GT5 Latest News & Discussion

[Samus]

That is not how Sony worked for PS3, why did they put a blu-ray in the PS3 using that logic? No one had Blu-ray discs to play in a PS3, but Sony spent a fortune at a loss in order to provide this high tech facility. They get a return by controlling the HD retail film market media. They can do the same with next gen PS4 Blu-ray 4k ready. There is no way they would release a PS4 for a new lifecycle without 4k capability, even with no current userbase in existence.
But I expect by next year someone on gtplanet will own a 4k display and tell us about it. And then awhile after go on to tell us how good it is for GT6 on the PS4.

People might not have had Blu-Ray then but they certainly had HDTV sets, HD monitors and HD video content. The HD boom was taking off and Blu Ray was of course one side of the HD format war, as Toronado mentions.

4K on the other hand is nowhere close to being a mass market reality. We're nowhere near 4K broadcasts, we have no 4K footage widely available in other formats and therefore nobody has 4K displays and won't for many years to come.

 

[gamerdog6482]

People might not have had Blu-Ray then but they certainly had HDTV sets, HD monitors and HD video content. The HD boom was taking off and Blu Ray was of course one side of the HD format war, as Toronado mentions.

4K on the other hand is nowhere close to being a mass market reality. We're nowhere near 4K broadcasts, we have no 4K footage widely available in other formats and therefore nobody has 4K displays and won't for many years to come.

I wouldn't say NOBODY has 4K displays, and it's only a matter of time before it completely phases out 1080p. Other than Nintendo, the Wii's will still be using 480i 20 years from now.

 

[BlisteredHand]

People might not have had Blu-Ray then but they certainly had HDTV sets, HD monitors and HD video content. The HD boom was taking off and Blu Ray was of course one side of the HD format war, as Toronado mentions.

4K on the other hand is nowhere close to being a mass market reality. We're nowhere near 4K broadcasts, we have no 4K footage widely available in other formats and therefore nobody has 4K displays and won't for many years to come.

I would disagree, I would say PS3 was launched well before HD displays were in the average peoples homes. Even now in 2012 a lot of people don't have HD TV's, they are split between non HD LCD and non HD cathode ray boxes. Sony set the standard and people bought HD TV's in order to use the PS3 at it's best. In my view of course.
Good full 40/42" HD TV were about £2,000 at launch of PS3. Which is nearly £3000 in todays money with inflation. So if in late 2013 40" 4k TV are about £3000 then market conditions are about right, at rough guess. (Toshiba do a 3D glasses free 55" 4k TV for £6999 already)
Also in 2006 there was no HD broadcast for the masses. In 2010 we had HD broadcast terrestrial TV 4 years after PS3 launch in UK. When other countries had terrestrial 1080 HD broadcast I don't know.
But gamers and movie watchers can drive TV sales. As soon as Sony makes 4k affordable to the masses via a player/console things will speed up dramatically. So even if there is no plans for 4k broadcast until 2020 the mass market is still there to purchase 4k content (on disc) and watch and play it through console generated graphics.
For games it will depend how powerful Sony are making the PS4, but without doubt it will easily play 4k movies for the mass market.

Sony provide the method of having 4k, not wait until users already have 4k. They lead the market.

 

[ch3ng]

For games it will depend how powerful Sony are making the PS4, but without doubt it will easily play 4k movies for the mass market.

I think it's 99% sure that we'll not see AAA games with native 4k resolution. We didn't even reached nativ 1080p with AAA games. Except some HD remakes and FIFA street 3 for example.
GT5 is not nativ 1080p.

I think the PS4 can handle 4k for OS including picture, movies, but will not run 1 AAA game in this resolution.

 

[coolboy48]

Maybe only first next gen Ridge Racer (RR7 could do proper 1080p but looks kinda plain by today's standards) or WipEout super-HD would run at 4K at the expense of more advanced visuals or something.

I agree that 4K capability is better for movie and non-gaming future proofing. PS3's 1080p capability helps with appeal as a blu-ray player.

If PS4 becomes a streaming box though, hmm... Time to upgrade to fiber optic interwebs. (Derp)

But of course, ideal target should be 1080p@30fps with better effects and the like. Hope there would be less cases of 'sloppius-portitis (tm)' too. (Sloppy ports.)

(I fear the thread has been fairly derailed from GT discussion.)

 

[BWX]

1080p 60 fps is fine.. I'd rather save the CPU cycles for more/better gfx and whatnot and I use a 52'' TV six feet away. (edit- on PS4, rather than 4k).

As far as this relates to GT6? More antialiasing, more anisotropic filtering, better/more Ai, more/better trackside objects, higher resolution textures, etc. I wish GT5 ran at a lower resolution if that meant better GFX otherwise.


EDIT- fixed, clarified- I meant 60fps in first sentence.

Even 720p (60 fps) is fine with me on the PS3/GT5 if it meant better gfx.. like shadows and smoke fixed, etc.

 

[amar212]

30fps is no-go for games IMO.

But each to his own.

Thank God, GT will never go under 60fps (as a goal at least) so this discussion in solved in the foundations.

 

[Samus]

I would disagree, I would say PS3 was launched well before HD displays were in the average peoples homes. Even now in 2012 a lot of people don't have HD TV's, they are split between non HD LCD and non HD cathode ray boxes. Sony set the standard and people bought HD TV's in order to use the PS3 at it's best. In my view of course.
Good full 40/42" HD TV were about £2,000 at launch of PS3. Which is nearly £3000 in todays money with inflation. So if in late 2013 40" 4k TV are about £3000 then market conditions are about right, at rough guess. (Toshiba do a 3D glasses free 55" 4k TV for £6999 already)
Also in 2006 there was no HD broadcast for the masses. In 2010 we had HD broadcast terrestrial TV 4 years after PS3 launch in UK. When other countries had terrestrial 1080 HD broadcast I don't know.
But gamers and movie watchers can drive TV sales. As soon as Sony makes 4k affordable to the masses via a player/console things will speed up dramatically. So even if there is no plans for 4k broadcast until 2020 the mass market is still there to purchase 4k content (on disc) and watch and play it through console generated graphics.
For games it will depend how powerful Sony are making the PS4, but without doubt it will easily play 4k movies for the mass market.

Sony provide the method of having 4k, not wait until users already have 4k. They lead the market.

We were behind as usual, HDTV was common in the US by 2004/5, Asia probably earlier still.

 

[coolboy48]

In a country like mine, you can get a budget minded Samsung 40 inch full-HD TV for about 1500 SGD. I have no idea whether other locals find it affordable.

There is only 1 local 720p free to air channel ('07 onwards) and they do not maintain the rez for almost all of their broadcasting. Only certain movies and specials like the Beijing Olympics and national occasions receive the HD-ness magic. Cable TV had a handful of HD channels one year ahead and the programs were genuine HD all the way.

I also genuinely wonder how powerful the next-gen of consoles will really be.
Will they equal today's idea of a decent semi-budget gaming rig and easily achieve 1080p30 with maxed out effects?
(i5-3570k and an AMD 7850 with 4 or maybe 8 GB RAM. The rumoured next X-some number was said to be along those lines or worse.)
Or will they blow the current >$3000 dream PCs into the next country?

Should consoles still match a decent gaming PC 2 years after release?

 

[Earth]

I'm pretty sure 4k is a long ways away from being mass market. I'd guess as much as 10+ years away.

Here is a handy chart that gives an idea of how big a TV has to be, it's resolution, and how close you have to be to it in order to tell the difference in quality

Notice it says you have to sit 5 feet away from a 55" TV in order to tell the difference 4k offers. If you are 10 feet away the TV has to be at least 120" in order to see the difference of 4K. Think people saying bluray wasn't enough of a quality difference over DVD to upgrade was bad? 4K will be much worse.

http://lowtek.ca/roo/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/resolution_chart.png

Thats just one of the reasons I dont think we see 4k on department store shelves for at least 10+ years. In the mean time I think manufacturers will focus on other things boosting contrast, reducing size, framerate, and adding features like 3D. 4K will work wonders for those with in home projectors (like me) but for the general public, not so much.

GT5 runs at 1280x1080 correct?

I'm hoping the PS4 is powerful enough to bump that up to true 1920x1080p.

And I really don't understand why some guys want PD to spend more time making the cars even more detailed on PS4. I think they are fine as they are. Sure I wouldn't mind them going over some models and fixing inaccuracies or adding a little detail here and there, but I'm against throwing 4 or 5x more polygons on them.

Put that towards 3D environment objects like buildings or track martials or even better towards more cars on track. Give me 24 or 32 car fields with GT5 car models over 16 car fields with extra details I might not even notice.

 

[Tornado]

Sony set the standard and people bought HD TV's in order to use the PS3 at it's best.

There were things prior to the PS3's launch that output in HD, you know.

So if in late 2013 40" 4k TV are about £3000 then market conditions are about right, at rough guess.

They won't be. I'd bet money on that.

But gamers and movie watchers can drive TV sales. As soon as Sony makes 4k affordable to the masses via a player/console things will speed up dramatically. So even if there is no plans for 4k broadcast until 2020 the mass market is still there to purchase 4k content (on disc) and watch and play it through console generated graphics.

Are you implying that Sony would drive 4k TV adoption by making the PS4 powerful enough to play content at 4k native? How expensive do you think Sony is willing to make the thing?


And, again, to what end? Sony isn't in a position to make that gamble this time, nor do they have anything to gain.

 

[avens]

I'm pretty sure 4k is a long ways away from being mass market. I'd guess as much as 10+ years away.

Here is a handy chart that gives an idea of how big a TV has to be, it's resolution, and how close you have to be to it in order to tell the difference in quality

Notice it says you have to sit 5 feet away from a 55" TV in order to tell the difference 4k offers. If you are 10 feet away the TV has to be at least 120" in order to see the difference of 4K. Think people saying bluray wasn't enough of a quality difference over DVD to upgrade was bad? 4K will be much worse.

http://lowtek.ca/roo/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/resolution_chart.png

Thats just one of the reasons I dont think we see 4k on department store shelves for at least 10+ years. In the mean time I think manufacturers will focus on other things boosting contrast, reducing size, framerate, and adding features like 3D. 4K will work wonders for those with in home projectors (like me) but for the general public, not so much.

GT5 runs at 1280x1080 correct?

I'm hoping the PS4 is powerful enough to bump that up to true 1920x1080p.

And I really don't understand why some guys want PD to spend more time making the cars even more detailed on PS4. I think they are fine as they are. Sure I wouldn't mind them going over some models and fixing inaccuracies or adding a little detail here and there, but I'm against throwing 4 or 5x more polygons on them.

Put that towards 3D environment objects like buildings or track martials or even better towards more cars on track. Give me 24 or 32 car fields with GT5 car models over 16 car fields with extra details I might not even notice.

Which is why resolution per se doesn't matter as much as the industry advertises it. It's preferable to run games at a lower res (lets say 720p) with better "effects" (video options, different than filters) than higher but without them (1080p).

Halo3 is a great example. Runs at 640p (a bit more complex than that), but when it was released it looked astonishing for a console game and that's what matters.

Car fields are also a great example. Some might prefer 32 cars at the same time, but devs correctly allow only up to 12 because the game looks and plays better (more responsive).

 

[BlisteredHand]

The ability of a PS4 that can do 4k also gives it the ability to do 3D at 1080p at full fps. This is big factor into making 3D image quality acceptable and good, for not just games but films. It will be standard on the PS4, sportsman's bet between me and you. By sometime 2014 4k will be a mass market device by the very nature of it being in the PS4 to everyone in the whole world that buys new consoles.

Talking about the sizes of TV and distance from it is a dead end line of argument as that bears no relevance to the need for the console to be 4k and 1080p 3D ready. Even if 4k resolution is further ahead as a standard people will want to play games and watch films in 3D 1080p at maximum FPS. In order to do this by default the PS4 will be 4K capable.

 

[avens]

The ability of a PS4 that can do 4k also gives it the ability to do 3D at 1080p at full fps. This is big factor into making 3D image quality acceptable and good, for not just games but films. It will be standard on the PS4, sportsman's bet between me and you. By sometime 2014 4k will be a mass market device by the very nature of it being in the PS4 to everyone in the whole world that buys new consoles.

Talking about the sizes of TV and distance from it is a dead end line of argument as that bears no relevance to the need for the console to be 4k and 1080p 3D ready. Even if 4k resolution is further ahead as a standard people will want to play games and watch films in 3D 1080p at maximum FPS. In order to do this by default the PS4 will be 4K capable.

yep, you didn't read a thing. Current consoles can run games at 4K (which is 4096x2160 tops, as absurd as it sounds) or 3D@1080p, but it's preferable not do it. Resolutions and 3d are not the benchmark.

Also 4k still won't be mass marketed by 2014.

 

[coolboy48]

A fair number of GT5 premo model fixes are required and I would even prefer them to new DLC if it's true that premos wil be reused for next installments.

I fear that issues will remain unfixed and pile up (in number) with every new premo. (Even some DLC models are inconsistent in minor details.)

It's very annoying that a NFS game has a more accurate and hence better looking Alfa 8C for example.

(Random thought: how many SLI'ed 690s to max out Crysis with stable 30+ frames at 4K...)

Edit: (Japan lives in the future comment below Best part is that it really seems to be true in reality.)

Another random thought: Thread tenseness rocketing.

 

[Tornado]

By sometime 2014 4k will be a mass market device by the very nature of it being in the PS4 to everyone in the whole world that buys new consoles.

You're contradicting your own arguments now, and you're still ignoring that Sony doesn't have anywhere near as much to gain by forcing 4k TV adoption rates as they did for winning the Blu Ray format war.

 

[avens]

and btw Japan doesn't count. They live in the future.

 

[BlisteredHand]

Are you implying that Sony would drive 4k TV adoption by making the PS4 powerful enough to play content at 4k native? How expensive do you think Sony is willing to make the thing?


And, again, to what end? Sony isn't in a position to make that gamble this time, nor do they have anything to gain.

Sony will be in far more trouble if they don't put in 4k capability. They have no choice in my view, even if it is a little too early. Maybe that's why we hear little of PS4 development, they are waiting for an acceptable affordable time to launch the 4k console. A non 4k console will be dead in the water, i'm sure Microsoft are pondering the same issue.

4K blu-rays movies will be on sale next year according to device maker LG.

Edit:

You're contradicting your own arguments now, and you're still ignoring that Sony doesn't have anywhere near as much to gain by forcing 4k TV adoption rates as they did for winning the Blu Ray format war.

I don't think Sony are forcing anything, it's just essential they provide it for the lifecycle of the next console. In the long term it will work out for them. A PS3 doesnt need to be expensive to play 4k movies or run next gen blu-ray discs. It would need to be expensive to do 4K gaming at high quality, but there exists the affordable compromise Sony can choose on investment, they can make it as cheap or expensive as they like. But it will still be 4k compatible. It may well turn out that PS4 wont be able, even at the end of it's lifecycle to play high detail high fps 4k games, but that wont matter. It doesnt have to.
Just like even after 6 years of PS3 it still cant do 60fps in native 1080p. PS3 still plays Blu-ray, and it could from launch.

Can't wait to prove you guys wrong.

 

[Samus]

By sometime 2014 4k will be a mass market device by the very nature of it being in the PS4 to everyone in the whole world that buys new consoles.

No it won't. The PS3 did not bring HD to the mass market and a PS4 will not bring 4K to the mass market either.

What brings new video formats to the mass market is more often than not determined by broadcast. We had PAL/NTSC/SECAM formats driven by broadcast and whilst HD video was possible/available as far back as the eighties and the first HD broadcast in the US was in 1996. HD content was around for years, but nobody had HDTVs until it was a regular broadcast format in the early 2000s. Long before the PS3 or Xbox 360 turned up, I might add.

People will not buy a shiny new 4K capable display until broadcasts are widely available in that format and that isn't likely to happen at all. 4K is not currently intended to be a broadcast format, 8K is the next in line, Ultra High Definition Television, but that won't be common until 2015 at the earliest, 2020 at the latest.

In short a games console capable of 4K output is not going to drive everyone out to buy a 4K capable HDTV. Sure you would get some adopters the same as you got some people buying HDTVs in 1998 (Yes, they were available then) but no way would it be a mass market format.

Sony will be in far more trouble if they don't put in 4k capability. They have no choice in my view, even if it is a little too early. Maybe that's why we hear little of PS4 development, they are waiting for an acceptable affordable time to launch the 4k console. A non 4k console will be dead in the water, i'm sure Microsoft are pondering the same issue.

4K blu-rays movies will be on sale next year according to device maker LG.

That's a pretty ridiculous statement. 4K is not on the radar for anyone but nerds, most people are still only just adopting 'normal' HDTV,

Like I said above, HDTVs were available as early as 1998, it wasn't a mass market product then though, just something for the enthusiasts.

 

[Tornado]

Sony will be in far more trouble if they don't put in 4k capability.

Explain this. They can't be the only one who would usher in the standard years in advance (which they wouldn't anyway, because the PS4 wouldn't be anywhere near influential enough to drive sales appreciably) and be the ones who will suffer massively if they don't.

I don't think Sony are forcing anything, it's just essential they provide it for the lifecycle of the next console.

It's essential for them to massively jack up the development costs of the system to (not) quicken the adoption rates of something that won't happen in large numbers (if it ever does) until the system is on it's way out? You've given no reason whatsoever that they need to do so beyond just repeating that they do. What is Sony's endgame in this hypothetical situation? What do they have to gain by potentially repeating the disaster of the first year of the PS3's life?

Can't wait to prove you guys wrong.

You can start any time.

 

[avens]

No news? lets discuss the future

 

[Earth]

Which is why resolution per se doesn't matter as much as the industry advertises it. It's preferable to run games at a lower res (lets say 720p) with better "effects" (video options, different than filters) than higher but without them (1080p).

Halo3 is a great example. Runs at 640p (a bit more complex than that), but when it was released it looked astonishing for a console game and that's what matters.

Car fields are also a great example. Some might prefer 32 cars at the same time, but devs correctly allow only up to 12 because the game looks and plays better (more responsive).

I think the difference between 1080 and 720 is noticeable enough to matter. Any time I switch a game or movie from 1080 to 720 I'm reminded of that. Games can look good in 720, MGS4 and LBP are examples of that. But they can look better in 1080.

There really is no excuse for 1080 not being standard for the next generation. GT5 is running on 6 year old PS3 hardware and manages a good framerate with 1280x1080 resolution. I've been saying for a while now, I want to play 1080 games on my 1080 TV. I dislike the fact the vast majority of 1080 content for my TV is blu-ray movies.

And only 12 cars on track? Thats one thing that always annoyed me about console games. They're always behind the PC when it comes to sheer numbers. Now I know you may say PCs tend to be more powerful then consoles. But that doesnt change the fact that 10 year old PC sims had 40+ cars on screen in a race with good framerate and AI.

The problem has been console game designers always see the need to take the power of a new console and stretch it so thin that the number of AI opponents/cars whatever never really goes up. For the first time in Gran Turismo's history the AI count jumped from 5 to 15 in GT5. I'm expecting another jump especially considering there is no real need to make the GT5 car models that much more detailed and taxing on the processor then they already are. I think it is realistic to expect at least 23 AI cars on track in GT6, if not 31. If PD really wants to keep raising the standard that should be their priority. Now that Forza has matched their on track car count, they must answer.

Before 4K there are several steps TVs can make first.
- 1" thick standard for every TV
- HDMI successor (HDBase T perhaps?)
- 3D standard in every TV
- 600 fps standard in every TV (no motion blur)
- mega contrast standard in every TV (1 million-1 +)

The above will all enhance 1080p TVs and make the need for 4K even smaller. The fact is we're just now starting to get 1080p broadcasts on satellite, and that's limited to pay per view movie channels. Everything else is 720 or 1080i and has been for a while. Sony etc know the mass public will not see the difference between 4k and 1080 so theres no reason rushing the technology out there any time soon.

 

[BlisteredHand]

I don't think it will be that expensive for Sony to include 4k capability, the power of the cpu/gpu doesnt have to be very high. It just needs a drive upgrade to the new standard. And I think it will be an upgrade of Blu-ray not a complete design from scratch with all the expense that entails. Like I said easy to have 4k ability at reasonable cost. Then it's upto sony how much extra they spend on cpu/gpu in order to get the best out of the game content potential, even if it means no games are in 4k.

@Earth in the UK we have had 1080i/p for some time, freeview over terrestrial broadcast. 2009 it started I think. The BBC have already recorded 8K test broadcast footage. So future formats are always being worked on.

 

[avens]

Supposedly this console generation's standard is 1080p. In reality it isn't.

In the end my only point here is that people expect 40+ cars on track and 4K on PS4 games. I'm telling you both won't happen.

And BlisteredHand, you have no clue whatsoever. AUP and all.

 

[Samus]

600fps? I think you mean 600Hz, and no, every TV certainly does not need that feature, it's just a gimmick as 3D is.

I don't think it will be that expensive for Sony to include 4k capability, the power of the cpu/gpu doesnt have to be very high. It just needs a drive upgrade to the new standard. And I think it will be an upgrade of Blu-ray not a complete design from scratch with all the expense that entails. Like I said easy to have 4k ability at reasonable cost. Then it's upto sony how much extra they spend on cpu/gpu in order to get the best out of the game content potential, even if it means no games are in 4k.

So the games wouldn't be 4K, there won't be 4K broadcasts, 4K media isn't really coming any time soon but you still think 4K would become mass market and everyone would rush out to buy 4K displays?

 

[Saidur_Ali]

4K capability for PS4 is more or less a given. However games running at 4K will be rare, maybe PD will add some kind of 'Hi-Fi mode' for PS4 version of GT .

Still expecting GT6 to be on PS3 though.

 

[Tornado]

I don't think it will be that expensive for Sony to include 4k capability, the power of the cpu/gpu doesnt have to be very high. It just needs a drive upgrade to the new standard. And I think it will be an upgrade of Blu-ray not a complete design from scratch with all the expense that entails. Like I said easy to have 4k ability at reasonable cost. Then it's upto sony how much extra they spend on cpu/gpu in order to get the best out of the game content potential, even if it means no games are in 4k.

If they don't have to make the system powerful enough to play games at 4k resolution, then they don't have to do anything towards support 4k TVs. I highly doubt that 4k TVs won't accept the same signals/resolutions that current TVs do, so there is no reason to go out of their way to support them specifically (which has the interesting effect of making any support Sony puts in the PS4 moot because it won't drive sales if people don't see the benefit).

4K capability for PS4 is more or less a given.

 

[ch3ng]

Supposedly this console generation's standard is 1080p. In reality it isn't.

In the end my only point here is that people expect 40+ cars on track and 4K on PS4 games. I'm telling you both won't happen.

And BlisteredHand, you have no clue whatsoever. AUP and all.

I agree but i think some people mean 4k support for OS, picture, movies.

Games will not run in nativ 4k. I want more cars on track and i hope they focus more on gameplay instead of graphics. But i know that it is only a wish which isn't realistic.

4K capability for PS4 is more or less a given. However games running at 4K will be rare, maybe PD will add some kind of 'Hi-Fi mode' for PS4 version of GT .

No. I think no game will run with 4k.

Still expecting GT6 to be on PS3 though.

Maybe.

If they don't have to make the system powerful enough to play games at 4k resolution, then they don't have to do anything towards support 4k TVs. I highly doubt that 4k TVs won't accept the same signals/resolutions that current TVs do, so there is no reason to go out of their way to support them specifically (which has the interesting effect of making any support Sony puts in the PS4 moot because it won't drive sales if people don't see the benefit).

Movies and picture? I think movies will not run in 4k until 2016 or so, but they could integrate 4k for multimedia.

 

[BlisteredHand]

And BlisteredHand, you have no clue whatsoever. AUP and all.

You are ignored from now as you make no sense.

So the games wouldn't be 4K, there won't be 4K broadcasts, 4K media isn't really coming any time soon but you still think 4K would become mass market and everyone would rush out to buy 4K displays?

There might be 4k games, there might be 4k broadcasts, 4k media is expected next year. The high capacity disc 4k involves will be greater than 50GB obviously and allow for PS4 games to be on 1 disc. No ones needs to own a 4k display to run a 4k capable PS4. It will still make use of it's new generation drive and processing power on a standard 1080p TV. It's future proofed.

 

[Samus]

Do you realise how powerful the PS4 would need to be to display 4K games at even 30fps? Many PC players use Eyefinity to achieve 5760x1080 resolution and require very expensive GPUs, usually 2, to achieve decent gameplay. Full 4K is 4096x3112, that's roughly 200% the amount of pixels for 5760x1080.

The PS4 would have to be a monster to be able to do 4K games and since that is obviously not going to happen, neither is 4K gaming.

4K broadcasts are not happening, unless you have some evidence to show me otherwise.

4K media, even if they do start appearing next year will still be a very niche market for many years. Many people haven't made the move from DVD to Blu-Ray, those that have have shelled out for a 720p or 1080p display. What makes you think people are going to shell out again for a 4K display?

So again, why do Sony need to make the PS4 capable of 4K output?