Just Raced Under The New Algorithms and Rules

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo Sport' started by GTFraker, Feb 28, 2018.

  1. Outspacer

    Outspacer

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    No, it's awful. It never makes sense to give both cars a time penalty, and even less sense to give both the same penalty.

    So there you are, leading the race and under pressure from 2nd, a few seconds clear of third place. He could just bump you off and take the win. The penalty isn't going to stop him, because you'll get the same.
     
  2. _ApexPredator

    _ApexPredator

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    Aye, I knew exactly what you meant :)
    It's nice that they've opened up some lines of communications at least anyway, but yeah that one line is pretty worrying!
     
  3. Robben

    Robben

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    But he can't "bump you off" as he will receive a more severe penalty if this
    "- The Penalty Judgement system monitors the on-track conditions for some time after a contact/collision, and determines a penalty after seeing the resulting conditions of the drivers involved after the collision."

    works as intended.
     
  4. NJT4567

    NJT4567

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    Just to cheer the chat up, actually had some clean racing at Willow Springs last night, managed 2 clean races and 2 podiums, really enjoy Willow Springs when the racing is clean.
     
    Alpha Cipher likes this.
  5. Revver00

    Revver00

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    35
    Dear PD,

    It is a total cop out to penalise both drivers where any contact occurs, let alone make it only for A and S DR - what happens is when a "B" DR is in the contact? They get no penalty!! It is also open to abuse in races where more than 1 driver from a "team" is entered, all 1 team driver has to do is contact all of the other entrants except his team mate, so they all get penalties whilst the team's clean driver wins by miles. Please hurry up and sort it out PD developers and in the meantime apply no penalties. It is ruining all of the racing in A and S DR until you do.

    Regards,
    an ex MSA clerk of the course (karting)

     
  6. Outspacer

    Outspacer

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    He could bump you off line, ruin your exit from a corner, then take you down the straight. Since:

    "- In a collision between two cars, the car behind will no longer receive a more severe penalty;"

    Plus, the one you quoted does not state how the penalty gets divvied up. If, say, you only get 4 secs when he gets 5, well maybe you'd consider that working as intended, but I don't.

    One thing we can say about these latest changes is that they are shying away from placing blame, since they realise they got it wrong too often.
     
    TamasToth likes this.
  7. ASH32

    ASH32

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    Sadly in my experience they do place blame and very wrongly too. The higher rated driver is always at fault and will either get the same penalty if hit from behind or a higher penalty than the other car involved for any other contact, even very minor ones that effect nothing.
     
  8. BallPtPenTheif

    BallPtPenTheif

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    They're listening. Cool.
     
    TheGeologist likes this.
  9. Outspacer

    Outspacer

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    That's a different scenario :) Anyway, you're preaching to the choir...

    As far as I can tell they have their heads firmly in the sand and aren't going to back down from having time penalties, even though its pretty clear that it's flawed for almost every incident in one way or another, and their 'Judgment' system is nigh on useless. A few tweaks here and there are not going to sudddenly make it work well enough. Indeed, most of their tweaks seem to make it worse, like this basing penalty on DR bollocks.
     
    ASH32 likes this.
  10. TamasToth

    TamasToth

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    I don't know the origin of these lines, but is just not true. In practice. Or if it is true, then they "determinig" faulty. You can monitor anything as long as you like if after that you conclude wrong. That is what happening. I mentioned several times - as experienced - that after a little touch, of which could be monitored before/after for miles, resulted in both of us stayed on track, basically on our pre-contact racing lines, was resulted in penalty. Completely incomprehensible.
    Just an example: I'm in front, my next turn should be a wide-in, late-apex type. The one behind is diving in, putting his nose inside, forcing me to "miss" the apex, I have to keep wide to leave place for him - but it is just happening sometimes, It is OK. I let the inside line, but because his late-braking he also misses the apex, getting out a little wider than expected: we can contact, Maybe I need to go wider, but there's place, he didn't pushed me out, I didn't closed on him and forced offtrack inside, so while I may miss a position, nothing harmful happened. We could go on racing. BUT, instead of this, we're getting penalty. (I just assume his penalty, I know about mine.) Why? I should never "call" for any judgement in a situation like this, I was not forced offtrack on the outside. Why should he "call" judgement? Taken the opportunity, he made his move, possibly gained a position, and both of us is on track.

    But there's more dumb evidence: Suzuka, last chicane. We are in a train, 1-2-3 with a little safety gap between us. The "racer" from position 4 or 5 just didn't want to brake enough, bombing into the train just turning. The clever bomber were flying thru between p1 and p2, touched (or touched by) p2, who receives a 10+ sec penalty, because after the contact the other party went off track (which should have been happened without any contact). What is it? What did the system monitored? And why bothered, if it concluded that wrong? It _is_ a joke.
     
  11. cleanLX

    cleanLX

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    Need a thread to petition the penalties...
    Seems most (myself included) would prefer the penalties only be served in the pit, or at the end of the race.
    Maybe create a thread for voting on penalty options... in hopes of PD listening/reading/considering... I did say hopes.
    In the event of gaining a position through contact, Instead of ghosting (so unreal) why not just post a notification to give the spot back or face a large time penalty... again, that carries to race end or is served in the pit... ? Cutting track, sorry, serve the penalty at the race end.
    Personally, I believe P1.13 penalties were doing wonders at making races clean... P1.14 relaxed things to the point digression in the racing, and needing to address things yet again with P1.15...
     
  12. Outspacer

    Outspacer

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    So don't risk overtaking anyone, because all they would need to do is nudge you to get the place back!
     
  13. Wasino87

    Wasino87

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    First of all i'm new here, so hello to everyone.
    Just want to say that i'm going like crazy right now.
    Was driving 3 races today and my SR droped from 99 (got this rating almost like forever) to 79, i guess i'm a really clean and fair driver.
    Have to say that i'm new to the DR A class. Had a couple of races the last few days, but everything was fine.
    But the last race today was just ridiculous, was starting from 8th got a slight bumb from behind +1sec penalty. the guy bumped me again, bam +2sec next time he divebombed me and i got a hit at my side from him, after that i got smth like 15 sec penalty.
    i mean this is just crazy, how could this be?
    i'm really frustrated right now and i dont know how to get my SR up to 99 again if the races keep beeing this unfair.
    I did nothing wrong in those 3 races, no breaking to early, no hit to another car from me, didnt push anyone from the track, just ****** nothing....
     
    CTznOfTime likes this.
  14. Sven Jurgens

    Sven Jurgens

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    I just had an incredible race on Monza. The penalty system ruined it though. We made contact in Ascari. I was on the inside fully alongside and he didn't want to concede, I went as far as possible on the kerbs, still contact, penalty, then he brake checked me trying to serve it right after, more seconds for me and we got separated. End of an 8 lap battle and -12 SR, down to 87 from that one incident. He got away with a neutral rating, I guess the one that brake checks still gets off better.
     
    CTznOfTime likes this.
  15. cleanLX

    cleanLX

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    dang-it!
    so many ways to be a jackolantern.
     
    Outspacer likes this.
  16. Jamie Bbbbb

    Jamie Bbbbb

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    614
    I got a couple of insane penalties at Monza today. 10 seconds for gently tapping someone from behind mid-corner at 80mph and giving them a boost if anything. Both times the other guy got 5 seconds.
     
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  17. Sven Jurgens

    Sven Jurgens

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    This is a nice one. He said he slipped on the grass, then tried to give back the position
    [​IMG]
    Instead he gave me 10 sec penalty and massive SR Down.
    He didn't get a penalty as it was a C/S driver.


    And this still isn't fixed either. I was having a great battle for first, followed him close into the pit end of lap 5.
    [​IMG]
    We came out fused, no control over steering and both crashed into the wall, race over, separated after serving penalties and someone else got lucky to take the win.
     
    CTznOfTime likes this.
  18. rcb929

    rcb929

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    Went from S , S rating to A , B rating in maybe like 5 races today in which I got involved in other people's accidents usually into T1. Penalizing the victim in an innocent victim is totally incorrect. It took a long time to get a S , S ratings and only took 1.5 hours to lose a good month's work and races. It wasn't bad many updates ago, not sure why there was a need to change the penalty system.
     
  19. TheGeologist

    TheGeologist

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    This is why I am not a fan of penalizing faster drivers. It makes no sense. If they want to penalize drivers harder than others, shouldn't they do it by Sr, not Dr?
     
  20. Shottah072

    Shottah072

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    894
    They changed the system a while back i believe but didnt run races lately. Got back to some racing this week and i am not sure this is improvement. I had people brake check me on the straights trying to clear their penalty and i got some 1 sec penalty's for some love taps that didnt cause any harm to either driver.
     
  21. Shottah072

    Shottah072

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    894
    Not sure if its because you got pushed but please stay in the pit exit lane till the end. It is there for a reason. I would like PD to implement a penalty for crossing it.
     
    Sven Jurgens likes this.
  22. tps_b86_

    tps_b86_

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    I think he mentioned he had no control upon leaving pits.
     
  23. Shottah072

    Shottah072

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    894
    Ah yes cant believe i missed that. Never mind then :p
     
  24. Sven Jurgens

    Sven Jurgens

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    I fully agree, and I always stay right until I've checked the map and mirror twice. However in the original video my steering input is to the right, while some weird force is pushing us both left.

    It's a known bug when exiting the pit, yet usually you 'only' get a penalty for overlapping on exit. I guess we were so perfectly merged that the collision physics send us both in the same direction. I had hoped this would have been fixed by now, how hard is it to put at least a few feet distance between cars coming out of the pits.
     
    Shottah072 likes this.
  25. Shottah072

    Shottah072

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    894
    Ah oke didnt knew that and cant recall it happening to me. It did look weird though :p

    Still i think putting a penalty for crossing the line should be implemented. Not everyone cares about it and it can cause havoc.
     
  26. Shottah072

    Shottah072

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    894
    Is there a breakdown of the new penalty system anywhere ?

    I read it is different for higher rated drivers now ?

    Also i had the first race ive done with this new system ruined cause i thought i could just cruise the pen off but instead it increased drastically. Since then i try to get rid of them asap. But i still see people finishing with small penalties. Is there a limit or anything ?
     
  27. Sven Jurgens

    Sven Jurgens

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    Well PD has done it. I didn't imagine it was possible yet they made the penalty system blame the victim even more. This is just ridiculous. My last race on Monza cost me 30 SR in one race from the first lap. I started the race in 6th.

    First T1, someone doesn't brake in time, crashes into me, I get a 10 sec penalty, he gets 1 second....
    [​IMG]

    Second, car behind on the outside steers into me, we both get 2 sec penalty, that's pretty basic.
    [​IMG]

    Ascari, car behind dive bombs me and causes me to tap the car in front of me.
    [​IMG]
    I get +5 sec from contact with car behind, he gets 1 sec, plus I get 10 sec from tapping the car in front...
    Result start in last basically and downgraded to SR.A after the race, from 99 to 69.

    Here's the full first lap

    I managed to finish 9th in an otherwise clean race, except for one early braker. Yet no SR Down or penalty for tapping him and he didn't even miss the apex. Maybe he was trying to reduce a penalty before the corner by braking a bit sooner.

    Monza was nice early evening, now it has gone to **** again. Next race disconnected at waiting for other players, hence my post here waiting another half hour to start restoring my SR. At least it disconnected early enough not to cost me more SR and DR....

    Bravo PD, well done!
     
    CTznOfTime likes this.
  28. Sven Jurgens

    Sven Jurgens

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    Penalties are far more severe in DR.A and DR.S.
    In DR.A a penalty greater than 5 sec will start increasing over time
    In DR.B it's 10 sec before it starts increasing over time
     
    Shottah072 likes this.
  29. CTznOfTime

    CTznOfTime

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    i understand they now want to make us extremely clean drivers, and borderline cautious, but based on what you all are describing, this is becoming awful and a nightmare...
     
  30. Shottah072

    Shottah072

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    894
    I am DR S is it 5 sec there as well ?