2014 Santander British Grand Prix

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I see Will Buxton is making no friends for himself, suggesting that Räikkönen should get a race ban for Hockenheim, suggesting his rejoin was as reckless and foolhardy as Grosjean's move at La Source in 2012.

He makes a fairly interesting case, pointing out just how close Chilton came to taking a piece of debris to the head (which is horrifyingly similar to Henry Surtees' fatal accident), and highlighting Räikkönen's reputation for refusing to do a pre-race track walk, which he suggests would have alerted Räikkönen to the gully he hit.

Buxton faces staunch opposition from the crowd of Räikkönen fans out there, but in the midst of it all, one very interesting point was raised - if it had been Maldonado who went off, people would be demanding his head. But because it was Räikkönen, there are no calls for punishment, because "he's a racing driver" and if he sees a gap, he's going to go for it.

Ironic that the fans condemn the stewards for inconsistencies when handing down penalties, but they will happily hold a popular driver to a different standard.
 
prisonermonkeys
I see Will Buxton is making no friends for himself, suggesting that Räikkönen should get a race ban for Hockenheim, suggesting his rejoin was as reckless and foolhardy as Grosjean's move at La Source in 2012.

He makes a fairly interesting case, pointing out just how close Chilton came to taking a piece of debris to the head (which is horrifyingly similar to Henry Surtees' fatal accident), and highlighting Räikkönen's reputation for refusing to do a pre-race track walk, which he suggests would have alerted Räikkönen to the gully he hit.

Buxton faces staunch opposition from the crowd of Räikkönen fans out there, but in the midst of it all, one very interesting point was raised - if it had been Maldonado who went off, people would be demanding his head. But because it was Räikkönen, there are no calls for punishment, because "he's a racing driver" and if he sees a gap, he's going to go for it.

Ironic that the fans condemn the stewards for inconsistencies when handing down penalties, but they will happily hold a popular driver to a different standard.
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Former GP2 driver Andy Soucek tweeted:
"I had a similar incident in Monza back in 2007 when I was racing in GP2 and was penalized with 5 pos due to rejoining the track dangerously"

Seems fair to me (If a little lenient), it was a stupid move that could have been avoided if he had done a track walk. (Or, ya know, slowed down to rejoin safely). Doesn't matter if people like him or not, it's a move that needs to be punished in order to set an example. Drivers should rejoin the track safely, or not at all.

On a side note, if they put ditches like that behind the curbs on all track you can bet there would be less drivers running wide. :sly:
 
I agree with the idea that he deserves a penalty, but I am not sure if a ban is the right one. What bothers me is the suggestion that he does not do track walks, and thus has no knowledge of things like that culvert.

If a driver goes off the way Räikkönen did, then he should have to demonstrate that he made every effort to avoid an accident. Keeping his foot down and trying to rejoin the race at speed when surrounded by other cars was dangerous enough, even without the culvert. And that alone is worthy of a penalty. The stewards penalise drivers who leave their pit garages in an unsafe way, so why not penalise dangerous rejoins?
 
Kimis rejoin wasn't dangerious, his aggressive throttle input was though.

very ametuer.
 
Any attempt to rejoin at speed is dangerous, especially when you are rapidly running out of space in which to merge back in, which is what the embankment did - it narrowed the run-off area, forcing him to rejoin immediately m
 
The difference is that Räikkönen was reckless this once. Maldonado makes career out of recklessness. Even so, a grid penalty may be justified.

Edit: Oh, and taking sides in the Vettel vs Alonso battle is just silly. They were both whiny children who repeatedly complained about the other while at the same time just as repeatedly breaking the same rules they accused the other of doing. In the immortal words of Rihanna, just shut up and drive. :D
 
Hun200kmh
Two questions about this one.
Is that Damon Hill driving the Gold Leaf Lotus and Allan McNish driving the Tyrrell?
And what car is the 3rd one?


Also ... Thanks! :) Like them all, especially the one with Bottas going for the outside. Did that one stick, do you remember?
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I'm not sure who was driving the cars to be honest, I know Fittipaldi was in his old Mclaren, and Felix Da Costa was driving the RB8. It's a Matra MS80 👍

And I think so, Bottas seemed to pass everyone like they were standing still :lol:
 
Kimi is just making mistakes because he's getting frustrated with his car, he's went from a Lotus which was smooth and planted most of the time to a 2014 car and not just any 2014 car but one which tries to spin you around every time you exit a corner. The difference between him and Grosjean is I remember thinking before the Spa race began "Please don't ram Hamilton.", he had built a bad reputation before the incident.
 
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Hun200kmh
Two questions about this one.
Is that Damon Hill driving the Gold Leaf Lotus and Allan McNish driving the Tyrrell?
And what car is the 3rd one?


Also ... Thanks! :) Like them all, especially the one with Bottas going for the outside. Did that one stick, do you remember?
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It is Hill in the Lotus, I'm pretty certain that's Paul Stewart driving his dad's Tyrrell (EDIT - scratch that, I think you're right.) The McLaren at the back is being driven by Fittipaldi.
 
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All I can say about Kimi recklessness topic is...

The one who make less mistake in his Formula One career and the one who makes many mistake during his early Formula One career.

Of course it's really transparent which head will roll first. ;)
 
Anghammarad
The difference is that Räikkönen was reckless this once. Maldonado makes career out of recklessness. Even so, a grid penalty may be justified.

Edit: Oh, and taking sides in the Vettel vs Alonso battle is just silly. They were both whiny children who repeatedly complained about the other while at the same time just as repeatedly breaking the same rules they accused the other of doing. In the immortal words of Rihanna, just shut up and drive. :D
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That was the funny thing, both of them said as much about themselves afterwards - they had to laugh at how ridiculous they had been even considering the "heat of the moment" and all that. So if they aren't even taking sides because it got so silly, why should we. Alonso literally said "the Red Bulls deserved to finish ahead of us". It was an amusing battle though.

Kimi got caught out, I'm sure he figured just clipping a corner of the grass would be no big deal and then was like WTF? Maybe a more thorough track walk could have helped, but for safety reasons I'm not a fan of any surface near the circuit being capable of bouncing a car like that. Also, it's hard to say he should have rejoined slower since you don't want to rejoin at a much slower speed than the other cars are going... so unless they decide to do something about the rules concerning big offs (cough cough Spa turn one) or leaving huge open runoffs then it is what it is. Personally I think the consequences should be higher for going that wide off track - you don't have to risk beaching your car in the gravel anymore so the trade-off should be at least going to the back of the pack of cars in the general area... Hell, I'm used to racing where any big 4-off is an automatic trip to the pits to verify your car.
 
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Peasantslayer
Kimi should get a slap on the wrist for Silverstone, nothing more.
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I agree. But if we're all honest with ourselves we must self-ask "would I think the same if this was Maldonado's doing?"

Because I think if it was, all of us here, or at least the large majority, would be crying MURDER and asking for a permanent, life-time ban from F1.
 
Peasantslayer
Kimi should get a slap on the wrist for Silverstone, nothing more.
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Problem is Kimi has made big mistakes like this in his career before, and his no BS attitude seems to intimidate people from wanting to take action against. Either because they don't think it will change him (which is what discipline rules are meant for see Grosjean), or just see a popular WDC winning driver that can do no wrong.

Point is track record shouldn't matter stupid is stupid whether it's the village idiot or the town mayor. As for this season Kimi has made mistakes and the quickest one that comes to mind is Monaco.
 
I think we should just look to the next race sliverstone is done, hope an exhaust breaks next race so I can at least hear the cars...:lol:
 
Every driver on the grid slows down no more than absolutely necessary before re-joining the track, Kimi was just unfortunate enough to be caught out by a bump in the grass. During the race I saw a car go well off track and then rejoin 20+ meters further in front of the car who was following(think it was from Ricciardo's onboard but not sure), but not one word has been said about that. On the topic of pre-race track walks, I wonder how many, if any at all check all the run off areas for possible unsighted bumps.
 
Peasantslayer
Kimi should get a slap on the wrist for Silverstone, nothing more.
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And if it were Maldonado who had had that accident, you would be screaming for his head.

Räikkönen should get a grid penalty and a suspended race ban for his carelessness.
 
prisonermonkeys
And if it were Maldonado who had had that accident, you would be screaming for his head.

Räikkönen should get a grid penalty and a suspended race ban for his carelessness.
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Of course we would, it's Maldanado, do you not understand the concept of your mistakes being worse if you have a bad reputation for making those mistakes?
 
Spurgy 777
Of course we would, it's Maldanado, do you not understand the concept of your mistakes being worse if you have a bad reputation for making those mistakes?
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Yes, I do. It's called hypocrisy. Every driver needs to be held to the same standard, and every situation should be judged on its own merits. In this case, Räikkönen showed poor judgement - he made no attempt to slow the car down as he went off, he attempted a dangerous rejoin at speed, his crash took out another driver and came close to eliminating two more, and according to some, he did not bother with a pre-race inspection of the circuit, which would have alerted him to the gully.

He certainly deserves more than a slap on the wrist. At the very least, he should get a grid penalty and a suspended race ban.
 
prisonermonkeys
Yes, I do. It's called hypocrisy. Every driver needs to be held to the same standard, and every situation should be judged on its own merits. In this case, Räikkönen showed poor judgement - he made no attempt to slow the car down as he went off, he attempted a dangerous rejoin at speed, his crash took out another driver and came close to eliminating two more, and according to some, he did not bother with a pre-race inspection of the circuit, which would have alerted him to the gully.

He certainly deserves more than a slap on the wrist. At the very least, he should get a grid penalty and a suspended race ban.
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It's not hypocrisy at all, it's common sense, if someone keeps making careless mistakes, you keep increasing the penalty for that person. Otherwise using your logic the first time a driver runs wide they should be disqualified from the race. Now I agree that he deserves more than a slap on the wrist, but a grid spot penalty at most, a race ban is definitely over the top for what was a minor misjudgement that had fairly serious consequences.
 
Spurgy 777
It's not hypocrisy at all, it's common sense, if someone keeps making careless mistakes, you keep increasing the penalty for that person.
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The problem with your argument is that you are giving drivers no punishment for a first-time offence, regardless of how serious it is. If Räikkönen's accident had been similar to the Gutierrez-Maldanado clash late in the race, I could understand your point - but it wasn't. It was far more serious, and a stern talking-to is nowhere near enough.
 
I don't mind kimi being penalised but to be honest had there not been a jump and he rejoined without crashing we wouldn't even mention it.
 
There is no way that hitting a grass->tarmac transition at 200kmh was ever going to be smooth, matter how well the grass was manicured. If he had 0 steering angle, he may have got away with it with just a bounce (like Perez and Webber have done), but the slight turn undid him in a big way.
Also, what would everyone prefer? A drainage gully where the cars shouldnt be, or delays in racing due to standing water?
 
sems4arsenal
I don't mind kimi being penalised but to be honest had there not been a jump and he rejoined without crashing we wouldn't even mention it.
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And if he'd never gone off in the first place we wouldn't be mentioning it either. What's your point? That we don't really talk about it when people don't stuff up? Seems obvious.

He did what he did with the stuff that was there. He made a mistake that had some potentially pretty serious consequences, especially on the first lap with all the cars bunched up like that. Grid penalties are given for far lesser infringements. That should be the absolute least he gets, especially since the incident was so easily avoidable.
 
Imari
And if he'd never gone off in the first place we wouldn't be mentioning it either. What's your point? That we don't really talk about it when people don't stuff up? Seems obvious.

He did what he did with the stuff that was there. He made a mistake that had some potentially pretty serious consequences, especially on the first lap with all the cars bunched up like that. Grid penalties are given for far lesser infringements. That should be the absolute least he gets, especially since the incident was so easily avoidable.
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That we probably wouldn't mention it had there not been a bump and he crashed. Hey Kimi had an off there.....anyway.
Would it make it any less of a wrong doing no it wouldn't although I'm sure Kimi had space to rejoin.

My point is had Kimi rejoined without crashing if no one would have mentioned it then why should we mention it now.I'd argue his mistake was not knowing about the bump in the road.
 
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