Groundfish
(Banned)
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“This one time, at band camp, my Miata stepped out a little and I didn’t spin”
Does not mean sim makes one a driver.
Does not mean sim makes one a driver.
Has GTS with a wheel setup made you a better driver in the real world
- Thread starter Junkman55
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LOL. Good one. If that is what you believe, good for you.
- 3,051
- England
- kilesa4568
killerjimbag
(Banned)
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- abetterplaya
Clearly what you believe and what are facts don't seem to expand into the fathoms of your mind. There definitely is some distortion going on. I'm going to go out and drive my 65. Perhaps I should do a few laps on my PS4 to make sure I know how to drive it. Nah never mind,I'm pretty sure I'm capable after owning it for 35 years.
Thanks. Good luck to you too. It's been fun everyone. Lol
- 899
- Phoenix Az.
- HuddyBob
For me no.
I grew up in a very small area (prior fuel injection, much less abs/tc etc.), driving in snow for half the year, gravel roads, lots of rain, and of course regular paved roads as well.
Snow storms were an opportunity to get out an "play". My Dad actually had me out on deserted "roads" and parking lots long before my legal driving age, learning how to modulate the throttle/brake, slide, catch slides... I got pretty dang good at that and graduated to gravel roads (more grip, higher speeds)... we never practiced on pavement, but, as I got older, and got my own cars, being young/dumb, I practiced on my own.
I also grew up playing full contact sports, where, vision, awareness and anticipation are priorities to injury free play.
I also raced mountain bikes and downhill skiing, where looking way down the path is a requirement.
I've only ever played the GT series of "sim's", but I can tell you I much prefer the real thing, and am much more in control of the real thing. I find in GT series when a car is hooked up, it feels relatively real, but once traction begins to break things get lost in translation rather quickly.
I can see how, for folks that never got to "play" behind the wheel, or play sports that developed situational awareness and anticipation skills, that a sim/game could actually be a benefit to their real world driving.
But from my experience, being good at one does not mean you are good at the other.
I grew up in a very small area (prior fuel injection, much less abs/tc etc.), driving in snow for half the year, gravel roads, lots of rain, and of course regular paved roads as well.
Snow storms were an opportunity to get out an "play". My Dad actually had me out on deserted "roads" and parking lots long before my legal driving age, learning how to modulate the throttle/brake, slide, catch slides... I got pretty dang good at that and graduated to gravel roads (more grip, higher speeds)... we never practiced on pavement, but, as I got older, and got my own cars, being young/dumb, I practiced on my own.
I also grew up playing full contact sports, where, vision, awareness and anticipation are priorities to injury free play.
I also raced mountain bikes and downhill skiing, where looking way down the path is a requirement.
I've only ever played the GT series of "sim's", but I can tell you I much prefer the real thing, and am much more in control of the real thing. I find in GT series when a car is hooked up, it feels relatively real, but once traction begins to break things get lost in translation rather quickly.
I can see how, for folks that never got to "play" behind the wheel, or play sports that developed situational awareness and anticipation skills, that a sim/game could actually be a benefit to their real world driving.
But from my experience, being good at one does not mean you are good at the other.
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- 1,298
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- TPC_Fudsy
Eerrr... none of their competitors had sims to help either.....
Leaving out that most of them were driving some sort of motorised transport at speed in challenging conditions from very young ages, and doing it a LOT....
Edit: I should add that I am not claiming that you need sims to be the best in the world. I am of the opinion though that sims can help with some skills, with the benefits varying from person to person depending on experience gained prior to having access to sims, the quality of the simulation and the setting in which the sim is used.
Nor could anyone claim that sims totally replace real world experience. There are however circumstances where real world experience is difficult, dangerous or expensive to come by. In those circumstances, it may be appropriate to do a lot of simulation time before attempting the real world situation. An extreme example would be orbital docking to the international space station or landing on the moon. While there weren't good digital simulations for the Apollo moon landings, the astronaughts trained in the "lunar landing training vehicle" ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_Landing_Research_Vehicle ) which is an analog simulator.
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- 150
- United States
I think most would agree, I am not sure op is denying that.
- 451
- Manchester
- Leftcurl
me personally answered yes... because it has. Nothing to do with saving myself from a spin or quicker reactions.. but more along the lines of timing of braking and throttle control. But as far as people comparing experience levels of driving IRL ... time means nothing... my aunt has been driving for 45 years and she is as nervous as a kitten today just as she was 45 years ago.... but yeh... she's got lots of experience 
- 1,230
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- KosmoKazi
The OP is an interesting question. I would only like to offer the question from the other end: as realistic as the game is, you can take a very good actual driver and put him in the game, and he might not compete at the high end with the better players. It's a different skill set for sure: the lack of actual g-forces and 'feel' make it so. A real car doesn't pulse through the steering wheel when it understeers. A car pitching under braking will 'feel' completely different than a car that settles down on the rear springs under braking, and the two cars might be equally fast in the hands of two different drivers, or not.
A real car doesn't estimate what gear to be in, warning you if you are over-cooking the corner speed! (I know, you can turn that off... but the point is, the info is helpful because you don't have those actual forces and sensory inputs to work with on a 2-D screen in your living room.)
You don't have a radar to help you see cars in your periphery, that's kind of a cheat, too. No, it is a cheat. (In the 'sim' sense, I know... it's a game, and the tool is helpful, so use it, I agree...)
I am sure, in fact I know, very good actual race car drivers who aren't able to match the speed of a lot of people who can tear it up on GTS. It's simply a different skill set.
I don't mean to dispute the OP question or suggestion... for sure some good points have already been made here about awareness, techniques, etc. which lend themselves to being a better driver. And I would expect a good driver who puts in some time on GTS benefits from those things when he gets back into his real machine, no doubt. It's one step between visualizing for practice and actual racing sims, in that regard.
A real car doesn't estimate what gear to be in, warning you if you are over-cooking the corner speed! (I know, you can turn that off... but the point is, the info is helpful because you don't have those actual forces and sensory inputs to work with on a 2-D screen in your living room.)
You don't have a radar to help you see cars in your periphery, that's kind of a cheat, too. No, it is a cheat. (In the 'sim' sense, I know... it's a game, and the tool is helpful, so use it, I agree...)
I am sure, in fact I know, very good actual race car drivers who aren't able to match the speed of a lot of people who can tear it up on GTS. It's simply a different skill set.
I don't mean to dispute the OP question or suggestion... for sure some good points have already been made here about awareness, techniques, etc. which lend themselves to being a better driver. And I would expect a good driver who puts in some time on GTS benefits from those things when he gets back into his real machine, no doubt. It's one step between visualizing for practice and actual racing sims, in that regard.
Junkman55
(Banned)
- 470
- United States
Had a close call on a 6 lane HWY at a light with a 8 car carrier in the middle with me on the right in a 2 car carrier. We were about 600 ft from a curve Narrowed going under a train overpass with no shoulder. We both started out side by side doing about 25 MPH when I noticed he was starting to drift into my lane to make the curve with his trailer . With in Seconds I jump and straddle the curb adjusting the space between us with him taking half of my lane , applying enough braking before hitting the bridge barrier and came back into my lane with no damage. The skills I have learned throughout my life and the quick reflexes that I maintain in my racing simulator . I believe save me from having a bad day and the other truck driver could finish his CB conversation.
killerjimbag
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- abetterplaya
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- RocketJoe1-61
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- TPC_Fudsy
I've been driving in the real world for around forty years and I would estimate that this is fairly close to the average speed. This is certainly the speed at which most of the near misses I've seen or been involved in occur. This is the speed you NEED quick reflexes and pre-learned responses in real life.
Further, if the incident happened at a significantly higher speed and the person involved didn't have the required responses to survive it, it's not likely they'd be in any state to be reporting it here is it?
killerjimbag
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- abetterplaya
Really? 25 mph. Come on. I've been in accidents doing 60 mph that were not my fault. I'm still typing on my keyboard. I drive the 401 series in Ontario. Average speed is 65 mph. It is the busiest highway in North America. Majority of accidents I see are survivable in today's cars.Yes I've been driving for 45 years. Whats the point?
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- TPC_Fudsy
Most people that live and spend most of their time in urban areas have little day to day need for high speed skills, nearly all of their driving is at less than 40mph.
Junkman55
(Banned)
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- United States
I do not care What you think. I have accomplished things in my life that people like you can only read about. Have a nice day.
killerjimbag
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- abetterplaya
Were do you live? Urban areas. Like Toronto. Google 401 highway. Here did it for you. Just stop already.
https://www.gettyimages.ca/photos/h...otography&phrase=highway 401&sort=mostpopular
- 1,298
- Australia
- TPC_Fudsy
Actually I currently live in a rural city, but my car computer still puts me at an average speed of less than 35mph. However, since it's obvious that no-one but you is smart enough to offer any useful information and everyone else has left the topic, I'll go with the majority vote and leave too.
killerjimbag
(Banned)
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- The Great White North
- abetterplaya
Facts in front of you. I drive that highway every day,the speed limit is 62 mph. Nobody drives 62 mph,closer to 70 mph.So yes I would have some information pertaining to the topic at hand.See ya.
Junkman55
(Banned)
- 470
- United States
I was surprised that you and your buddy thought outdriving a potential traffic accident is a Laughing matter. Let’s get back To the question did my simulator setup With GTS software help me From having contact with that 18 wheel tractor trailer. I did the math my reaction time is 4.7 seconds give or take my speed and distance are correct. In my book that’s not bad.LOL - that's a good one!
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- 1,772
- Ludwigsburg
- RocketJoe1-61
Ho ho, so me and my buddy were throwing stones on your pink house, right ?
To begin with I'm telling you I'm an absolute fan of avoiding any damage in public traffic - that's what I successfully do for 35 years now. That's not been the point that made me and my buddy laugh.
My first point is, you got a tendency to hopelessly exaggerate your greatness as a driver and racer without any evidence - in a way that is hard to take at times for mere mortals. In my book 25 mph is low speed, even in a truck, so I can't see any special skill needed to master the situation you've been in. Thousands of drivers manage dangerous situations each and every day so no, that's nothing special. And before you start calling me clueless, I've been driving various trucks for many many years.
Btw if your reaction time actually was 4.7 seconds, I for sure don't want to share a road with you.
My second point is I think you at least partly were at fault too in the incident you described. In my book you shouldn't have moved yourself into such a situation at all.
You didn't see it coming ? No thought of the big truck needing a bit of space to make the corner ? You more than once mentioned your vast driving and racing experience refined on $1000 sim rig and you didn't see it coming ? You either weren't any more aware than the other driver on the CB or you guys were drag racing each other. In the best case it was a complete lack of partnership and solidarity in public traffic.
When someone starts to complain about a race incident over in the PENALTY thread, one of the first responses will ask for a video. And that's what I do too, now. Show us a video of said action to prove how great your driving was. Until then, I'm out.
Go on building your castle of dreams, I for sure won't knock on your door anymore - until you come back with a ...
Have a nice day.
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Junkman55
(Banned)
- 470
- United States
To answer your questions I didn’t make contact! If by driving at 25 MPH or at 60 MPH if you are in an accident the insurance company will assess you with fault just by being involved, being able to avoid an accident is always best. You and your friend think you could have done better then me that’s great and I tip my hat to you.
The poll is do you think “GTS with a wheel set up makes you a better driver in the real world“. If you disagree that’s fine with me. My example was not about racing but how a driving simulator can help practice driving skills the racing only makes it fun.
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