Official 2011/12 Barclays Premier League Thread

Discussion in 'Sports' started by iScoRcHv, Jul 21, 2011.

  1. Ross

    Ross Premium

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    And you can also add Sir Matt Busby to that list. I don't know if anyone has been in charge of any club in any country in any league longer than Sir Alex Ferguson has though. (26 years this September)
     
  2. Liquid

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    Mickey Evans was manager of Caersws between 1983-2007, and has been again since 2009 giving him 27 years so far...
     
  3. Ross

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    That's overall but I was talking about longest running in one stint.
     
  4. Liquid

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    The Internet says Fred Everiss was secretary-manager of West Brom for 46 years, 1902-1948, in an era where today's use of the word 'manager' was not the same as back then. But for all intents and purposes, it's still the same thing.
     
  5. Ross

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    That is certainly as long time and it just shows how football has changed as that was back in the first half of the 20th century. Managers now are lucky to get away with 1 year in charge.
     
  6. Liquid

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    Ferguson, Wenger and Moyes are the only managers in the top four divisions who have been in their posts more than 10 years.

    John Still is the next candidate, 8 years 1 month at Dagenham & Redbridge.

    Then there's a bit of a drop-off; Tony Pulis (Stoke), Paul Tisdale (Exeter) and Terry Brown (Wimbledon) have had 5 years, Kenny Jackett (Millwall) has had 4 years then Harry Redknapp is the 9th longest serving manager; 3 years 8 months at Tottenham.

    Which really shows how much time, and indeed how many managers, have passed.
     
  7. Ross

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    It seems Famine has a rival for knowledge. But yes, that does show how the times have changed. And with the 9th Ranking manger lasting only just over 3 and a half years, I can see why no one really wants managerial jobs any more.
     
  8. Liquid

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    Rome wasn't built in a day but chairmen know better, it seems.

    And I can't mention that phrase without;

    The best in my opinion. Followed by Ferguson.
     
  9. Emptyone

    Emptyone

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    Grant Holt has handed in a transfer request at Norwich. Clearly he thinks he's worthy of bigger and better things than the canaries. Also, Aston Villa have approached Skolsjaer about the job, given his impressive season at Molde.
     
  10. Liquid

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    He's 31. I suppose it's make or break; he's in the Premiership now and a transfer request might be his only chance to play for a really big club. But what team bigger than Norwich needs him? Fulham and West Brom perhaps. Everton might be a decent shout but they probably wouldn't have the money.

    It's strange when I think of all the players I've actually seen in the lower leagues who have gone on to better things. Grant Holt was one of them. Played well.

    Given the 'undisclosed' transfer fees, I'm not surprised they won.

    Villa would be a major challenge for anybody, especially a rookie like Solskjaer. Not much money and a poor squad.
     
  11. Emptyone

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    Everton have just got Jelavic, but the other two could need reinforcing. However, his age isn't helpful, but he has transitioned well from lower divisions.

    Solskjaer was a rookie. Man city proved for a couple of years money can buy you absolutely nothing. Clearly he had some part to play in their triumph. It might be a little early for him to move away. Though he can't stay at Molde forever if he has any managerial ambitions ...
     
  12. Liquid

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    Blackburn, Chelsea and Manchester City have proved that you can buy the league. Eventually.

    It'd be nice to see OGS do well, but it could be a step too soon after one season in Norway. Another season outside the top 10 would be agony for the Villa fans. Could Solskjaer take them back into Europe straight away? I don't think so. Could any realistic candidate? I don't think so on that, either.
     
  13. Emptyone

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    Villa have underlying problems. Solskjaer needs to build his managerial career, not just hop into Villa, and i agree, I'm not sure anyone could work much magic there. Top 10 is feasible, but the quality of the teams in and around the european places means without re-investment they will be floundering in the middle ground for a while. But someone needs to get them into that middle ground first and away from practically being relegated like this season. Not a job many would want.

    Oh and Brendon Rodgers has rejected the Liverpool talks. That's one man scratched off the list anyway.
     
  14. Liquid

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    (Liverpool are talking to Martinez anyway)

    Villa's current squad wouldn't get near 9th place. Serious investment needs doing, but I'm doubtful that Lerner will pump £20-30 million into the playing squad.

    They should have never gotten rid of O'Neill. Hell, even Houllier took them to 9th place!
     
  15. Emptyone

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    Yep, but just some extra information never hurt. Sacking O'Neill was a mistake, but they shouldn't have finished so low. Maybe 12th at a stretch. Everton's squad isn't amazing, but they still do pretty well for it, though Jelavic made all the difference. Missing Bent for a couple of months reduced their goal threat, hence why they finished so low. Aside from him the attack is a lot of pace but not much goal-scoring talent.

    Serious investment won't happen. Lerner will put it all down to the manager, and send the same team with minor reshuffles out next season. Things need to change.
     
  16. Liquid

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    Isn't it a pain that the right man for the Liverpool job works for Everton?
     
  17. ExigeEvan

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  18. cuco33

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    All great managers but we will agree to disagree. Footy years ago was much different than it is today and today's game is significantly harder. SAF and others didn't do as much in as little time as Mou did. I know the argument already... Mourinho gets to be in big teams with big bankrolls, and I'll reply with he started his winning success at Porto for 2 years winning everything possible and many many managers have had opportunities like Mou has had at the big clubs with the big wallets and were not successful or as successful.

    Mou truly is a legend in my eyes, but I'm a self confessed fanboy of his so isn't much to change my mind. :sly:
    His arrogance is what pisses a lot of people off, but it's all mind games similar to what many managers do and I love it. SAF himself is arrogant and has his own mind games as well but I guess being a successful manager at Man U all these years, people give him a pass.

    The only negative behind Mou is how he's bounced around a lot of clubs and leagues but I'm sure if he didn't have a problem with Abrahmavich, he'd still be at Chelsea winning.
     
  19. Liquid

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    But Mourinho didn't do it, or hasn't done it, over a period of time as the others have/do/did.

    Alex Ferguson is the most successful manager of all time. He's won every top competition that there is to win. He's managed and nurtured some of the best talent to have ever come from the British and Irish isles.

    Bob Paisley took what Bill Shankly started and turned Liverpool into the international powerhouses of the 1980s and gave them their worldwide reputation that still resonates today. Paisley is still unmatched in his record of being the only manager to win the European Cup three times.

    Brian Clough is my personal favourite. He took two teams from the bottom of the English Second Division to the English First Division title. Won two European Cups with Nottingham Forest. Also the best player; he has the best goal ratio of any post-war English player and second best of any post-war British player.

    Bob Paisley did only ever manage Liverpool, but Alex Ferguson managed East Stirlingshire, St. Mirren and Aberdeen prior to Manchester United. Brian Clough managed several poor clubs in his career; Hartlepool in the English 4th Division before his success at Derby, and Brighton and Leeds before his legendary time at Nottingham Forest. Mourinho isn't the only manager to have done it at other clubs.

    Don't get me wrong, I like Mourinho. He knows the game well and he has the success to back it up. But he's not the greatest of all time in my eyes. Not yet. A few more years of continuous and unparalleled success and he still has a lot of catching up to do with Alex Ferguson.

    Fergie isn't arrogant, he just doesn't care what other people think. Wily and unflappable. He's King of the mind games. (Ref: Keegan)

    But he didn't win the European Cup and that's what Roman wants.
     
  20. TyrrellRacing

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    Rio's season. :tup:

    [​IMG]

    Arguing over who the best manager ever is pretty pointless. Certainly Mourinho is the best at the moment, who else pretty much guarantees success as long as you have the money, but would he have been as successful had he managed the top clubs 30 years ago ? Probably not.

    Ferguson's record is unmatched at United but what about if he managed abroad ? Nobody knows although I'd be willing to bet he wouldn't be as successful as Mourinho.

    Same can be said for Clough. I seriously doubt he would be as good in today's football. Similar kind of performance as Dalglish I would say. But then again what do I know ? Nobody will ever know.

    Also 19 hours and 29 minutes till the champions league final. :nervous:
     
  21. Lissa

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    Hahaha! That made me laugh, not an easy thing to do at this time on a Saturday morning when I'm having to do overtime at work.

    At least I'll be home in time to watch the Championship play-off final before settling down for the Champions League Final! :)
     
  22. MUSC4EVER

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    well done to west ham..beating blackpool 2-1 in the play-off final!

    welcome back!:tup:
     
  23. marchi

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    Sir Alex gets a pass because he's earned the right to be arrogant. Not only has he been at the helm of a club for 26 years building team after team, nurturing talent after talent, bur for a large portion of that 26 years, United arguably being the biggest club and team in world sports.
     
  24. cuco33

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    We will just agree to disagree folks. :p
    Footy is significantly harder today than it was 10 or more years ago. I'm not taking anything away from Sir Alex as I think he's a phenomenal coach and I do respect him quite a lot but in SAF's case he has had massive financial backing and club support all the years he's been at Man United. Some people say Mou has had that but in reality he's had that at Chelsea and nowhere else. No one can claim he's had financial backing at Porto in Portugal and Mourinho wrecked the Portuguese League for 2 solid years winning everything possible, even in the 2 European tournaments that Porto won (UEFA Cup and Champions League). He then moved on to Chelsea, where he was responsible for bringing Chelsea the success they had the short time he was there (the biggest success the club has ever seen and put the team as a dominating force in the EPL), and if you took note the old guard is basically Mou's former squad (not all but they certainly played like a team soon as Mou was there and even after he's left). He could have won the CL had he stayed at Stamford Bridge but Abrahmovich pushing players into his squad was the ultimate downfall of that relationship.
    He also tore up the Italian Serie A. 1st year he duplicated what Mancini did (and for the record Mancini was a bit lucky that the other clubs weren't as good, and the 1st year Mou was there he dealt with a hugely risky AC Milan with a dynamic Kaka x Pato pairing). He also acquired Mancini's club and only purchased a few players. 2nd year he was there he solidified himself as the only coach to win a treble in Italy. Wasn't even a big spender there either. He brought Quaresma who eventually proved to be nothing more than a flop. And that Inter squad played the absolute best when he was there playing even better his 2nd year, and was 1/4 of itself the very following year even though they only lost Eto.
    He went to Real Madrid to dethrone what most consider the greatest football club EVER to exist. 1st by winning the Spanish Cup and next by winning La Liga, while installing massive confidence into the Madrid players. Some say Pep Guardiola ran away because of Mou as talks of him leaving only started once Mou was being rumored to come to the Madrid side. Remember the season before they got thrashed at Camp Nou 5-0, and this season they beat Barca at their home. He wasn't there when Madrid spent big money for Kaka and Ronaldo. He only brought in Coentrao (LB, this was his biggest purchase in the 2 years he was there) and Callejon (very cheap too) along with some more veteran type of players like Carvalho, Altintop and Sahin.

    All this while being a relatively 'younger' manager. He will be back in EPL and when he comes back, whatever club he goes to, he will succeed greatly. Just you wait and see :p

    Is he a bit arrogant? Of course he is! But many coaches are as well. He does it to play mind games and for the media to focus on him rather than the players. I think the best mind game he played was in Italy when he first got ejected from a game. He went on and on for a good 2 minutes about how he'd never forget the 1st coach to toss him out from a match, and how he thought he shouldn't have seen the door, and how he's never even considered that what he did deserved it and would never forget the ref.. pauses for a few seconds and then goes 'what was the referee's name again?'
    lol!!!

    And yes, I fully admit I'm a diehard and massive Mourinho fanboy ;)


    edit: just noticed this is my 1000th post on gtp!! and it's about Mou :D
     
  25. Liquid

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    Mourinho had no money at Inter or Real?

    I am shocked.
     
  26. cuco33

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    Well I don't mean he had NO money... Most of the players on both Inter Milan and Real Madrid were there already. There's usually this thing that Mou is as good as he is because of the money he's allowed to splurge with but that's not really true. He's proved it at Porto and is a big coach to be part of the youth squads and transfer markets (one of the reasons for the split with Chelsea). At Inter the biggest player he lost was Ibrah, huge loss, but brought in Eto, Milito and Motta. He also brought on Pandev and Muntari when most were questioning why, all while losing Aquefresca and Patrick Viera, amongst others. Quaresma was the black eye for him as he forced the Milan club to bring him on, and was a complete flop. I lived in Italy for 9 months during that time and I can not explain to you how bad the media was on Mou let alone how bad they were on him over the whole Quaresma ordeal.
    At Madrid his biggest purchase was Coentrao and probably his best deal was Callejon but his 1st year at the club he complained heavily over lack of funds and transfers as he repeatedly stated Madrid needed another striker. He was right too. Once Higuain got hurt, the pressure fell on Benzema and last season he wasn't scoring in all the chances he had. This season he was a much better Benzema and he's already given credit to Mou. Same goes for Kaka, who gave credit to Mou. Note that his first year at Madrid saw a La Liga season points record being broken... it's just that Barcelona also beat that record as well. This year, RM did even better by breaking into 100pts at the end of the season. Few years ago the 2 top clubs were no where near the 90-100 pt mark. Barca got closest before Mou was there (when Pellegrini was coach) with 87 pts and that was amazing then. I don't think people understand how big the 2 Spanish giants have been in recent years, especially Barcelona.

    Mourinho gives players plenty of opportunities too. This is very different to Mini-Mou (AVB) who was basically forced to play Torres on the norm.

    Since this is EPL related thread, I don't want to see Mou back in EPL next season. I want him to win a treble at Real Madrid, THEN come back to EPL and dominate ;)
    He's the perfect candidate to take over Sir Alex's job. SAF just needs to retire.
     
  27. Emptyone

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    Serious amount of stuff flying around Twitter about Drogba leaving Chelsea. Various sources in both English and French media say it's official.
     
  28. Liquid

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    He's been off to China for a long time, it seems.

    Van Persie is off to Russia too.

    Fresh from the rumour mill.
     
  29. Emptyone

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    Well here's some more concrete evidence Drogba leaving Chelski Maybe torres won't be so unhappy now he's the main striker, and Lukaku might get a chance.
     
  30. Touring Mars

    Touring Mars Moderator

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    Drogba may as well quit - he's achieved everything he wanted with Chelsea now. Torres should cut his losses and quit Chelsea even if Drogba goes, though.

    I don't see Van Persie going to Russia for any price - esp. not to a team that will not play Champions League football next season. Manchester City are after him too, and he's far more likely to go there - and they can probably match any offer he will get - but EPL and CL football is far more appealing than Russian league football and Europa League.