question for anybody not a citezen of the usa...

[DGB454]

Originally posted by Krusty
maybe it was maybe it wasn't...but now it's worse than ever

Prove it.

 

[TurboSmoke]

Originally posted by InsertCoolName

I keep hearing that everybody hates US citizens, is it true? What are you're opinions of US citizens?

i dont think very many people dislike US citizens any more than they dislkie the citizens of any other country...

the main source of anti-american sentiment arises from the disapproval of the actions of the American government in international affairs, from failure to agree to Kyoto, to the Iraq invasion and international trade sanctions against its strongest allies such as the UK and Germany...

the citizens of the US are just lik ethe rest of us, unable to do anything in the face of the tyrannt...i feel sorry for them, i dont hate them...

 

[Mike Rotch]

I dont have any different feeling towards americans then any other countries citizens excepts on three fronts:

1) Americans usually come across as an extremely arrogant lot (not talking GTP forums here), but just the general, "we can built it bigger and better so shut up, what do you know" attitude

2) 98% of Americans think Africa is a country

3) 98% think Nelson Mandela is President of Africa


Other then that, *shrug*

 

[TurboSmoke]

Originally posted by Mike Rotch


2) 98% of Americans think Africa is a country

3) 98% think Nelson Mandela is President of Africa

if 98% of a supposedly well educated nation is this ignorant it reinforces my point that these people are not to be hated but rather pitied instead....

there are countless other facts that shame america too....i remember and interview with Bush during his election campain, the American reporter was grilling him on his imfamous lack of the basic understanding of international politics, he asked bush, "who is the president of Pakistan?"

Bush had no bloody idea, despite the fact that its only half the size of the US and has Nulcear weapons pointed at washington....

 

[audiracing]

Originally posted by M5Power

The president's been waving an American flag for eight months in Iraq and his approval rating has slipped below 50%. Honestly - if you're just going to make blind anti-American comments, shut the **** up. [/B]

Maybe that wasn't the case in Iraq, but just look at whats going on with your steel companies and you'll see me point.

 

[DGB454]

Originally posted by Mike Rotch
I dont have any different feeling towards americans then any other countries citizens excepts on three fronts:

1) Americans usually come across as an extremely arrogant lot (not talking GTP forums here), but just the general, "we can built it bigger and better so shut up, what do you know" attitude

True. We can.

2) 98% of Americans think Africa is a country

Untrue. I don't know anyone who thinks that except maybe a few 10 year olds.

3) 98% think Nelson Mandela is President of Africa

See my comment above.

 

[Mike Rotch]

We can

Thanks for being the stereotype I was referring too. I mean, after all if a 3.6 liter porsche can deliver the same performance as an 8 liter viper, you must be right.

I dont know anyone who thinks that

You dont know anyone who thinks that? So obviously 240 million other Americans must think like you.

See my comment above.

See my comments above

 

[Talentless]

Mike, you made a statistical statement without proof, DGB stated a personal observation that, while not proof that only a minority believe as the statistic you mentioned says, is also not proof of that statistics validity.

Beliefs can be wrong, but they are not usually under the same burden as a statistical claim. It's more on you to prove your exceptionally high statistic on US ignorance than it is on DGB to prove his generalization of Americans as not as ignorant as the statistic suggests

And my gramar is not very good, but I think you could be misreading DGB's first reply, which looks to be interpretable as agreeing with your statement, and not at all, or only, agreeing with the parts about superior capabilities.

 

[DGB454]

Originally posted by Mike Rotch
Thanks for being the stereotype I was referring too. I mean, after all if a 3.6 liter porsche can deliver the same performance as an 8 liter viper, you must be right.

2004 Porsche 911 GT3 3.6 liter
_________________________
Bhp@RPM: 380 @ 7400
Torque (lb.-ft.)@RPM: 284 @ 5000
MSRP $99,900

2004 Dodge SRT Roadster Viper V10
_____________________________
500 hp
525 lb.-ft. of torque
MSRP $81,795

These came off the Chrysler and Porsche websites.
You decide...Pay more and get less or pay less and get more?

You dont know anyone who thinks that? So obviously 240 million other Americans must think like you.

At least all of the ones above 10 that I know.

 

[milefile]

Originally posted by TurboSmoke
from failure to agree to Kyoto

The word you're looking for is "disagree".

international trade sanctions against its strongest allies such as the UK and Germany...

In a competitive economy this is normal. Germany and Britain sancion America, too.

the citizens of the US are just lik ethe rest of us, unable to do anything in the face of the tyrannt

Except vote him out.

...i feel sorry for them, i dont hate them...

Pity is for the weak. And socialists.

 

[milefile]

Originally posted by GTJugend
I don't see americans as lazy. I rather see americans as very productive.

It's just one thing I don't get, Mabye you us citizens can explain it to me.

Why do you identify yourself so strong with being "American"? At lest that's my impression that many of you do. I mean I like my country. I think it's a great place to live. Yet i rarely if ever think of myself as a"Swede", even when I'm travelling in other countries. I couldn't care less if I we joined with another country in some union and called ourselves "Bongistan". It's just something artificial that has nothing to do with the quality of my life.

What does it boost in you when you think of yourself as "American"?

I have a Swedish friend and he identifies very strongly with his background. His house if filled with Swedish kitch and there's a big Vilkommen (sp?) sign on his front door. He speaks Swedish whenever he can, and after six years in America he's still very hard to understand through his accent. And yet Swedish friends of his who have lived here for less time cam speak almost perfect English. I think it's a personality type, and that type can be found in any country. Another characteristic of the type is hating other countries.

 

[Duke]

I'm proud of my American citizenship because I'm proud of the American Constitution and the fundamentals of the American system.

I don't like everything it has become, and the ways it has been misused and misinterpreted in our history, but I'm still amazed at the strength of intellect, will, and physical effort the Founders were able to focus in creating this country. That's something I'm proud to have as part of my heritage, and it has enough power to keep me proud of this country despite some of the errors we have committed.

I don't see a country in the world without significant errors in its current behaviour and history; and I see many many countries that are not founded on such perfect ideals as this one.

 

[milefile]

Originally posted by daan
This picture, to me, sums it up.

Then you obviously know nothing.

Americans seem to be very insular. They only seem to care about America, not the world.

What country is not like this. Why not abolish countries?

Most countries seem to realise that our energy will run out at some point so they are trying to be more efficient.

Are you saying that the products you see as inefficient should be banned? That we should not be able to choose? What would all of you morally superior non-American's harp on then?

America uses more energy (electricity and oil) per head of population than any other country

I'd check that fact if I were you.

whilst not producing anywhere near as much as it needs. It then has to buy it in from other countries, which has the effect of giving other countries your money whilst depleting that countries reserves too.

And what Western country does not do this? At least in America the individual gets most of the benefit, not the tax greedy government.

And you still insist on buying trucks & SUV's that get 10mpg!

You? You mean Me? Which one of us 200+ million Americans are you refering to?

And don't get me started on gun laws. The average nutter in another country does not have access to his "father's arsenal", but in America.....

Oh please do start. This should be good. I want to see you estimate and weigh freedom against your convenience.

I can see that you, and others, do not understand what it means to be free, do not desire freedom, and couldn't handle it if they had it. There are so-called Americans like that, too... Al Gore for instance.

 

[Talentless]

I'm often perplexed by the ease with which a whole people can be comforted by an irrelevant statistic that speaks of the failings of some but not all.

Why does a statistic about gun accidents apply to me? Is it comparable to the statistics on becoming infected with diabetes. Accidents, at times a product of conscious mistakes, are not comparable to natural phenomena that cannot be avoided no matter the actions one takes, only can one hope to not be afflicted. Both my parents are diabetic, I may become so as well, but that is not the same as a stranger dropping a loaded revolver and having a serious of events cause the gun to fire after having been dropped and kill the man. I can work to prevent that, I'm more at the mercy of fate, if you'll pardon my using that concept, in not becoming diabetic.

And, suicide rates are utterly irrelevant. I don't care if people use a gun to kill themselves. I care if they have a will to describe the care to be given to their dependants, if any.
And hope the suicidal can get counseling.

 

[Talentless]

Originally posted by milefile
Oh please do start. This should be good. I want to see you estimate and weigh freedom against your convenience.

I can see that you, and others, do not understand what it means to be free, do not desire freedom, and couldn't handle it if they had it. There are so-called Americans like that, too... Al Gore for instance.

Do you, then, agree with the parts that pertain to guns?

Originally posted by Talentless
We are independent, as such, we have some mistrust of the UN and similar bodies. From a strategic stand point, it might be justified sometimes. We prefer some independence rearding self defense. Reliance on government is not something we want even to the point of our lives being determined by departments of government that may not be able to aid us. Also, guns can work, logically presumed from their capablities, in stoping some criminal activity. Fairness tells us not to confine a person to his possible inequities against an assailant. A gun gives some level of equalization, and hypotheticals do not counter that contention. Because my basis is in observable fact. Other countries can rightly boast of their successes with gun control, if true, in general statistics aren't always reliable. But there always exists that person who could not get away, who was not fortunate enough. It then becomes a question of whether it is the greater good to allow the man to have had a chance, albeit not gauranteed, or to have restricted him in the hopes that the occurence of some crimes will be reduced. Ethically, I side more with the former argument.

 

[milefile]

I do agree with you, Talentless, regarding gun control. I used to be all for gun control, then I watered it down some. Now I am totally opposed. Believing in America may seem counter-intuitive at times, but only because social-bureaucracy is enroaching on all sides. The fact that many Americans swallow this bilge is no evidence of benefit. The world is smeared with those who think they are entitled to a good life simply because they breathe, those who think their security is somebody else's job, those who think their health and well being are anybody's responsibility but their own, and America is not immune.

Put simply, those who think they will benefit from a so-called "world government" (UN) are all for it, i.e. they are pulled up by others' strength. Those who think they will be hurt by it, in other words, dragged down* by interests irrelevant to their locality and culture, are against it. America today is struggling to remain true to its inception despite the socialist threat.

Rather than giving things away so others may be as comfortable as us, why not teach them to work for it themselves. The result of this would be a stronger world rather than a mediocre one.

 

[Talentless]

For a while I've wondered about how strong Europe's defenses are. I don't really know how good they are, but I'm fairly confident that social spending is favored in the continent. If diplomacy fails, and cooperation among its states isn't sufficient, to whom will the burden of protection go?

 

[Rossell]

2) 98% of Americans think Africa is a country

Continent.

3) 98% think Mandela is the President

of South Africa.

 

[Talentless]

Mandela hasn't been the president for several years. Aren't there legal issues surrounding his wife?

 

[TurboSmoke]

Originally posted by milefile
The word you're looking for is "disagree".

n a competitive economy this is normal. Germany and Britain sancion America, too.

Except vote him out.

Pity is for the weak. And socialists.

the difference is that the American sanctions against Europe are illegal...according to the World Trade Organisation

no one person in the US can vote out the president...i think you need something called a majority which seems to evade america at her every turn....

pity is indeed for the weak...but one cant help pity the underprivilidged....or as you say, impaired...

 

[TurboSmoke]

Originally posted by Talentless
For a while I've wondered about how strong Europe's defenses are. I don't really know how good they are, but I'm fairly confident that social spending is favored in the continent. If diplomacy fails, and cooperation among its states isn't sufficient, to whom will the burden of protection go?

what songbook are you reading?

europe isnt a state....is that what you think?

the individual countries in europe are more than capable of looking after themselves....and if as you think a european army would be banded together, it would be twice the size of the US armed forces....something more akin to the chinese army...

 

[Talentless]

Originally posted by TurboSmoke
what songbook are you reading?

europe isnt a state....is that what you think?

the individual countries in europe are more than capable of looking after themselves....and if as you think a european army would be banded together, it would be twice the size of the US armed forces....something more akin to the chinese army...

1. I obviously stated myself as having a suspicion and not full knowledge.

2. States plural, as in synonymous with country. Conintents are comprised of countries.

3. I never said I thought European states would band together. I asked if they do not, and if their military power is not adequate individually, who will have to help them.

 

[1X83Z]

Originally posted by jay wilkie
it's very simple.. people dont like US citizens because they think they all act like M5... I'm not just saying that to annoy you M5. I'm telling it how it is. Your "rub salt in the wound" attitude is what a lot of people think Americans are like.....

You make a fair point - it was just yesterday I was discussing with my friends how much I hate Europe.

Jackass.

Oh, and, incidentally, when my country is attacked by a blind asshole with no sense of what he's saying, I will defend it. And if the price I have to pay is a jackass telling me that I act stupidly, then fine - I'm not in the wrong. You are.

 

[jay wilkie]

Originally posted by M5Power
You make a fair point - it was just yesterday I was discussing with my friends how much I hate Europe.

Jackass.

Oh, and, incidentally, when my country is attacked by a blind asshole with no sense of what he's saying, I will defend it. And if the price I have to pay is a jackass telling me that I act stupidly, then fine - I'm not in the wrong. You are.

I rest my case... ********..

the rest of the world can name call too you know.. and I dont care what you think of Europe. One, I live no-where near there and two, I'm sure they couldn't care less what people like you thought of them. ( please note: I didn't say what Americans thought of them, just idiots like yourself. You could be from Europe, and Europeans wouldn't like your attitude).

 

[Mike Rotch]

Originally posted by Talentless
Mandela hasn't been the president for several years. Aren't there legal issues surrounding his wife?

Actually ex-wife, winnie mandela, and the "issues" range from being found guilty of fraud and corruption, to allegations of murder and attempted murder. Good ol' democracy.

Look, I dont want to get further embroiled in an argument about SUV's and Kyoto and Vipers and Guns. Perhaps the issue that people are missing in this thread is there is a definite perception by non-Americans, that Americans do not seem to want to believe exist. Sure you can argue about a Free Constitution (which I agree with totally Duke) and about not using a huge amount of fossil fuels.

The point is, the perception exists.

 

[Jay]

i like the US i been there 3 times

 

[TurboSmoke]

Originally posted by Mike Rotch
Perhaps the issue that people are missing in this thread is there is a definite perception by non-Americans, that Americans do not seen to want to believe exist.
The point is, the perception exists.

exactly, and who perpetrates this perception.? who gives america a bad name? who consistantly lives up to our expectations of the arrogant, overweight, undereducated, lazy american?

the actions of europe dosent give you this bad name, the actions of asia doesnt give you this bad name, the actions of africa doesnt give you this bad name.....america gives america a bad name.....

look at the state M5 has worked himself into....throwing obsceneties and foul language due to his hatred of other cultures and foriegners...'i hate europe'....how can you hate a land mass? a continent....? is it the people you hate? is it the government? if so which ones....please dont think that the people of Finland are the same as the Czech Replublic or the govts in Portugal are the same as Bosnia....Europe is hugely diverse, the most diverse continent on earth....surely you dont hate every single one of us M5?

have you never been to the French alps? or to the beaches of Spain....what about the wide spaces of Ireland....

youre not really interested....you prefer to stay in your little fort and despise the rest of the world for disagreeing with your precious Bush.....i cant beileve you folks defend him so blindly and then critisise the Iraqis for doing the same over Hussien.....

 

[DGB454]

I'm sure M5 doesn't really hate Europe. He was just responding to the blind attacks on America with nothing to back it up.
Don't forget who we are and where we all came from at some point. We are from your countries..we are your relatives...we are you. You want to talk about diversity? We are the most diverse country in the world.
We are also the most traveled country in the world. We aren't the ones sitting in our little fort despising the world. You are. We aren't the ones believing everything the government owned media spits out and forming our opinions based on that.We aren't the ones burning your flags in the streets because of a misconception.

Who is giving America a bad name? You are.
You have the nerve to compare Bush to Hussien? Bush has his problems but he is nowhere close to a murdering tyrant that kills his own people for sport that Hussien is. Bush can easily be voted out of office if we choose to do so and that's just one of the things that makes America great. Our ability to elect the people that lead us. Do the Iraqi people have that choice? Hopefully soon they will because (fat lazy uneducated) Americans(and some Europeans) choose to put their lifes on the line for them.
Before you start bashing others you should get your facts straight instead of straight from your news stations and rumors from your friends.
I am beginning to not care what the rest of the world thinks about us. If it is all based on the unsubstantiated crap I'm hearing here then let them wallow in their own collective ignorance and think what they will.

 

[Jay]

Originally posted by DGB454
Do the Iraqi people have that choice? Hopefully soon they will because (fat lazy uneducated) Americans(and some Europeans) choose to put their lifes on the line for them.

Hey what about Aussies we are there too

 

[TurboSmoke]

Originally posted by InsertCoolName

I keep hearing that everybody hates US citizens, is it true? What are you're opinions of US citizens?

read the above quote....people here arent 'blindly attacking' the US, we are resonding to the question asked....and we are telling you what we think...

you as an american cannot tell us we are wrong because this question was aimed at non americans....we tell you what we think of you and you tell us we are wrong?

thats like saying do you like peanut butter....no! and you saying yes you do....everybody likes peanut butter....

no my friend not everybody has a love affair with US politics...i know thats a shock to every american in here...not everybody agrees that youre the greatest nation in the world just because you tell us every day that you are....

if you dont like the answers then dont repeatedly make threads up asking us what we think of you...

we have told you.....you may not like it but its what we think...

and M5...he's so blatantly a xenophobe that you're the blind one not to see that.....look at this post in which he states that he hates europe...and threads about Jordans trip to Paris....his contempt for all thing non american is venomous and he needs to relax....