is GT6's photo mode better than Forza 5?

[Stylel_Code]

Cant beat this. Thats trackdetail and not fancy texture maps.

Just read posts above you:

Other tracks in GT6 have some great textures too -->

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[gtuned]

What car is that rim shot from? It's beautiful!!

By the way, I would like to say that I am very impressed with @gtuned and his posts. All of his posts have been top notch in this thread. He has stayed on topic, posted good answers to people's requests (such as photos of standards) and is one of few people here who actually is discussing the topic as opposed to bickering about which game has "better FPS" and absolutely irrelevant rubbish.

So, thank you gtuned for being one of the few who's kept things civilized. I've been looking at this thread for a while, and all of your posts have been top notch.

By the way, the post of yours with the photos of standards is STAGGERING. Who knew that models coming from PS2 days could still look anything close to PS3, nevermind XB1 quality? Incredible, my hat is off to you. 👍

I appreciate it mate, just trying to keep a good sensible discussion and give good, balanced points to each game instead of just pointing out irrelevant "facts"

 

[Zer0]

Forza lets you take and slightly edit within game, while GT is giving you a real camera.

That's very true and it shows when that Forza's "capture" method can't avoid some of the same in-game filtering problems.

Note how fast the ground and asphalt becomes blurrier and undetailed with the distance compared to GT (see the differences with the "Bilstein" logo at the bridge, click to zoom).

That's a problem of lack of anisotropic filtering and the reason because most of the Forza "good" photos are taken with blurred backgrounds or very aggresive bokeh, also because Forza's graphics are often seen as "bold", even having high-res textures at close-ups.

The same happens in-game. Look here how even Forza using a more high-res asphalt textures at a closer distance, the overall look of the track in GT6 becomes finer and more detailed. And that GT6 capture is from a compressed video file, not a frame-buffer shot as Forza, so some of the original detail is lost.

 

[GrandTurismo]

That's very true and it shows when that "capture" method can't avoid some of the same in-game filtering problems.

Note how fast the ground and asphalt becomes blurrier and undetailed with the distance.

That's a problem of lack of anisotropic filtering and the reason because most of the Forza "good" photos are taken with blurred backgrounds or very aggresive bokeh, also because Forza's graphics are often seen as "bold", even having high-res textures at close-ups.

The same happens in-game. Look here how even Forza using a more high-res asphalt textures at a closer distance, the overall look of the track in GT6 becomes finer and more detailed. And that GT6 capture is from a compressed video file, not a frame-buffer shot as Forza, so some of the original detail is lost.

That still doesnt mean you can take better pics in FM opposed to Gt.

 

[phpq]

FM5 on 8 Gigabyte of RAM:

GT6 on 256 megabyte of RAM:

I don't know if these are the best photos to compare textures of both games,
hard to get a fair trial, with images of such different angles.



an example:


the player views textures

now textures seen from above

and in some cases they take to load. the 8GB makes all the difference.

I think the PD did a good job, given the limitation of the hardware. but there are no magic.

 

[Griffith500]

I still think texture streaming is magic (nice demonstration, there), and geometry streaming is the next thing to get to grips with. Bring on the detail, PD!

 

[Stylel_Code]

I still think texture streaming is magic (nice demonstration, there), and geometry streaming is the next thing to get to grips with. Bring on the detail, PD!

I don't get texture streaming and geometry streaming, can you explain a bit to me please?

 

[GrandTurismo]

I still think texture streaming is magic (nice demonstration, there), and geometry streaming is the next thing to get to grips with. Bring on the detail, PD!

I think the sounds should be a priority..

 

[Griffith500]

I don't get texture streaming and geometry streaming, can you explain a bit to me please?

I don't really fully get it myself (in terms of the fundamental processes), but basically rather than loading everything in one go before the race starts, only as much as is needed in the first scene is loaded, and the rest is loaded on-demand as you play.

I think originally it came about for long tracks like the Nordschleife, which had the infamous streaming bug in GT5 for a while (missing textures). But now it allows for more detail than could be loaded all in one go, if you push the limits of how much you can load in a short space of time.

Geometry is the "polygons", the shapes that the textures get applied to, and streaming that is a bit harder without knowing which bits are visible. There's loads of stuff on the internet about it, mostly technical.

I think the sounds should be a priority..

For the graphics engine programmers? Sure, why not!

 

[Stylel_Code]

I don't really fully get it myself (in terms of the fundamental processes), but basically rather than loading everything in one go before the race starts, only as much as is needed in the first scene is loaded, and the rest is loaded on-demand as you play.

I think originally it came about for long tracks like the Nordschleife, which had the infamous streaming bug in GT5 for a while (missing textures). But now it allows for more detail than could be loaded all in one go, if you push the limits of how much you can load in a short space of time.

Geometry is the "polygons", the shapes that the textures get applied to, and streaming that is a bit harder without knowing which bits are visible. There's loads of stuff on the internet about it, mostly technical.

Oh thanks now I see what you mean. Sometimes my replay camera showed me some missing textures which then loaded very quickly when the camera switched from a place to another place a little bit far away. It is because of the low RAM of PS3. It is also probably the reason, as shown in the pics of Goodwood above, that HD textures are only partially loaded when looking close. The RAM limitation was one of the biggest issue with the PS3 for a game such as GT6. With PS4 and its amazing 8GB of RAM GDDR5 ( a little bit still reserved for system though, normal) It will be an impressive improvement overall. We will be able to have phototravell quality Premium on track with gameplay, and an HD scenery which was impossible to accomplish on PS3 because of its RAM. Not to mention the huge leap in GPU, CPU and easier architecture.
Goodwood is the best looking GT track, looks better than any Next gen game out there when you drive on it believe me guys. And I think the reason is becaise the track is very small, thus PD can use more HD textures.
I hope GT7 brings us an amazing leap. But I already know in graphical side, it will be better than any game and this for many years because of the photorealistic GT graphics has always aimed for.
Also not to mention, Xbox One doesn't have 8 Gb of RAM only for game. It is divided, some used for Gaming and the other used for system. PS4 has way more RAM used only for games than Xbox One, and the RAM system in PS4 is more usefull for developers as it uses 8GB of GDDr5 vs 8 GB of DDr3 on xbox one. I mention this just briefly just to show off how would the next GT be capable with such a great RAM.

 

[GrandTurismo]

Oh thanks now I see what you mean. Sometimes my replay camera showed me some missing textures which then loaded very quickly when the camera switched from a place to another place a little bit far away. It is because of the low RAM of PS3. It is also probably the reason, as shown in the pics of Goodwood above, that HD textures are only partially loaded when looking close. The RAM limitation was one of the biggest issue with the PS3 for a game such as GT6. With PS4 and its amazing 8GB of RAM GDDR5 ( a little bit still reserved for system though, normal) It will be an impressive improvement overall. We will be able to have phototravell quality Premium on track with gameplay, and an HD scenery which was impossible to accomplish on PS3 because of its RAM. Not to mention the huge leap in GPU, CPU and easier architecture.
Goodwood is the best looking GT track, looks better than any Next gen game out there when you drive on it believe me guys. And I think the reason is becaise the track is very small, thus PD can use more HD textures.
I hope GT7 brings us an amazing leap. But I already know in graphical side, it will be better than any game and this for many years because of the photorealistic GT graphics has always aimed for.
Also not to mention, Xbox One doesn't have 8 Gb of RAM only for game. It is divided, some used for Gaming and the other used for system. PS4 has way more RAM used only for games than Xbox One, and the RAM system in PS4 is more usefull for developers as it uses 8GB of GDDr5 vs 8 GB of DDr3 on xbox one. I mention this just briefly just to show off how would the next GT be capable with such a great RAM.

We have the clouuudd.

 

[Stylel_Code]

We have the clouuudd.

Please don't turn this thread into a PS vs Xbox thread. It wasn't my aim and your response could have been a little bit more constructive, for example explaining how it could have been better than PS4's RAM because it seems it is what you claim. But don't do that now here, it's not the thread made for this.

 

[Terronium-12]

We have the clouuudd.

You have the bannnnn.

 

[IneedSchool]

You have the bannnnn.

*Random Guitar solo*

 

[imported_skidmark]

@Zer0 Is that a bad thing though? I don't know much about graphics but are we saying that all developers need to waste resources on complex engines just to get our approval? The game looks good everywhere and everytime. GT5/6 looks good at times but other it looks worse than the first Forzas despite PD having almost 10 years of experience with the PS3.

If a basic engine allows Forza to have better AI, physics, sounds, damage, environments and locked 60 fps then I don't see the problem unless this is just a useless pissing contest.

Exactly! GT has a better lighting engine on a few tracks that allow dynamic lighting but the other tracks are exactly the same 'baked' lighting of all other racing games out there. Forza has better more detailed car models without a dought and theres no comparing when it comes to track detail.
Lighting isn't the only defining thing in a games graphics.

 

[Stylel_Code]

Exactly! GT has a better lighting engine on a few tracks that allow dynamic lighting but the other tracks are exactly the same 'baked' lighting of all other racing games out there. Forza has better more detailed car models without a dought and theres no comparing when it comes to track detail.
Lighting isn't the only defining thing in a games graphics.

Well, actually no. For example, there is two versions of SPA Francorchamps in GT6. One with your supposed baked lightning, and another with full cycle among weather. When you set the same time of day in the full day/night cycle as the one baked, you get the same environment and the same lightning.
Also, I highly doubt Forza car models look better than GT6's premiums. As for the tracks, read above you, I mentioned a RAM problem for this which can only be fixed with more RAM, meaning with next GT on PS4..

 

[imported_skidmark]

We have the clouuudd.

You think good wood is better looking than any track in forza5?? Think you need to get your eyes tested mate!. Yes gt looks great on the old ps3 but there's no comparison in-game/not replay! Cause we all know gt uses post processing in there replays but actual in game there's no comparison, forza looks ace.

Well, actually no. For example, there is two versions of SPA Francorchamps in GT6. One with your supposed baked lightning, and another with full cycle among weather. When you set the same time of day in the full day/night cycle as the one baked, you get the same environment and the same lightning.
Also, I highly doubt Forza car models look better than GT6's premiums. As for the tracks, read above you, I mentioned a RAM problem for this which can only be fixed with more RAM, meaning with next GT on PS4..

Do you realise that forza has prob double/tripple the Poly's on there next gen cars to that in forza 4.PLUS! every single car has a forza vista model.. If uve never witnessed these models then you have no argument these are the most detailed car models in any car game PC or not!. Yes they don't look like that in game but these are the next gen remakes they look stunning!.

You mention a track that uses dynamic lighting for a baked lighting discussion not to clever!. Overall its plain to see that overall, the quality is spread across all of forza5,which is why its left feeling a little skinny content wise.

Oh thanks now I see what you mean. Sometimes my replay camera showed me some missing textures which then loaded very quickly when the camera switched from a place to another place a little bit far away. It is because of the low RAM of PS3. It is also probably the reason, as shown in the pics of Goodwood above, that HD textures are only partially loaded when looking close. The RAM limitation was one of the biggest issue with the PS3 for a game such as GT6. With PS4 and its amazing 8GB of RAM GDDR5 ( a little bit still reserved for system though, normal) It will be an impressive improvement overall. We will be able to have phototravell quality Premium on track with gameplay, and an HD scenery which was impossible to accomplish on PS3 because of its RAM. Not to mention the huge leap in GPU, CPU and easier architecture.
Goodwood is the best looking GT track, looks better than any Next gen game out there when you drive on it believe me guys. And I think the reason is becaise the track is very small, thus PD can use more HD textures.
I hope GT7 brings us an amazing leap. But I already know in graphical side, it will be better than any game and this for many years because of the photorealistic GT graphics has always aimed for.
Also not to mention, Xbox One doesn't have 8 Gb of RAM only for game. It is divided, some used for Gaming and the other used for system. PS4 has way more RAM used only for games than Xbox One, and the RAM system in PS4 is more usefull for developers as it uses 8GB of GDDr5 vs 8 GB of DDr3 on xbox one. I mention this just briefly just to show off how would the next GT be capable with such a great RAM.

Judging by this post you don't read much. Ps4 has 4.5 gig of ram for developers..Xbox has 5gig.

 

[ColouredBadger]

Judging by this post you don't read much. Ps4 has 4.5 gig of ram for developers..Xbox has 5gig.

Just to answer this.

Xbox One has 8Gb 2133MHz DDR3

Playstation 4 has 8Gb 5500MHz GDDR5

Playstation's hardware is superior and they use the GDDR5 because of a higherband-width than the DDR3, which is necessary for rendering higher polygon counts, physics, high-res textures, etc. allowing developers to make more detailed games. It also has more than twice the System Memory Bandwidth than the Xbox One. All this means that the PS4, and potentially GT7 are capable of making Forza, and other Xbox Exclusives look like a polished Xbox 360 game compared to PS4's exclusives like Final Fantasy 15 and Gran Turismo 7.

I've said this part countless times now. It's still funny to me that a game built on a console with these specs; 256Mb 550MHz DDR3 (PS3) Is going up against; 8Gb 2133MHz DDR3 (Xbox One) in a handbag swinging contest of which is better. It's slightly sad really. Especially as the PS3 is keeping up with Xbox One's "future" console, let alone Sony's next-gen offering to the point where it is needed to be argued over in these kinds of threads.

We get it, your Xbox One's are superior to PS3 (we didn't need Stephen Hawkin to point that one out). But it's not superior by that much so stop arguing the toss that Forza is just a little bit better than Gran Turismo because in all honesty, with the specs Xbox One has, Forza should be a damn sight better than what they've managed to churn out.

Thank you!

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Judging by this post you don't read much. Ps4 has 4.5 gig of ram for developers..Xbox has 5gig.

And MGS GZ runs butter smooth at 1080p 60fps on PS4 and Xbone only 720p, and it will be one of many.

 

[Tornado]

You think good wood is better looking than any track in forza5?? Think you need to get your eyes tested mate!. Yes gt looks great on the old ps3 but there's no comparison in-game/not replay! Cause we all know gt uses post processing in there replays but actual in game there's no comparison, forza looks ace.

No, I don't think he would have thought that.
It's hilarious that you accused another member of "not reading much" right after starting an argument with a Forza fanboy who can't even respond to you because he was banned for the post you quoted.

 

[chzsln485]

GT had always great color pallet, graphical style and the cars looks extremely real. It does a fantastic job at simulating reality, greatly enchaining the immersion. All of the Kaz's movie/photography background is shining thru.

Forza while technically superior looks like a game. I don't think it's because Turn10 is incapable - it's more of a choice in my opinion.

Exactly this. Does anyone remember GT5's Standard car photo thread? Some of the pics looked insane in there, even using PS2 cars, simply because GT's very accurate lighting made the photos look realistic as a whole. Likewise, much higher poly models from Forza might look better, but look less realistic and more "gamey" because of the overly shiny cars and exaggerated, film-like lighting.

 

[ImaRobot]

All this means that the PS4, and potentially GT7 are capable of making Forza, and other Xbox Exclusives look like a polished Xbox 360 game compared to PS4's exclusives like Final Fantasy 15 and Gran Turismo 7.

FF is not exclusive, and GT is no where to be seen, So I'm unsure of how your getting these comparisons. The funny thing is, is that I can see GT looking more like a polished PS3 game with the reused, 2-generation old assets. Still, I'm curious to see what they can do graphically with GT on a current gen.

I've said this part countless times now. It's still funny to me that a game built on a console with these specs; 256Mb 550MHz DDR3 (PS3) Is going up against; 8Gb 2133MHz DDR3 (Xbox One) in a handbag swinging contest of which is better. It's slightly sad really. Especially as the PS3 is keeping up with Xbox One's "future" console, let alone Sony's next-gen offering to the point where it is needed to be argued over in these kinds of threads.

Its not all that surprising really. Graphically, we are getting to a point where there arent going to be that much drastic changes between games from the end of the last gen, and games at the beginning of the current gen. Most of the very pretty games that where out last gen seemed to sacrifice in some way or another in playability, I can imagine that we will be more amazed by the magnitude content in a game, rather then its graphics.

At first, I was amazed by Current gens, but after having my Xbox One for 2 months now, the hype has calmed. The graphics, while good, do not blow me away on either console. The jump from Xbox/PS2 to 360/PS3 was much more amazing, and that is a jump we are no longer going to be able to witness.

We get it, your Xbox One's are superior to PS3 (we didn't need Stephen Hawkin to point that one out). But it's not superior by that much so stop arguing the toss that Forza is just a little bit better than Gran Turismo

Why are you going to tell someone to stop doing, what you are doing?

because in all honesty, with the specs Xbox One has, Forza should be a damn sight better than what they've managed to churn out.

Thank you!

They've managed to churn out a very playable game, I'm glad.

 

[PepeMickey]

The ''FM5 is only better because...hardware'' argument is getting ridiculous, what about Forza 4? That one still looks better and it has more ''premium'' content than GT has ever had.

You're trying so hard to put GT6 on the same level as FM5/PCARS but fail to realize that GT has yet to out do itself, it needs to fix itself before it can even compete. You should probably start with GT5 vs GT6 then address the first forzas, also, I don't see how GT7 with standard cars and tracks is going to beat anything.

 

[bashfulboson]

The ''FM5 is only better because...hardware'' argument is getting ridiculous, what about Forza 4? That one still looks better and it has more ''premium'' content than GT has ever had.

You're trying so hard to put GT6 on the same level as FM5/PCARS but fail to realize that GT has yet to out do itself, it needs to fix itself before it can even compete. You should probably start with GT5 vs GT6 then address the first forzas, also, I don't see how GT7 with standard cars and tracks is going to beat anything.

Na~
FM4 doesn't look better than GT at all.
It looks cartoonish

 

[Tornado]

Ignoring the reappearance of the idiotic "looks cartoonish" argument, Forza 4 has nearly as many asterisks on when it looks "better" than GT6/GT5 as GT6/GT5 do for when they look better than Forza 4.

 

[imported_skidmark]

Just to answer this.

Xbox One has 8Gb 2133MHz DDR3

Playstation 4 has 8Gb 5500MHz GDDR5

Playstation's hardware is superior and they use the GDDR5 because of a higherband-width than the DDR3, which is necessary for rendering higher polygon counts, physics, high-res textures, etc. allowing developers to make more detailed games. It also has more than twice the System Memory Bandwidth than the Xbox One. All this means that the PS4, and potentially GT7 are capable of making Forza, and other Xbox Exclusives look like a polished Xbox 360 game compared to PS4's exclusives like Final Fantasy 15 and Gran Turismo 7.

I've said this part countless times now. It's still funny to me that a game built on a console with these specs; 256Mb 550MHz DDR3 (PS3) Is going up against; 8Gb 2133MHz DDR3 (Xbox One) in a handbag swinging contest of which is better. It's slightly sad really. Especially as the PS3 is keeping up with Xbox One's "future" console, let alone Sony's next-gen offering to the point where it is needed to be argued over in these kinds of threads.

We get it, your Xbox One's are superior to PS3 (we didn't need Stephen Hawkin to point that one out). But it's not superior by that much so stop arguing the toss that Forza is just a little bit better than Gran Turismo because in all honesty, with the specs Xbox One has, Forza should be a damn sight better than what they've managed to churn out.

Thank you!

Ps4 has 4.5 gb for developers Xbox has 5gb and 32mb esram get it right mate

Ive been following both consoles and watching every faceoff and it looks like to me the Xbox one has taken some leaps with its drivers and new xdk. John carrmack (I'd software) tech guru stated there's hardly any difference between the consoles with regards to performance NOT numbers on paper...

Think what the hell you like,but from playing gt6 and f5 how you can compare the two is beyond me.
YES GT has very nice touches here and there but it doesn't transcend through out the game.. Whereas forza has a consistent quality, tracks/cars all being of a certain high standard.

Now if gt7 does turn out to be special I'll think about getting a ps4.. But i fully expect forza 6 to build on what they've already got-an excellent racer!

 

[imported_skidmark]

And MGS GZ runs butter smooth at 1080p 60fps on PS4 and Xbone only 720p, and it will be one of many.

Haha that title didn't recieve the new xdk or direct x12 benefits. It came out in march which is the time xboxs drivers were still garbage!. I'd expect 900p on xbox 1080p on PS which isn't a hell of a lot of difference!!.

I love it how people seem to think the ps4 is so much more powerful but when you here it from developers (the people who actually make the games) there's not a lot of difference,who are you going to believe???

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Haha that title didn't recieve the new xdk or direct x12 benefits. It came out in march which is the time xboxs drivers were still garbage!. I'd expect 900p on xbox 1080p on PS which isn't a hell of a lot of difference!!.

I love it how people seem to think the ps4 is so much more powerful but when you here it from developers (the people who actually make the games) there's not a lot of difference,who are you going to believe???

Certainly not you.

 

[Terronium-12]

I'm going to outline this just once more:

- This is not an FM5 vs. GT6 thread. We have one of those.
- This is not an Xbox One vs. PS4 thread. We have several of those and here's two of them.
- This is a thread comparing the photomode of FM5 and GT6, nothing more and nothing less.

If the thread breaks topic once more for any reason it'll be locked and won't be reopened.

 

[imported_skidmark]

I hear you!