*** New Corvette Z06 ***

[TheCracker]

Seriously, what qualifies as "same" or "similar" for you? All race cars have different trannies. The Chassis is the same (and what's this crap about passenger structure? You obviously haven't seen the vette's chassis--it's all the same structure), the suspension is VERY similar--they use coils instead of the leaves to make it easier to change them out for different races, but the rest is pretty close to the same. Of course a 700+ hp car needs a different fuel delivery system. Different electronics? Well, since power seats, A/C, nav, and a 6 disc CD changer aren't options on a C6R, I'd say you're right there, too. And WHAT INTERIOR? Its a RACE CAR! the interior consists of a driver's seat!

WTF! - the suspension is so VERY similar - that its completely different?, not only are the pickup points changed, all the componants changed and the parts they are connected too - uprights, calipers, disks, wheels, tyres all different - but now you inform me that they don't even use remotely similar styles of spring either!

So apart from them having the same/completely different suspension - you basically now agree with me. Good, i'm glad we've cleared up your nieve view on racing cars.

I thought you were talking about my comment saying most people here that own Jags are Ford Brass. I think people don't like them because they always seem to have problems and the amount they cost I guess they don't want to tolerate it.

Unless i'm very much mistaken, North America is the largest market for Aston, Jag, Land & Range Rover, Bentley and Rolls Royce - i know these companies are now American and German owned - but they are still designed and mostly built in the UK, and are traditionally UK companies.

 

[Pebb]

Ok I only got 1 photo of the new Z06 at Goodwood FOS and here it is:

 

[Dave A]

Twerbos on a 5.3L V8 and it only produces 550hp? Now that sounds like a bunch of marketing bull**** to me.

Thats what it produces, and no it's not turbo'd, it's supercharged. And Aston happens to be one of the finest car makers on the planet, name something from the US that has more class. You do realise that Aston's are LUXURY cars don't you, and luxury cars are heavy because of all the luxury items in them so quit stirring **** because you're gonna turn this thread into a UK cars v US cars flam war.

 

[FAOLIU05]

Holy crap! A 'Vette buff arguing a point of specific power output? I never thought I'd see the day...

It's supercharged, not turbocharged, so that all 550hp and all of the 600lbft is available all of the time with no lag. They're for driveability, not extreme power.

Thats Twin Superchargers.

Didn't know that. But its still an ASS-TON.

 

[Famine]

Twin superchargers? No, really?

Stupid Ass-ton's? Like the 550HP Twin supercharged V8 Vantage?...That's an ass-ton...And Is still a beast..

 

[FAOLIU05]

Oh he ****'in said Twin Turbochargers.

 

[Jay]

Well his original post (Driftster's) shows no sign of editing.

 

[FAOLIU05]

There's a number of my posts which show no signs editing.

 

[Pebb]

Anyone can use my photo as a wallpaper if you want.

 

[Famine]

It's supercharged, not turbocharged,

Thats what it produces, and no it's not turbo'd, it's supercharged.

Whatever, FAOLIU05.

It clearly read "supercharger" last night, as did Live4Speed's post and mine (which you quoted), all of which occurred before your bombshell.

 

[skicrush]

I thought we were done with this. But I'm afraid I'm not the one being naive here.

WTF! - the suspension is so VERY similar - that its completely different?, not only are the pickup points changed, all the componants changed and the parts they are connected too - uprights, calipers, disks, wheels, tyres all different - but now you inform me that they don't even use remotely similar styles of spring either!

So apart from them having the same/completely different suspension - you basically now agree with me. Good, i'm glad we've cleared up your nieve view on racing cars.

Did I say something in a different thread that pissed you off? If I was bragging on a Monte Carlo because it's in NASCRAP, that would be one thing. This situation is comepletly different. But I dont' know the first thing about NASCRAP (or "PRO" (FAKE) wrestling, for that matter, because they're both utter CRAP). I wouldn't mind seeing where you're getting your info from, since I haven't been able to find any kind of detailed info on the C6R suspension setup other than what the corvetteracing website puts up. I mean, the people that set up the suspension for the Z06 (Pratt & Miller) certainly don't have any connection to the corvette racing program.

SO, I still FAIL to see how the Corvette program DOESN'T materially benefit from the racing program.

Like the C5-R before it, the Corvette C6.R starts from production roots: the same hydroformed frame rails that roll down the assembly line at the Corvette plant in Bowling Green , Kentucky are sourced for the structure of the race car. With the new C6 production model measuring shorter in overall length (but with a longer wheelbase), race car engineers faced a new set of numbers in which to achieve their goals to make the car faster on the 180-mph Mulsanne Straight at Le Mans and other high-speed circuits.

The phrase "technology transfer" has never been more appropriate than when used to describe the matched set of Corvette C6.R and Corvette Z06. Lessons learned on the track have benefited the Z06, just as GM's vast resources have enriched the C6.R race car. Both cars are powered by 7-liter small-block V-8 engines with dry-sump lubrication systems, CNC-ported cylinder heads, titanium valves and connecting rods, forged steel crankshafts, and plate-honed cylinder bores. While the components and specifications of the street and competition engines are tailored to their specific environments, the thought process behind them is identical.

Are they IDENTICAL Ti valves, connecting rods, IDENTICAL crank? No, I'll give you that much. Each is tailored to live in its environment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet_Corvette#C6
Taken as a whole, the C6 Z06 is very similar to its race-going variant, the C6-R, much more so than the C5 Z06 was to the C5-R.

Found at http://forums.beyond.ca/showthread/t-70722.htmlThat same 427 is slated to continue in the C6R, but thanks to the much closer relationship between road and race trim demanded by new FIA/ACO/ALMS rules, the roadgoing Z06 will get its own 427 (Mat-motor? Rouse-motor?) for 2006. The numbers are nothing short of staggering: a full 500 horses at 6200 rpm, 475 lbs-ft @ 4800, a sub-four 0-60 dash, and quarter-mile sprints in under 12 seconds—a set of bogus plates and a false identity card would be nice additions to the glovebox. Despite being essentially a re-thought race motor, this new Z06 mill (called LS7 by GM) also promises remarkable tractability, thanks to receiving the same level of engine-management attention given its junior cousins.

While its exterior dimensions and general layout are shared with the LS2, the new LS7 is based on a separate block casting and assembled by hand at GM's new Performance Build Center in Wixom MI. The punched-out aluminum block carries lightweight titanium conrods attached to aluminum flat-top pistons giving 11.0:1 compression. Six-bolt, CNC-machined, forged-steel main caps are needed to keep the assembly together.

CNC machining is also utilized on the new aluminum heads, which boast an 18% improvement in airflow over LS2 units. Nearly straight tunnel-like intake runners feed the air/fuel charge through huge 2.2-inch titanium intake valves while 1.62-inch, sodium-filled hollow exhaust valves let spent gasses back out. A hydraulic-roller cam provides a significant .591-inch lift, even before taking into account the super-high-ratio rocker arms.

As on the C6R's race engine, hydroformed four-into-one tubular headers carry the exhaust from the heads, after which it's routed into a model-unique set of catalytic converters and dual-mode mufflers. The latter include a vacuum-operated valve that stays closed at low revs to manage noise and opens at larger throttle angles for minimum backpressure. The engine is lubricated by racing-style dry-sump oiling, which ensures complete lubrication under all cornering loads. Despite the massive displacement, lightweight internals give the LS7 a 7000-rpm redline in roadgoing trim—a figure more commonly associated with multivalve twincam Fours than traditional pushrod V8s.

So, like I said, I'm pretty light on info about the suspension setup. Care to share your source? Or is it going to be the same story as the engine? Same components, just tuned differently for their different environments?

 

[TheCracker]

I'm not having a go at you skicrush, i just think you're reading too much into GM's marketing hype - its such an old trick.

here's a picture of them both together - i know its not a great piccy but its all i can find.

 

[FAOLIU05]

all of which occurred before your bombshell.

Yeeeeeeeaah... my bombshell... 👎

Lets just keep going on and on about it, because you know how thats productive and benefitial to the thread.

I saw what I saw... I'm leaving it at that.

 

[Famine]

Bearing in mind I quoted you verbatim the other day, then you edited it out and called me a liar I couldn't give a rat's ass what you saw.

 

[skicrush]

I'm not having a go at you skicrush, i just think you're reading too much into GM's marketing hype - its such an old trick.

here's a picture of them both together - i know its not a great piccy but its all i can find.

They do NOT look near as similar as I thought they should. Interesting.

I completely understand where you're coming from. I'm certain VERY FEW parts are actually interchangable between the 2 cars. But with the exception of the MC12 (which pretty much IS the race car), I think the Z06 has benefitted from the factory racing program (both the C5R from a lessons learned/parts developed POV and the C6R from homologation issues) more than any other car on the road. Is it marketing? Yes, the whole racing program is a marketing tool. In fact, I think GM could do a lot more to promote the success of the corvette racing pgm than they have. But is it all just marketing? No, I think the Z06 has tangibly benefitted in quite a few ways from it. I think its performance will be just below the Carrera GT and Enzo (MC12), which are more or less road legal purpose built race cars, and that this performance is a testament to its relationship with the race program.

 

[///M-Spec]

Yeeeeeeeaah... my bombshell... 👎

Lets just keep going on and on about it, because you know how thats productive and benefitial to the thread.

I saw what I saw... I'm leaving it at that.

Bearing in mind I quoted you verbatim the other day, then you edited it out and called me a liar I couldn't give a rat's ass what you saw.

I don't think there's a single doubt in my mind regarding Famine's trustworthiness. If someone here is lying, I know who it isn't.



M

 

[Joey D]

Unless i'm very much mistaken, North America is the largest market for Aston, Jag, Land & Range Rover, Bentley and Rolls Royce - i know these companies are now American and German owned - but they are still designed and mostly built in the UK, and are traditionally UK companies.

I don't buy this to much, I know I live in Michigan and we are into the big 2 but I rarely see those cars. Except in Bloomfield Hills and most people that own them, Jags at least, are Ford Motor Company brass. But I wouldn't call them a UK influcenced companies. Look at what happened to Chysler when DB bought em. There designs were strongly changed.

But like I said living in Michigan things are different.

 

[skicrush]

I don't think there's a single doubt in my mind regarding Famine's trustworthiness. If someone here is lying, I know who it isn't.



M

I hate to be the one to break the news, but there are several of us who have been reading the thread the whole time. Besides the fact that it would be INCREDIBLY unlikely that both Live4speed and Famine would both misread the same post in the same way. Besides the fact that I edited my post above to correct the html tags three times before it said it was edited. I'm just saying that is all a bit of a stretch, and this isn't the Jackson Jury.

 

[Dave A]

I think we just need to get back to the topic and find another direction for discussion before this gets out of hand.

 

[svtsnake]

I wouldn't go that far.
There are alot of European users on here. Alot.

im pretty sure if vettes are expensive in europe, then porsche are also expensive there.

2nd, a Porsche can hold its own at even the $80K point.

The fastest Porsche according to your addition ($95K) is the 911 Carrera 4S Cabriolet.

the 80k porsche you talk about can hold its own againt a normal c6 vette.
the 911 4s will get smoked by a z06.

And about $20K more and you get the 911 Turbo. Both these cars have been out for years though, so I don't know the equality of comparing a brand new sports car to cars quite a bit older.

'01 z06 with 385hp driven by steve millen around thunderhill.
vs '01 porsche 911 turbo 415hp also driven by steve millen
z06 still achieved a faster time.

only car to edge out the z06 was a Ferrari 360 Modena.

 

[Swift]

I still wonder why there is so much comparison with the Vette and the 911. They are aimed at totally different markets. Well, not totally different, but pretty different.

Most people that can afford a Porche aren't considering a Chevy. Likewise, the people that go for vettes generally aren't considering the Porche.

I guess it's a fun comparision, but kinda pointless. I would thing the Viper/Z06 comparision would be consistant.

 

[Dave A]

The 911 is far more everyday than a Z06, it even supposedly has rear seats. I see TVR as an interesting comparison, because if the Corvette was British and TVR was American the majority or people would be on different sides now. TVR use the principle of a raw drivers car built for performance only, which is something that many Americans I've spoken to like in a car, yet you bring up Corvette v TVR comparisons, and the same people that say they prefer a sports/supercar to be a proper sports/supercar not one that tries to be usable at the same time argue that as a plus point about the Vette. I'm not saying anyone heres done that, but my point is they both offer an appeal to similar audiences on their respective side of the pond because they both offer high levels of performance for relatively small ammounts of money.

And svtsnake, why would the fact that Vettes are expensive over here mean Porsches would be expensive over here since Vettes are American and Porsches are European? I'm not saying Porsches are cheap over here, but you're reasoning needs working on.

 

[Driftster]

On the note of the Viper/Vette Comparo.... Are there any substantial differences in performance when speaking of the Viper Conv. Vs the Viper Coupe...Considering in ANY other car there is usually a large margain(asside from the C12). And if a Viper Conv. gives a Vette a run for it's money driving skill asside, what about the coupe..

 

[Joey D]

The Vette is pretty much on par with the Viper, you just get better fuel economy with the Vette and you don't have to drive a Dodge.

 

[Driftster]

You mean... Except you don't GET to drive a dodge..

 

[Joey D]

No I mean you DON'T have to drive a Dodge. I've never been a Viper fan, sure they look cool but I thought they were a little over done. Just like most Dodges. Overdone.

 

[///M-Spec]

I hate to be the one to break the news, but there are several of us who have been reading the thread the whole time. Besides the fact that it would be INCREDIBLY unlikely that both Live4speed and Famine would both misread the same post in the same way. Besides the fact that I edited my post above to correct the html tags three times before it said it was edited. I'm just saying that is all a bit of a stretch, and this isn't the Jackson Jury.

What? Did you misread my post or something? I think I made it clear whom I would believe, if it came down to his word: he happens to be quoted in my sig.


M

 

[svtsnake]

And svtsnake, why would the fact that Vettes are expensive over here mean Porsches would be expensive over here since Vettes are American and Porsches are European? I'm not saying Porsches are cheap over here, but you're reasoning needs working on.

since yes the vette has cheap plastic interior, and the porsche (911 to be exact) is a luxury sports car, i would assume it would be more expensive.
vette expensive = shipping costs/taxes
porsche expensive = luxury sports car/taxes/shipping costs (not saying that shipping would be as expensive as vette, but both will have a destination charge no matter what.

 

[Gabkicks]

well. it also costs more because its a porsche The badge adds on a few thousand.

 

[Driftster]

Well I think Vettes are VERY expensive overseas, I don't know possitively though. But I remember a particular driver interview with the C5-R drivers wishing they had a Corvette of their own... And no, not speaking of the C5-R