2012 Deutsche Tourenwagen Meisters (DTM)

  • Thread starter Blaze_409
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Dont they use the full Brands Hatch track anymore ? It would have fit DTM a lot better I think. But overall it was a good race, great driving by the front drivers.

They have always said that they prefer short track versions so the fans can see the cars more often.

For the first time ever I have been following the DTM series this year due to the return of BMW like others on here!

I really like the series but I dont like this forced two pit stops rule. From the ESPN commentators I understand refuelling has been banned this year? Is this correct?

Anyway, BMW has had a good return but I hope Audi will be able to be stronger. Paffett seems to be walking away with it at the moment

Paffett should have won all three races so far since Spengler jumped the start in Lausitzring and was not given a drive through for it.

And yes refueling is banned this year. The stops are just for tyres.
 
InvincibleM5
Why is that so? Is it because they don't want any of those refueling can (I think) to end up on the track?

Yea really. The races that I did watch from last year had the cans all over the track. Wonder if that has something to do with it as well.

If only Spengler would've stayed with Mercedes, then they may be really dominating the manufacturers.
 
Audi seems to be behind even BMW. Or maybe Spengler is just making up the difference. I cant tell whether the BMW is a good car or if the drivers are just pedaling extra hard. They seem to be ahead of Audi but Mercedes definitively has the quickest car.
 
There are no Audi's, BMW's or Mercedes. They are all spec Dallara's with manufacturer badges and bodywork.

The only real difference between them is the ability of the driver and his/her engineer to set the car up properly.
 
There are no Audi's, BMW's or Mercedes. They are all spec Dallara's with manufacturer badges and bodywork.

The only real difference between them is the ability of the driver and his/her engineer to set the car up properly.

From now on, why don't you just imagine people are putting the word 'Team' before or after the manufacturer name, it'll save you making the same point every few posts.
 
Since it's effectively a drivers series, why not just call it by the driver then?

because it wouldnt be true... I heard the same interview you posted here some time ago and the only thing that its the same is the frame/chassis (Dallara) and some areo parts... the engines all have different specs the cars have differente weights and the BMW has a BMW engine in it... if AUDI and Mercedes use a Judd engine thats yet to be confirmed also...
 
Since it's effectively a drivers series, why not just call it by the driver then?

That doesn't really do justice to the hundreds of other people working hard for the teams in order to acheive the results.... "BMW Team Schnitzer" or "HWA" is probably fairer than saying Bruno Spengler, Gary Paffett, BMW, Mercedes or Dallara...

..although since DTM run drivers, teams and manufacturers points standings.. then I guess any is fair.
 
There are no Audi's, BMW's or Mercedes. They are all spec Dallara's with manufacturer badges and bodywork.

The only real difference between them is the ability of the driver and his/her engineer to set the car up properly.


All the Aero work varies from manufacturer to manufacter.
 
Actually they use a spec Dallara safety cell correct?
All the Aero work varies from manufacturer to manufacter.
I dont believe DTM is as "spec" as you think. More Spec than Super GT but not as "spec" as Indy car.

No. The entire car is a Dallara. Lock stock and barrel. Only the body panels and engines are different for each manufacturer.

The aero is Dallara. It is delivered by two Venturi tunnels running either side of the chassis that feed air to the Diffuser at the back. It is exactly the same for every car.
 
Tired Tyres
No. The entire car is a Dallara. Lock stock and barrel. Only the body panels and engines are different for each manufacturer.

The aero is Dallara. It is delivered by two Venturi tunnels running either side of the chassis that feed air to the Diffuser at the back. It is exactly the same for every car.

What about the suspension? Brakes, ECU, etc...again i'm only curious to know how it works?
 
Anyways, I'm going to cheer for a car with a Mercedes emblem. (since EVERYTHING else is the same). That makes me feel better.
 
the engines all have different specs the cars have differente weights and the BMW has a BMW engine in it...

Funny then how the engine sounds from all three manufacturers sounded exactly the same when watching the Lauritzring race...
 
Funny then how the engine sounds from all three manufacturers sounded exactly the same when watching the Lauritzring race...

maybe BMW supplies the engine to the other teams:rolleyes:



Audi

Chassis:
CFRP monocoque with integrated fuel tank, CFRP crash elements on the sides, CFRP crash elements, front and rear
Engine:
V8 normally aspirated engine, 90-degree cylinder angle, 4 valves per cylinder, air intake restricted to 2 x 28.0 mm by regulations Engine control unit:
Bosch MS 5.1 Engine lubrication:
Dry sump Displacement:
4,000 cc Power output:
Approx. 340 kW (460 hp) Torque:
Over 500 Nm
Drive system:
Rear-wheel drive Clutch:
4-plate CFRP clutch
Transmission:
Sequential 6-speed sport transmission
Differential:
Adjustable multi-plate limited slip differential
Drive shafts:
Constant-velocity (CV) shafts
Steering:
Power-assisted rack and pinion steering
Suspension:
Independent front and rear, twin A-arm suspension, push rod system with spring/damper unit, adjustable gas pressure dampers
Brakes:
Hydraulic dual-circuit braking system, monoblock light metal brake calipers, ventilated carbon fiber brake discs, front and rear, brake force distribution between front and rear continually adjustable by the driver, electromagnetic starting valve
Rims :
Forged aluminum rims, front: 12 x 18 inches; rear: 13 x 18 inches
Tires:
Hankook, front: 300-680-18; rear: 320-710-18
Length:
5,010 mm (incl. rear wing)
Width:
1,950 mm
Height:
1,150 mm Minimum
weight:
1,100 kg (including driver)
Fuel tank capacity:
120 liters

BMW

Chassis:
Carbon-fibre monocoque with integrated tank and steel roll cage; carbon-fibre crash elements on sides; carbon-fibre crash elements at front and rear
Length/width/height:
4,775 mm/1,950 mm/approx. 1,200 mm
Tank capacity:
120 litres
Basic weight (incl. driver):
1,200 kg
Engine:
90° V8 aspirated engine, four valves per cylinder, 2 x 28.0mm air restrictors (in accordance with regulations)
Capacity:
4,000 ccm
Output:
approx. 480 bhp (with air restrictors, in accordance with regulations)
Max. torque:
approx. 500 Nm
Engine management system:
Bosch MS 5.1 engine control unit, without fuses, central display
Transmission:
Sequential 6-speed sports gearbox, operated via pneumatic shift paddles mounted on the steering wheel; 4-plate ZF Sachs carbon-fibre clutch; adjustable multi-disc limited-slip differential
Front axle/rear axle:
Double wishbone axle with pushrods and adjustable shock absorbers with six settings; H&R coil springs
Brakes:
Hydraulic dual-circle braking system; monoblock, light-alloy brake callipers; inner-ventilated brake discs at front and rear; brake-force distribution can be adjusted continuously by driver; electromagnetic starting valve
Wheels:
Forged aluminium rims; 18" x 12" front, 18" x 13" rear
Tyres:
Hankook; front: 300-680-18, rear: 320-710-18

Mercedes

Chassis:
Carbon fibre monocoque with steel roll cage, front, lateral and rear crash structures, bonnet, doors, side panels and wings in carbon fibre
Length:
5010 mm
Width:
1950 mm
Height:
1210 mm
Wheelbase:
2750 mm
Fuel tank:
120 litres
Weight:
1100 kg (with driver)
Aerodynamics:
Aerodynamic modifications to front splitter and side panels, flat bottom, front and rear diffusers, rear wing
Engine:
Capacity: 4.0 litres, Cylinder head: 4 valves per cylinder, Cylinder arrangement: V8, 90°,Performance: approx 500bhp at 7500 rpm, Maximum torque: 500 Nm, Air intake restrictors: 2 x 28 mm diameter
Transmission:
Standard 6-speed transverse-mounted gearbox, rear-wheel drive, pneumatically operated sequential gear shift on steering wheel, mechanical differential lock without traction control, carbon fibre driveshaft, 3-plate carbon fibre clutch operated by foot pedal
Suspension:
Double wishbones with spring/damper units to front and rear axles, actuated via pushrods
Brakes:
Standard carbon braking system without ABS
Steering:
Rack and pinion steering with power assistance
Wheels / tyres:
Aluminium wheels, control tyres, Front: Wheels: 12x18 Tyres: 300 / 680 R18, Rear: Wheels: 13x18 Tyres: 310 / 710 R18

All cars have different dimensions, weights, power, etc... if all cars were the same they would have the same specs.
 
Funny then how the engine sounds from all three manufacturers sounded exactly the same when watching the Lauritzring race...

I'd guess because the specs are strictly the same, exact same exhaust placement and all the car will sound the same or slightly different in detail.

Much like Formula 1 is now. I failed to distinguish the difference in sound between the Mercedes, Cosworth and Renault engines. Neither on TV nor in real life!
 
Qualifying went like this...

1 Mortara E. Audi Sport Team Rosberg Playboy Audi A5 DTM
2 Paffett G. THOMAS SABO Mercedes AMG THOMAS SABO Mercedes AMG C-Coupé
3 Ekström M. Audi Sport Team Abt Sportsline Red Bull Audi A5 DTM
4 Tomczyk M. BMW Team RMG BMW M Performance Zubehör M3 DTM
5 Hand J. BMW Team RMG SAMSUNG BMW M3 DTM
6 Spengler B. BMW Team Schnitzer BMW Bank M3 DTM
7 Green J. Mercedes AMG Mercedes AMG C-Coupé
8 Albuquerque F.Audi Sport Team Rosberg TV Movie Audi A5 DTM
9 Werner D. BMW Team Schnitzer E-POSTBRIEF BMW M3 DTM
10 Schumacher R. Mercedes AMG Mercedes AMG C-Coupé
11 Farfus A. BMW Team RBM Castrol EDGE BMW M3 DTM
12 Molina M. Audi Sport Team Phoenix Red Bull Audi A5 DTM
13 Rockenfeller M.Audi Sport Team Phoenix Schaeffler Audi A5 DTM
14 Vietoris C. Mercedes-Benz Bank AMG Mercedes-Benz Bank AMG C-Coupé
15 Tambay A. Audi Sport Team Abt Audi ultra A5 DTM
16 Scheider T. Audi Sport Team Abt Sportsline AUTO TEST Audi A5 DTM
17 Merhi R. Junge Sterne Mercedes AMG Junge Sterne Mercedes AMG C-Coupé
18 Priaulx A. BMW Team RBM Crowne Plaza Hotels BMW M3 DTM
19 Wickens R. stern Mercedes AMG stern Mercedes AMG C-Coupé
20 Wolff S. TV SPIELFILM Mercedes AMG TV SPIELFILM Mercedes AMG C-Coupé
21 Frey R. Audi Sport Team Abt E-POSTBRIEF Audi A5 DTM
22 Coulthard D. DHL Paket Mercedes AMG DHL Paket Mercedes AMG C-Coupé

Good to see Joey Hand up the grid, sad to see Any Priaulx that far back.
 
Man, the first corner at Spielberg really is a bit stupid. Safety car on the first lap predictably enough.

Good start by Tomczyk and Spengler for BMW... Joey not so much, and more problems for Priaulx and Werner.

...

CMON JOEY!

...

Great work by Tomczyk and the team in the last pit-stop... ! Just needs to push now :D
 
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What a battle between Audi, BMW and Mercedes!

Best race of the season so far, we've actually had some close racing! Not too impressed by 3 more retirments for BMW. Got to hand it to Paffett and his team, they're doing a great job.

..

Dang, c'mon Joey! Dig deep..!

..

Ah poo... oh well, Good result for BMW team RMG, both cars in the top 10. Mortara did a good job for Team Rosberg to take the win.
 
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19 Wickens R. stern Mercedes AMG stern Mercedes AMG C-Coupé
Wickens is a very talented driver - he'd had success in just about every series he's tried his hand at - but he's being wasted in DTM.

But I suspect Mercedes placed him there so that they could hold onto him and promote him to Formula 1 at some point.
 
I think out of all driver I feel sorry the most to Andy Priaulx. Again, being a victim of someone else's idiocy. Vietoris caused it all and I'm very mad...

I don't know what happened to Joey, but seemed to me like the car wasn't well at all. The rear seemed to be loose.

Great race, very close, Paffet being the most consistent, great drive by Mortara but obviously I'm happy for Tomczyk in the BMW to jump ahead of Paffet. Great race! 👍
 
I still can't decide if BMW are struggling (in all 3 of the championships) partly because they have the fewest cars.

I don't think BMW is struggling in DTM, more like they're having some bad lucks. A total of six cars is no little but there could've been more of them...
 
Something i noticed...These DTM guys are absolutely brutal with each other.....This is worse than a Nascar race. Guys just flatout ramming, shoving, hitting eachother off... Boy! They dont give an inch!! For there own grandmothers trololol.
 
I think its a result of the series being such "spec" based. Everyone runs the same speed and its very difficult to pass. So any opportunity is liking spotting water 100 miles into a Desert hike...
 
I think nowadays the DTM race success depends on pole position, tyre management and pit stop. Otherwise, it will be absolutely difficult to make any overtaking and as you said, any opportunity is like spotting a water in a desert.
 
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