- 82
- GTP_FlyingLizard
i am not dissappointed overall. But the thing that really annoyes me is that driving the cars feels like they are on rails. There is no bumpung and jerking! The ride is way to smooth!
i am not dissappointed overall. But the thing that really annoyes me is that driving the cars feels like they are on rails. There is no bumpung and jerking! The ride is way to smooth!
i am not dissappointed overall. But the thing that really annoyes me is that driving the cars feels like they are on rails. There is no bumpung and jerking! The ride is way to smooth!
I'm new to the GT series, so rather than say, "I'm disappointed" I'd describe it more as "stunned". I bought a PS3 specifically for Prologue (and Blu-Ray...) and was just expecting more. I guess my expectations come from playing about 200 hours each of Forza 1 and 2 and just hearing all the buzz about the GT series for so long.
I have a Playseat, Buttkicker, 50" Panasonic Plasma and top of the line Onkyo THX sound, so I was pretty excited to get Prologue while waiting for GT:5 and Forza 3, since I burned out on Forza 2 after many months and wanted to try something new. I especially want to try the G25. The Microsoft wheel was OK, but not up the the G25's level.
The things, that didn't disappoint were the demo (it adds some really nice atmosphere, great visuals and music). The demo makes the cars look sexy sitting in driveways, fields etc. Forza didn't have anything like it. It really adds style and atmosphere. The replays are really good (don't watch much, but I see them on the demo) and the support of the G25, which I've decided I need to buy. I'm playing with a controller until my G25 arrives, so I can't say for sure, but the physics seem ok so far.
I've heard a lot of negative about the AI, but it seems fine to me. I spent 99% of my time online with the Forza series, so I'm not the best AI judge, but it seems ok. Drivers do make errors and try to pass inside and outside. Forza's AI didn't seem much better. The graphics aren't quite as impressive as I was expecting, but they are pretty good and better than Forza's by a bit. I was really surprised, that I'm enjoying the heck out of the in car view. I love watching the drivers hands move on the wheel! Hope Forza 3 has that feature.
This is what has me stunned though.
1. Leaderboards - Forza 2 has class leaderboards with up 400,000 people ranked per class per track. You can filter by friends, car, driver aids etc. Prologue has the top 100 by car by track. That's it unless you want to see the top 100 in the world per track. Yikes, I can't compete with my friends unless we're in the top 100. Plus, we have to be driving the exact same car. Stunned this is so bad.
2. Online - No voice chat. No North America vs Europe (I have friends in Europe). No public or private hosted rooms. No way to find friends. Who you race is completely anonymous and random without even voice. Very bizarre and solitary. No host room options to turn off ABS, TCS, STM, set laps, kick players. And the short races with long single file rolling starts... sigh. People in the back are screwed. Lastly, the boost issue of whatever you want to call it is embarrassing. I hope PD doesn't really think online players are that stupid not to notice. Maybe they are, I can't talk to them to verify on my own.
3. Quick Tune system - Most of it is ok, but picking your horsepower and car weight is very arcade like. I know some people didn't like Forza's thousands or part swapping options, but most did, including me. It just seems so bare bones and goofy to pick your horsepower. "ummm Mr. Mechanic, I'd like and extra 23 horsepower... wait, no make it 26 no on second thought how about 356..". Oh, well. I also miss the all the stats, charts, graphs, tire temp stuff for gear heads, but I can live without it in Prologue. I'd like to see more depth in GT 5 though.
4. No ghost mode online - I figured bumper cars could at a minimum be solved by using the ghost option, but there isn't any. Very disappointed.
5. Only 3 quick tunes per car. I had one or more per track in Forza 2 (could add up to 30 or so, especially during testing), so this is pretty basic.
I didn't expect the performance points system would be perfected yet, so it's understandable there are Lotus Elise type problems with Prologue. PD is interested in patching, so maybe they can fix that a bit. The penalty points system and bumper car physics just invite problems online, but a ghost mode could have fixed it but alas, there isn't a ghost mode... As it stands I'm really disappointed in online. Hoping the next patch improves our situation.
I knew it wouldn't have car painting, tournaments (those didn't work out very well for most in Forza 2 anyway) and website integration, so it wasn't unexpected. I'd like to see all of that and clans for GT5, but I don't need it to have fun with Prologue (just fix the damn scoreboards!).
Having said all that, I'm still having fun and don't regret my purchase, but I'm hooked with racing sims, so I'm not the best judge of value. I'm still hoping PD steps up for GT 5. I don't need another 630 cars (I know most here do...), but I need usable game features. After seeing how bare bones Prologue is, I'm a bit worried. It seems PD doesn't really want to add the depth found in Forza 2. They are sooo focused on car models and tracks. I expect Forza 3 to add even more like Car Clubs, weather etc. I hope PD catches up, because I want both franchises to keep one upping each other.
I've seen $40 retail games, so some would say once you hit $40 it's a game.
My take is this is our opportunity to tell PD what we want in GT 5, so it makes tons of sense to compare to existing racing titles and tell PD what we want. What better chance do we have than right now?
Pretending that Prologue is perfect and that PD will magically just figure out what features are most important to us is a poor strategy on our part. Comparing to other games strengthens our argument for more features, because the bar has already been set that high by other games. We're challenging PD to do better.
I want the best GT 5 possible. I hope PD reads these forums. If they think all we need are private rooms, maybe that's all we get...Constructive criticism is helpful. That's what I'm trying to do.
If there is one thing I want to see improved though, is the physics engine (or whatever do I have to call it) off track. If you come onto the grass or in the sandpit, it seems that the car is skidding on ice, sort off. Isn't it the purpose of a sand pit to slow down the car? And if you want to drive off the grass, and you push down the throttle, there is no wheel spin, instead, the engine is holding back.
If PD should read this, please do something about that.
I think it always has been for him.PD didn't bite off to much though, KY will put out the game when he thinks it is finished. From all the interviews I've seen and the "Behind the Apex" clip on Prologue I gather this is more of an art project for him then a game.
This won't even be close to some of the worst. Duke Nukem is unacceptable, yet fans still jump at every little tease that shows up.From a business perspective, and a gaming perspective, the development time is unacceptable.
I can guarantee you that those license test and missions, no matter how tedious and no matter how hard you have to push it, make you a better driver in the game overall.I don't know, but the end of 2009 seems like a bit too far off. I am assuming that Forza 3 would be out by then. Is it reasonable to expect more DLC over the next few months? Adding more cars & tracks would be nice - damage might be too much to hope for.
Nobody has commented on my criticism of the GT game-play structure. Is that because everyone accepts that there is no alternative possible? I remember when I started playing Forza 1, I found the majority of the races fairly interesting, but when I tackled GT4 (I had not played previous versions of GT), I found a lot of the "races", "missions", & of course the dreaded "license tests" dauntingly tedious. It's one thing to have to set a time trial lap time on the Nurburgring - challenging, but enjoyable - it's another thing to have to run the same $#%^&^! two corners over & over & over again to get them "just right". As in GT4, it seems that some of the races in GT5P are pointlessly easy, while others are insanely hard, requiring not "good driving", but endless repetition & a tendency to obsessive compulsive disorder.![]()
KY has mentioned this may be coming.What really piss me off in this game?
- no changing weather conditions
What is it with people and this? On my list of wants this is dead last.- no tyres traces on the track in real time (as well as in sand area outside the track)
Have you tried Arcade, maybe Online? Did you beat all the dealership events?- after finishing off all classes it's getting pretty boring
Penalty system and ghosting are two completely different things. I agree the penalty system needs work, but I know the ghosting has prevented someone online from ruining my race on a couple of occasions.- silly, absolutely unacceptable, penalty system (is this a real driving simulator with disappearing, blinking cars???)
Yep, and you know no one else has beaten your time just because they had better grip.- you can get only sport tyres in time trial mode
I laughed a bit at this. For one, PGR4? Really? But I love the London track. Then again I like a realistic street race in real-life racing too.- track in London is pretty dark and short, nothing really special except buildings around and all infrastructure, much better i've seen in Project Gotham Racing 4.
Racing and driving is about more that OMG POWAH!!!!!!! I like racing the slower cars. That is when it becomes less about the machine and much more about the driver. They gave balance to make everyone happy.- ok, we've got 70 cars in total, but there are still some famous vehicles missing, like McLaren, Koenisegg, Lamborghini (instead of Daihatsu, Suzuki they supposed to put these in)
I didn't notice.- menu is very slow
I can't comment on this as I still have an SDTV, so I can't see a difference.- replays running on 30fps
It is coming, as early as Autumn, in an update.- no damage at all, you can't even scratch your paint.
It is what they advertised.- 7 tracks is still not enough
Agreed.- online problems (updating game sometimes going horribly long)
After that laundry list this is a decent score. About what I would give it.Overall: 8/10
i am not dissappointed overall. But the thing that really annoyes me is that driving the cars feels like they are on rails. There is no bumpung and jerking! The ride is way to smooth!
Using my DFP and my FFB on 6 I still notice bumps on these tracks as well.Tracks like Fuji / HSR / Suzuka don't have many bumps because that's just how they are. Daytona hasn't been repaved in ages so it is extremely bumpy/jerky
I can guarantee you that those license test and missions, no matter how tedious and no matter how hard you have to push it, make you a better driver in the game overall.
Don't compare a demo to a full game.
Any driving practice will make you a better driver. Driving tests that focus on a single corner reduce the exercise to a few muscle-twitch responses that can be perfected by endless repetition. Tests like that may make some sense to a complete newcomer to driving, but they are tedious & pointless for an experienced driver. I have no objection to complete lap time trial tests, however (preferably on the Ring!)
Look, simply put, what I would like from GT5 is a series of races where you are matched against more or less equally performing cars with realistic AI, so that you can race bumper to bumper over a number of laps (more than 2,3 or 5), looking for an opening so that you can squeeze past fairly, all the while risking spinning out or serious damage from pushing too hard or "inappropriate" contact. I.E. real racing! 👍
(I'm not aware of any racing event IRL that requires a driver to overtake 15 other cars in one lap!)
Don't compare a demo to a full game.
Come to think of it, the things you just mentioned to be done well are the exact same things that are even remotely finished. The rest will be finished when GT5 hits the shelves.There are things that this game does very well such as the pro physics, the graphics and the general presentation but it's the SIMPLE things that the game fails to get right.
... and that's the very point. GT5 has not been released. Comparing Prologue to FM2 would be the same as comparing a FM2 demo to GT5. Sure, you can argue that FM2 and Prologue are the releases we have right now, so it is fair to compare them. However, it is vital to understand that Prologue is missing certain things and has faults because it is not the full game.Sorry but what are we supposed to compare it too? Forza and GT are direct competitors and it only makes sense to compare their respective releases this generation
Can't argue with most of this. One thing though:1) Online options
Tell us who as people who register officially and use the GTP_ names are expected to behave befitting of this forum. I am sure that Sphinx, at a minimum, would like to know who and what they did.(and the people with GTP_xxxx in their name are just as bad as anyone else so don't you lot get all high and mighty).
Not much to disagree with here either. It is okay, when it works.2) Penalty system
You do know it explains what the settings mean in a scroll across the bottom, right? It isn't in-depth because it is quick tuning. More than the cheap arcade tuning in GT4, but not quite a full-fledged system.3) Quick tune
Now, this is weird, because I can pull this up and do some tuning while in a race without pausing. And these are all things that can be adjusted real-time in actual cars. Now, your Forza reference would work great for an option in a pit stop, but for the sake of realism, not allowing pausing while doing it would be an awesome idea.4) Lack of in-game tuning
I fail to see this as a major issue as it is a street course, which is a good thing to have. Plus, an occasional short track is not a bad thing. It makes the races a bit more intense.5) London track too short
Can't argue with most of this. One thing though:
Tell us who as people who register officially and use the GTP_ names are expected to behave befitting of this forum. I am sure that Sphinx, at a minimum, would like to know who and what they did.
FoolKillerYou do know it explains what the settings mean in a scroll across the bottom, right? It isn't in-depth because it is quick tuning. More than the cheap arcade tuning in GT4, but not quite a full-fledged system.
FoolKillerNow, this is weird, because I can pull this up and do some tuning while in a race without pausing. And these are all things that can be adjusted real-time in actual cars. Now, your Forza reference would work great for an option in a pit stop, but for the sake of realism, not allowing pausing while doing it would be an awesome idea.
FoolKillerI fail to see this as a major issue as it is a street course, which is a good thing to have. Plus, an occasional short track is not a bad thing. It makes the races a bit more intense.
FoolKillerI can't comment on the F2007 because I don't have it yet.
I'm actually afraid it might be me as the few times I went online my connection was spotty and everyone jumped around, so what appeared to be a clean pass turned into a bump as they suddenly jumped in front of me at least twice.Specific names escape me as I was too frustrated whilst getting thrown into the gravel for the 20th time in a single race for trying to over-take down a straight. All I caught were the "GTP_" prefixes. I will try to catch full names next time.
Actually, that is quite possible, as for us general non-overly mechanical sorts this is about as complex as we want. Of course, if it were more complex I would learn.Hmpf. Maybe my pedantic engineer side showing through?
I thought you were talking in a race or whatever. It seemed kind of cheap. But yeah that actually sounds cool for a non-recorded run.I don't just mean those available in the Prologue, in Forza 2 you could change gear ratios, anti-roll bar settings, diff settings, brake pressure/bias, spring rates, ride-height all by pressing Start and going to Tuning. This saved LOADS of time when it came to tuning the cars (and it only works in the Test Drive mode so you can't cheat in a Time Trial or whatever).
That would be neat too. But I don't want to give up my real-time on-board adjustments.I love it and now that it's gone, I miss itOh and pressing up on the D-pad to bring up the real-time telemetry (you can use it actually AS you drive) is a God-send as you can see how much power you are producing, how much of the suspension travel you are using, current G-loads (on the longitudinal as well as the lateral axis) as well as tyre temperatures, camber angles and wear rates. I loved it.
I'm actually afraid it might be me as the few times I went online my connection was spotty and everyone jumped around, so what appeared to be a clean pass turned into a bump as they suddenly jumped in front of me at least twice.
Beginner: Daytona Super Speedway
GT5P physics rock all over Forza2 buy along way, provided you have a wheel.
Im not sure how much different they feel with a pad, i havent played a driving game with a pad in over 4 years.
Forza2 with the microsoft, wheel felt ok at best, but the handling was too forgiving and the wheel total rubbish.
In Pro mode with no aids in GT5p, it almost feels like driving, add the clutch and manual shifter into the equation (SP?) with the G25 and is comparable to some PC sims for feel.
Its not quite right, but its a lot better than anything else on a console, and its far prettier than anything on PC.
Forza2 lacked that next gen look, that PD have delivered.
FM2 sound was much better.
The AI in GT is still sorely lacking over what FM2 achieved, i can reset race after race in GT5p and find the same cars spinning in the same spot time after time, and as for driving round the outside the sweeping right turn on the fuji track, is laughable, 5 cars did it on one lap when i raced the other day.
FM2 collison physics are miles better than GT5p, its crazy that in the 5th instalmant prologue PD still havent figured out how to program the effects of a collision to any realistic effect.
GT5 isnt going to be the end all to all racers, they have so much to learn from what others are doing, but PD are too narrowly focused on what they dhave been doing for 10years, they have a tunnel vision approach to their product, and relentlessly work and rework what they already have, rather than throw any aspect out and start it from scratch.
GT5 does somethings well, its a great drive, if they get online working right and deliver good enough tools to host lobbys, we should all get tremendous value out of it.
As an offline racer, i think we can forget that being of top quality, they are to far behind and blinkered about the total overhaul their AI needs, so far for me, GT5prologue is just a further demonstration of a modified AI that was seen in GT4 and its predecessors.
The core physics, AI, graphics, atmosphere of Prologue are really good, but there are some parts that really need work. Some of it will get fixed in GT 5, but I'm guessing these missions are GT thing.
Can someone verify has the GT series always had this type of career mode?
is there a certain "GT5P sucks, Forza rocks and discussion ends here" formula in action here?