Is GT Sport a wrong choice? FM vs GT war issue

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo Sport' started by Mati_Blaster, Nov 11, 2018.

  1. Scaff

    Scaff Staff Emeritus

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    They have indeed, repeatedly (just as GTS has).

    The wet racing in PC2 stacks up very well in regard to how cars react under wet conditions on tracks, particularly the dynamic factors involved in wet surface build up and the drying line.

     
  2. Furi

    Furi Premium

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    There is no wrong or right choice.

    If you have PS4 you get GT, Xbox then Forza.

    Threads like this are for vain fanboys. If it was same platform (PC2 for instance) then it would be worth discussing... but no...
     
  3. mokalovesoulmat

    mokalovesoulmat

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    GT Sport: esports tool/racing simulator tool

    Forza: racing video game

    A lot of people are still looking at GT Sport as video game, but GT Sport itself is not.
     
  4. GTV0819

    GTV0819

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    I'm no fanboy but I only have Playstations and thus, GT is the only racing game I've got that I play really lot. I love the series but despite that, I'm dissing it out because of its shortcomings. I have not played any Forza game yet but I've watched some videos of the gameplay and it seems really cool because it has some features a GT game could only dream for like the ability to roam around freely and make some swaps of a selected car's engine, as well as allow a lot of customization that may make them unique-looking.

    Man, I wish GT had them a long time ago but it sucks not to have it until now and just only dream for it.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2018
  5. chris4652009

    chris4652009

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    The online side of Forza has come a long way tbf, i'm enjoying it a lot more than GT Sport now
     
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  6. chris4652009

    chris4652009

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    As per my comment in the FM7 thread this morning:
    Returned to his after a break, spent pretty much all day Sunday online and can honestly say I'm finding the A class hoppers surprising clean and well behaved.
    Everything just feels more race focused and cleaner, the game now has a more serious feel to it than it did the last time I played it, no one playing battering rams with SUVs anymore!

    I'm Really enjoying the direction this title is going tbh
    good job Turn 10
     
  7. ArR29

    ArR29

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    Honestly, that's not even my point. I'm not downplaying PC2 weather physics. I was merely using PC2 as an example that having weather effects can cause performance issues on PS4 and given how competitive the online racing can be, you surely don't want to have unpleasant experience. Game engines are not all equal though just because T10 has managed to do it on Xbox without FPS issues that doesn't mean PD can easily do it without major downgrade in overall quality of the game. Mind you Kaz main goal with GTSport is to have consistent image quality and performance.
     
  8. chris4652009

    chris4652009

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    Why does it have to be a "war"
    Why can't we all just play both/either and enjoy what we play?
     
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  9. Groundfish

    Groundfish Premium

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    I tried wet in pc2.
    To me too much grip.
    Maybe pc2 is diff on pc?
    In pc2 there’s much less feel of the cars weight and tires grip.
    I saw a Forza tournament the players all used controller.
    Gt has great ffb when tires approach limit on corners.
    I feel gt sports physics model gets an undeserved bad rap because of players of other titles.
    To me it feels more like real driving than pc2 in particular.
    Jmo
     
  10. ImaRobot

    ImaRobot Premium

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    Eh, if you want to actually race, any of the titles mentioned will do. It just depends on what specifics you want that will change that.
     
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  11. RacingFan1

    RacingFan1

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    Well, honestly If you are looking for a serious racing game, for doing serious races against other opponents, I think Forza is indeed a wrong choice. I've not seen yet any serious "sim racer" that recommends Forza 7 for serious racing. I see it more as a fun arcade-ish game for casuals.
     
  12. TokoTurismo

    TokoTurismo

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    I'm not sure if I said it or not, but I'm glad to own all three games and not just one (FM7, GT Sport and PC2). I don't care for realism as along as a game is just fun to play. That's what should matter most in a video game after all.
     
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  13. Scaff

    Scaff Staff Emeritus

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    With what tyres? How wet was the track?

    Nope.

    Odd as I find quite the opposite.

    And?

    GTS is a step forward in terms of physics for the GT series, but the issues it still has with tyre and damper modeling still put it behind the likes of AC and PC2.

    I also find with my rig that GTS has very little FFB, certainly when compared (again) to AC and PC2, both of which are more detailed and more accurate.

    GTS is a singularly more approachable title by design, its physics are demonstrably more 'simple' than many other titles, that doesn't make it better or worse, it simply makes it a design choice by PD, and one that many appreciate.
     
  14. chris4652009

    chris4652009

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    I couldn't agree more
     
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  15. Scaff

    Scaff Staff Emeritus

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    While I don't have FM (but loved the series last gen) I totally agree that limiting yourself to a single title results in so much being missed, I'm certainly glad to have the stupidly long list of titles I do, so I can run whatever suits the mood I'm in at that time.

    Personally it depends on what mood I'm in, for many however (and this would be my most common mood) realism is the fun.

    Indeed, enjoying yourself should always be the key, what starts the problems at times is that its a subjective thing for everyone.
     
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  16. ImaRobot

    ImaRobot Premium

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    It definitely doesn’t follow strict homologated racing like GTS, but it’s not any more arcade than GTS would be. The only main difference is the one focused on multiplayer and the other single player. They are a really good alternative to each other. The word casuals is such an odd one to throw around, to be honest as there’s hardcore players in any of these games. It really doesn’t hold much weight.
     
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  17. RacingFan1

    RacingFan1

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    Gotta disagree with that, GTS may not be extrely realistic but I think it feels more realistc than Forza 7. Not easy to explain with words but if I compare them to real driving I got the feeling that GTS while still not being there, is closer.
     
  18. ImaRobot

    ImaRobot Premium

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    That you think it feels better means little though, to be honest. They've always been hand in hand in the middle ground together, almost exclusively to be honest. They don't fall as low as purely arcade games, but they definitely aren't simulating anything like you see in Pcars or Assetto Corsa. They've always occupied the same space with their physics engine - simulating things a bit differently but simulating enough to mimic reality in a realistic manner, but not over-excelling in it outright. Easy to pick up and play. The reason for that is to make it a more accessible game to appeal to way more people than something even more niche, like the more physics-oriented sims. Hell, our very own @Scaff has put most games through the ringer in that regard and has even proven as much in the past.
     
  19. Tired Tyres

    Tired Tyres

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    Not in my experience. In Forza I have to switch on stability control to make it similar to GTS with the 'pad. It is still more difficult to control the cars than in GTS at that point though.
     
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  20. RacingFan1

    RacingFan1

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    Well, you guys have your opinion, I have mine.
    I have to say that I always use wheel and not pad, and I dont remember which wheel was in forza but not the T150 I have.
     
  21. ImaRobot

    ImaRobot Premium

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    Physics don't change with a wheel. What would change is the dampening that you receive on a pad and FFB you get with a wheel, so that could boil down to the differences that you feel rather than the actual physics. Regardless of what you feel, these two games hold on to that middle ground of simulation, and do it extremely well. They both have things they simulate better than the other, and a load of things they do similarly, but still are easy enough for just about anyone to jump into if they want to.
     
  22. RedRockValley

    RedRockValley

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    In my opinion, Forza back in it's 360 days was definitely better than PS3 era Gran Turismo. Now though with the new console generation, the tables have turned.

    Forza nowadays seems to be the one with less attention to detail (some cars modelled incorrectly in places, exaggerated/copy paste sounds (looking at you Horizon 4), weird shading and lighting, lackluster multiplayer) while GT Sport does those things really well.

    Of course, there are some things that GT doesn't have on Forza currently. This being an in-depth career mode (GT League really only is just a credit farm with no prize cars) and car selection (no argument there, still love GT Sport's current lineup though.)

    As I have said though, this is just my opinion. I'm fine with people playing either game as long as they don't attack others for it.
     
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  23. ImaRobot

    ImaRobot Premium

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    I think the two companies really acknowledged their issues they've faced in the past. With GTS being rebuilt from the ground up, and Forza's next iteration essentially put on pause while they iron out many of the issues with their current game. Even if they have their focus in different area's, both achieved what they set out to do, fairly well, in my opinion even if they both have their hiccups along the way. You're doing yourself a disservice if you're restricting yourself from what's on the market.
     
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  24. RacingFan1

    RacingFan1

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    Yes it seems forza now is facing problems that GT had in the past - huge quantity of cars and tracks takes many resources and leads to less attention to detail in other areas.
     
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  25. RedRockValley

    RedRockValley

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    It's obvious the issue Forza had was time constraints.

    The suits at Microsoft obviously have quite alot of control over Forza, which lead to Turn 10 having a "schedule" with releases of Forza games.

    Now, in the OG Xbox/Xbox 360 era this worked quite well due to the consoles being less sophisticated, which meant less workload. With the Xbox One though, they have to work at that quick pace while trying to keep the game looking as up to scratch as possible. This came with sacrifices to car models, sound etc. because of the higher bar the Xbox One set.

    Thankfully as you mentioned, Forza has been put on pause to iron out the issues with the franchise. Soon enough, I hope GT and Forza become proper rivals once again, like the good ol' days :lol:
     
  26. ImaRobot

    ImaRobot Premium

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    That's really not so much the case either, at least only to a certain degree. New to the series vehicles seem to be ok for the most part, it's the ones that get ported over that still hold on to the same inaccuracies that they've had in the past. What has happened, which is one major thing I think, is that their QC department hasn't been the best lately. The recent iteration of Horizon as well as the last of Motorsport had their share of bugs, more so than usual. In their haste to meet such a strict deadline I feel it hinders the quality control in some area's. That's likely why Forza Motorsport "8" was put on hold for now.
     
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  27. beyond72

    beyond72

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    For the all criticism aimed at Forza 7, doubt we'll see a car collection as vast (out of the box) for a long time.
    But for Forza 8 they should give up trying to appease fans of Horizon and go the other way and they might attract new fans.
    If you look past some of the presentation and design choices of 7, the ingredients are already there.
    They have the history of motorsport in a box but need to market that fact.
     
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  28. Groundfish

    Groundfish Premium

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    I haven’t played any games except pc2 ac and gt sport. Prior game was ridge racer.
    I tried ac then pc2 because of the comments I found online.
    You can’t mention physics online about gt sport without being told pc2 is better or ac is better.
    I’m almost fifty been driving a lot of years.
    Sure ac and pc2 offer more ffb effects, but my impression upon driving in them so far is that much of that isn’t helping me info wise.
    Maybe if I spent more time in one or the other I would learn to interpret what the devs were trying to accomplish with these effects.
    I tried Nurburgring gp with 650s gt3 in rain and I could brake easily and make good time first try. T1 I could get on it pretty good on exit. Just seemed like it wasn’t raining.
    I also did Bathurst Toyota 86 gt4.
    Did four laps and got nausea from all the default camera shake. Coming through the dipper the last time had to turn off the game.
    Cold tires effects are way over cooked imo. They are racing slicks not ice cubes.
    So pc2 left a very bad taste in my mouth.
    Spent hours tinkering with ffb settings to get it drivable.
    So that was just my experience.
    I could write more but I digress.
     
  29. TokoTurismo

    TokoTurismo

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    Indeed. As a car fan, I couldn't have said it any better. :tup:

    Absolutely, and I don't disagree either. When it comes to sims (whether you are on a wheel or pad) the challenge is there, and I love it!

    PCARS2, for example, is a pretty tough game to get into. But that's what makes it unique and thrilling compared to Forza and GT.

    Both Forza and GT are not hard to get into because of the simplicity of there physics model. Some are going to (obviously) deny that, but it's true.

    Excatly! Well said. :):tup:
     
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  30. Scaff

    Scaff Staff Emeritus

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    Which may well indicate something.


    I'm 48 and have spent most of my working life in the motor industry, with time spent in dealerships, working for OEMs and third party suppliers. That's afforded me a lot of driving hours on road and on track, in a wide range of cars.

    What they are attempting to communicate is what happens in reality, and by and large they do a good job of it.

    And? Wet spec raceing tyres when up to temp generate a massive amount of grip and clear a huge amount of water. Are they as quick as slicks or inters? Nope, but they are still going to generate a massive amount of grip in comparison to road tyres. The challenge with wet conditions is losing temp in tyres (which is the real killer in terms of grip), or hitting standing water and aquaplaning.

    Why not just turn down/off the camera shake?

    Speaking from direct personal experience, bugger all grip on cold slicks is exactly what they should be like.

    And I have no problem with you not getting on with either AC or PC, personal opinion of them isn't an issue (nor should it ever be) as its subjective. However objectively (while they still both also have issues) AC and PC have more in-depth physics models and get more of it right than GTS does.
     
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