Anonymous get details to 90k Members of Staff in Military

[Luminis]

>I'm< the one making baseless assumptions? Western democracies are barely that, or a popular vote in your own country would have likely turned down EU membership. The only 'true' (direct) democracy operating are your neighbors to the south in Switzerland. But the harsh reality is, money makes the world go round. And money and power go hand in hand. Big business, big money and government corruption are nothing new.

Censorship to the degree it's happening now, though, how is that part of the 'big buisiness', how is that part of 'money makes the world go round'?
And, more importantly, how does that make things right?

If everybody shared that sort of view, we'd be hailing Le Roi Soleil Louis XXIV or something now...

But if you really think giving a bunch of pricks like anonymous free reign is going to 'improve' the state of democracy or stop political corruption, than there's no point to discuss this further. They're NOT out for the greater good. They're out for themselves, as much or more than anybody. And doing a fine job of convincing people of their 'noble' goals, it seems.

Yeah, i suppose you know precisely what their goals are, right?
Also, free reign? I wouldn't go that far, but I don't mind seeing them causing some trouble for those who're trying to feed lies to us.

Also, as far as I am concerned, if they were out of rjust selfish reasons, wouldn't they have tried to blackmail the US government to pay for the login data? Wouldn't they have hacked a bank or something? wouldn't they have already targeted someone wlse than just governments?

Why bother trying to stop censorship in Turkey? Why bother convincing people that they're the good guys when it would be just si much easier to go after selfish goals right of the bat?

And, lastly, if it's their selfish goal to 'force' a government to admit to what shady buisiness they're up to, I'm all for it.

But, hey, as long as their are enough puppets out there, who'll follow their 'leaders' without questioning the status quo, who are willing to accept what's wrong with our political system because it has been that way for decades, well, we probably wouldn't see any change whatsoever if it wasn't for the likes of Anonymous.

 

[Owen.C93]

In my opinion things have got a bit mixed up, just because they can leak those email doesn't mean they should, they need to pick targets wisely to reach their goal. But on the other hand they also have to gain a following and stay known (Look at how little we hear of wikileaks these days despite some pretty incredible leaks coming from them) so they will continue to release big payloads when they come across them.

 

[Luminis]

^ Pretty much. That's why I consider stuff like the leaked email adresses and passworst as 'collateral damage'. Not a desirable thing, but sadly, a necessity.

 

[TommyWizard]

Yeah, this will defiantly be a wake up call. Sadly, its Tax Payers money that been wasted on "High Security Systems" that just got hacked by a couple of pimply teenagers.

 

[Luminis]

Well, tax payer's money is wasted left and right, doesn't make that much of a difference, does it

Just kidding, I think you're right, it is a bit of a shame.

 

[plate88]

From what I take, Anonymous likes to expose companies or organizations that run their business carelessly. I'm fine with that, but at the same time risking hundreds of thousands of innocent people's info or background is not right. Unfortunately, I believe their end result is going to screw the innocent people before the corrupted ones.

 

[CaptainHarlock]

So, reading Marvel Comics made you a better person then those who are younger than you?

For one thing, I welcome the attitude to not sit around and watch idly while the system is going down the drain. Because, responsibility also means to use once's power if needed. Isn't that something the Marvel Comics taught you as well?

First off, do you honestly think I'm sitting here and I'm actually happy about what my country did in Iraq? I say with a resounding "HELL NO!". We weren't sitting here say "Yeah! This is a great idea!!". We hated the idea, too. That dumb **** of a President we had in office, right along with his buddies, screwed this nation over to such an extent that it's going to take us, and parts of the world, YEARS to recover from. I just want to make that clear. I wish that guy had hit him with the shoe, he might have knocked that smile off his face, and knocked some sense into him. Now I can't think about that too much, because it makes me too angry!!

It hasn't taught me to be a "better person", but what it has done is shown me examples of what having a "moral code" is like. And it seems you don't know the meaning of the phrase I cited. Remember when Spider-Man chose to be selfish and he didn't stop the robber when he had the chance? Well what happened? Someone innocent, his uncle, was killed. You use your powers to HELP people, before you help yourself. Are Anonymous really "helping" anyone? Or are they just using their abilities to get their names in the papers, all for their own sense of self satisfaction and to inflate their egos? They could be helping people, but they aren't.

You help others before yourself. With great power, comes great responsibility.

 

[Luminis]

Are Anonymous really "helping" anyone? Or are they just using their abilities to get their names in the papers, all for their own sense of self satisfaction and to inflate their egos? They could be helping people, but they aren't.

Let's look at an example.

There's censorship taking place in Turkey. I think censorship is bad. Anonymous tries to take action against that. I think taking action against censorship is good.
Do you disagree with that?

What reason are they doing it for? I know only what they claim. Where does your knowledge, that exceeds that, come from? Or is it just that, pure assumption?

 

[alvin23a]

They don't have enough brain cells in their head to think deeply enough. That IS NOT their decision to make and in my opinion should be seen as an attack on the American government and it's army. God why do I feel that strongly... I'm Canadian.

Cause anyone of our countrys could be next.

 

[CMvan46]

Let's look at an example.

There's censorship taking place in Turkey. I think censorship is bad. Anonymous tries to take action against that. I think taking action against censorship is good.
Do you disagree with that?

I 100% disagree.

Nobody can FORCE anybody to change. They have to want to. This way of thinking is a major problem with many Western and 1st world countries. They believe their way is best and the rest of the world should be like them. People in Iraq DID NOT want the American's "help".
It is not up to any one or group of governments or people to decide what is best for either an individual or a bloody COUNTRY. Things will run their course in due time. Believe it or not slavery isn't that far removed from western civilizations. Eventually if people become fed up enough change will occur.

Anonymous has no right to alter natural progression because they have superior hacking skills.

 

[Luminis]

Eventually if people become fed up enough change will occur.

Isn't that exactly what Anonymous is? Apart from being international rather than hailing from a single country, of course.
A bunch of people that are fed up and are taking action.

Anonymous has no right to alter natural progression because they have superior hacking skills.

And Anonymous isn't part of that 'natural progression'?

I'll be using Turkey as an example again: People have been demonstrating against the censorship and such. Anonymous is taking action to help with just that. So, what's the problem, I wonder? Shouldn't they be doing what they can to help those people with what they want to achieve? Or should they just stand by and watch?

See, I don't have the power to help any of those people in their ambitions to protect their own free speech, so I'm glad there's at least someone to do that. And, most importantly, without bloodshed.

Or is that the problem some of you are having with Anonymous: They're not out in the open, bleeding and dying for their ideals, but doing it in a way that hasn't been used for these kinds of things so far?

 

[CMvan46]

Remember the old saying two wrongs don't make a right?

The way Anonymous goes about their business is not legal in anyway. To add to that they are too cowardly to actually come out and say who they are which greatly diminishes their ability to impose any real change.

You can't attempt to enforce positive change by doing something illegal. Completely defeats the purpose.

 

[Luminis]

Uh, what? So, the illegal actions taken that caused the French Revolution, for example, were bad?
Revolting against Gaddafi was a bad move, then, either, right? I guess due to the laws he passed, that was illegal as well. And I dare say that getting rid of him was indeed positive.

Also, them hiding their identity is one of their biggest strengths, you'd have to be a fool to not use that to your advantage. As they say, desperate times call for desperate meassures. That's one of the reasons they're not just getting disposed off...

 

[CMvan46]

You've got a point there but it is not positive in any manner when they put innocent lives at danger which is exactly what they are doing by stealing the 90k soldiers information as they did.

Last I checked there were no world leaderboard rankings for hackers and for all we know there is a group of computer geniuses out there who could potentially steal this information from anonymous and use it however they please.

Can you imagine a terrorist group getting a hold of this stuff? It sets a very dangerous precedent when people and groups like this are alerted to the potential "ease" with which this information was obtained. I think they are well, well over their heads with this one.

 

[Luminis]

You've got a point there but it is not positive in any manner when they put innocent lives at danger which is exactly what they are doing by stealing the 90k soldiers information as they did.

Last I checked there were no world leaderboard rankings for hackers and for all we know there is a group of computer geniuses out there who could potentially steal this information from anonymous and use it however they please.

If there is such a group of genuises, wouldn't they have been capable to steal that data from the US military themselves in the first place? Otherwise, you'd be assuming that the guys at Anonymous are superior to them - which is something that would seem out of line with what you've said before.

Also, yes, there's no leaderboard for hacking and such, which makes it harder for me to see where the selfishness is involved here.

Can you imagine a terrorist group getting a hold of this stuff? It sets a very dangerous precedent when people and groups like this are alerted to the potential "ease" with which this information was obtained. I think they are well, well over their heads with this one.

For one thing, I doubt that the information retrieved is that useful to any sort of terrorist group, mainly for the fact that there should be no sensitive data send via email, as that's one of the most basic measures that are usually taken in terms of IT security. Also, I think it's a bit far fetched to blame Anonymous for the data being easily accesible, or pointing that out.

But, agreed, it was not the right thing, or legal thing to do. From my point of view, though, there's one major flaw with the legal way: What is legal and what isn't? That's up to the government. In China, free speech is illegal, for example; how is one to change that the legal way?

This of course doesn't ring true for the US (yet), it's just a point I'm trying to make...

 

[Crispy]

I don't really consider them Cyber-Terrorists until they shut the power grid down. If they do this, then people may die. (People on life support) What they did here, which wasn't right at all, but they did it to tell the US Government that, if we can do this, then the real terrorists can, and that's bad news. They are warning the military that they need to update their security, and they need to do it fast, because if they don't, bad things will happen, which could cost lives.