FM Vs GT - Discussion Thread (read the first post before you post)

[Spagetti69]

Who said Forza will be flawless? A quote would be handy.

 

[Luminis]

If FM4 turns out to be a big GT5 you and I will be the first to come to the forums with our displeasure, if not we'll be enjoying ourselves till FM5.

Well, I'll probably spam the T10 forums again, anyways

I'm expecting to still find some flaws with the PI system, visibility issues at dusk due to not having headlights, the AI's cars not upgrading according to the track and still lacking in terms of pace and such...

Even I'm not disappointed at all, I'd like to point out most of the flaws that concern me in whatever way. From what I've seen, that helped the franchise develop to where it is, so I'll continue to act like that

 

[Da-Bomber]

One glaring flaw with Forza that bothers me is the game does not have a Honda Accord for God knows why.

 

[Spagetti69]

Could some one post a link to the IGN GT/Forza article. I'm on iPhone sorry.

Think it applies to this thread.

 

[II-zOoLoGy-II]

One glaring flaw with Forza that bothers me is the game does not have a Honda Accord for God knows why.

Now I have heard everything.

 

[shhiny48]

Now I have heard everything.

Yeah going to side with you on that one. Could care less about the Accord... but the Accord Euro R's are fun to drive in the GT series!

 

[JJ72]

Actually I kind of expect we will have the Dacia Sandero as some sort of secret car....

 

[shhiny48]

Actually I kind of expect we will have the Dacia Sandero as some sort of secret car....

👍

 

[Terronium-12]

I want the Skoda Yeti, or this game is 🤬 to me.

 

[PzR Slim]

Oh, not even. You must have missed the remarks about suggesting the name of the boards changed to the "We Hate Gran Turismo Forums."

There are some very fannish claims going on for Forza 4, to one extent or another that it won't have any issues, or issues of any consequence. As someone who has had to endure hair pulling from just about EVERY Microsoft product for fifteen years now, I can't see how anyone can say that about F4 without crossed fingers. Now, this could be the first MS product to work as advertised with almost nothing to wince over, but I've been down this path through all three Forzas, so my fingers are taped crossed.

As with all things Forza, we'll find out in a couple weeks whether or not Jeremy Clarkson will be the heart and soul of the game, and not just the voice - you know, a man who's opinion of himself is greatly exaggerated.

No one has said it will be flawless. It won't, the history of FM games and games in general tell you this. What I said was, that because this is T10's third attempt at a 'this generation' racer on the same hardware there is much less chance of the issues that PD ran into as a result of GT5 being their first 'this generation' game on current hardware. PD were starting from the ground up after being out of the game for a long time and dealing with new hardware. I think GT5 suffered as a result of that.

Some people don't seem to realise how much of a disappointment GT5 actually was for many people. They assume that we are FM's extreme fans when for many of us GT5 was our first love. I have said it in the past that I was secretly smug leading upto the release of GT5 that my first love would show this FM upstart how it was done properly. I was prepared for GT5 to wipe the floor with Forza and I would have loved it to happen. But it didn't, it failed miserably in that regard. It does some things incredibly well but there are many things that Forza does so much better. And as a whole FM3 does a better job overall with FM4 looking as though it's going to do even better. I don't say this because I am an FM extremist. I say it with my hand on my heart because it's what I believe. I've been gaming for over thirty years, owned every console imaginable and played just about every racing game ever made.

Sometimes I think these arguments are completely pointless. When I think back over the years we are so lucky to have the games we have now. When I see people complaining about graphics I love to post this picture.

Makes you realise how far we have come!

GT5 is an astounding game, as is FM3 and I'm sure FM4 will be as well. I have a preference for one, not based on some weird allegiance, I just think one is better than the other.

 

[Sele1981]

GT5:

Circuit de la Sarthe 2009_2 by shintastic48, on Flickr

Makes we want to finish my work today, go home and play GT5

 

[jabofu]

One glaring flaw with Forza that bothers me is the game does not have a Honda Accord for God knows why.

You know that there is the make called "Acura" in the game with the TSX-model. So there is the Accord, same car, but with a different name.

Unfortunately there arent any older Accords.

 

[HBK]

Some people don't seem to realise how much of a disappointment GT5 actually was for many people. They assume that we are FM's extreme fans when for many of us GT5 was our first love. I have said it in the past that I was secretly smug leading upto the release of GT5 that my first love would show this FM upstart how it was done properly. I was prepared for GT5 to wipe the floor with Forza and I would have loved it to happen. But it didn't, it failed miserably in that regard. It does some things incredibly well but there are many things that Forza does so much better. And as a whole FM3 does a better job overall with FM4 looking as though it's going to do even better. I don't say this because I am an FM extremist. I say it with my hand on my heart because it's what I believe.

This.

Very much, this.

 

[Spagetti69]

I think GT5's game case is better.
Overall volumetric size is smaller, therefor saving storage space and maybe increasing space for an extra game.

 

[jabofu]

I think GT5's game case is better.
Overall volumetric size is smaller, therefor saving storage space and maybe increasing space for an extra game.

Absolutely, I really dont get it why nobody brought this up before. The underside of the blu-ray is also way better for use as a mirror.

The green case of FM 3 is also bad outdoors. When I take it for a walk in the park and drop it, it will get hard to find it again. Pretty camoflage.

When you think about those aspects of the games, then GT5 is way way better and blows FM3.

 

[HBK]

 

[Luminis]

GT5 also has a cover that can be flipped, so the ESRB ratings and stuff don't get in the way of your viewing pleasure, if I'm not mistaken.

HUGE plus.

 

[Tenacious D]

See, that's what makes debating here quite annoying, at times.

Is that bolded part what you read into other statements or did you make that up from scratch?

Well, there have been plenty of posts like this:

I doubt it. There just isn't as much to criticize. Yes FM4 doesn't have things that GT5 has(rally, karts, weather, etc) but everything that FM4 does have is done in top notch quality. The same cannot be said for GT5 imo.

Anyhow...

What we've seen and read, though, suggests that T10 addressed a lot of the issues people had with FM3. Small images? We get Big Sots. AWD cars being dominant? We get a revised PI system so that they get a higher PI in comparison. Body roll wasn't enough? Look at some of the muscle car pictures, there's plenty of roll now.

Does that mean there won't be any flaws? Absolutely not. Does that give us a general idea about how T10 approached their game? Yes, it does.

I really can't see a point to this part.

Small images?? How about "small images of high compression and color distortion." It's almost like you haven't done a thing with any Froza game prior to 4 but race.

Have any remarks or videos T10 have given us a clue to the issues in the previous three games? Or that car models would be ported flaws and all from the first game through the third?

I really shouldn't have said anything. I was dead tired last night, still am, and you guys were merrily riding your parade to ship day. Then if anything was wrong, I could just imagine the reactions to people asking why T10 hadn't addressed such n such.

By the way, zr1chris remarked that PD hadn't shown a sign of Standard cars prior to release. Dude, we didn't just have images to argue about, we got videos! People only remember what they want to, and it's the same way with Forza.

Just keep something in mind in regard my post: people cross their fingers in favor of something turning out well... of course I'm forgetting the nature of these two games and Playstation in general. Only SONY products, and Gran Turismo in particular, can be criticized. I should have learned my lesson by now.

Carry on with the hype train, chums, just a few short days to go.

 

[Luminis]

Well, there have been plenty of posts like this:

Hey, if "not as much to criticize" equals "lol FM4 = perfect" in your mind, nothing I can do about that. I still see no claim to perfection there (much unlike the one of a certain game's director, by the way).

I really can't see a point to this part.

Oh, why doesn't that surprise me?

Small images?? How about "small images of high compression and color distortion." It's almost like you haven't done a thing with any Froza game prior to 4 but race.

Yeah, small, high compression artifacts, blabla. The whole thing. The point you so gently missed is actually pretty simple: They've adressed issues that have been complained about. Plain and simple. Or so I thought.

Have any remarks or videos T10 have given us a clue to the issues in the previous three games? Or that car models would be ported flaws and all from the first game through the third?

Remakrs about how the steering aids can all be turned off (major complaint about FM3)? Yes.
Remarks about how they've implemented a mode to get bigger pictures of better quality (big complaint with FM3)? Yes.
Remarks about how they've reworked the PI system to not favor AWD cars and cars with high downforce (mahoossive complaint with FM3)? Yes.

So, your point, again? Sure, there are flaws. Some cars having issues with the modeling, for example. What's wrong with saying that something like the nose of an S2000 being slightly off isn't as glaring a flaw as having 800 cars from 2004 in your game?

I really shouldn't have said anything.

Feel free to say whatever you want, but in my opinion, you should to try to cling to things that have actually been said.

Only SONY products, and Gran Turismo in particular, can be criticized. I should have learned my lesson by now.

So, every game should be criticized as much as GT5? I'm sorry, I'm just not as fuzzed about by the modelling of a dozen cars being off as I was by the standard cars. What am I supposed to do? Make some stuff up to complain about, just for the hell of criticizing something? Because that'd be "fair"?

 

[PzR Slim]

Only SONY products, and Gran Turismo in particular, can be criticized. I should have learned my lesson by now.

I really don't get your point. This thread is full of people criticising both games and refuting that criticism in equal measure. Both games can be, and are, criticised and people will refute that criticism from both sides of the debate. There just happens to be more people on the Forza side of the debate active in this thread, not unusual looking at it's home on the forum. I think it's home on the forum also means that the more rabid supporters of GT tend to be the ones that pop in and 'debate'. It would probably be better if this thread was in a 'neutral' area of the forum but I'm not sure any part of the forum is neutral.

One thing I think we all forget at times is that there is no right answer to the question, 'Which is better?'. All we really have is opinions that differ.

 

[jabofu]

Well, there have been plenty of posts like this:


Anyhow...


I really can't see a point to this part.

Small images?? How about "small images of high compression and color distortion." It's almost like you haven't done a thing with any Froza game prior to 4 but race.

Have any remarks or videos T10 have given us a clue to the issues in the previous three games? Or that car models would be ported flaws and all from the first game through the third?

I really shouldn't have said anything. I was dead tired last night, still am, and you guys were merrily riding your parade to ship day. Then if anything was wrong, I could just imagine the reactions to people asking why T10 hadn't addressed such n such.

By the way, zr1chris remarked that PD hadn't shown a sign of Standard cars prior to release. Dude, we didn't just have images to argue about, we got videos! People only remember what they want to, and it's the same way with Forza.

Just keep something in mind in regard my post: people cross their fingers in favor of something turning out well... of course I'm forgetting the nature of these two games and Playstation in general. Only SONY products, and Gran Turismo in particular, can be criticized. I should have learned my lesson by now.

Carry on with the hype train, chums, just a few short days to go.

Sure, it is all a big funny joke and this part of the forum is for the GT-Experts to come by and have a fun time by mucking Forza and its players.

Tell me that I am wrong, but the standard car thing was never to be heavily advertised to the customer. It only got leaked with some youtube video and screenshots, it was more like the Porsche problem and FM4. It was more like if Turn10 only would have shown Autovista and no gameplay, it would be the same how players got threated by PD.

And sure, we are only hyped, uninformed and blind fans who never see the problems in Forza. We can only criticise GT and praise Forza. Dude, you must be the wisest man around here, able to hold the balance in the discussions.

So what with the hype for GT? It was hyped through the roof into the space. Problems like standard cars and big physic flaws are talked down till this day, not from all, but from the most. Most player say that is it still a very good game, even with some big problems. On the other hand, this cant be working with Forza 3 + 4. This game have bugs too, considerably way less than GT5, but it cant be a very good game for many minds here.

People put it on the same tier as NFS, Burnout and other racers.

Seeing the niveau of this forum go down like the financial market in 2008 is what surprises me the most. When I joined some years ago, I thought here would be a forum for reasonable discussion about GT and it was, but now it becomes the kindergarden of the dummies.

 

[bell]

gt5 has too many inconsistencies!
. loading time too many of them.
autos standards. Too many of them
No simulated car damage
and so on. . ..

but forza 3 in favor had a nice round packet!

And GT5 already had problems with the comparative F3!

In my opinion, Forza will again be the better gaming experience!

 

[OGL]

Fair enough

 

[OGL]

Lolz, Forza has no keys in the car's start slot

 

[MitchZ06]

Forza Motorsport 4 - The Real Hotwiring Simulator.

 

[Spagetti69]

Lolz, Forza has no keys in the car's start slot

Don't think there's fuel in the go hole either.

 

[OGL]

Perhaps the best actual cockpit I was able to google

 

[HBK]

Have any remarks or videos T10 have given us a clue to the issues in the previous three games? Or that car models would be ported flaws and all from the first game through the third?

wtf are you talking about? Of course Turn10 doesn't advertise "hey, we don't have proper pit-stops!", pretty much like PD does not advertise "hey, we don't have damage!". What's the point? All games have flaws. Do you seriously imply that having some modeling errors like a slightly off Enzo nose or some slightly misplaced headlights are GLARING FLAWS? I mean, SERIOUSLY?

By the way, zr1chris remarked that PD hadn't shown a sign of Standard cars prior to release. Dude, we didn't just have images to argue about, we got videos! People only remember what they want to, and it's the same way with Forza.

Not sure what your point is. Everyone with a tad bit of knowledge of how game development works and a slight interest in the franchise knew we would be getting 800 "standards". We saw it coming, there was leaks, heck even Turn10 commented on that! Doesn't change the fact that it sucks, and show how weird PD priorities are for their game.

Yeah, standards sucks, I know we're all getting tired of hearing such things, but this is still the truth. Having 800 PS2/PSP cars in a PS3 game is just plain wrong. And don't try to derail this into some "hey the S2000 is wrong from FM1 and still is", because even if there are still some modeling errors, we still get an S2000 with high detail modeling (in photomode), a fully functional cockpit, damage, and customization (both visual and mechanical).

Do I need to remind you that, to this day, no freakin' cockpit in GT5 has a functional fuel gauge?

But hey, at least you can activate the wipers! And honk!

 

[PzR Slim]

I don't see why any of us need to get angry over this and shout. Like I said above, it's all just opinions. Just try and respond in a matter of fact manner. Half the problems in this thread come about by the way we talk to one another. Chill people.

 

[Mr Fox]

Sure, it is all a big funny joke and this part of the forum is for the GT-Experts to come by and have a fun time by mucking Forza and its players.

Tell me that I am wrong, but the standard car thing was never to be heavily advertised to the customer. It only got leaked with some youtube video and screenshots, it was more like the Porsche problem and FM4. It was more like if Turn10 only would have shown Autovista and no gameplay, it would be the same how players got threated by PD.

And sure, we are only hyped, uninformed and blind fans who never see the problems in Forza. We can only criticise GT and praise Forza. Dude, you must be the wisest man around here, able to hold the balance in the discussions.

So what with the hype for GT? It was hyped through the roof into the space. Problems like standard cars and big physic flaws are talked down till this day, not from all, but from the most. Most player say that is it still a very good game, even with some big problems. On the other hand, this cant be working with Forza 3 + 4. This game have bugs too, considerably way less than GT5, but it cant be a very good game for many minds here.

People put it on the same tier as NFS, Burnout and other racers.

Seeing the niveau of this forum go down like the financial market in 2008 is what surprises me the most. When I joined some years ago, I thought here would be a forum for reasonable discussion about GT and it was, but now it becomes the kindergarden of the dummies.

GT5 is like that movie "Twins" with Arnold Schwarzenegger and Danny devito, one half of the game is really great and stands out really well, the other half is just awful, and lets the game down as a whole.

Its like you fancy this really really hot girl, but the only way you can go out with her, is if she can bring along her ugly annoying room mate with her. Problem is you can never get rid of her dam roommate, shes always there irritating the hell out of you, either in your face or lurking in the background.

Where as Forza i think is pretty much judged as a whole, theres no need for Forza fans to cherry picking the best bits or omit the nasty bits, every thing just works well together.