GTPNewsWire
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This is the discussion thread for a recent post on GTPlanet:
This article was published by Andrew Evans (@Famine) on December 9th, 2019 in the Automotive News category.
McLaren's 620R is a $325,000, Road-Legal GT4 Race Car
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Chikane_GTR
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What a waste of money when for 150k you can get a dodge viper 2017 acr that would smoke this car on any track.
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- ZedNinetySix &
But can you drive to a racerrack and race in an official GT4 class race with only a tyre swap to slicks? That would validate this car reminiscent to yhose classic 60's racing cars which were driven to the track before the race!
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- evildave333
I must apologise ive bought all 350 of them and im not sharing lol
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Danoff
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Why would you want to do that?
I'm much less impressed with the raceability of McLarens after hearing about one particular failure mode in which coolant leaks inside the front end, and then upon going around a turn dumps coolant directly in front of the most loaded tire, resulting a serious off-track, and change of pants. This happened to a friend of mine in his 720s. Significant damage.
McLaren
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Well, R.I.P. to the values of those 10 special edition MSO X cars that were supposed to be like a street-legal 570S GT4 race car, but retained creature comforts. They've been trading hands at around $330-350,000 due their rarity, but now that McLaren is building 350 examples of an actual street-legal 570S GT4 at $300,000, what's the point in buying one; they're gussied up 570S' where as this is the real deal.
But, McLaren has been shooting its used values in the foot by constantly by producing more cars than demand would appear, so I guess it isn't surprising that 1 of the few models out there that has a chance to retain some value (MSO Xs have lost around $30-40,000 so far compared to MSRP) could now be affected by the factory producing a more-available model of the same concept at a much cheaper price. Those who want the creature comforts of the MSO X compared to the 620R are just going to buy a $190,000 570S.
But, McLaren has been shooting its used values in the foot by constantly by producing more cars than demand would appear, so I guess it isn't surprising that 1 of the few models out there that has a chance to retain some value (MSO Xs have lost around $30-40,000 so far compared to MSRP) could now be affected by the factory producing a more-available model of the same concept at a much cheaper price. Those who want the creature comforts of the MSO X compared to the 620R are just going to buy a $190,000 570S.
It's a mixed bag. There have been some issues, but there's also plenty of owners who swear by their cars. Realistically, if you're after a road-going McLaren but you're concerned about the split of reliability claims in the owner-base, the 675LT is the car to buy. That car has been bullet-proof and safe from reliability issues. They're daily drivable despite its hardcore appearance, and the car is rare enough to see a rise in market value eventually.
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- ZedNinetySix &
My original question was never answered, only replied with something totally unrelated to my question.
Does anyone know if you can drive it to a GT4 series and have it legally compete as it is? Is that the vision of this project?
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McLaren
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Some cars are exempt from mileage heavily affecting value. Out of the 1,000 made, there's roughly only around 20-30 available worldwide at a time. Options are what typically affect the 675LT's value more than anything.
For current instance, here are 3 of the cheapest UK Coupe examples available: '16 w/ 14,200 miles - £187,990, '15 w/ 4,900 miles - £189,000, '15 w/ 300 miles - £199,990. As they rise in value, mileage continues to vary anywhere from a few hundred, to thousands. The current top spec. example is a Spider w/ 2,000 miles asking £419,550 b/c it has a full MSO catalogue of options.
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- SpacedustDaddy
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- GTP_Famine
No, you can't. That essentially boils down to the roll cage. Although it's not strictly necessary for a McLaren to have one from a safety point of view, it very much is necessary for it to meet the rules and thus GT4-class homologation. The 620R does not have one and thus meets neither the rules nor the homologation form of the 570S GT4 - it would have to be re-homologated and it wouldn't pass.
It doesn't have one because they are ludicrously dangerous in road cars, and almost certainly would not meet type approval for road homologation if it did. A safety cage is essentially intended to function with all other safety equipment (including helmet/HANS) to protect the occupant within a defined structure that forms a safety cell. Without a helmet, a safety cage is blunt force skull trauma during an accident - it's actually a reduction in the safety space for the occupants, and just waiting for a head to strike it as you flop about.
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- ZedNinetySix &
Ah, thats a shame... This car doesnt have much purpose then...
Would've been cool to have everything up to regulations as standard and simply drive to a GT4 race event and compete in it with just a tyre change like the 60's...
Would've been cool to have everything up to regulations as standard and simply drive to a GT4 race event and compete in it with just a tyre change like the 60's...
Danoff
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As I said earlier... why is that cool?
Silver Arrows
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Because people love deifying an earlier age in racing, when *real* men raced, and they hauled them in open trailers to the track, completely forgetting that for 90% of racing that goes beyond short track/SCCA club events, that simply can't happen. It's the typical nostalgia for the past.
Plus, why would one, who presumably would want to use a McLaren for GT4 racing and has the funds to pick, go with the one that is more or less always going to be typecasted as a rich man's track toy, instead of, y'know, the real thing?
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- ZedNinetySix &
You're missing the point, its not about nostalgia, I was speaking from a regulations point of view, back in the mid 60's, the endurance sportscars of the time had to be road legal by regulation to compete in many events, even for cars such as the GT40, 330P4(rather extreme examples tbf) and others, especially in America and Italy, and due to this, you had many racedeivers who literally drove that same car to the track and raced it, as they were road legal but also primarily designed to race.
Case in point, you didnt need a trailer or a big rig towing your cars and equipment to the track, when you could just drive the very car you are racing to the track, towing a small trailer of equipment, or even in the car entirely, which is why breadvan style racecars were not uncommon back then.
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- SpacedustDaddy
As a further point, aren't WRC cars road legal?
Mentioned by FAmine, the roll cage without a helmet is the main caveat for any purchaser. Next, would be the other points about homologation, etc. I feel it would be cool if an owner were able to drive it to the race, participate and drive it home. I feel it would add more value to the car, just because it COULD be done. Doesn't have to be for nostalgia's sake.
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- ZedNinetySix &
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We drive our cars from the road into the circuit in Germany as part of a parade. It's slow and steady until we get to the circuit, and even then the tires are cool. In terms of performance, the line between a GT4 and a modified road car is very blurry (deliberately) so driving off with a number plate isn't really that special and nobody else at the track cares if you do. There are currently many teams that run their cars on the road and to the circuit. Nobody thinks you're cool for doing it and nobody thinks you're a 'boss' in your road car. If you're there to race, then the track is what matters. Anything and everything outside of those gates is irrelevant come the weekend.
That being said, this car is silly. It's not catered towards the serious GT4 competitor. It's a niche market for people who want a McLaren to drive on the road and something they can take out on a track day - but having driven some of the brand's latest offerings, I don't see how a GT4 variant would compliment how it rides on the road, nor would it have anything to add to how much fun you can have on a circuit. If you want to race in a GT4 series and you have that much money laying around on such an odd car, then chances are you'd go for a series car anyway.
This is a very niche car, but having more options is never a bad thing.
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- SpacedustDaddy
That's the whole point of this small part of the discussion.
Anyway, I don't know if any McLaren owners asked the question about a GT4 car for the street. Not sure if any one McLaren owner's question, was answered with this car.
Is something like the Ferrari F40 closer to a competition car than what this McLaren is? A VIPER ACR? Ford Shelby Mustang GT350R? Are those race cars for the street? Would be just as much of a waste as this 620R.
Danoff
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I don't get it. I especially don't get it at this price point.
Maybe when you're competing on some kind of low-rent race, where you want to be able to pull up in your General Lee and win a race, and then take the same car and run moonshine, and outrun the law and angry fathers, then sure...
But there are so many reasons why it's better to trailer your track car to and from the track. So many. Also, I love the ridiculous idea that it's somehow easier to change out a set of tires at the track than it is to bring your track car on a trailer and not change the tires (and pads probably). I mean, where were you going to put 4 racing tires? In the trunk?
It's such a strange thing that car-guys seem to value for absolutely mind-boggling reasons. The idea that it's somehow better to drive your track car on the road, and if possible, to rely on it for transportation to/from a track day. Blows me away how pervasive this notion is.
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This is the great McLaren conundrum. Does McLaren consistently making some of the best driver's cars on the roads make up for a relentless model schedule that immediately makes each and every one of those models obsolete? Can you buy any McLaren safe in the knowledge that in six months McLaren won't have released something even better?
I mean, I could. I've driven a few of the things and can't imagine wanting any more than a 570GT. But collector types must be steaming.
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