The GiffyLube guys screwed my Viper!

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GTP_Sa11yz-Rage
I was running the Oreca Viper at 298's. Consistently for about 8 runs... 298.02, 289.12, 298.34, 298.22 and so on. I went and got the old changed, came right back in and started a new session without changing anything on the car, ran the same line, everything. The car now has such bad under steer I can't even get out of the turn without letting off and the best I can hit the tunnel is like 160 whereas before high 160's. :ouch:

How do I get the lube guys fired? 👍 SOB's!

Seriously, it seems like when you leave a session that settings go away or something. Or am I :crazy: ?
 
My guess is that the power increase from the oil change has also increased your torque.

PD in their inverted wisdom have not been able to model the performance of high capacity, low RPM, high torque engines, so they just make them understeer instead.

You don't want to get me started on what they did to the Tuscan! :grr:.
 
You mean the GiffyLube guys? :rolleyes: :)

:lol: Nooo ... Polyphony Digital (which is a non-anagram of "The Cars of those who sponsor us shall be made more than they really are whilst the superior mechanicals of those pesky European jalopies shall be made to chunder" ... hmm ... even for a non-anagram there be a few too many wordles there :)).
 
Well there appears to be something in what you say sukerkin, however, my new and BIGGEST pet peeve is with the speedo! - When my speedo hits 300 mph, I've gone 300 mph. Not 299.55! WTF? :ouch: :crazy: :grumpy: (it was explained that it rounds up or something) That's not helping my frustration...:nervous: Aaarrrghh!
 
Don't let it get to you - that way lies the destruction of valuable gaming equipment (been there, done that :o).

The game is, after all is said and done, a game. Altho' the driving can feel surprisingly real, the more you play the more that you see is wrong. In the end you just have to shrug, accept the flaws and set your own goals.

That's the real strength of the GT series, that you can decide what you want to do rather than be tied to some phony story-line or an enforced progression through race series.

If simulation is what you're after then there's nothing on a console that does the job - check out Live for Speed on your PC.
 
You mean like busted controllers and broken in half game discs? That kinda thing? 👍 Yep, nothing like looking at your snapped in half controller and realizing it's 2am and you don't have and extra.. :crazy:

Just a game - just a game hahaha, still when you pin 300 for like the forth time and it's still saying 299.95....wellll, it's time for an herbal tea :scared:
 
Here's a suggestion, ignore the in-car speedometer

A wise guy eh.....:sly:

But......it......said........3 0 0 :crazy: Hahahahaha...

I've noticed it's just weird all around, sometimes you think you're under and it gives you an extra one mile an hour.

It's just funny that after about 2 hours of gripping and clenching and workin' it over, you see the flash of 300 and then the 'real' number and it's such a drag, but that's what makes it a gas. 👍
 
My guess is that the power increase from the oil change has also increased your torque.

PD in their inverted wisdom have not been able to model the performance of high capacity, low RPM, high torque engines, so they just make them understeer instead.

You don't want to get me started on what they did to the Tuscan! :grr:.

First off, I would like to start out stating that the whole 10-15hp gain of changing your oil would not remotely be responsible for what was described. Something must have happened to the settings of the car or something along those lines. 👍

Second, please explain to me how the any car's engine, besides weighing a lot, would go about inducing understeer into a car. The suspension, tires, and aerodynamics have something to do with a certain car's understeer, but defenitly not the engine. :dunce:

peace,
eg6_dude
 
Second, please explain to me how the any car's engine, besides weighing a lot, would go about inducing understeer into a car.

He didn't say it would. He said that that is the way PD seem to have modelled them.
 

Second, please explain to me how the any car's engine, besides weighing a lot, would go about inducing understeer into a car. The suspension, tires, and aerodynamics have something to do with a certain car's understeer, but defenitly not the engine. :dunce:

peace,
eg6_dude

In a word, Location.

The exact location of a cars engine (being the biggest single mass in the car) has a huge effect on its basic balance. Its why engineers always try and locate it as low and as close to the centre as they can, and by doing so lowering the cars overall centre of gravity and reducing its polar moment of inertia. Its for these reasons F1 cars are mid-engined.

Audi A4's and above have a reputation for a chronic understeer bias for similar factors, the longitudinally mounted engines are right over and forward of the front axle line. Stick an engine in this location and you will get understeer as a natural balance that will be hard to tune out, take the same engine and locate it lower and further back and it will make a huge difference to the balance of the car. Its one of the single reasons why the A4 has always chased the 3-series dynamically, the Audi's always started with an inherent weakness when it comes to balance.

Not directly related to the point in question I know, but its not just the weight that's a factor.

Regards

Scaff
 
I understand how the placement of the engine could make the car understeer or affect the cars handling, but what Sukerkin was saying was that the type of engine would make the car understeer.

... not been able to model the performance of high capacity, low RPM, high torque engines, so they just make them understeer instead....
 
He was saying that, since PD didn't know how to model the performance of the engine, they just made the car understeer instead.

It looked more like a joke than a serious statement to me, though... I guess that is a lost concept.
 
I understand how the placement of the engine could make the car understeer or affect the cars handling, but what Sukerkin was saying was that the type of engine would make the car understeer.

Which is why I also said "Not directly related to the point in question I know, but its not just the weight that's a factor." 👍

After all you did state that "Second, please explain to me how the any car's engine, besides weighing a lot, would go about inducing understeer into a car.", and besides weight, location would do it. Come on you know I could never resist something like that.

:)

Scaff
 
IF you get an OC than you increase your power. Increase in power might also effect other things. If you tune a car at say something like 520hp and go get an oil change to bump it up to 535hp it will handle differently because your car was not tuned to handle perfect at that increase of speed.
 
IF you get an OC than you increase your power. Increase in power might also effect other things. If you tune a car at say something like 520hp and go get an oil change to bump it up to 535hp it will handle differently because your car was not tuned to handle perfect at that increase of speed.

Many people barely can tell the difference, and trust me, the difference is definitly not that large to affect the cars handling that severly. Something else affected the car besides the oil change. :)

peace,
eg6_dude
 
The oil change added just enough horsepower to get the car to the speed where it was now doing a wheelie. When the front wheels aren't on the ground, I think it can fairly be described as "understeer". This is one of the things that can happen when you're trying to hit 300 mph.
 
Hi eg6_dude

I think that you took what I posted in a manner other than that which I intended and also took it a step further and put words in my mouth. As it happens, they were true words and even if I didn't say them here, I probably have said something similar on the subject in automotive conversations. The manner in which you referenced them was not exactly complimentary tho' :cries:.

My honours' mostly been covered by other responses so I wont go into any extensive details, other than to say that Cheezman caught my drift (well done that man).

Sometimes it's a good idea when entering a discourse online to have a look at someones profile before you respond to them. It might be full of lies but it can sometimes help colour what you say. If you'd looked at mine you'd see the simple word "Engineer" and might have concluded that I had a certain basic knowledge of mechanicals and material physics from that (tho' I'm really a software/electrical engineer).

Leaving all that aside, what I was actually getting at is what I said in the first place i.e. PD don't model the powertrain type correctly and so, if you increase torque, you increase understeer. I suggested that such an increase might have something to do with the handling changes rage encountered.

However, I'd also suggest that he takes a look to see if his chassis has 'worn out' as that is a more likely cause of the observed problem.
 
Sorry to get off-topic, but if you think those gauges are wrong, go check the gauges on the VW Beetle or Mini Cooper 1.3i in GT3. You go 100MPH and it says 80. :grumpy: That was the worst accuracy ever!
 
Well apparently this is what happened. When I took the car in for an OC I went to QuickieLube instead of GiffyLube this time, the attendant say's to me while he's under there, "Hey you got Armor All tire dressing all over these slicks you want me to clean them off?' :crazy:

Evidently the moron at the GiffyLube figured it would be cool to dress the tires, I didn't notice and when I get out on the track and as I'm making my 'slingshot' out of the turn to pickup speed the tires are 'rolling over' and sliding on the sidewalls a bit and they hit the Armor All and wheeee! As soon as I went out after the second OC it was fine again.

I think it was actually the power increase, I take a pretty tight line in the turn and drift out wide on exit and that was where it was over-steering. I just kinda blanked on that at the time.... Still c'mon, dressing slicks? Who does that, they should fire him for sure! 👍
 
Hi eg6_dude

I think that you took what I posted in a manner other than that which I intended and also took it a step further and put words in my mouth. As it happens, they were true words and even if I didn't say them here, I probably have said something similar on the subject in automotive conversations. The manner in which you referenced them was not exactly complimentary tho' :cries:.

My honours' mostly been covered by other responses so I wont go into any extensive details, other than to say that Cheezman caught my drift (well done that man).

Sometimes it's a good idea when entering a discourse online to have a look at someones profile before you respond to them. It might be full of lies but it can sometimes help colour what you say. If you'd looked at mine you'd see the simple word "Engineer" and might have concluded that I had a certain basic knowledge of mechanicals and material physics from that (tho' I'm really a software/electrical engineer).

Leaving all that aside, what I was actually getting at is what I said in the first place i.e. PD don't model the powertrain type correctly and so, if you increase torque, you increase understeer. I suggested that such an increase might have something to do with the handling changes rage encountered.

However, I'd also suggest that he takes a look to see if his chassis has 'worn out' as that is a more likely cause of the observed problem.

My apologies dear sir :nervous: I was unaware that remark was a joke and I was also not trying to offend anybody. I just like to have accurate and correct information for others to read.

sorry,
eg6_dude
 
My apologies dear sir :nervous: I was unaware that remark was a joke and I was also not trying to offend anybody. I just like to have accurate and correct information for others to read.

sorry,
eg6_dude


Not a problem. good sir :bow:. My apologies for the somewhat 'snippety' response of mine that you quoted (my excuse is that I was tired :o).

The Net breeds misunderstanding like a virus. I'm sure half the arguments and flames are caused by people, through no fault of their own, getting the wrong end of the stick :D.

Much kudos for the post too - it speaks well of you that you had the courtesy and thoughtfulness to not just 'let it lie'. That's a rare and welcome character trait here in annonymous Web-land 👍
 
I was running the Oreca Viper at 298's. Consistently for about 8 runs... 298.02, 289.12, 298.34, 298.22 and so on. I went and got the old changed, came right back in and started a new session without changing anything on the car, ran the same line, everything. The car now has such bad under steer I can't even get out of the turn without letting off and the best I can hit the tunnel is like 160 whereas before high 160's. :ouch:

How do I get the lube guys fired? 👍 SOB's!

Seriously, it seems like when you leave a session that settings go away or something. Or am I :crazy: ?

I too have experienced this although not on my new PS2. Up until three weeks ago I had been playing on my 18 year old daughters PS2that was about 4 years old. I constantly noticed that my cars woud feel different from time to time when leaving a track to go from practice to Family Cup race mode. I would find my car wouldn't run as well as it had been in practice. Or I woud be racing, and then leave the game to go trosleep and the next day fire up the game and the samecar on the same track just wouldn't run the same way. Since buying my new console I haven't had this happen.
 
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