Gran Turismo 6 vs Forza Motorsport 5-Test Drive SRT 2013@Bathurst

[makimak22]

Fir

Okay, i'm going to assume English isn't your first language:

You just said FM4 did a bad job with the Nurburgring, yes? Because they did. The track was incorrect. Supposedly, it's being "rescanned". What the incorrect representation of a track has to do with licensing is beyond me. So i'm going to sit here and eat my peanut butter cookies, drink cranberry juice, fart a couple of times, and probably rage at Strider.



Show me financial statements from both companies proving so. Otherwise, cookie, juice, fart, Strider.




So PD isn't a First Party Sony developer? T10 must not be a First Party Microsoft developer. Sweet mother of holy chocolate balls slathered in banana sauce you have rocked my world!




Is GT Academy not already "allowed"?

Pls go back and read the original post. I was simply replying to a previous post by another member saying the TG took back the test track rights from GT because GT5 did a bad job of it...

Hang on, I will just give Hirai and Ballmer a call.... I worked in the game industry and these kind of deal happen all the time.

When did I say PD is not 1st party? But it is not owned and ran by SONY. Otherwise GT Academy would nver happen....

 

[Gerarghini]

On the topic of Top Gear, Top Gear used GT4 for the comparison between video games and real life, not Forza.

Wasn't it just because Forza wasn't big enough yet?

So PD isn't a First Party Sony developer? T10 must not be a First Party Microsoft developer.

I think what the statement was about is that PD develops all of its assets (aside from the KW and Yokohama partnership) while T10 I believe uses outsourcing or whatever it was called I forget. I might be wrong just because I believe T10 is much larger than PD.

 

[dice1998]

Fir

Pls go back and read the original post. I was simply replying to a previous post by another member saying the TG took back the test track rights from GT because GT5 did a bad job of it...

What does that have to do with Nurburgring, again? I must have missed that part while eating my cookies.

Hang on, I will just give Hirai and Ballmer a call....

Great!

When did I say PD is not 1st party?

Plus PD operates pretty much independently.

Last time I google'd, PD isn't an Indie development studio.

 

[OpticZero]

...I think GT is still trying to get the basics down...

Seriously??? Still trying to get the basic physics right???

 

[Alss]

Comments like that don't say much, other than you think of Forza too highly.

Or you refuse to accept just how stale the GT series has become.

 

[super_gt]

I hope to see this year comparison Gran Turismo 7 on PS4 vs Forza Motorsport 5.

 

[TokoTurismo]

Or you refuse to accept just how stale the GT series has become.

Um. You do realise that's just your opinion, right? Don't say as if it's a fact. GT can also be fun to many other people, even without all the features that aren't in the game and people here cry about.

 

[Bo]

Or you refuse to accept just how stale the GT series has become.

You come across as, and I really hate to use the term, but a Forza fanboy. All you've done in here is criticise GT and big up Forza to no end.

 

[jimipitbull]

Or you refuse to accept just how stale the GT series has become.

Some people accept 13 tracks in racing title, others don't.

 

[Alss]

You come across as, and I really hate to use the term, but a Forza fanboy. All you've done in here is criticise GT and big up Forza to no end.

Not at all , but GT never moves forward.

Poor engine sounds

Poor AI

Poor AA

Poor frame rate

Poor damage

Poor impact sound

Stale driving experience

No livery editor

Forza 3-4-5 all do these aspects far better.

You do not need to be a fan of any other game to see this, GT is dying and its not hard to see why, they can't even get the basics right , I was a GT fan but im not enclined to blindly support a franchise that can't sort out the basics of the game they produce.

Whether your a forza fan codemasters fan or whatever it makes no difference GT fails with every release and fans will speak with there wallets more so now drive club and P cars are on the horizon , PD cannot afford to keep churning out GT in its current state .

 

[GregOr1971]

So , FM5 released on a brand new 500€ next gen hardware that is supposedly 10 times more powerfull than X360 and we can agree PS3 too (not talking bout 256mb vs 8GB of memory ? ) , does better rendition of Bathurst ?
That comes so surprising that I wouldn't believe a s+++ , if Darin wouldn't do a comparission test/review. ISR must be real desperate seeking for viewers/hits from fanboys hordes trolling on YT or he's just mad that PD didn't send them a nice free GT6 racing pod as FM5 did ?


PS: I don't doubt that FM5 is good game as previous FM I played were and yet with all that power under the hood, FM/T10 is still not able to do day/night cycle and weather change after 5 iterations of the game and 10years of development ? But livery editor is cool I agree.

add:

Maybe I was too hard on Darin and ISR after all I don't see test getting really biased toward any game and the only points he make about why he thinks GT6 Bathurst is "worst" are lack of "proper" sound , flickering shadows and damage model> all 3 I can live with /not bad for a 8 year old piece of hardware vs NEXT GEN rendition/ and still enjoy GTs 24h cycle with weather rather than FMs endless time stood still > main reason I got bored of FM .

 

[jimipitbull]

PD cannot afford to keep churning out GT in its current state .

Well, it looks like GT6 is selling twice as well as Forza 5. Can Turn 10 afford this?

http://www.vgchartz.com/game/72222/forza-motorsport-5/
http://www.vgchartz.com/game/72181/gran-turismo-6/

 

[Bo]

Not at all , but GT never moves forward.

Poor engine sounds

Poor AI

Poor AA

Poor frame rate

Poor damage

Poor impact sound

Stale driving experience

No livery editor

Forza 3-4-5 all do these aspects far better.

You do not need to be a fan of any other game to see this, GT is dying and its not hard to see why, they can't even get the basics right , I was a GT fan but im not enclined to blindly support a franchise that can't sort out the basics of the game they produce.

Whether your a forza fan codemasters fan or whatever it makes no difference GT fails with every release and fans will speak with there wallets more so now drive club and P cars are on the horizon , PD cannot afford to keep churning out GT in its current state .

Those things i've highlighted are typical "fanboy" terms. In other words, it's utter rubbish. GT is not dying, as GT6 outsold Forza 5 on the Christmas charts. Is GT failing with every release? If it is, then please tell me how it's on eof the biggest gaming franchises of all time.

The "stale driving experience" that you've put down is not only a matter of opinion, but you haven't even provided a reason why. All you've done in this thread is knock GT and proclaim Forza (because apparently Forza 3,4 and 5 have all beaten GT into the ground ).

I think this qualifies you as some sort of Forza fanboy.

 

[Imari]

Well, it looks like GT6 is selling twice as well as Forza 5. Can Turn 10 afford this?

http://www.vgchartz.com/game/72222/forza-motorsport-5/
http://www.vgchartz.com/game/72181/gran-turismo-6/

I imagine they're fairly happy about it. 80+ million PS3s in the wild versus how many Xbox Ones? Maybe 4 million by now? Seems pretty good to me. You can only sell as many copies as there are people who own the console.

If FM5 sold 2 million copies at this point then every other Xbox One owner would have a copy. That would be wild, rampant, flailing success. I think having 25% of Xbox One owners buy the game is pretty good, on the scale of things.

Besides, release titles exist almost purely to shift units of hardware. Microsoft won't care how many copies of FM5 it sells, it will care how many Xbox Ones it can get into homes on the back of the titles available. Later on in the lifecycle is when sales and profitability of the game become more important. Right now, every single Xbox One owner could buy a copy and it's still not that massive a number compared to big hitters like GT5 or GTA V.

Comparing sales numbers between games with that big a difference in hardware take up isn't going to be useful. Big sales numbers are very important to GT6, they're trying to recoup their investment from the last 8 years of development. Big sales numbers are impossible for FM5, they're simply trying to drive (ha!) hardware attachment.

Unfortunately, comparative sales are not a useful measure of quality in this instance.

 

[jimipitbull]

I imagine they're fairly happy about it. 80+ million PS3s in the wild versus how many Xbox Ones? Maybe 4 million by now? Seems pretty good to me. You can only sell as many copies as there are people who own the console.

If FM5 sold 2 million copies at this point then every other Xbox One owner would have a copy. That would be wild, rampant, flailing success. I think having 25% of Xbox One owners buy the game is pretty good, on the scale of things.

Besides, release titles exist almost purely to shift units of hardware. Microsoft won't care how many copies of FM5 it sells, it will care how many Xbox Ones it can get into homes on the back of the titles available. Later on in the lifecycle is when sales and profitability of the game become more important. Right now, every single Xbox One owner could buy a copy and it's still not that massive a number compared to big hitters like GT5 or GTA V.

Comparing sales numbers between games with that big a difference in hardware take up isn't going to be useful. Big sales numbers are very important to GT6, they're trying to recoup their investment from the last 8 years of development. Big sales numbers are impossible for FM5, they're simply trying to drive (ha!) hardware attachment.

Unfortunately, comparative sales are not a useful measure of quality in this instance.

The point of the comparison was to show that PD are not in financial trouble, compared to their competitor. For that, I used the numbers available.

User base/console sales have little relevance for this comparison. I do note though, that ps3 console is actually outselling xbone on a weekly basis. You could interpret that as GT6 being a better console seller than FM5.

 

[Imari]

The point of the comparison was to show that PD are not in financial trouble, compared to their competitor. For that, I used the numbers available.

It's doesn't really show anything of the sort though. They could both be in financial trouble, or neither, or either of them, because we have no real idea what sort of return per unit they get or what it actually costs them to make each game. Some sales numbers in the absence of any other data are nearly meaningless for evaluating financials.

What you can say is that any return from FM5 is likely a bonus. I doubt it's intended to be profitable in a simplistic sense, it's intended to prop up the Xbox One ecosystem at the start of it's life. T10 is not going to be in financial trouble because FM5's primary purpose is not to be financially successful.

Perhaps GT6 is intended to do the same for the PS3 at the end of it's life, but I sort of doubt it. I suspect GT6 is purely cashing out the investment of development for the last eight years with the current PS3 user base before too many people start migrating to PS4. Were it about extending the PS3 lifespan, there would have been little disadvantage to releasing six months later and having the game somewhat closer to feature complete.

PD probably need good sales from GT6, although what they would count as good sales at this point is unknown. They're likely getting less revenue than they expected though, considering the backlash from microtransactions and that their monthly DLC still hasn't started producing cashflow.

T10 would like good sales, as would anyone, but they're pretty limited in what they can achieve in that area. There's a fairly hard ceiling on how many they can sell, and as such Microsoft must have planned for the game either to be extremely cheap to make (which looking at it, I sort of doubt) or that they'll eat the loss for the other expected benefits of a console moving game.


It is interesting that PS3 is still selling well, but there's so many great games available for that particular platform that pinning it on any single one is probably difficult. If people are buying a new PS3 it could be for any number of reasons. There's been a number of outstanding games in the last year, and there's many exceptional titles in every category for users just getting onto the system now.

 

[MXH]

GT is not dying, as GT6 outsold Forza 5 on the Christmas charts.

Luckily for PD, considering the amount of money people have to spend in order to play FM5. Did you honestly expect otherwise?

Is GT failing with every release? If it is, then please tell me how it's on eof the biggest gaming franchises of all time.

Stagnation would be a more appropriate word, I believe. When people are starting to look elsewhere to get their driving and racing experiences, previous achievments mean very little.

The "stale driving experience" that you've put down is not only a matter of opinion, but you haven't even provided a reason why. All you've done in this thread is knock GT and proclaim Forza (because apparently Forza 3,4 and 5 have all beaten GT into the ground ).

One has to still acknowledge and give credit where credit is due. Forza does most of those mentioned aspects better, and that's not an opinion.

 

[Rash-182]

Well, it looks like GT6 is selling twice as well as Forza 5. Can Turn 10 afford this?

http://www.vgchartz.com/game/72222/forza-motorsport-5/
http://www.vgchartz.com/game/72181/gran-turismo-6/

Oh my god..

So its not fair to compare XONE and PS3 graphics wise. But it is perfectly ok to compare sales of two titles on 80 million PS3´s and 2 milion XONE´s

👍👍👍

 

[jimipitbull]

What you can say is that any return from FM5 is likely a bonus. I doubt it's intended to be profitable in a simplistic sense, it's intended to prop up the Xbox One ecosystem at the start of it's life. T10 is not going to be in financial trouble because FM5's primary purpose is not to be financially successful.

Perhaps GT6 is intended to do the same for the PS3 at the end of it's life, but I sort of doubt it. I suspect GT6 is purely cashing out the investment of development for the last eight years with the current PS3 user base before too many people start migrating to PS4. Were it about extending the PS3 lifespan, there would have been little disadvantage to releasing six months later and having the game somewhat closer to feature complete.

PD probably need good sales from GT6, although what they would count as good sales at this point is unknown. They're likely getting less revenue than they expected though, considering the backlash from microtransactions and that their monthly DLC still hasn't started producing cashflow.

T10 would like good sales, as would anyone, but they're pretty limited in what they can achieve in that area. There's a fairly hard ceiling on how many they can sell, and as such Microsoft must have planned for the game either to be extremely cheap to make (which looking at it, I sort of doubt) or that they'll eat the loss for the other expected benefits of a console moving game.


It is interesting that PS3 is still selling well, but there's so many great games available for that particular platform that pinning it on any single one is probably difficult. If people are buying a new PS3 it could be for any number of reasons. There's been a number of outstanding games in the last year, and there's many exceptional titles in every category for users just getting onto the system now.

Yeah, I pretty much agree here.

It's interesting looking at the breakup of sales figures by region. Approx 2/3 of Forza sales are in NorthAmerica (630,000), and GT6 has sold half as many units in NorthAmerica(320,000). For the rest of the world, GT is way ahead.

 

[Rash-182]

Those things i've highlighted are typical "fanboy" terms. In other words, it's utter rubbish. GT is not dying, as GT6 outsold Forza 5 on the Christmas charts. Is GT failing with every release? If it is, then please tell me how it's on eof the biggest gaming franchises of all time.

The "stale driving experience" that you've put down is not only a matter of opinion, but you haven't even provided a reason why. All you've done in this thread is knock GT and proclaim Forza (because apparently Forza 3,4 and 5 have all beaten GT into the ground ).

I think this qualifies you as some sort of Forza fanboy.

Again, Alss has listed a number of things, that are wrong with GT titles for the last 15 years. Yet the only argument, that you can come up with are the sales numbers??

Talking about fanboys

 

[TokoTurismo]

Again, Alss has listed a number of things, that are wrong with GT titles for the last 15 years.

Despite that, some people still play GT even with all the things Alss mentioned. Need I say people don't care about the flaws games contain? They will still enjoy said game no matter what. Other games being better or not, who cares.

 

[Rash-182]

Of course, but the last time I checked, this thread was about Forza 5 vs GT6

 

[Tornado]

As opposed to just monopolizing the name of Top Gear, the presenters’ voice and Stig with no particular appliction to the game itself?

In the run up to GT5, a huge deal was made about the licences that PD were excited to grab. WRC, NASCAR, Top Gear, Super GT.
What were the particular applications of those to GT5?


WRC: Literally nothing. The GT series had had WRC cars for 10 years by the time GT5 came out, and the WRC licence amounted to nothing beyond 4 already-several-years-out-of-spec rally cars and nothing to do with them. Even despite all of the hoopla made about the return of point to point races, the rally mode was the worst it had ever been; and a complete disgrace compared to the huge expansion rallying was given in GT4.
Super GT: Also nothing. The GT series had had those cars since day one, and the Super GT licence did nothing but give a dozen or so already-several-years-out-of-spec Super GT cars (that PD would have undoubtedly included anyway) and nothing to do with them. They screwed it up so badly that even though their had been a 5 race championship series dedicated to those cars in every previous game, all GT5 had was 3 unconnected semi-sprint races.
Top Gear: The Test Track (with no ability to even do a standing start on it, nevermind any of the cars linked to the show), a few completely anonymous races with no more effort put into them than the chase the rabbit seasonals, and an intro voiceover by someone who isn't even on the show.
NASCAR: The only one they even bothered to do anything with (likely because it was the only one that had a real impact in a market that they were losing influence in). It amounted to zombie Jeff Gordon giving an intro voiceover (a nice idea, if poorly done), a few creative (by PD standards) special events, a single track and a race series that does nothing to even pretend to use the rules of NASCAR. Still, I'd call this a net gain because it's the only NASCAR game that's any good since Dirt to Daytona.




In comparison, I barely utilized the Top Gear options in Forza (outside of the Car Bowling, honestly. Don't care for Autovista so didn't hear any of the narration, and didn't bother with Car Soccer), but simply turning Forza 4 on for the first time does a better job connecting the series to the game than GT5 did with its use of the licence.

Those things i've highlighted are typical "fanboy" terms. In other words, it's utter rubbish. GT is not dying, as GT6 outsold Forza 5 on the Christmas charts. Is GT failing with every release? If it is, then please tell me how it's on eof the biggest gaming franchises of all time.

It's pretty depressing that so long as the game has the sales, problems will be excused by people who don't even get the money from the sales.

The "stale driving experience" that you've put down is not only a matter of opinion, but you haven't even provided a reason why.

So that post you quoted wasn't good enough for reasoning?

 

[Bo]

Again, Alss has listed a number of things, that are wrong with GT titles for the last 15 years. Yet the only argument, that you can come up with are the sales numbers??

Talking about fanboys

I said the things I highlighted, because I agree with the others. Basic logic. The only reason I picked him up on those things is because all he has done in this thread is proclaim Forza to high heaven and pick flaws with GT.

 

[Alss]

As others have said I have posted reasons but you choose to completely ignore them, and yet im the fan boy ( face palm )

 

[Bo]

As others have said I have posted reasons but you choose to completely ignore them, and yet im the fan boy ( face palm )

A list of vague terms like "stale driving experience" is not an explanation as to why the driving experience is stale. I haven't seen you say a single word about why GT is good, you just seem to be putting it down with vague claims and proclaiming that Forza has always been the God of games.

 

[Imari]

Don't care for Autovista so didn't hear any of the narration...

It was actually a pretty good way of presenting the car information in an interesting and entertaining way. I got bored of the Autovista car porn thing in the first few minutes, but I still went through and listened to each short narration from Clarkson because they were kind of cool. It's a nicer and more fun way to learn about the cars than random blurbs scrolling down the side of the screen, for me anyway.

The in-game stats say I wasted a couple of hours doing that, but I enjoyed myself so I think that's a great (and easy!) way to add some volume to the gameplay. For people that like that stuff, anyway. I'm sure if it were on every car, every person would have at least a few of their favourites that they'd go and listen to.

 

[Alss]

I listed 8 points that are not even an opinion but fact and you come back with im being vague .

PD could re-release GT4 re title it GT7 and folk like you would still be pleased and defend , which is cool just don't expect others to be wearing the same rose tinted glasses.

 

[Bo]

I listed 8 points that are not even an opinion but fact and you come back with im being vague .

PD could re-release GT4 re title it GT7 and folk like you would still be pleased and defend , which is cool just don't expect others to be wearing the same rose tinted glasses.

You're still clueless on what I said. I highlighted certain vague points that were the words of a fanboy, and yet again, you're just bashing GT and you can't say a single bad word about Forza. Also, tell me how "stale driving experience" is a fact. I don't use the term fanboy lightly, but you're honestly one of them.

EDIT - If you hate GT this much, why do you keep coming back to this thread? I treat Forza and GT fairly equally. They could both learn from each other. But you can't say a bad word about Forza, and instead GT is so much of a failure, and it's a disaster, it's stale etc. Apparently, these are all facts, and not opinion in any way (a biased and tainted opinion at that) .

 

[ironman44321]

You're still clueless on what I said. I highlighted certain vague points that were the words of a fanboy, and yet again, you're just bashing GT and you can't say a single bad word about Forza. Also, tell me how "stale driving experience" is a fact. I don't use the term fanboy lightly, but you're honestly one of them.

EDIT - If you hate GT this much, why do you keep coming back to this thread? I treat Forza and GT fairly equally. They could both learn from each other. But you can't say a bad word about Forza, and instead GT is so much of a failure, and it's a disaster, it's stale etc. Apparently, these are all facts, and not opinion in any way (a biased and tainted opinion at that) .

I wouldn't even bother. He's not here to have an intelligent debate or add anything meaningful. He just said that list of things he doesn't like about the games are Fact...he's hopeless.