GTP Cool Wall: 1965-1966 Shelby GT350

[Famine]

It wasn't an all original car from Shelby. The GT350 was 90-95%+ Ford.

Great. So what? The Dodge Stealth was 90-95% Mitsubishi, but it was still a complete, standard, original car from Dodge.

The GT350 was a complete, standard, original car from Shelby.

If there was never was a Mustang, there wouldn't have been a GT350 made from said Mustang.

Indeed - and if there never was a Model T, Ford wouldn't have existed to make the Mustang. It's still an odd point.

I guess I'll rephrase that since you missed that one. If there was no BMW, Alpina wouldn't have BMW's to modify and be "making them their own". Point being, there would be no "standard Alpina B7" if BMW didn't make a "standard 7-series" for Alpina to base the B7 off of.

See above.

"Entire motoring world?" No.

Yep. Even car insurers say the Shelby isn't a modified car. Even car insurers, who'd class a misplaced sticker as a modification.

Badge engineered cars like the Cygnet, various Ford/Mazda cars, etc. are quite different than what the GT350 is, or Alpina, etc.

Luckily I covered most of the situations where cars are developed as one thing then sold or marketed as another in the rest of that section of paragraphs.

So then why bother explaining why you think its a cool car if no one cares?

Carbore: "Hey, that's a cool car."
Normal person: "Is it? Just looks like a girly Mustang to me."
Carbore: [prolonged explanation]
Normal person: "I've just remembered I'm moving to Marrakech. Bye."

 

[Sage Ages]

Put a girl in the driver's seat of a boss 429, and then see what she says.

"🤬🤬🤬🤬" *spinout*

Carbore: "Hey, that's a cool car."
Normal person: "Is it? Just looks like a girly Mustang to me."
Carbore: Mustangs are cool.

Fixed.

Edit: My bad. Didn't mean to double post.

 

[FordMKIVJ5]

Put a girl in the driver's seat of a boss 429, and then see what she says.

"🤬🤬🤬🤬" *spinout*

Probably nothing more than a man would also say/do in the same car.

 

[White & Nerdy]

Also, if anything, being a Shelby makes it cooler. Let's see, what do people think of when they hear "Shelby"?

A Shelby Prius would be Sub-Zero.

 

[Slash]

The GT350 was a complete, standard, original car from Shelby

Yet Shelby never designed it, or stamped the fenders or any core part on it. They simply added better parts and somehow this makes it is own car? Bull. Its not any different then someone modifying a Fox body and then trying to sell it as its own model under their name. Which can't be done. The Shelby is not is own car it is simply a higher performance variant.

Carbore: "Hey, that's a cool car."
Normal person: "Is it? Just looks like a girly Mustang to me."
Carbore: [prolonged explanation]
Noraml person: "I've just remembered I'm moving to Marrakech. Bye."

You could have just said there's history there.


But I'll never understand the girly stereotype. Being the mustang fan I am I knew it was a high end model when I was younger. In school I made a wood cutout that said Shelby on it and its proudly displaying in my room.

 

[White & Nerdy]

@Slash I think it's a fairly recent thing.

(hopefully that's not worth a ban.)

 

[Sage Ages]

Also, if anything, being a Shelby makes it cooler. Let's see, what do people think of when they hear "Shelby"?

A Shelby Prius would be Sub-Zero.

 

[Roo]

Also, if anything, being a Shelby makes it cooler. Let's see,
what do people think of when they hear "Shelby"?

*Cobra*

I would imagine most car people would think that. I suspect most of everyone else would think 'What's a Shelby'? Then you would have to explain. Which is uncool.

 

[Famine]

Yet Shelby never designed it, or stamped the fenders or any core part on it. They simply added better parts and somehow this makes it is own car? Bull. Its not any different then someone modifying a Fox body and then trying to sell it as its own model under their name. Which can't be done.

That alone tells you that it is different

The Shelby is not is own car it is simply a higher performance variant.

The title and VIN say it's a Shelby GT350, not a Ford Mustang.

You could have just said there's history there.

Ah yes, "history". Everyone's favourite school subject and the coolest thing of ever.

But I'll never understand the girly stereotype.

Lots of girls drove them in the 1960s. It was quite a popular car, you see, and some ladies like driving nice cars. Granted the "girly" stereotype was more tilted towards the six pots, but not exclusive to them.

Also, if anything, being a Shelby makes it cooler. Let's see, what do people think of when they hear "Shelby"?

A Shelby Prius would be Sub-Zero.

Sorry, that's an AC. Those are (apparently) the rules.

 

[Dennisch]

@Slash I think it's a fairly recent thing.

(hopefully that's not worth a ban.)

WTF is that??

 

[GranTurismo916]

About the "not Mustang" argument. Does it really matter? Everyone that I know would say "that's a Mustang," not, "that's a GT350."

 

[White & Nerdy]

It was a Shelby in the U.S., and it was probably Caroll Shelby's most famous project anyway. It's the one instantly-recognizeable car most associated with the word "Shelby".

@Dennisch A photoshop, hopefully. (pretty sure it is).

This, however, seems to not be.

 

[Slash]

@Slash I think it's a fairly recent thing.

(hopefully that's not worth a ban.)

I can't think of a car any more manlier than a big block Mustang.

I would imagine most car people would think that. I suspect most of everyone else would think 'What's a Shelby'? Then you would have to explain. Which is uncool.

How hard is it to say its a type of Mustang? Those words making a car become uncool is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.

That alone tells you that it is different

I am not arguing that its different. My argument is that it doesn't make it not a Mustang. By your logic any modified car is not what it was despite what it looks like and that if I may say so is ridiculous.

The title and VIN say it's a Shelby GT350, not a Ford Mustang.

The VIN was a reissue done by Shelby to incorporate the modifications into the number, which also shows the Ford numbers. The title yes does say its a Shelby but it also says its a Ford. Maybe its different overseas but from the 2 I have see in person with full documentation very clearly said "FORD" on the paperwork.

 

[mustang fanatic]

My point of view on a mustang being a girly car:

A V6 could be a girly car

A red convertible could be a girly car (my grandma's dream car is a red mustang convertible), besides, girls like anything that's a red convertible. Mustangs just come around more I guess.

Non-girly mustangs:
Any high performance mustang (gt, Mach 1, or Boss), or any classic fastback with a V8

My point: Ford offers many different Mustangs for many different people, some for guys, and some for girls.

 

[Adamgp]

Great. So what? The Dodge Stealth was 90-95% Mitsubishi, but it was still a complete, standard, original car from Mitsubishi.

The GT350 was a complete, standard, original car from Shelby..

The Dodge Stealth was a badge engineered car. Not the same.
The GT350 was a modified Mustang.

You want a Shelby original? Try the Series 1, which came decades later.

Indeed - and if there never was a Model T, Ford wouldn't have xisted to make the Mustang. It's still an odd point.

See above.

Not an odd point.

If the GT350 was a Shelby original, it could in theory have existed even if Ford never created the Mustang. But if there was no Mustang, there would be no Mustang for Shelby to create the GT350.

And if there was no 7 Series BMW, Alpina couldn't create the B7 now could they?

Yep. Even car insurers say the Shelby isn't a modified car. Even car insurers, who'd class a misplaced sticker as a modification.Luckily I covered most of the situations where cars are developed as one thing then sold or marketed as another in the rest of that section of paragraphs.

Insurers are the "entire motoring community?"

 

[Sage Ages]

It's pretty much a Mustang. It looks like a Mustang. People call it a Mustang. It's based off the Mustang. It has Mustang logos. Shelby sometimes refers to it as a Mustang.

 

[Scaff]

It was a Shelby in the U.S., and it was probably Caroll Shelby's most famous project anyway. It's the one instantly-recognizeable car most associated with the word "Shelby".

It was a Shelby in the rest of the world as well, none of which changes Famine's point that if the logic that the 350 is a modified Ford, then the Cobra is a modified AC and the GT40 is a modified Lola.

 

[White & Nerdy]

Indeed. Insurers live in a parallel universe, occasionally popping their heads into ours to annoy us.

 

[playnthru]

Put a girl in the driver's seat of a boss 429, and then see what she says.

She'll say meh, when do we install the blower YO!
--------
My point was not that the Mustang is a girly car? NO! It was that woman are attracted to the Mustang styling as much/if not more, than men! Power does not make a car manly..

Which has nothing to do with the Shelby debate.

 

[Slash]

Someone please find some paperwork photos for this thing please.

 

[White & Nerdy]

It was a Shelby in the rest of the world as well, none of which changes Famine's point that if the logic that the 350 is a modified Ford, then the Cobra is a modified AC and the GT40 is a modified Lola.

The Cobra was modified a lot more heavily than the GT350. GT350 = some go-fast stuff on a Mustang. Cobra = new bodywork and entirely different engine, and probably different suspension setup too, to the point where a lot of people who would recognize a Cobra probably don't even realize what an AC Ace is.

I thought he was referring to the AC version seen in Gran Turismo, which seems to have slightly different engine tuning.

 

[Johnny1996]

Whatever the car technically is, be it Mustang or Shelby, can we all just agree that it is a piece of American history, so that way we're all on the same page with one thing about the car, please?

 

[Scaff]

The Cobra was modified a lot more heavily than the GT350. GT350 = some go-fast stuff on a Mustang. Cobra = new bodywork and entirely different engine, and probably different suspension setup too, to the point where a lot of people who would recognize a Cobra probably don't even realize what an AC Ace is.

Don't matter the chassis is exactly the same and the bodywork is simply a pumped up version of the original (and that people might not know the difference is irrelevant).

I notice that you don't mention the Mk1 GT40, no surprise given that it is basically a Lola with very slight bodywork changes that wasn't even built by Ford.

Nor does it change the point that has been argued that without the AC Ace no Cobra would exist, and without the Lola Mk6 their would be not GT40.

 

[Famine]

By your logic any modified car is not what it was despite what it looks like and that if I may say so is ridiculous.

Yes, that is ridiculous.

Luckily that's not "my logic", rather some bizarre mindbelch you've pasted onto what you think I'm saying and are pretending is my sentiment.

The Dodge Stealth was a badge engineered car. Not the same.

Ah, you managed to read that example? Now go back and look at the variety of instances I posted of a car being engineered as one thing and sold/marketed as another in a previous post.

The GT350 was a modified Mustang.

Sure. But it was sold as a Shelby GT350 - a standard, unmodified vehicle. Even Ford were on that train but... you're not...

Not an odd point.

If the GT350 was a Shelby original, it could in theory have existed even if Ford never created the Mustang. But if there was no Mustang, there would be no Mustang for Shelby to create the GT350.

And if there was no 7 Series BMW, Alpina couldn't create the B7 now could they?

And I'll reiterate that [lack of any previous car] = [failure of subsequent dependent car to exist]. It's a really weird thing to say, as if it makes the Mustang really a Model T.

Insurers are the "entire motoring community?"

They're an extremist fringe of it that likes to charge you as much money as they can (hence the word "even" prior to "car insurers"). If they could bill you modified car rates for a Shelby GT350, they would. They can't - it's an original, unmodified car.

The Cobra was modified a lot more heavily than the GT350. GT350 = some go-fast stuff on a Mustang. Cobra = new bodywork and entirely different engine, and probably different suspension setup too, to the point where a lot of people who would recognize a Cobra probably don't even realize what an AC Ace is.

Yeah, but they didn't design it from the ground up, so apparently it doesn't count. Not my rules, sorry.

 

[Sage Ages]

Ford was working with Lola at the time as far as I know.

 

[White & Nerdy]

Until the Mk IV came along?

That's just a much slighter case of the original getting lost in the shadow of what came after. Anymore, no one really remembers Ford bought the design off Lola, they just remember that it's a Ford that pwned Le Mans because and made Ferrari run home crying for mommy. And personally, I don't really mind that.

 

[Scaff]

Ford was working with Lola at the time as far as I know.

No they were not, the Lola Mk6 was designed and built in 1962, Ford went to Lola to build them a GT car for LeMans as Ford had exactly zero experience in doing so. The only involvement Ford had with Lola on the Mk6 was to supply the powertrain. The Mk6 was a Lola product, without it the GT40 would not have existed in any way at all and the GT40 Mk1 was a good 80% Lola Mk6.

The exact argument being used for the 350 applies 100% to the GT40 and would make it a modified Lola.

 

[White & Nerdy]

Yes, that is ridiculous.

Luckily that's not "my logic", rather some bizarre mindbelch you've pasted onto what you think I'm saying and are pretending is my sentiment.

Sorry, but Slash has it here. I could throw some bolt-ons and flashy paint at a new Mustang, call it the Partisans 302 Competition, and try to sell it as that, but underneath it's still a Mustang. Might be technically called the Partisans 302 Competition, but it's still more or less a Mustang with some racing stuff on it.

 

[Slash]

Years different but point stands. Its a mustang regardless of what it was sold as. It says very clearly right there. This backs what @White & Nerdy just said.

 

[Scaff]

Until the Mk IV came along?

That's just a much slighter case of the original getting lost in the shadow of what came after. Anymore, no one really remembers Ford bought the design off Lola, they just remember that it's a Ford that pwned Le Mans because and made Ferrari run home crying for mommy. And personally, I don't really mind that.

What anyone does or doesn't remember is utterly irrelevant to the point, you either apply it consistently which makes the GT40 a Lola and the Cobra an AC or the 350 is a Shelby.

You don't get to have it both ways without being hypocritical.

 

[Famine]

Sorry, but Slash has it here. I could throw some bolt-ons and flashy paint at a new Mustang, call it the Partisans 302 Competition, and try to sell it as that, but underneath it's still a Mustang. Might be technically called the Partisans 302 Competition, but it's still more or less a Mustang with some racing stuff on it.

Great. Not what the point is at all. In fact the point is that I (and the world) say the Shelby Cobra you posted is a Shelby Cobra and the folk arguing the toss should be saying it's an AC.

Though they probably won't - while saying the Shelby GT350 is a Ford Mustang, the Alpina B10 is a BMW and the Ruf RGT is a Porsche 911.


And missing the point that it's this incessant arguing of the toss that makes cars like this boring to normal people.