Gran Turismo 7 Physics

[llNovall]

Just a nobody with no real life experience talking out his butt here with a G29, but my thoughts on the 1.13 physics:

Doesn't feel like much has changed. Sure, I can actually take a corner without insta-dying now, but it feels like the "instant death slider" has just been moved to a higher speed. There is still no warning and no lead up to a car's rear end breaking out. They're still snappy, but at least they're also easier to catch and correct them now. I still don't feel comfortable near a car's limits, much less enjoy dancing on the edge of adhesion. My gut tells me it's still far from realistic. A stock RX-8 is still way too snappy and spinny.

Part of that is because I am seemingly expected to know so much, yet is given so little information. FFB is still nonexistent. No idea what the heck the tyres are doing in either road or racecar unless I listen to them or find myself facing a wall. I confess I have no idea how to suss out a car's limits in GT7 and drive conssitently near them. Currently I have to drive with trail and error, crashing the same car many times to memorise exactly how much speed I can carry into a corner and how much gas I can give on exit. There is nothing at all intuitive about the experience and it's a frustrating chore.

I'm at such a loss for how to drive quickly in GT7 I might open up a new thread asking for help.

Is it just me or do the stock roll bars and brakes feel artifically weakened in GT7 to encourage tuning? I tried slamming the brakes with no ABS in the Tuscan in GTS, and the tyres locked up immediately. Did the same on GT7 and I barely got any smoke. Will post video proof if needed.

G29 here and feels great. Try 4 torque, 5 sensitivity, and controller sensitivity at -2. Let me know what you think after.

 

[extreme car]

O no doubt nothing is impossible, but I’m also a realist man, those guys have pretty much dedicated their lives to driving and that series.. and while I can hold my own in GT7… just going off me I shouldn’t be that close to those pros. It’s not the end of the world I will still enjoy the game but that how way I feel.

Uhh you do know the GT7 aliens can probably lap my tsukuba lap time by about 3-4 seconds right? Do you think those aliens can beat BM crew or match their GT7 time IRL? I'm just happy the RWD cars are getting closer to their IRL dynamics and time around tsukuba, snap oversteer on throttle was my major concern and they fixed in the new update so they're heading in the right direction.

 

[Td04]

What are the times of Bm crew at tsukuba with gt86?

 

[Mane]

Yeah car handling, bugs etc way more important to me than adding tracks, cars.

I didn't mind it before tbh, but this patch sounds like a big improvement to me.

It was mostly fine before, with some problems right on the edge of adhesion (either losing or gaining grip). The more extreme the situation the more apparent you could make it.

In testing this I could get a Porsche engined Samba bus to wholly disregard its own inertia and weight shifting to incorrectly apply grip loading delta across all four tyres.
I also managed to get incorrect lat/long regrip changes.

It looked hilarious, like a car stuntman on wire-work! But was difficult to describe, as it is a combination of multiple things.

I'm looking forward to more tracks and cars, but they're coming anyway.


Fixing the problems is very important, and updating the translation layer (how you 'feel' the car despite not being in one) is the priority. The translation layer is THE thing GT has always excelled at, you know what the car is doing and is going to do, you can feel it without having it explained.

Great update, heading in the right direction and enjoying their journey.

 

[GTboyz]

This feels a lot better for me. I was worried that all the cars I had fun before no longer enjoyable but I enjoy driving them even more.

 

[platocplx]

It was mostly fine before, with some problems right on the edge of adhesion (either losing or gaining grip). The more extreme the situation the more apparent you could make it.

In testing this I could get a Porsche engined Samba bus to wholly disregard its own inertia and weight shifting to incorrectly apply grip loading delta across all four tyres.
I also managed to get incorrect lat/long regrip changes.

It looked hilarious, like a car stuntman on wire-work! But was difficult to describe, as it is a combination of multiple things.

I'm looking forward to more tracks and cars, but they're coming anyway.


Fixing the problems is very important, and updating the translation layer (how you 'feel' the car despite not being in one) is the priority. The translation layer is THE thing GT has always excelled at, you know what the car is doing and is going to do, you can feel it without having it explained.

Great update, heading in the right direction and enjoying their journey.

Great response there and yup how you connect to the cars comes first. In the coming months, I’m sure more and more I’ll come on the content side. I’m sure while there are a loud vocal minority here majority of people are probably just finishing some of the content. Meanwhile I just checked in 94 hours in and im just nearing the end of the menus due to me either trying to get gold on licenses, re doing races in menus to get first, playing online etc.

 

[F30clubman]

The road cars I tried still felt a bit odd, namely the E30 M3 Evolution. But perhaps the set up I had on it doesn’t work with the new physics and it’s just a case of starting a new tune from scratch? (If anybody has any new tuning tips for the new physics, please share!)

Odd? That car was enormously improved from GTSport to GT7 and now it has become completely tamed and boring to drive! Good for an arcade game that one plays with a joystick but not for a simulation.

 

[Jeff Goji]

Fixing the problems is very important, and updating the translation layer (how you 'feel' the car despite not being in one) is the priority. The translation layer is THE thing GT has always excelled at, you know what the car is doing and is going to do, you can feel it without having it explained.

Great update, heading in the right direction and enjoying their journey.

This is very encouraging to read. I can't wait to try it out when I get off work this evening.

 

[Nielsen]

I’m not really sure what has changed with the physics. Everyone appears to be saying it feels so much better now, but what does exactly? I’ve driven a handful of RWD cars and I cannot identify a difference. 🤔

 

[graesand]

I’m not really sure what has changed with the physics. Everyone appears to be saying it feels so much better now, but what does exactly? I’ve driven a handful of RWD cars and I cannot identify a difference. 🤔

You cant notice anything at all????

 

[GTboyz]

I’m not really sure what has changed with the physics. Everyone appears to be saying it feels so much better now, but what does exactly? I’ve driven a handful of RWD cars and I cannot identify a difference. 🤔

Cars have more grip and the braking distance is reduced.

 

[SPOOLMAN]

Physics are incredible now 😍

Driving this C63 pre patch was near impossible. Now look at how much control I have over it. As someone who has driven a c63 on the track it feels exactly like the real life counterpart.

Some quick notes

- Cars now turn in as they should

- You can find that fine line between grip and over the limit. Allowing the cars grip limit to be so much higher!

- Braking is simulated far more realistically.

This update is amazing and the physics are almost flawless.

 

[RedRockValley]

I’m not really sure what has changed with the physics. Everyone appears to be saying it feels so much better now, but what does exactly? I’ve driven a handful of RWD cars and I cannot identify a difference. 🤔

Try the GT86 ‘15 on Comfort Softs.

 

[Nielsen]

Cars have more grip and the braking distance is reduced.

I don’t feel a difference in grip.

Try the GT86 ‘15 on Comfort Softs.

I’ve never driven the GT86 on comfort soft in GT7, so I wouldn’t be able to tell a difference. The tire choice shouldn’t matter though, as the patch notes make no mention of improved tires.

Since the update I’ve driven the Nissan Fairlady Z ‘08 (just to name one) but to me it feels no different than before. Very wobbly weight transfer and demands overly careful inputs, as always.

 

[Magog]

Any IRL driver I've ever heard compare sim racing to irl driving has always said driving irl is easier. Maybe that's just because all the intuitive feeling they get from actual g forces, but still.

The GT Academy guys didn't seem to think so if I remember the show correctly.

 

[m76]

I haven't gone through the thread, there are way too many new posts since the patch.

I want to ask has driving on banked turns been improved? Because previously it was deadly. The car was tyring to kill you.

 

[Fredzy]

Try the GT86 ‘15 on Comfort Softs.

Or GR86. I just wasted my lunch hour and 15 minutes that I was supposed to be in a meeting to try this out - wasn't expecting this in the update. I can finally enjoy driving the GR86 in GT7. CS tires around Tsukuba, could probably have gone all day. This is GT7 2.0 now.

Better still, I was able to compare it back to back with the 2nd gen BRZ! (All aids off.) I have to give PD kudos.. I was not expecting this result. In auto journo reviews you always hear about the BRZ being more stable/predictable, the GR86 more tail-happy and playful, but usually people are a little faster in the GR86. This was my exact result. BRZ was a little easier to drive, 86 was comparatively loose and took an extra lap or two but could best the BRZ's time. (Honestly I'm not too concerned with how those times line up with reality.) I had a straight up blast sliding them around. I'm excited for GT7 now.

Before this update I'd describe driving the 86 with aids off as painful.

The only other test I did was 02 Viper on Blue Moon oval, SH tires. It used to basically hydroplane on the big sweeper - and odd thing to happen in the dry. Seems totally OK now. @m76

 

[RedRockValley]

I haven't gone through the thread, there are way too many new posts since the patch.

I want to ask has driving on banked turns been improved? Because previously it was deadly. The car was tyring to kill you.

Felt a lot better when I had a drive on Nords earlier.

 

[xMAXIx79]

Felt a lot better when I had a drive on Nords earlier.

No you haven't gotten any better....driving has gotten ridiculously easy.

 

[LSFDRX]

There are simply people comfortable in their own bias.
I keep challenging the same arguments with the same videos as there is still a lot of information within video. I’m not the only one giving these examples.
The people in videos have track experience over those that weigh their comments about physics here and are not even bad drivers. Maybe the perception of what is expected in these videos is different to what you experience in certain games, so the overall idea is that they are sloppy when they are handling the car’s physical traits not expected in certain games.

You are spot on I was shocked to see how I really didn’t need throttle control like before… chassis balance also got extremely easy and the car is not as easy disrupted over bumps and off camber turns.. and even if you get outta wack it’s now even easier to catch the car.. I know many people will like this and enjoy it, but for me im kinda like meh…😑

This is something I worry about too, and I haven't yet got to the game to test 1.13 out yet, but getting used to how GT7 was I found to be a lot of fun, no matter what me or anyone thought of how "realistic" it was. I know that no matter what, unusual things can be compensated for, learned, exploited, whatever, but some of the cars had such a beautiful delicate balance near and above the limit that it made learning them so rewarding. I've never had a tenth this much fun driving a F430, an E30 and E46 M3, FD RX7, BRZ, in any game, but they felt like such magic things in 7. The snap was real, but it was always there demanding you kept on top of things at all times. I know from previous videos you've posted that you definitely put in the work to become a master of all cars in all settings in 7, and I approach things much in the same way, so I hope the danger is still there to keep us on our toes.

I surely do look forward to more control in slip angle, and it sounds like that might be possible according to many other posts here today, but I just don't want it to be at the expense of difficulty in that it makes the stakes lower.

Or... I could just be spoiled and everything will continue to be just fine. Who knows? lol.

I'll report back later after I get some miles in, but I'm very excited about it after all these comments!

 

[Nielsen]

The hypersensitivity of GT7 physics might have made me numb to the smallest of physics improvements, because the game has forced me into the habit of being gentle and alert to the point where I can no longer remember how it feels when you aren’t. Just not feeling the change here, and the patch note is too cryptic for me to decipher. I don’t know exactly what to look for, and then you might as well get trapped by the placebo effect.

 

[unfairlane]

I haven't gone through the thread, there are way too many new posts since the patch.

I want to ask has driving on banked turns been improved? Because previously it was deadly. The car was tyring to kill you.

Tryed a Firebird at Daytona and it was acting just as crazy as before, like if it had no weight on the rear axle. Took the Superbird for a spin (oh my jokes ) at Laguna and it was just as crazy as before the patch, snapped around on flat open road at 3rd gear

 

[Funky P]

Tryed a Firebird at Daytona and it was acting just as crazy as before, like if it had no weight on the rear axle. Took the Superbird for a spin (oh my jokes ) at Laguna and it was just as crazy as before the patch, snapped around on flat open road at 3rd gear

They improved how snap oversteer handles, its not gonna fix cars with ****** handling

 

[unfairlane]

They improved how snap oversteer handles, its not gonna fix cars with ****** handling

Oh shut up kid. They have ****ty handling in this stupid game, even after any kind of upgrading. But in real life, give them a set of tyres, a diff and some ARB`s.. I`ve done this a few times IRL and know the "physics"

 

[Goshin2568]

Oh shut up kid. They have ****ty handling in this stupid game, even after any kind of upgrading. But in real life, give them a set of tyres, a diff and some rollbars.. I`ve done this a few times IRL and know the "physics"

You've driven a superbird flat out at laguna seca irl? Wow, that must've been quite an experience. I'd love to hear about it!

 

[Fuzzi0n]

Not done much yet, but the R8 GT3 Evo felt a lot better than before. It probably has slightly too much grip now, but I think that's more down to the tyre compounds in this game versus the older ones as RH feels like RS did in GT Sport on the GT3 cars. The car does feel a lot more predictable and stable with a wider setup window from my first impressions anyway.

The slip angle and grip falloff of the road tyres still is a bit weird at times, I find it slightly odd that I can easily drift a 400ish HP Celica on 40:60 torque split on SS tyres.

FWD feels pretty similar but still suffers from the issue that all the cars do with the differential not really affecting things properly, I shouldn't really be able to run basically an open diff off throttle and just get tons of understeer still. The lift off oversteer seems entirely tied to the static weight distribution of the car, you can easily test it just by moving some ballast around.

Will have to try some more stuff to get a good idea, but it certainly seems like a step in the right direction for me at least.

 

[szejok666]

Comfort Softs are much more grippy than before - about 1 second faster lap time at Tsukuba than pre-update (stock Supra RZ 1:07,3 vs 1:08,3). On Nordschleife I am about 10 seconds faster with same CS tires ('92 NSX Type R 8:13 vs 8:03 - on first lap today). They have more grip, but aren't as snappy as Sports Hard before update (I haven't tested Sport or Racing tires yet).
Comfort Hard and Medium on the other hand feels like haven't been touched (at least I can't feel the difference, didn't have time yet to test long enough).
As a result Performance difference between CS and CM is much wider than before, which creates a problem - Some cars are too fast compared to RL on CS and too slow on CM. Like mentioned before Supra RZ - Laguna Seca lap by Motoharu Kurosawa 1:45,87. On CS 1:42 is attainable easily (too fast), but I'm struggling to lap faster than 1:48 on CM.
I know that for most people this probably isn't an issue, but for me it is. GT5 and GT6 didn't have this problem and recreating realistic lap times was spot-on with correct tires.
Seems like one step forward, one step back.
Also, visible front wheels angle corresponding to controller input was not corrected (not fast enough), so watching replays is still pointless (looks funny when drifting or countersteering for instance - wheels point to the left, car turns right, or left-right lock to lock at walking speed - see for yourself).
After all it's only 2 months since game release, but I must say this GT has many problems.

 

[sems4arsenal]

The GT Academy guys didn't seem to think so if I remember the show correctly.

GTAcademy guy here; full bred race cars are incredibly easy to drive.

We've also raced in some absolutely fish tail happy cars like the Caterham 7 and those things just want to spin out

 

[nicefrog]

The patch has made this game into Daytona USA... I'm not really a fan. Yes it needed to have a little more traction put into the game but this is like driving a magnet on a steel desk. Unfun.. almost disgusting I would say

 

[unfairlane]

You've driven a superbird flat out at laguna seca irl? Wow, that must've been quite an experience. I'd love to hear about it!

The Superbird is just a styled up Roadrunner. I know how this car handles both in close-to-stock & hotted up. Too bad the 1970 Roadrunner isn`t in the game btw, it`s a lot cooler than the Superbird