GT5 AI rocks !!

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There is no reason that the AI couldn't run superhuman perfect laps. Most people wouldn't want that of course.

But why the AI is so slow is a puzzle. The only way to have a competitive race against the AI is to run alot less car than the AI.

The AI brakes too early, and tip-toes through the corners.

A really fast AI would frustrate casual players, so some kind of adjustment seems obvious. Most games have 3 or 4 skill levels. It works.

I know Kaz doesn't want GT to feel like a game, which is probably why he didn't include adjustable AI skill. The so-called adjustable AI in the arcade mode just gives the AI faster cars, instead of changing their skill.

It would be a whole different experience if you could set the AI to Hard difficulty level. I'm about a top 2% driver according to TT results and I'd be perfectly happy if there was a Hard difficulty that really challenged me, and an Insane difficulty that only the aliens could beat.

Hard and Insane would lock out SRF and Driving Line of course.

They could require players to beat every race on Hard to unlock Insane, like alot of other games.
 
Two words. Difficulty Level.

The majority of players struggle to beat the AI even with a superior car, I suppose there could be a difficulty system like in the PSP version of Gran Turismo where more money is rewarded for beating tougher AI but If a player wants a challenge there's always online racing/trials.

why cant PD get rid of AI, and instead make all GT6 career online, imagine, you select race you want to participate, you see how many players around the world are playing those, and how many are waiting, then you select and connect and race with others, I would be very happy, and no need for the AI... :)

I like it but it will be frustrating if you have your win taken away because the host has left and of course as less people play the game it will be harder to progress through your career. Take GTA IV for example it's almost impossible to level up because barely anybody plays online now.
 
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GT5's AI are most likely meant to cater to the average player, not someone who plays racing games/sims on a regular basis. If the average person can't beat the AI, do you think they'll continue to play, buy DLC, etc? Most likely not, we might all complain that the AI are easy, but those same people race in leagues, have been racing for years, etc (myself included) so no wonder we think the AI are stupid and easy to beat. If I was someone who didn't play racing games a lot and just picked up GT5 ( or any other racing game/sim) occasionally, I'm sure I'd find the AI challenging. A difficulty level would be nice though as Simon said. I don't like racing against the AI anyways, online is where I go for a good challenging race.
 
we might all complain that the AI are easy, but those same people race in leagues, have been racing for years, etc (myself included) so no wonder we think the AI are stupid and easy to beat.

That was exactly my point, but someone disagreed.

I do think that's what it comes down to... if you play these types of games enough, and especially online multiplayer with other real people controlling the competing cars... then ANY AI is going to seem lacking... and the easier they are, the more stupid they will seem.

I bet if you asked someone who's NEVER played multiplayer with other real drivers, particularly someone new to the game, they probably would not think the AIs are easy to beat... if you use a comparable car on same tires as the AIs.

And there's definitely a difficulty level thing with the AIs. Because if you go back & try the Sunday Cup, the AIs are a lot less aggressive than the Aspec professional events, etc, IMHO.
It's not a difficulty setting. And perhaps it's not up to par for a lot of people. But there is a sort of progression there.
 
Went back to retry my old GT3 arcade mode on hard difficulty... All i can say is, GT3's AI feels a lot better than gt5's AI.

While GT3's hard AI actually does racing with you, GT5's so called hard arcade AI seem to act more like moving obstacles that are obstructing your way to first place :grumpy:

Same opinion.
I was racing the AI in GT4 and we were all on the same track, stock cars and very similar cars (BMWs)
I actual had to race them, they may have blindly ran into me but they could still post a great lap time.
In GT5 they pull over for you when you try to pass. Kills the fun and if you are in a race on the same tires as the AI in GT5 they can't come close putting up a race... it's like they give up.

What they need is to have the AI get harder as the game progresses.

Level: 1-5: easy AI (About the speed we have now)
Level:5-15: The AI we have now but they stop pulling over when you pass.
Level:16-25: AI that is 1.5-2.0 seconds faster on any given lap compared to what we have now. But won't block to much. (GT4 - GT3 AI speed)
Level 26-35: Consistently 2.0 or better than what we have now, won't let you pass unless they make a mistake. (Think a better GT4 or GT3 AI)
35-.....:Consistently 2.5 to 3.5 seconds faster and and rarely make mistakes.

I bet if you asked someone who's NEVER played multiplayer with other real drivers, particularly someone new to the game, they probably would not think the AIs are easy to beat... if you use a comparable car on same tires as the AIs.
That was me less than a year ago, after a month with the game I could win, SPEC races against the AI by wayyyy over 10 seconds.... To get a race that I would only win by 2-3 second I would use CM or CH tires against them on SH. Only way to make them keep up.
 
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In GT4 the AI got harder in the later events; so in the same car on the same tyres at the same circuit they would run faster.

I think this is the case for GT5 too, though i've not tested it. The problem is, there is so few events in A-spec that I don't think there are too few events to compare where the AI are running similar cars.

I also believe that the game has rubberbanding, the AI times vary considerably depending on my own pace (Something apparent when there was that 1 lap Ferrari seasonal at La Sarthe, the AI times varied by 10-15 seconds directly proportional to your own time).

At some circuits the AI is actually quite challenging. Tsukuba is the main one off the top of my head.
 
I like GT5's AI, They are consistent.

If the AI were like the "Superior Carbon Peptide unit" that I run into online then I doubt I would play for very long.

It would be nice if the AI had some sort of sliding scale of ability

The AI isn't perfect but you can adapt to get a good race against them. It is a shame that they all have the same problems. Woefully slow at Cape Ring - Would be nice if they had more personalities in the AI cars.
 
Never played Forza for any more than a single lap round a friend's place, so can't compare with that, but by comparison with Shift 2 and numerous other titles I've played GT has always had the weakest AI cars. They lack the "I" part of that equation, I see them more as moving obstacles.
If you think GT5's AI rocks, you'll **** your pants when you play Shift 2 and race against the AI in that, once you get over the wonky handling.

(EDIT: If you want to see how truly awful they are take out a car in practice mode at Route X. Despite it being completely driveable at full throttle at all times they will actually brake on the straights for no reason and for both the banked corners)

Shift 2 is pretty challenging, but I find the physics to be too arcade like.

why cant PD get rid of AI, and instead make all GT6 career online, imagine, you select race you want to participate, you see how many players around the world are playing those, and how many are waiting, then you select and connect and race with others, I would be very happy, and no need for the AI... :)

No, just no.
 
In GT4 the AI got harder in the later events; so in the same car on the same tyres at the same circuit they would run faster.

I think this is the case for GT5 too, though i've not tested it. The problem is, there is so few events in A-spec that I don't think there are too few events to compare where the AI are running similar cars.

I also believe that the game has rubberbanding, the AI times vary considerably depending on my own pace (Something apparent when there was that 1 lap Ferrari seasonal at La Sarthe, the AI times varied by 10-15 seconds directly proportional to your own time).

At some circuits the AI is actually quite challenging. Tsukuba is the main one off the top of my head.

That ^^^^ I have seen that happen. When you drive away from them it seems like they get low boost.
They are still slow but a little better.
 
I am not a good enough driver to know what real race driving is like.

But by adjusting your own car you can make just about any race as easy or as hard as you like, and that is plenty for me.
 
I assume that by "rubber-band" you mean the AI slowing down when they're ahead of the human racer, and then driving like hell when they're not. There should be no need for this if the AI was more competitive.

In GT5, it's nothing more than a drive to the finish line. You pass a few cars without hitting them, and then cruise to the finish. It's pretty boring.

If the AI was competitive, though, then they would actually try and fight for the lead, and by that I mean proper fights for the lead, and not just ramming you off like they currently do.

I see you know nothing of video games , that's what makes AI competitive.. , and no they don't slow down once they pass you they return to default speed... they get a boost the further back they are. Gt5's AI needs this so bad! but about 95% of people will whine and complain how its unfair how they improved there lap and the ai still beet them , I honestly could care less.. I want a challenge! The harder it gets the bigger the speed multiplier in the cars! In fact Gt1 --3 have speed multiplier ratios , so a AI car is default faster than yours on a straight line!
 
It's only good at avoiding collisions in some parts (when someone spins for example), as they still drive into your side half the time when you are alongside one turning into a corner.

They are slow, they brake unnecessary hard, they drive in the way, they take exactly the same programmed lines each race, and they back off when you pass them (they step off the gas) which immediatly drops them 2 seconds behind you, as such they never fight back neither.

GT5 AI sucks.
I actually tested this, i stayed behind an AI for a whole race his whole time was 35 seconds faster, when i passed him he slowed down? shouldn't it be the other way around?
 
It's not just outright speed that's an issue. Have you ever seen the AI move to cover the inside line or use any other forms of defensive driving? I haven't.
 
It's not just outright speed that's an issue. Have you ever seen the AI move to cover the inside line or use any other forms of defensive driving? I haven't.

They do this all the time... when their race line tells them to, they'll do it every single lap. I'm sure that part of the reason for their horrible lines is that they are actively trying to make the AI drive more in the middle of the road so that it's more difficult to get past them. Doesn't accomplish much other than being frustrating.
 
GT5's AI is a good base. That much is true. But it needs several tweaks made to their behavior (some of which are actually already in the game, but PD simply hasn't bothered making universal) to make them truly exemplary.





I see you know nothing of video games , that's what makes AI competitive..
Oh? I could have sworn that I've played games (and I don't mean Forza. I mean the ones made by CM, as well as some others) where the AI was competitive on it's own merits rather than because it it cheats. But, you know, I guess I just don't know anything about videogames.

and no they don't slow down once they pass you they return to default speed... they get a boost the further back they are. Gt5's AI needs this so bad! but about 95% of people will whine and complain how its unfair how they improved there lap and the ai still beet them , I honestly could care less.. I want a challenge! The harder it gets the bigger the speed multiplier in the cars! In fact Gt1 --3 have speed multiplier ratios , so a AI car is default faster than yours on a straight line!
You want a challenge, then ask PD to make competitive AI. Rubber-band AI is not competitive. It's cheating. And there is no argument on that fact, either. The only reason GT2's stood out in particular is because they occasionally made mistakes (which went away for the most part in GT3 and was nonexistent in GT4).


Hell, it isn't even a "Good or Bad" scenario like you are presenting it as. Compare GT4's absolutely atrocious AI to GT5's, and GT5 might as well have the best AI ever made considering how much better it is.
 
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I see you know nothing of video games , that's what makes AI competitive.. ,
And I see that you know nothing of simulators. Being able to drive more like a human racer, (doesn't mean they have to be 100% like a human, because that's technically not possible yet) is what makes them competitive.
and no they don't slow down once they pass you they return to default speed... they get a boost the further back they are. Gt5's AI needs this so bad!
No they don't. What the AI needs is better programming, so they won't do their usual driving around the track. And if they're behind, speed up a bit. This, as I have said, is boring.
but about 95% of people will whine and complain how its unfair how they improved there lap and the ai still beet them ,
Because it is unfair.
I honestly could care less.. I want a challenge! The harder it gets the bigger the speed multiplier in the cars! In fact Gt1 --3 have speed multiplier ratios , so a AI car is default faster than yours on a straight line!
Have you ever seen a video of racing in real life? Have you ever seen a driver who would slow down or speed up just so that one racer can have a "challenge"? Because in my mind, it isn't.
 
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Honestly, its 2012. Not having adjustable difficulty is basically inexcusable in my opinion.

Motorstorm: Apocalypse had three difficulty levels (Rookie, Pro and Veteran) but GT5's AI is way better. I saw cars in Apocalypse crash into easily avoided obstacles and overboost even when playing with the "Veteran" difficulty. So, maybe having AI with no adjustable difficulty that can actually drive is better than having adjustable AI that drives like they've been drinking all night.
 
PureHeavyMetal
Motorstorm: Apocalypse had three difficulty levels (Rookie, Pro and Veteran) but GT5's AI is way better. I saw cars in Apocalypse crash into easily avoided obstacles and overboost even when playing with the "Veteran" difficulty. So, maybe having AI with no adjustable difficulty that can actually drive is better than having adjustable AI that drives like they've been drinking all night.

Or you could have AI that has adjustable difficulty levels AND don't drive like they've been at the bar all night 💡
Other games manage to do both, so its not like its an impossible task...
 
Motorstorm: Apocalypse had three difficulty levels (Rookie, Pro and Veteran) but GT5's AI is way better. I saw cars in Apocalypse crash into easily avoided obstacles and overboost even when playing with the "Veteran" difficulty. So, maybe having AI with no adjustable difficulty that can actually drive is better than having adjustable AI that drives like they've been drinking all night.

Yeah, because comparing the AI in an arcade, off road racer to the AI in a track based simulation game is totally fair.
 
Yeah, because comparing the AI in an arcade, off road racer to the AI in a track based simulation game is totally fair.

Actually, I believe Apocalypse is the first in the series to feature on-road racing. But you're absolutely correct; not a fair comparison. I haven't played any other racing games other than GT5 and MSA though (I'd never had a gaming console until Christmas 2011) so I was only comparing it to the only other AI I'd raced against.
 
Better AI would be appreciated. I just don't know if PD could do it on GT5... maybe GT6. I'm definitely not trying to be pessimistic, I'm just having a difficult time seeing this done when there are several other "issues"... I still love this game, with all of its issues.
 
More Competitive AI would be appreciated. I just don't know if PD could do it on GT5... maybe GT6. I'm definitely not trying to be pessimistic, I'm just having a difficult time seeing this done when there are several other "issues"... I still love this game, with all of its issues.

Fixed 👍
 
I hate all AI, I was racing them on 3-5 in GTA and I went to pass the R34 and he sideswipes me and then...disqualified!
 
FM4, competitive AI, but not professional (they make mistakes often even in short races and don't consistently take the best lines like professionals do) nor are they human-like.

GT5, not competitive AI, but they're smarter.

I don't prefer one over the other, but I would like the computer to be realistic. So I prefer GT5's AI. :D

Ditto.

I wish GT5s AI could go faster or slower (ignoring B-Spec drivers here), they are always perfect which is slightly unrealistic, but otherwise are better. They do occasionally move out of the way, and try to T-bone you when overtaking you (to cause you to spin), but otherwise are they better of the two, even if they still need lots of work for GT6 (which hopefully'll be on PS4 and thus more room for AI improvement).

FM4s are just, racoons really, you're driving really close to one, trying to overtake him, but you won't need to, give him 30-40 seconds, and he'll freak out and total himself, especially if he's first - completely unprofessional, and therefore unrealistic.
 
You people make it seem like Forza 4 AI go off all the time. They don't. I've only seen them go off two or three times. They certainly don't total their car when you're next to them too.
 
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