Sciaru BRZFRS (BreezeFrees)

  • Thread starter Thread starter Azuremen
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Kamuifanboy
In my opinion, buying a Muscle car that isn't a V8 is sacrilege.
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That's fine because this isn't the 70s and we don't have 400+ cubic inch big block tanks that only do the quarter mile (not that there's anything wrong with that, before I get called out as being an import ricer guy again, its just a fact). Mustangs and Camaros have always been Pony Cars, and today's classification would simply put them as Sports Coupes. If I had to choose a 2011 V6 or 2010 GT, and ignoring any potential difference they have with mods, I'd take the V6 so I could laugh at the guy with more motor not being any faster.


Don't forget that the precious AWD loses over a quarter of its crank hp as parasitic losses, so a 305hp STI puts down 220whp. With common mods and nearly 400 crank horse you're still at 300whp, the cheaper 5.0 GT puts down over 350whp.

So like I posted earlier, the Toyobaru slots in right between the WRX and STI in (wheel) hp to weight.
 
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Kamuifanboy
I'm not blind to facts mate. I just choose not to believe some based on personal opinions, or in some cases, personal tests on cars, in the case of the Porsche argument.

If your going to talk facts. Then my argument about Porsche's being not as good as the GTR is a fact. The GT-R is quite a bit cheaper than a competitive speed Porsche.
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This is a gem. I love this. Probably one of the stupidest things I've ever read, but I love it.

Fact
/fakt/
Noun:
1. A thing that is indisputably the case.


Delusion
/diˈlo͞oZHən/
Noun:
1. An idiosyncratic belief or impression that is firmly maintained despite being contradicted by what is generally accepted as reality
 
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Please don't mind my 5 minute quickie photoshop job. :lol:

86_shop.jpg
 
2011 5.0 0-60 = 4.8s
1/4 = 13.0@110mph

2011 STI 0-60 = 5.5s
1/4 13.8@97mph

And for funs

2011 V6 Stang 0-60 = 5.6s
1/4 13.9@102

AWD is just adding weight and robbing horsepower, honestly.
 
Eric.
2011 5.0 0-60 = 4.8s
1/4 = 13.0@110mph

2011 STI 0-60 = 5.5s
1/4 13.8@97mph

And for funs

2011 V6 Stang 0-60 = 5.6s
1/4 13.9@102

AWD is just adding weight and robbing horsepower, honestly.
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I sense some random mix-n-match here.
I take it 5.5 for '11 STI is Edmunds's test with no rollout (and I'm not exactly sure how did the manage to be that much slower than '08 STI). V6 Mustang in similar setting is @5.8 , and 5.0 is 5.2. Lighter STI hatch would be a bit faster.
 
Azuremen
The Mustang doesn't need AWD to be quicker. Which is part of the point.
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That was certainly not part of the point. The only point being made was that it (STI) was lighter than the Mustang. Do show where I said that AWD would make it faster. And I don't even recall saying either car was faster. I just said that the Mustang was heavier than the STI. Which it is 70lbs and 300lbs depending on engine model from the understanding that I got.
 
Kamuifanboy
That was certainly not part of the point. The only point being made was that it (STI) was lighter than the Mustang. Do show where I said that AWD would make it faster. And I don't even recall saying either car was faster. I just said that the Mustang was heavier than the STI. Which it is 70lbs and 300lbs depending on engine model from the understanding that I got.
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You must hate the GT-R then as well. :rolleyes:

We all know the Germans build the best cars anyway, so this America vs Japan thing is amusing.
 
Azuremen
You must hate the GT-R then as well. :rolleyes:

We all know the Germans build the best cars anyway, so this America vs Japan thing is amusing.
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Again, as I stated before. I love BMW's. Driven E46's really hard on tracks and are seriously probably one of the best cars ever created. So easy to drive at speed.

I'd definitely agree that Germans make the best cars as an all around quality aspect, and most are generally faster than competing countries
 
Toronado
Is it mid-engined or AWD or something equally stupid? It's hard to tell with GT300 regulations these days.
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I'd assume it's FR. Should be interesting to see how it does. Although i'll be sad to see the Legacy go. The Legacy was easily the loudest car on the grid, even louder than the GT500's. Will be missing that noise.
 
Kamuifanboy
I'd assume it's FR. Should be interesting to see how it does. Although i'll be sad to see the Legacy go. The Legacy was easily the loudest car on the grid, even louder than the GT500's. Will be missing that noise.
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I'm thinking the new car will probably use the same engine. Unless the rules changed...
 
^I'd imagine it'll be around 24,000 to 30,000 USD. That would put it in the right range against it's competitors, as well as probable ensure good sales.
 
That would be a dream, but I don't know if they would. Although looking at Mazda Miata prices, that could very well be possible. It seems they're aiming their sights on the NC MX-5, so 22,000 or 23,000 USD might be pretty accurate. If Subaru decide to do an STi version however, I think they would price it more along the Mustang. Maybe $28,000? If STi does get ahold of it, there better be Turbos.
 
homeforsummer
Can't see them pricing it that close to the MX-5. Don't get me wrong, it'd be nice and they'd not be able to make them quick enough for the demand at that price, but I reckon they've put too much money into the project to let it go for that low.

Unless Toyota are feeling particularly greedy, I'd like to think it'll be around £26k in the UK and true to tradition, about $26k in the US.
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It'll be interesting to see what they decide. Pricing it against the Mustang and the Genesis would make the greatest amount of sense to me, and that doesn't differentiate that much further away from the MX-5. Considering that the Camaro and Challenger are floating around in that same price range, it gets that much more complicated.

Toyota can try to sell the car based on purity of performance, and I totally agree that it works in principle, but it only really works for cars that own a particular market all their own. The MX-5 essentially stands alone, the same can really be said for the GTI/GLI, and even the Wrangler. Mazda, Volkswagen and Jeep can pretty much charge whatever they want because they have a pedigree, and generally are the only option when you want that kind of car. The FR-S/GT-86 and BRZ are going in an increasingly crowded market. One bad pricing decision is going to kill it, real fast.

What may be more interesting is the pricing difference Toyota will put on the FR-S/GT-86 and the BRZ. Knowing that they're almost entirely the same vehicle, aside from some very small differences, can they really justify charging that more? For three more horsepower and a more attractive face? It would seem to be a difficult proposition.
 

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