26 cars lined up for 2010 & bile from Bernie

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I don't know who is most qualified to answer this, I haven't really looked into F1 spending, the budget cap is 40 million...pounds I am assuming.

What happens with regards to non-UK based teams, say the USGP team? the pound is obviously in a state of fluxuation with other currencies, which could change significantly over the course of a season. how is that going to be handled?
 
The FIA established a "costs committee", which is apparently supposed to closely regulate everything - from spec/out-sourced parts to costs of labour. I do wonder, now that there's a limit on spending, will Force India set up a shop in... India? :P
 
First off, exactly what support does Honda have? Honda's staff and facilities are all sitting nicely in the BrawnGP HQ at Brackley, worrying about their jobs. Their engines are underdeveloped and underpowered - and they haven't made them in a while. And if Aguri were to enter, it would be under the budget-cap - where again, Honda's expertise at burning dollars wouldn't help much.
I'm hypothesising.
 
If Aguri was to re-enter F1, what engine would they probably use? Now that Honda is out, then maybe a ferrari engine? I would probably take a renault engine if I were them.
 
Thing is, the grid is tightening up for new entrants, engine-wise. We have 5 active engine-manufacturers - and with BMW not supplying, and McLaren working double-time, that works out ok. However, the remaining teams would either have to fetch Cosworth mills (or find an arrangement with Honda's still-existing engine facilities in Japan), convince BMW to supply another team, or find another third-team support deal from Renault and Ferrari...
 
If Aguri was to re-enter F1, what engine would they probably use? Now that Honda is out, then maybe a ferrari engine? I would probably take a renault engine if I were them.

They will most likely try and cut a deal with Honda first and then look at Toyota engines.

Their engines are underdeveloped and underpowered - and they haven't made them in a while.

Since budget capped teams have their engines outside the 40M£ salary, im guessing its legal to strip a honda motor down to the block and rebuild it?
 
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Since budget capped teams have their engines outside the 40M£ salary, im guessing its legal to strip a honda motor down to the block and rebuild it?

Not entirely. While development is allowed, and spendings on it aren't capped, the engines themselves remain homologated - meaning most parts can't be changed. So gains can be made, but it'll be very hard to catch up with the developments done by the other teams since the limits were first set. Just for example, the top teams apparently had ~760HP at the start of 2007 - but by end of 2008, were touching 790HP. Honda started and stayed at ~740HP (Toyota started there - until mid-2007, their V8 was said to be the most underpowered in the field - but improved vastly). With that much catch-up to do, I doubt a privateer wants to spend all the money that engine desperately needs in order to become competitive.

As for rebuilding, F1 teams don't bother with that - they use a brand-new engine. And between races, with the (inapplicable to cap-teams) limit on the number of engines, the FIA places seals to prevent re-use.
 
Well then, what engine will they use? BMW is out of the question, so that leaves renault, honda maybe, ferrari and cosworth.
 
David Richards has mentioned recently actually that he's thinking about Cosworth, and that seems the most likely anyway, being the cheapest option and having no restrictions like the other engines or silly things like contractual agreements like having to field Nakajima.
No one is going to use Honda, that would be crazy, they just pulled out of F1 because they can't stomach the costs, they wouldn't come back to supply engines this soon.

I honestly don't see any of the new entrants using anything other than Cosworth and possibly Ferrari depending on who buys Toro Rosso and what they decide to do with that contract. Its not worth the effort of trying to get the FIA to allow a third engine supply from Renault nor is it worth convincing BMW especially considering the Cosworth has less restrictions on it and is cheaper. Plus the fact that Cosworth is not affected by the problems hitting car manufacturers so isn't going to disappear in 2011.

All this is what makes me wish they would drop the engine freeze soon, or at least allow some more engine manufacturers to offer their goods, it doesn't have to be car manufacturers it could just be people like Judd, Ilmor, etc.
 
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Exactly what restrictions does the Cosworth mill lack? :odd:


As for Nakajima, you'd be surprised, but while his Toyota ties brought him the drive in the first place, Frank Williams himself thinks quite highly of him, and said he wants to keep the Nico-Naka duo regardless.
 
I was led to believe that the engine freeze didn't apply to the Cosworth tender? I'll have to find where I remember that from but I'm pretty sure I remember it being mentioned as a reason why teams should go for it.

The point still stands about Nakajima though, he was forced upon the team, and I'm not entirely sure Richards is the kind of man to allow that....but then again I used to think the same of Frank, suppose it depends on what is the best deal and what is most likely to be competitive.

Edit: I just found a few old news items and now I remember - the Cosworth engine is being used as the "standard" for all the other engines to be measured - none of the other engines may exceed the performance of the tender engine. So technically, the Cosworth engine-teams have a slight advantage in that their supplier will be first to react when the FIA changes engine rules but otherwise, there is no difference other than cost for this engine.
Apologies if I lead anyone to believe what I posted before.
 
The original idea was that a Cosworth mill would be the "standard", and every manufacturer should have power and torque curves exactly like it, ±1%. That idea didn't work out, and was flat-out rejected by the FOTA.

All engines are still homologated - meaning many parts are still frozen just as they were at the end of 2006 - and that includes the Cosworth mill, which holds no special status. All engines are essentially last year's V8s without the rev-limiter, and minor changes to adapt them to it - and, of course with unlimited spendings, the infamous "reliability changes" will return.
 
Well, I still think the Cosworth is the most tempting option if not purely due to it being a cheap and reliable supply and not restricted by supplies to other teams or favouritism (if it happens at all).
 
For reference, the countdown timer ends at about 3pm local time on the afternoon of the British Grand Prix. Interestingly enough, the British Grand Prix was originally slated to be the time and place that Dave Richards was going to announce the major sponsor of the last Prodrive effort ...
BMW is out of the question,
Since when? As best I can recall, they haven't come out and said "we won't be supplying an engine to an other team".
so that leaves renault,
Except that Reanult already supply Red Bull and may be on the outer: they're not getting results and ING is withdrawing all sponosrship from the sport.
honda maybe,
Don't have an F1 program at the moment. They have the facilities to manufact engines, but probably not the desire to re-enter the sport to be upstaged by the Brawns.
ferrari and cosworth.
Cosworth is far more likely given that it's a cheaper engine built to spec. Maybe in the future they could shift to a Ferrari powerplant, but I wouldn't put it past Maranello to charge a higher price with the budget cap coming in to bleed the teams of resources a little. Not so much that it's obvious what they're doing, but certainly a spiteful move.
 
This with no races in North America. I wonder what the odds for a USA GP and Canada to be back in a year or two?
 
The same odds of Force India making a podium tomorrow and Button's car spinning out.
 
The same odds of Force India making a podium tomorrow and Button's car spinning out.

Wait, really...considering we now have two possible US teams, all the teams have been pushing a return to North America since Canada was dropped, the sponsors have been pushing for it and also that Montreal are still trying to bring F1 back?
If I was to predict the next Grand Prix to hit the calendar other than India, Korea or Portugal I would definitely guess Canda or the USA.

Not as unlikely as some seem to think.....in fact, I'd say we are more likely to get a US Grand Prix than we are to see the British Grand Prix saved.

Some of the sponsors on the cars actually have more interest in the US market than places like Bahrain and China anyway.
 
With 2 U.S. teams tenatively slated,I really do think they have to consider a U.S. Grand Prix somewhere.

Back to Indy ?
Laguna Seca ?
Watkins Glen ?
Infineon ?
Homestead ?
Mid Ohio ?
Portland ?
 
With 2 U.S. teams tenatively slated,I really do think they have to consider a U.S. Grand Prix somewhere.

Back to Indy ?
Laguna Seca ?
Watkins Glen ?
Infineon ?
Homestead ?
Mid Ohio ?
Portland ?

doubtful
no sadly dosnt meet FIA requirements
wouldnt enjoy it
the most likely
would be nice
doubt it
doubt it.

if they where to bring back a US round it would have to be in a place that is a money maker. Florida and Cali yea but Ohio and Oregon not so much. im thinking it would be infineon or homestead or it will be someplace like vegas where alot of money will be spent and people will travel there for more then just the race.
 
Indy would be the most likely candidate, possibly using the new layout designed for the MotoGP (I hope so ... the infield switchback was an ugly corner), but Bernie doesn't think there's a circuit that would be suitable enough. Laguna Seca and Infineon are lack adequate grandstands and pit facilities; both would need major upgrades, but the severe inclines and descents mean neither would be considered safe. Portland is simply too short; the quickest ALMS cars do it in just over a minute. After all, the A1-Ring was dropped from the calendar when Villeneuve proved you could consistently do it in about 1min 10sec. Homestead-Miami might be a possibility, but it's a very flat circuit and as short as Monaco; most circuits these days come in about five and a half kilometres; Homestead-Miami is just under four. I'm not really sure about Watkins Glen, but I do know that Formula One left for a good reason tht didn't involve money. It might have been something to do with safety in the era of turbo-powered cars. Mid-Ohio is also a little on the short end, and has an odd layout with race starts being held on the straight leading up to turn four.

Personally, I'd like to see forty laps of Miller Motorsports Park in Utah. It's about two hundred metres longer than Spa, but it's got some great corners in the infield and whoever named the turns had a sense of humour (like Agony and Ecstacy, Right Hook and Knock Out, Indecision and Precision).
 
Personally, I'd like to see forty laps of Miller Motorsports Park in Utah. It's about two hundred metres longer than Spa, but it's got some great corners in the infield and whoever named the turns had a sense of humour (like Agony and Ecstacy, Right Hook and Knock Out, Indecision and Precision).

I agree Miller Motorsports Park would be a great choice.👍
 
The biggest problem I saw with MMP was that it was in the middle of nowhere...until I checked it out on Google Maps and saw that it's only about thirty miles from Salt Lake City, which already has world-class accommodations as a result of hosting the 2002 Winter Olympics.

+1
 
Eaxctly. I'm willing to bet that when he likes of Catalunya and Interlagos were constrcted, their respective cities were not encroaching upon the baoundaries of the circuit. In fact, I'd say they'd have been quite deliberately isolated because of thenoise, but the cities evenually grew around them.
 
I think seeing as Indy is out of the equation, a US street circuit would be very welcome in my opinion 👍 I realise we are getting a few too many at the moment, but at least the US has a history of street circuit-Grand Prix...some of them classics.
Otherwise, I think these new US teams should get together and try and start a project to build a new circuit up to FIA standards perhaps? Then they could hold test sessions there rather than flying out to Europe.
 
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