Aggressive driving in Sport Mode.

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo Sport' started by kilesa4568, Aug 28, 2018.

  1. WaikeCU

    WaikeCU

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    Same for me.

    I don't overtake at that spot of the track, because even though trying to make the pass stick, I feel I'd still lose tremendous amount of time getting through the chicane. What I often do is sell a dummy move , so the car in front gets too defensive pre-corner (middle or inside of the track) and thus gets compromised off corner. If I get a better drive than the car in front, then an overtake at the main straight going into turn 1 will be a breeze.
     
  2. Mr616

    Mr616

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    I've only done x2 sport races since my few months off and I'm now SR:A for the first time in a long time (was SR:99).

    Some overly aggressive defending from some and then just people not aware of what's going on around them. I can't bring myself to race at Suzi as I can't help but feel my SR will plummet even further due to the nature of some of the corners inviting people to poke their nose into corners where an overtake just isn't on.

    If people are overly aggressive over a period of laps, I will try and pressure them into an accident. I don't want to overtake them and then be a victim of an outlandish divebomb later in the lap lol.

    I must man up and just jump into some races and whatever will be will be, but standards of some seem to have dropped sharply while I've been away :(
     
  3. Voodoovaj

    Voodoovaj

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    "Aggressive" is such a nebulous description. "Dirty" is another somewhat nebulous term.

    Dirty implies intent to do harm or to ruin your race. I think it's "dirty" when someone unnecessarily squeezes you off the track or when they weave excessively to prevent a pass, to the point of risking their own race to hinder you.

    What is aggressive to one person is dirty to another. Then, of course, there is the "overly aggressive" and we've all seen those. That's when someone makes a move that can't happen without contact.

    There's a time and place for all of these practices.

    I've pulled out of the pits and had to content with a back-marker, on worn tires, on an in-lap, trying to keep me from passing. You'd better believe that's a tie to be overly aggressive or even dirty.

    I play the game as I do any sport, you play the "whistle" which in our case is the penalty system. If the system allows it, no foul. It's up to you to decide if it's in your best interest or not.
     
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  4. baldgye

    baldgye Premium

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    ...making it hard to judge
     
  5. golfer07840

    golfer07840

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    • If you illegally weave block, I am going to feint to the outside on dive bomb you because if you can't figure out where you're going then I can't either.
    • If you try to slam the door on me during a shared corner, I will place my car on your rear flank so you'll punt yourself.
    • If we run two wide on an exit line and you run mid track trying to cut my line, I will run you to the outer edge of the track but I will leave you more than a car width on the outer edge.
    • If you make a last minute move to the outside during my braking line, I will not wait for you to get your place back after I accidentally ram you into the wall.
    Of all of those tactics, only the last one negatively effects my SR.

    Looking back at that list, the more loose they make these rules the more I end up racing like it's GTA Online.



    It's funny, I like your approach as it's more ethically sound. However, putting it into practice I always feel guilty running close behind a dirty driver because you end up using them as offensive blocker as you reap the benefits of them ramming people out of your way. I know that's not your intent and I think you're ethically sound here, but I always felt worse gaining on good drivers via the dirty driver.[/QUOTE]

    Suddenly I had this image pop to mind reading this:

    [​IMG]
     
  6. kilesa4568

    kilesa4568

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    My main problem is that I can plan and make a move safely to get a good overlap (door mirror) but get a lot of nudges to make me back out again. In my eyes, the move is 3/4's complete but lately it's nudge nudge nudge to track limits and I either back out or risk a big incident. Usually for them, not me, hence the original question. For years, I've backed out of these moves and thought I'd try forcing the issue for a change. It didn't work.:lol:

    Good advice if both parties have good race craft. What do you do if the person in front does 2, 3 or even more defensive moves though? That's the sort of driver I'm talking about. Trying to maintain their position by any means but looking for the added bonus of running you off track.

    To be honest, it's been rough going since the penalties were relaxed (rightfully so) but there are people out there who'll give you a clean race and if my little experiment in aggression is anything to go by, play it safe rather than expecting the same level of race craft back and you'll be fine.

    If you want to race at Suzuka, do it. Don't put your love of a track below what could happen to your rank as rank's always recoverable. Waiting for Suzuka to come back to the weeklies might mean a long wait...

    Dot the I's and cross the T's with your line at Suzuka as it's a bugger to pass plus with it being 10 laps, it's shouldn't be anywhere near as frantic as the sprints. If I don't do a lobby tonight, I'll be giving it a whirl. I'll just close my eyes at Degner 1.:D

    To me, aggressive is trying a pass where you really shouldn't while dirty is deliberate contact or multiple moves to impede a driver. My experiment with aggression was to try and hang on to overlaps I'd already got and trying to force the issue. Watching the top guys and gals races, my overlap is good and usually successful. In my races, it's who manages to come out of the corner unscathed.:crazy:

    I managed to complete most of the passes but usually at the expense of a penalty after they go for a big hit and crash themselves. Lesson learned.

    The plan is to 'git gud' or at least, 'git gudder'...:dunce: See if I can get myself up to a supposedly better class of opponent and who'll hopefully throw less curve balls at me.
     
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  7. fastone371

    fastone371

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    It seems to me that most drivers that would rather push you out of the way rather than pass cleanly are indeed fast, for a lap or 2, then more often or not you pass them up again when they are trapped in the kitty litter. I think part of the reason they are fast is because they are racing at qualifying pace and taking chances that most clean drivers wont take, especially early in the race.
     
  8. KepleroGT

    KepleroGT

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    320
    Ignoring them will make them bored and even angrier. And you can't ignore them if they dive bomb you in turn 1 of Lago Maggiore.
     
  9. AUTISTICBOYX

    AUTISTICBOYX

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    Or t1 interlagos, or t1 suzuka, or t1 monza, or... yeah. The only thing that helps, talking from experience, is brakechecking the perpetrator but then it causes carnage for all the other cars. It sucks either way. Ghost car mode with no slipstream for the 15 initial seconds of the race could be a solution.
     
  10. kilesa4568

    kilesa4568

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    Couldn't agree more. By all means test your limits in qualifying and practice but have a bit of patience when you find your regular line is being used by the driver in front.

    I know it's a race but take your time and stop falling on your own sword. Read The Tortoise and the Hare.:lol:

    As weird as it sounds coming from the person who made this thread, I'd probably switch to another game if ghosting was on strong at the start or any other time. You learn nothing from it as there's no consequences, other than a few missed heart beats.

    If I was PD, no ghosting and full damage in all the weekly races. Make people learn a hard but more realistic lesson about mistakes.
     
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  11. twitcher

    twitcher

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    6,232
    I started doing this in PCARS, have carried it over into Sport, and it’s extremely effective. I used to try to emulate real life, making all my moves under braking, but found that often results in contact (it takes 2 people to pull off a clean overtake), or at the very least a slow exit leaving me vulnerable to a third driver.

    I still make the odd move under braking, but I’ve started making the majority of my overtakes by focusing on getting really clean exits and passing people on the straight. I’ve even started using the psychology of online racing against people by faking dive bombs, which usually causes them to do all manner of funny things....then I just late apex, power down, and drag past them on the straight.
     
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  12. AUTISTICBOYX

    AUTISTICBOYX

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    Yeah i'm sure i'll learn hard to not play GTS again when my race is over at T1 just because i'm on pole. Your time in this life is finite, you are in control of it. Having to constantly wait in queue because other people can't drive doesn't seem very productive nor fun.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2018
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  13. senzr

    senzr

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    Dirty drivers get you great footage you can LOL over later. You can't play this game with an attitude to get back at em without losing your mind. Let it go and try to have fun.

     
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  14. kilesa4568

    kilesa4568

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    There'll be a settling period after damage gets turned on so don't spit your dummy out straight away. Once people get used to the more serious consequences, it should rein in some of the unnecessary aggression or it'll clean shop of the dirtiest drivers till they change their ways.

    Racing is organised queue jumping so how can you moan about a driver you say can't drive yet they're in front of you? Track position is king so unless they're blatantly dirty, you give them the same respect as someone of equal or better skill. If it takes time to get a pass on them, so be it. I've sat behind people for an entire race and not found a way to pass and personally, I love those types of races. It's more like chess. It might not be productive or fun to some people but that's racing for you.
     
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  15. Jamie Bbbbb

    Jamie Bbbbb

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    A bored troll has no purpose. A bored troll will go and do something else. Trolls thrive on spontaneity.
     
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  16. Sven Jurgens

    Sven Jurgens Premium

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    Not so sure about that. In my second race today on Suzuka the winner was pretty much the only one with a red rating at the end. A red A in the max SR.S room, all blue S after him and a lone red S at the bottom. Everyone ignored him. No congratulations, no comments. You think he got bored winning with his aggressive driving? Maybe he did get bored. He was sitting in the room for a bit waiting for a reaction perhaps. Then left as nothing came his way as comments just went between the rest of the field.

    At least he'll be out of SR.S for 1 race or more. Sometimes the SR deductions work. Penalties didn't obviously as he was sitting in first.
     
  17. Lazybike

    Lazybike

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    618
    I've been racing in the A race all week, I'm A/S, and not had a single dirty incident, out of 30+ races I've had one case of accidental contact, it's been close at times .057 at the line :) I've been playing on my jasonrowe account so if we've met on track, thanks for the clean and exciting racing.
     
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  18. Kano Manel

    Kano Manel Premium

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    Master @BallPtPenTheif you've found a fan on me for this. Could you please be so kind to upload a video of how you do this? Fully grateful
     
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  19. Jamie Bbbbb

    Jamie Bbbbb

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    We are talking about people who go out of their own way to make other players' experiences worse out of spite. Not all dirty drivers are trolls.
     
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  20. BallPtPenTheif

    BallPtPenTheif

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    No, they're just sensitive juvenile spazzy vengeance machines with personal space issues.
     
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  21. Rizla

    Rizla Premium

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    :lol::lol::lol::lol:

    Jings! Was just about to take a puff of my ciggy when I read that, burst out laughing & blew my smoke out of my fingers straight into my cup of tea. Thanks man. :tup::lol:
     
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  22. Sven Jurgens

    Sven Jurgens Premium

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    Ah those! They usually quit mid race when they've fallen to the back and are out of fun. Although there are a few disturbed drivers around that go out of their way ghosting through you while a lap behind, trying to obstruct your view. I like the trolls though that cause a yellow flag at the finish so no one can serve their penalties :lol:
     
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  23. AUTISTICBOYX

    AUTISTICBOYX

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    Yeah and nonetheless it brings no solace to those whom he took out on T1 as the damage is already done and the troll never cared past that either way. So the fair, high qualifying driver(s) ends up taking the fall.
     
  24. WaikeCU

    WaikeCU

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    324
    Depends really. If I'm really that much faster than him and he's the leader, then I'll just stick behind him and let him tow me around lap for lap. Throw in a few dummy moves here and there, these are things that add pressure and he'll crack eventually. If he doesn't, then overtake him when least expected. If stay behind him lap for lap, then I'll become unpredictable where I will eventually overtake him.

    If I know that cars are closing in and catching up and are faster than me, I try and not waste time. Sometimes contact will be inevitable with these kind of drivers

    Other than that I live to fight another day if it doesn't work out.
     
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  25. DJShadesUK

    DJShadesUK

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    Why not? If some dirty arsehole is blatantly not playing by the rules and, more importantly, ruining my race, then I'm going to do all I can to dish out some punishment. Don't get me wrong, I don't do it unless it is absolutely deserved; I'll let people get away with a certain amount - after all, racing incidents happen - but when it becomes obvious that their actions are on purpose (like if they bump me off the track and then go on to do the same to someone else right in front of me) then its open season.

    For instance last week at Lake Maggiore I was approaching the banked hairpin and saw someone in the mirror who obviously had a better run out the previous corners. So, within general rules in most motorsport series, I slowly, in one move with no contact, squeezed them over to the extreme inside of the track, leaving them a cars width. As we approached the corner whoever it was hit me towards the left - okay, we're racing closely, racing incident - then hit me again - okay, he/she is showing they're not going to be dominated - but then there was a third hit, then a 4th, 5th and finally a 6th where, because he/she was so obsessed with side-swiping me off the track, he/she missed the braking zone and we both ended up in the gravel trap. Somehow we both got out the gravel at the same time but, having ruined my race, I set about making sure their SR would be dropped so low that they would regret behaving like a complete arse and at least wouldn't be bothering me for a good while.

    I don't like having to do that kind of crap, I'd much rather have a hard fought but clean race where we're all driving to the same rules, but sometimes, in lieu of PD not being able to program a competent penalty system, needs must I'm afraid.
     
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  26. kilesa4568

    kilesa4568

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    I remembered an incident where I got my own back on someone who repeatedly targeted people for punts and unless I dreamt it, I wrote about it in the QM Exiles thread somewhere. @ROCKET JOE might remember it as I think I shocked a few friends when I wrote it.

    Three times I was deliberately punted by the same person at the same sharp corner. Zero braking type punts with no chance of dodging. Three times I caught them back up and the third time, I was directly behind them going into the exact same corner and punted them off. I stopped playing GTS for a while as it was just cold blooded premeditated murder.

    These people annoy me but they play the game how they want and they've got to live with themselves. The fact I sank to their level shocked me way more than anything they did to me on track though. Sorry if that sounds sanctimonious (it does to me) but I know what I can live with at my age. Like the above grey area with the penalty system. It's a clever solution but it's wide open to abuse so not my cup of tea.

    That's regarding dirty drivers who're a law unto themselves.. It's the overly aggressive drivers who refuse to yield in bad positions or who try and force passes through from quarter chances. Basically, poor race craft.

    My night's experiment showed you can't fight poor race craft without punishing yourself at the same time but you can stay savvy and try to use it against them. Kinda what I was already doing but I had to question it after an extended run of rough races. See how the other half lived maybe. I'd have been safe in a higher ranked lobby as I was just racing hard but in B, too many pass attempts are taken personally, along with an 'Oh no you don't! This place is mine!' mantra.:lol:
     
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  27. NevilleNobody

    NevilleNobody

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    Gardens tonight was a disgrace, almost everyone was an idiot. As soon as they catch you they try to force a pass.
     
  28. ROCKET JOE

    ROCKET JOE

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    In first ... because it's a really dirty move exploiting the flaws of the game to your own advantage - the exact same move the dark side uses. You claim to be a clean racer in self-defense but that doesn't make it any better and to me it's just one more contribution to low-quality-racing.

    I'm not much of a gamer ( GT actually is the only game I've ever played ), I just love driving these cars as quick as possible and I've learned to love OL racing ... according to racing rules ! So using gaming tactics on track is somehow beyond my horizon and what's more, I just don't want to sink to the scumbag's level and I was sure @kilesa4568 ( couldn't you be my native English voice-over again :lol: ? ) doesn't like that too.

    I'm not talking about that one odd moment when you lose your head in anger and switch to vengeance mode. We're human after all, so that doesn't shock me in the least but leaves me amused ;) ... I'm talking about an impression I have ( and please allow me to leave it at that without going into details ) that more and more people have started to incorporate gaming tactics and weird track behavior into their racing just to be successful. And that's not me, simple as that.

    In second ... more generally speaking ... you're not the FIA nor the police nor the judge nor anything and it's just not up to us to punish other players. Self-defense ? Ok, defend yourself ... on track ... according to racing rules.
    I might be a bit over-sensitive here but the eye-for-an-eye-approach always makes me think we've hopefully left the middle-ages some time ago :cheers: !
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2018
  29. Lazybike

    Lazybike

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    In my experience dirty and fast don't go together, I don't mind hard racing, in fact the more I trust another player the harder I can race, if it's someone I've raced before and I've seen their skill level, then I can race them safe in the knowledge that they can handle, and more importantly, they will enjoy some close racing, I think some people put winning before racing and that's a shame.
     
  30. NevilleNobody

    NevilleNobody

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    Yeah that's the issue. The number of people trying to stuf fit up the inside at the awkward chicane at Gardens is remarkable, there's just no room, by bombing in you leave me nowhere to go, at all, so we tangle. Why not get a run on me and pass me at the end of the uphill straight?

    Imbeciles.
     
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