Makeshift Shuffle - No Tuning RacesOpen 

The good news is now all my cars are faster because I've just oil changed them all. I panic bought and just rushed in last time out!
 
i'm gonna try to get in today.

last night i researched cars between 390-410pp. i came up with a nice list with popular cars. it might be something we can do in the future :)
 
My real car is in inspection / safety bay. I will be along once they finish, should be close to on time, give or take a couple races.

Watermelon, does that bit.ly thing use a www. or http:\\ before it? You had to repeat it often, the visitors did not seem to follow the purpose for it.

Too bad there is not some simple one paragraph of standing info that someone entering a lobby could read. That would be one "pop-up" of customizable text that would be VERY worthwhile, IMHO.
 
yeah maybe I should put the http: slash slash.. Good point.

lightningd
i'm gonna try to get in today.

last night i researched cars between 390-410pp. i came up with a nice list with popular cars. it might be something we can do in the future :)
Click to expand...

Tested? Can you send them to me?
Maybe we can put them on the list to be tested.

I'm in the process of compiling a 4-door list in the ballpark 420pp range.

I have one list I'm testing (of cars in the game that don't get much play but that I find fun)

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/time-trial-testing-mixer-makeshift-shuffle.295260/

And I'm also going to be compiling a list including cars that are in the area of performance of the vintage Muira Bertone. Hopefully some Ferraris & other Lambos.

So this is looking toward in the coming weeks.

I'm really looking for people to help test, so everyone feel free to get involved. 👍

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/time-trial-testing-mixer-makeshift-shuffle.295260/
 
Room #

1472 6681 3716 3555 3465



I've opened the room a bit early.
But I'm just eating my lunch now, fyi. So no rush. We'll start racing about 5 past.
 
ok, just bought all the cars for today. is a room number going to be posted?

watermelon, do you want me to post it on here, or PM you. i also have an idea to add more cars into the mix that might be a cool option
 
Hey guys, I got my own GT6 copy today. Saw melon's room plus shuffle in title, couldn't resist not joining :D

Good to see a lot of GT5 people, though I was surprised to know GT6 doesn't have shuffle, does anyone know if it's planned in future update?

I'll make sure I have all the cars before next event.
 
Ok, so here is my proposed lists. I will explain why there is 2....
I did no testing, just looked at PP in the dealership.

(DEALER/MODEL/PP/COST)

List A:
1) AUDI S3 '02 406 41,070
2) PEUGEOT RCZ '10 407 42,300
3) MAZDA RX-7 GT-X (FC, J) '90 407 24,860
4) MITSUBISHI GALANT 2.0 DOHC Turbo VR-4 '89 408 27,810
5) PEUGEOT 205 Turbo 16 '85 408 78,400
6) FIAT Coupe Turbo Plus '00 409 48,110
7) NISSAN 240SX '96 409 24,980
8) MERC 190 E 2.5 – 16 Evolution II '91 410 67,910
total cost without paint/wheels, 355,440

List B:
1) TOYOTA MR2 G-Limited '97 405 23,600
2) HONDA ACCORD Euro-R '00 406 25,330
3) NISSAN SKYLINE GTS-t Type M (R32) '91 407 26,610
4) TOYOTA 86 GT '12 407 30,000
5) MAZDA RX-8 Type E '03 408 27,500
6) LOTUS Elise '96 409 37,600
7) TRD CELICA TRD Sports M (ZZT231) '00 409 22,500
8) HONDA INTEGRA TYPE R (DC2) '99 410 25,160
total cost without paint/wheels 218,300

List C (list A and B combined)
1) AUDI S3 '02 406 41,070
2) TOYOTA MR2 G-Limited '97 405 23,600
3) PEUGEOT RCZ '10 407 42,300
4) HONDA ACCORD Euro-R '00 406 25,330
5) MAZDA RX-7 GT-X (FC, J) '90 407 24,860
6) NISSAN SKYLINE GTS-t Type M (R32) '91 407 26,610
7) MITSUBISHI GALANT 2.0 DOHC Turbo VR-4 '89 408 27,810
8) TOYOTA 86 GT '12 407 30,000
9) PEUGEOT 205 Turbo 16 '85 408 78,400
10) MAZDA RX-8 Type E '03 408 27,500
11) FIAT Coupe Turbo Plus '00 409 48,110
12) LOTUS Elise '96 409 37,600
13) NISSAN 240SX '96 409 24,980
14) TRD CELICA TRD Sports M (ZZT231) '00 409 22,500
15) MERC 190 E 2.5 – 16 Evolution II '91 410 67,910
16) HONDA INTEGRA TYPE R (DC2) '99 410 25,160

So there's a few scenarios/options with the 2 lists...

1. since money is tight, everyone gets list A first, and do what watermelon has been doing

2. once everyone get's both lists A and B, then...
-----2.1. If more than 8 people are in the room, then do what watermelon has been doing using List C.
-----2.2. If there are 8 or less people are in the room, you do an easy calculation.
----------2.2.1. If your gap from the leader was an odd number (i.e. +0.207) use list A.
----------2.2.2. If your gap from the leader was an even number (i.e +3.588) use list B.
----------(NOTE: if you were the winner, use 2nd's places gap number)

3. If there's a mixed bag, some people only have List A, some have List C.
-----3.1 Those with List C, just follow what's in step 2.
-----3.2 Those with List A:
----------3.2.1. If there are 8 or less people, just use List A like normal
----------3.2.2. If there are more than 8 people:
---------------3.2.2.1. If your finishing position was odd, use List C to find your car.
---------------3.2.2.2. If your finishing position was even, subtract by one, and use List C to find your car.

I think this would create a good bit of variety with some popular cars and different drivetrains. what do you think? overly complicated? lol

EDIT: Sport Hards for tires, since it's >400PP
 
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Sorry about that typo on the room number. :dunce:
Thanks for correcting it.

EVERYBODY WORK ON GETTING THE VINTAGE ROAD CARS LIST.

And also the vintage sports cars list.

Then report here that you have gotten them.

👍

Vintage Road Cars
  1. Autobianchi A112 Abarth '79
  2. Honda Civic 1500 3door CX '79
  3. Marcos Mini Marcos GT '70
  4. Nissan Skyline 2000GT-B (S54A) '67
  5. Mitsubishi Lancer 1600 GSR '74
  6. Honda 1300 Coupe 9 S '70
  7. Volkswagen Golf I GTI '76
  8. Toyota Celica 1600GT (TA22) '70
Comfort Soft Tires
* I think they all come with comfort soft except the Autobianchi you will have to buy comfort softs.

I'm thinking seriously of cutting the Autobianchi & adding back in the Miata 89. OR MAYBE KEEPING BOTH

In which case the list would look like this:
  1. Autobianchi A112 Abarth '79
  2. Honda Civic 1500 3door CX '79
  3. Marcos Mini Marcos GT '70
  4. Nissan Skyline 2000GT-B (S54A) '67
  5. Mitsubishi Lancer 1600 GSR '74
  6. Honda 1300 Coupe 9 S '70
  7. Volkswagen Golf I GTI '76
  8. Toyota Celica 1600GT (TA22) '70
  9. MX-5 Miata (NA) '89


  2. Like today's races Handlebar unfortunately got caught in the sea-saw effect. That unfortunately happens sometimes, and not other times. It's just an effect of who's racing, and how the first race turns out, from what I've seen.
The lists really work out better if there's 1-2 alien drivers from the future who happen to be super fast in the low power cars. (:odd: doodle ahem :odd: ;)) With the rest of the grid made up just a few fairly decent or at least consistent drivers but with more than 2 inconsistent peeps like me. :lol:

It turns out that a lot involved in this are in the fairly consistent average to above average category.
And then so we fall into the problem where just some drivers are not good in some cars, and that's all that it comes down to is luck of the draw, plus some flip flopping. *sigh*

I'm terrible when I get the Megane, I'm totally inconsistent with the Golf, and I don't seem to be able to get the most out of the Seat.
Handlebar seems to make the most out of getting the Seat, but clearly hates the PT Loser :indiff: Not like anyone LIKES the PT (or I don't think so lol), but whereas Kling tends to do pretty well on average in the PT Cruiser :boggled: Some actually seem to be able to get more out of the PT Cruiser.

If you look at the race results for each race, you will see that not everyone does well in the Seat.
It certainly does not guarantee most people a win.
And some people have done quite well in the PT Cruiser. I think Kling once won a race in the PT Cruiser.

lightningd
I did no testing, just looked at PP in the dealership.
Click to expand...
Not to poopy on your parade, but that's a recipe for disgruntlement. And if you're not putting slower drivers in consistently faster cars on average (like the calculation made in the shuffle algorithm), you're going to wind up with people way out ahead, or way out behind.
The idea of shuffle is to keep a variety of racers together close in the race.

That PEUGEOT 205 Turbo 16 '85 is a wonderfully fun car but half the people involved here would wind up having miserable races with it competing against the other cars in that list.
Just sayin'.

Or at least that's the idea with this club.
In other words, this is not just about mixed model racing. It's about a system to allow a variety of people to join in, and still have close exciting races.

PP tells you very little, other than where to start out.
I guarantee if you did some laps on the same tracks with those lists of cars, you'd be looking at far greater differences than between the cars on these lists (which we have tested with several drivers - see post#1 to see the list of the people who tested).
It's no accident these cars are so close.

And it would be really bad if the car assignment kept putting people who finish in the front in faster cars, and people who finish in the back in slower cars. You'd wind up with people getting lapped on Grand Valley East in 4 laps. :scared: :ill:

Here's an example of the testing:

Blick Auf Das Schloss (Eifel Circuit) (2.15 miles) (custom gt5 track)
(this track had a lot of sweeping straight bits & a long s/f straight)

01:31.430 - Mazda MX-5 Miata (NA) '89 - GTsail2
01:32.502 - Volkswagen Golf I GTI '76 - GTsail2
01:33.015 - Mazda MX-5 Miata (NA) '89 - Audiman2011
01:33.726 - Toyota Celica 1600GT (TA22) '70 - Audiman2011
01:33.726 - Toyota Celica 1600GT (TA22) '70 - GTsail2
01:33.800 - Mitsubishi Lancer 1600 GSR '74 - Audiman2011
01:33.923 - Mazda MX-5 Miata (NA) '89 - watermelonpunch
01:34.005 - Mitsubishi Lancer 1600 GSR '74 - GTsail2
01:34.170 - Volkswagen Golf I GTI '76 - Audiman2011
01:34.920 - Honda 1300 Coupe 9 S '70 - GTsail2
01:35.049 - Mitsubishi Lancer 1600 GSR '74 - watermelonpunch
01:35.113 - Nissan Skyline 2000GT-B (S54B) '67 - Audiman2011
01:35.213 - Nissan Skyline 2000GT-B (S54A) '67 - watermelonpunch
01:35.289 - Volkswagen Golf I GTI '76 - watermelonpunch
01:35.365 - Nissan Skyline 2000GT-B (S54B) '67 - GTsail2
01:35.434 - Toyota Celica 1600GT (TA22) '70 - watermelonpunch
01:35.571 - Honda 1300 Coupe 9 S '70 - Audiman2011
01:35.807 - Honda 1300 Coupe 9 S '70 - watermelonpunch
01:36.493 - Honda Civic 1500 3door CX '79 - Audiman2011
01:36.811 - Honda Civic 1500 3door CX '79 - GTsail2
01:36.958 - Marcos Mini Marcos GT '70 - Audiman2011
01:37.193 - Marcos Mini GT '70 - GTsail2
01:39.180 - Honda Civic 1500 3door CX '79 - watermelonpunch
01:39.251 - Marcos Mini Marcos GT '70 - watermelonpunch


The Commuter cars, I'd originally started with a list of 18 cars, but had to get rid of most of them because they were hugely inconsistent depending on the track or driver.

Not to keep harping on this, but I'd like to get more people involved in testing these cars:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/time-trial-testing-mixer-makeshift-shuffle.295260/
There's not a heated deadline! We'll probably leave the time trial open for some weeks or close to a month perhaps. So you can do it little by little. You don't need to spend 2 hours at once testing all the cars on the same day. :lol: :scared:

But we really need a range of different people to test the cars on a couple different tracks, to get a large enough sample so the testing provides data that is statistically significant in indicating the average performance of the cars.

💡
(I'm going to add the PP #s to the time trials, so as to demonstrate how indicative the PP is to average performance on a number of tracks with different drivers. )

I'll likely post a 2nd list of the 4 door cars once I've tested them to weed out any outlier crazies.

I really do try to get rid of the ones that are wildly inconsistent.

For example, I'd originally included the Alfa Romeo Giulia Sprint GTA 1600 '65 in the Vintage Road Cars list. I've cut that because it's too wildly dependent on who's driving it.

Chariots of Boop (Toscana tarmac) (gt5 custom track)

01:41.588 - Alfa Romeo Giulia Sprint GTA 1600 '65 - Audiman2011
01:43.636 - Alfa Romeo Giulia Sprint GTA 1600 '65 - watermelonpunch
01:45.831 - Autobianchi A112 Abarth '79 - Audiman2011
01:46.011 - Volkswagen Golf I GTI '76 - John Wells
01:52.057 - Autobianchi A112 Abarth '79 - watermelonpunch
01:54.705 - Alfa Romeo Giulia Sprint GTA 1600 '65 - John Wells

Handlebar
It was a HUGE help when drivers had all the cars and had actually written them down in order ahead of time...

Just sayin'...
Click to expand...

I totally agree. And I've tried to encourage that!
Don't most of you guys have ipads or smartphones or whatever the heck to bring up the list in front of you in your cockpit or couch or whatever? :lol:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...here-you-make-peak-power.294282/#post-9106404
:lol:
As you can see, I use paper and pen. I'm OLD SKOOOL. :sly:

Oddly, I went back & was able to watch 2 replays that previously had hung & I couldn't watch. But then on another day, I was able to watch them.
But just now, I tried to watch today's replays, and only 1 played - the 2 other I tried froze the ps3.
So it's not replay specific. :boggled:
In other words, it's not the particular replay itself that causes the problem. Or else the one that wouldn't play days ago, wouldn't have played for me yesterday.
Now I'm thinking I'll try to watch today's tomorrow or something. :crazy:
 
nickg07
Thats a good liat of cars fun and fairly quick. Better than we've been using. The integra might be too fast though.
Click to expand...
I should mention you guys... You probably may not realize this, but in GT5, I always held this shuffle club room:

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...omptu-casual-shuffle-racing-vcrc-mcrc.261562/

So if you're wondering. :lol:

(I'm the low power race host around here. ;))

I always stayed away from the 400 to 460 pp range for 2 reasons:
1) I don't really like the cars in that range.
2) you'd always wind up with some people getting 4wd cars winning all the time, with others getting spinny cars or cars that hit the limiter. :ill:


Oh and I just noticed more problems...
Examples...
The RX-8 is one of the best handling well-behaved cars in that list. Almost any driver on any track would do pretty consistent driving in that car.
Whereas I said before half of any group of average drivers would be off-roading at some point in the Peugeot.
The MR-2, in the hands of the right driver (like one likely to come in 2nd?) could do well. Others would be left in the dust in the MR2.

List C (list A and B combined)
1) AUDI S3 '02 406 41,070
2) TOYOTA MR2 G-Limited '97 405 23,600
3) PEUGEOT RCZ '10 407 42,300
4) HONDA ACCORD Euro-R '00 406 25,330
5) MAZDA RX-7 GT-X (FC, J) '90 407 24,860
6) NISSAN SKYLINE GTS-t Type M (R32) '91 407 26,610
7) MITSUBISHI GALANT 2.0 DOHC Turbo VR-4 '89 408 27,810
8) TOYOTA 86 GT '12 407 30,000
9) PEUGEOT 205 Turbo 16 '85 408 78,400
10) MAZDA RX-8 Type E '03 408 27,500
11) FIAT Coupe Turbo Plus '00 409 48,110
12) LOTUS Elise '96 409 37,600
13) NISSAN 240SX '96 409 24,980
14) TRD CELICA TRD Sports M (ZZT231) '00 409 22,500
15) MERC 190 E 2.5 – 16 Evolution II '91 410 67,910
16) HONDA INTEGRA TYPE R (DC2) '99 410 25,160
 
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the Seat is an overdog. it has 50pp more than the other cars. it was 4-5 seconds a lap faster than the other cars. that is just stupid and not fun for me. Seat won every race someone drove it. it was always the Seat way ahead, then a pack of great racing from 2nd place on. I am very experienced and can drive all the cars fast.

i love that '85 Turbo, and won a bunch of races in GT5 with it.

it was hard to do 1000 hrs of testing in 1 hr last night. sorry, i should have put more effort into it.
 
lightningd I'm sorry you're upset, but honestly, the cars in the Commuter Cars list are FAR closer together in performance than the cars we used in shuffle in GT5.

Also, you're perfectly welcome to start your own league with your own idea & system. 👍 💡

If you are dissatisfied and not having a good time, it could be that this particular format is not your cup of tea.

I did not win every time I got the Seat. Nor did many others who got the seat.
Indeed, I haven't won at all.

If you wish to disparage me, or others for that, then this is NOT the club for you. 👎 👎

I made it clear that this is the deal here. And that anyone was welcome to steal my ideas & use them in whatever way they see fit.
I'd be only too happy to see others make successful series where people enjoy themselves doing the kind of racing driving the kind of cars they like. 👍
 
The biggest advantage the Seat gave me was on straights, just as the PT was a comparative dog on the alternates.

While the Seat is an Overdog, going doubles on car redistribution (like at Nurb) once we have 9 drivers, or when there is clear driver diff - like doodle - may be a way to tighten the field.

Ymmv
 
Handlebar
when there is clear driver diff - like doodle
Click to expand...

MY mileage definitely varies when there's a doodle!
But then he's more than 20 years younger than me apparently. So unless I start injecting myself with monkey hormones, :lol:, I guess it's not that surprising.
 
Yeah, we have several guys in SNAIL who were fast enough for GT Academy but not old enough.

I was old enough (and enough, and... Enough some more) but nowhere near fast enough. Enough said.

=};-{D#
 
Man, I guess you never got one of the old vintage muscle cars at Monza in shuffle. :lol:


Well this is an example of a grid in my Lo PP Shuffle in GT5 (a very popular always near capacity shuffle lobby):

20120821lemons03s.jpg


Mazda2, Miata, Swift, Alfa Romeo Spider 66, Lupo, March, Yaris, Alfa Romeo Special 63,
Isuzu 117coupe, Honda 1300 Coupe... all in the same race. (Sometimes a Cosmo would get thrown in there.)
 
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