seat right now, unless they can get a full 2013 contract on top of a half-year, however you'd just be learning how to drive a bad car and possibly ruining your F1 career with bad results and crashes. But then what of their 2014 engine? will it be any good, a move to Ferrari is a huge gamble for any driver.

 

[Pupik]

It's difficult to judge Massa on one race, especially when the car is so awkward. Massa got his puncture when Ricciardo clipped him, and that was why he got tangled up in Senna.

Besides, who would replace Massa if Ferrari dropped him?

You know as well as I do, that nobody in F1 really has a clean slate, save a rookie or two, not least anyone in the Number Two Ferrari seat, no matter whether the mount is made of gold or peanut brittle.

And that's the pity, Massa's one of the nice guys, and some other driver will get thrown into the deep end. There's also that Giancarlo fellow that at least won't hurt anyone else's career!

 

[Pezzarinho17]

For someone who other people say cannot overtake. He's not been out in front his entire career, y'know. He's always been able to race and overtake. But if he's already out in front, he doesn't really need to, does he?

Sarcasm, maybe poorly veiled. He has shown time and time again that he can overtake but he still has critics (Brundle even stated sarcastically a defence for the guy).

On the Massa talk, I believe Massa's main defense will be coming from Alonso. Bitter McLaren fan I may be (yup, can't stand the guy), but history tells us that Alonso likes to be the main focus of a team and with Massa there he is seen as a god. If you stick someone else in Massa's seat and see that driver come closer to Alonso's times then he isn't so godly anymore. Plus how many other drivers will join the team hoping that they one day get the chance to be told "Alonso is faster than you"...

 

[prisonermonkeys]

You know as well as I do, that nobody in F1 really has a clean slate, save a rookie or two, not least anyone in the Number Two Ferrari seat, no matter whether the mount is made of gold or peanut brittle.

I'm just saying that you can't really judge Massa on one race. Ferrari know that their car is disappointing at best, so if they're looking critically at Massa, they're obviously going to take that into account. If Massa duplicates Alonso's Australian Grand Prix result at Sepang, then they could probably just write Melbourne off as a bad race. But if he repeats his own dismal performance this weekend (particularly if Alonso scores points again), then Ferrari are going to have to start keeping a close eye on him. After all, while once is an accident, and twice is coincidence, three times is a pattern. If Massa consistently underperforms, then he could probably be dropped as early as the Mugello test after Bahrain if Ferrari are prepared to sacrifice some position to get a new driver into the seat and established for 2013.

 

[Imari]

Still can't figure out why Kobayashi held out from making real effort in Q2.

In one of the post-race interviews he said that for some reason he couldn't get the tyres to grip. Whether they wouldn't warm, or he got some crap on them or something I don't know, but that was the reason given.

Clearly based on race pace and Q1 pace he was absolutely capable of getting into Q3.


Re: Massa. I'd have said either of the Sauber guys would be in with a shot at the Ferrari seat if (big if) Massa got binned. But based on that one weekend, would you want to move from Sauber to Ferrari?

Sauber have a good car, presumably will shortly find several more sponsors knocking on their door to fill up some of the big empty spaces in their livery so won't be short of cash, and have two teammates on reasonably even footing. Ferrari have a car that's probably no better and are the one team to unashamedly use team orders (and Alonso, which makes this relevant).

Me, I'd probably stick at Sauber, unless for some reason I had a Ferrari fetish.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Sauber's problem is that James Key left the team four days before the C31 was unveiled. Their entire development schedule is going to be thrown off as they try to find someone new to lead the team.

 

[Brend]

Am I the only one who has this gut feeling that RBR will be back on Top Form in 6 days? I'm liking their struggle to be honest but I fear the worst.

 

[Liquid]

Am I the only one who has this gut feeling that RBR will be back on Top Form in 6 days? I'm liking their struggle to be honest but I fear the worst.

Well Red Bull have generally been weaker at the higher speed courses... except that Vettel has won the Malaysian Grand Prix for the last two years.

It'll be a real test if either they're falling back or the rest McLaren are catching up.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Am I the only one who has this gut feeling that RBR will be back on Top Form in 6 days? I'm liking their struggle to be honest but I fear the worst.

Even if they are back up on top, McLaren will no doubt be there. They're not going to be blitzing the field by eight tenths of a second - they've lost more than anyone else with the ban on OTBD. It's perhaps Adrian Newey's achillies heel: he makes excellent racing cars the work by using clever ideas to get their speed. But when those clever ideas are banned, and in the absence of another new idea, his cars are suddenly very vulnerable in comparison to previous years. The RB8 is an evolution of the RB7, but the only really new thing on it is the vent in the nose step. And I very much doubt that will make up for the loss of OTBD.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

Am I the only one who has this gut feeling that RBR will be back on Top Form in 6 days? I'm liking their struggle to be honest but I fear the worst.

I think they will definitely be winning lots of races this year but certainly not dominating like they have for the last couple of years. I expect the season to play out similarly to 2007 and 2008, just replace Ferrari with Red Bull.

 

[RX-7_FD3S]

Perez is part of Ferrari developement program, he is the best driver in saving tyre also, so if anyone replace Massa it's probably gonna be him. At least that's what I heard. Perez was the only one that did one stop in Australia.

But it's a bit too soon I think.

 

[slavssn]

Does anybody still believe in Kubica? He would be the perfect teammate for Alonso.

Bear in mind though, what Algersuari's said in the media was utter rubbish - Robert's hand is in a very good condition, as the Pole was trying out Skoda Fabia WRC lately and, been doing karting with great results (set the fastest time on one track, I believe). Even here in Poland most people don't believe in his comeback but, I hope he can recover at least as well as Häkkinen a couple of years ago.

 

[Cowboys965]

Does anybody still believe in Kubica? He would be the perfect teammate for Alonso.

Bear in mind though, what Algersuari's said in the media was utter rubbish - Robert's hand is in a very good condition, as the Pole was trying out Skoda Fabia WRC lately and, been doing karting with great results (set the fastest time on one track, I believe). Even here in Poland most people don't believe in his comeback but, I hope he can recover at least as well as Häkkinen a couple of years ago.

Didn't he just break his leg?

 

[Pagey279]

Didn't he just break his leg?

He partially severed his hand off....

As for me i really want to see him back, he was one of my favourite drivers and given the right car....well he might even be fighting for championships if he still has the pace he used to

 

[Liquid]

well he might even be fighting for championships if he still has the pace he used to

So we're replacing one driver recovering from a serious injury with another. Massa -> Kubica.

Who's to say Kubica won't flop like Massa has? Both have had nasty injuries.

 

[Cowboys965]

I read that he slipped on ice and broke it recently.

 

[F1 fan]

I read that he slipped on ice and broke it recently.

He did, but he had a long list of injuries before that. Kubica was severely injured in a rally crash prior to the 2011 season.

 

[Pagey279]

So we're replacing one driver recovering from a serious injury with another. Massa -> Kubica.

Who's to say Kubica won't flop like Massa has? Both have had nasty injuries.

He might well flop, but i wasn't saying to replace Massa with Kubica. I was just saying if he was given a drive in a decent car then he might be fighting for championships. As he showed before the accident that he had the skill and pace, but whether he still has it now? Who knows

 

[hornet_burnout]

I have to say this: it's (I was) wrong to say Maldonado punted Grosjean out of the track. On purpose. As pointed out, there's oversteer from stepping hard on the gas, and it's correction looks like a punt.

Still think it was perfectly avoidable and unnecessary on lap 2 of race 1, and another racing incident that, if blame has to be assigned, it's still all his!

 

[F1 fan]

snip

Yes, but before Massa's accident, he was clearly leading the team and coping well with a dog of a car. Prior to that, he came within a hair of the championship. We can't just assume that Kubica will come back and be the same old Robert.

Ferrari are in a very tough situation right now. One race into a twenty race season and people are already calling for Massa to be dropped. If they replace him mid-season, they're best getting some fresh talent in. Perhaps someone like Perez or Kobayashi or maybe even a rookie to evaluate him for the future.

One thing I just realized is that Perez has proven how good he is at preserving his tyres. Ferrari couldn't use him as a test subject like they do with Massa.

 

[Pagey279]

Yes, but before Massa's accident, he was clearly leading the team and coping well with a dog of a car. Prior to that, he came within a hair of the championship. We can't just assume that Kubica will come back and be the same old Robert.

Ferrari are in a very tough situation right now. One race into a twenty race season and people are already calling for Massa to be dropped. If they replace him mid-season, they're best getting some fresh talent in. Perhaps someone like Perez or Kobayashi.

One thing I just realized is that Perez has proven how good he is at preserving his tyres. Ferrari couldn't use him as a test subject like they do with Massa.

Hence why i used the word might 👍

Also as i said in my previous post i wasn't suggesting they replace Massa with him

 

[slavssn]

Didn't he just break his leg?

Doesn't look like so.

source: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.225932677504274.46019.100002626315943&type=1

As for that "broken leg", it was probably more of an ankle luxation.

 

[Liquid]

One race into a twenty race season and people are already calling for Massa to be dropped.

I look at it as being 39 lukewarm races since he came back. 2010 was okay, a few podiums here and there but on the whole he's not what Ferrari need.

It's unfortunate because he's been a popular driver and a good one too, but he's just not replicated his 2008 form since his injury.