Track List Feedback

[BORDER323]

You couldn't be more wrong, the GT5 tracks have WAY more vertexes than GTSP tracks, vertexes are the geometry and actual 3D modeling, and the most time consuming portion of digitalizing a circuit, texturizing is a lot faster. If you think a PSP track has the same amount of detail in its geometry (vertex) as Prologue or GT5 you sir are an idiot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tAdNmhG-mY

That's a very nice way of putting it with all the big words and that ( although im not sure digitalising, texturizing are actually words ), and a very informative video.. ( not )

As much as I don't really want to get into an argument about 3D and vertex's / polygons.. and be all technical and geeky.I don't see why I should be called an IDIOT by someone who obviously isn't very well educated on the matter.

So let me educate you.

http://www.racingpaintshop.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=701&Itemid=301

The above link will take you to a track I am in the process of making for Rfactor, granted it's not up to GT levels, but thats more because Rfactor cannot handle the detail level's GT can and it is somewhat unfinished, But I like to think it's actually pretty ok and this does provide me excellent knowledge of what exactly goes into track creation.

Rfactor / GT tracks are created in exactly the same manner and each are created in the exact same 3D program. ( 3d studio max / Maya.. I do believe PD use Maya with custom plugins to suit their requirements. )

Now, I am 100% correct in what I say about PSP tracks being exactly the same as GT5 tracks. The tracks in their basic form of a wireframe can be upscaled or downscaled accordingly to suit its games hardware format.

As has been proved in the fact PSP tracks have actually been upscaled already , and have been showcased in GT HD. Using the same process and procedure that PD have undertaken to UPSCALE the GT4 cars to GT5 levels.

A track is made of Polygon's ( triangles ) this wireframe of triangles can be optimised to perform at its best in whatever game. Once this has been done texture's are added to give it is "life like" appearance.

These tracks WILL have been created firstly with enough detail for GT5, then the wireframe will be optimised for the portable game. This is the most logical, time saving way to do it.

If you recall, Pd have stated They have FUTURE proofed the new GT5 cars , this is by giving them initially more detail than they actually require for GT5 , then downscaling these models for GT5. The highest detail models are kept and will be used in GT6 / GT7.

PD have realised they do not need to keep creating cars for every title which they have done in the past, they can make super detailed cars with millions of polygons, then downscale them in triangle's in minuet's to suit the latest title. In essence the tracks are exactly the same, just with less polygonal detailand the textures aren't as highly detailed.

If you honestly think PD would create 2 tracks from scratch, one for PSP , and then again re-create that same track for GT5, then I am very sorry to say sir.. YOU ARE THE IDIOT NOT I.

So what have we learned...

Firstly its not best practice to go spouting off on a subject without a good understanding.

Second, Its also not best practice to name call for needless reason's.

Make a mental note... and be on your way.

There's a good chap.

 

[BORDER323]

Speaking as an English teacher ... my god, does your setence structure need work!

Sorry to quote.. and I am fully aware my english is not the greatest.

But I did have to laugh at the irony in your post, especially when I saw the spelling mistake...

TOP CLASS... LOL

 

[SlipZtrEm]

Trust me I'm upset at something in GT5, but i guess i'm different I can look past all that stuff, I drove on the ring in the GT5 demo and it is 1000 times better than what it was in GT4, and this is using bumper cam. Many cars and tracks might be the same or missing, but when we finally play the game I bet they will give us a way better experience we going in GT4. Thats what i'm looking for 👍

I guess the question could always change to "how much can people look past?"

I would hope, no, expect, that they give us a better experience than we got in GT4, dude! I ran the 'Ring in the demo with the 458, and yeah, it does feel good. It surely helps it's my main go-to track. I'm talking in chat with Ploopsy right now and I'm reminded that GT4 always felt so clinical and cold. I miss the absolute fun feeling I got with GT2. That had a lot to do with the tracks, and after knowing about the two-tier car list, I still held out hope that hey, all my favourite tracks would be back, or at least most of them, and the track list can arguably make a game more boring quicker than a car list.

And I still can't think of a single good reason PD can justify bringing back GT4 assets to add 800 cars to the roster, but can't bring back tracks from that game. Unless it's a plan for future DLC... which would be almost too evil.

With more tracks you can add a bigger variety to the game, the license tests and the races. Now I'm a bit afraid, that it will be too much racing with different cars on allready chewed up tracks. Something like in GT5 Prologue.

Actually, one interesting idea about licenses; we know we can save randomly generated tracks. There's nothing stopping PD from having track creator courses already saved for specific license use 👍

 

[Addegj]

Shockingly that is a very good point.

Less tracks than the portable version.. I mean come on.. somebody has got to be taking the P!55 havent they ????

That is just ridiculous, I would have been better buying a PSP to play GT on ???

IMO ( and this is just my opinion so no point having a go at me )

This is the worst GT to ever hit the shelves. Not because of the weather / nite/day stuff is limited to a select few tracks which sucks .Oh and the damage model is graphically a joke..Oh yeah I forgot standard car tuning...more.... yep theres no LAN play ...any more....Oh yeah no multi screen by the looks of it "OO OO" but we do have the X1... Another JOKE !!

But read that again...

Less tracks than the portable version

I cant believe they have the bare faced cheek to put this on the shelf and label it GT5..then try to sell it for £150... PD & SONY... you should all have stockings on your heads and pretend to be ROBBERS... because thats what your amounting to at the moment.

This is either GT4.5 or GT6 Prologue...

There better be some SERIOUS dlc for cheap or this will be the last GT I buy.

Totally agree.

 

[Devedander]

Where are people getting the track list I do not see it on the official site?

Are you serious?

 

[scope72]

Where are people getting the track list I do not see it on the official site?

It can be found on the U.K. site or the JP site.

http://eu.gran-turismo.com/gb/news/d15022.html

 

[Gejost]

I have to agree, the track list is disappointing. Although there are 27 tracks, and lots of variations, it looks rather scarce. There are some great circuits missing. Take Spa for example, a legendary and favourite circuit of many racing drivers and fans. Isn't it time PD, to finally include this legendary track? And only weather and night/day on very few circuits? Not what I expected, not what I expected at all.

 

[TheROADKRAKEN]

Oh my...

Less tracks than the portable version..

That is just ridiculous, I would have been better buying a PSP to play GT on ???

This is the worst GT to ever hit the shelves.

But read that again...

Less tracks than the portable version

There better be some SERIOUS dlc for cheap or this will be the last GT I buy.

Obvious "quality over quantity" argument aside, what if GT6 ends up having everything you missed from GT5? Will it then be:

a) "they should have had that stuff in GT5, so PASS"

b) "they should have ____ and ____ also, so PASS"

c) "I wish I could buy it, but DARN IT they never updated GT5 the way I wanted so... PASS"

It's so fun to dissect these tantrums!

 

[dazzi]

No Seattle I grew up on that Track from GT2,GT3 and GT4, no Infineon and the El Capitan the track amount is pretty poor I have to say really poor.
Can I just add, I think rallying will have even less presence than in previous GT's even though it has so called 'wrc' licencing....

 

[capps]

Maybe thats why GT5 was delayed for a few weeks so they could add an extra track in so the list does not look so bad.

 

[ZZ-II]

I had to register me to write this:

@Polyphony Digital: This Tracklist is really really disappointing . All the great tracks from GT4 are missing...

Costa Di Amalfi
Cita Di Aria
Midfield Raceway
El Captain
Test Course

and more......guys, please give us these tracks as DLC!



i mean, we've 1031 cars ( ok, lots of great cars missing, like Koenigsegg etc...) BUT, only 27 Tracks is a bit crazy .


I hope the guys from Polyphony and/or Kaz. will read this Forum and give us some Information soon....

 

[scope72]

No Seattle I grew up on that Track from GT2,GT3 and GT4, no Infineon and the El Capitan the track amount is pretty poor I have to say really poor.
Can I just add, I think rallying will have even less presence than in previous GT's even though it has so called 'wrc' licencing....

That could be true.

It could also turn out to be completely wrong. We still haven't seen a WRC timed race on a randomly generated point-to-point. We haven't even heard a co-driver's voice.

So, I would definitely say the jury is still out on that one.

(I definitely want Seattle though) Edit: (and El Capitan) *cries*

 

[BORDER323]

Oh my...



Obvious "quality over quantity" argument aside, what if GT6 ends up having everything you missed from GT5? Will it then be:

a) "they should have had that stuff in GT5, so PASS"

b) "they should have ____ and ____ also, so PASS"

c) "I wish I could buy it, but DARN IT they never updated GT5 the way I wanted so... PASS"

It's so fun to dissect these tantrums!

Its funny..

If 'im having a tantrum, then take a look back through all the posts in this entire thread.. and contemplate its TITLE..

Then take 5 to have a think to yourself..

Seem's many more members than just lil old me share the same TANTRUM.

Anything constructive to add at all... or just a general "POP" at me was it ???

 

[shirakawaa]

Among other things, I was also expecting some fixed (not randomly generated), famous (or in a famous location) point-to-point tracks. Older Course Maker screenshots suggested there would have been some.

 

[II IVORBIGUN II]

The more I think about the track list the more im convinced we shall see DLC. If thats the case how much would you be willing to spend per track?

Personally I would pay £5 for a track and would even spend £10 for Spa.

Now before many say "im not paying for what should be in the game" what you have to remember is DLC is part of gaming these days. Like you I don't really agree with it and in my opinion EA are the worst offenders for abusing DLC. However it is part of gaming these days and a majority of developers/publishers do it.

I will add that i've paid £40 for video games that have had alot less content than GT5.

 

[Heath_1]

If I'm honest, I was a tad disappointed at the exclusion of some of the cars I wanted and also the tracks like Midfield and Test Track. But I'm pretty well over that now and satisfied with what I've seen on the list.

But as I said in the Latest News Thread I really don't believe either list is complete. Someone give me any reason as to why they would exclude Test Course? It lives up to it's name and has been in every Gran Turismo.. so why drop it now? Looking at the list I fail to see any other track that can be used as an alternative apart from SSR7 which.. really isn't an alternative to Test Course actually.

Overall at the moment I'm satisfied. If it turns out that the game has more than the lists say then I'll be even happier, but if not.. then so-be-it.

 

[Stune]

Ive never really been a fan of DLC for one simple reason. The tracks purchased don't have their part in the single player game so they tend to only be used online. I dont think it would be bad if they released a classic track pack with Apricot Hill, Midfield, New York, Infineon etc. If they were £5 each i sure would pick carefully which ones i get as all the tracks included in the game are equivalent to just under £1 per track.

 

[BORDER323]

The more I think about the track list the more im convinced we shall see DLC. If thats the case how much would you be willing to spend per track?

Personally I would pay £5 for a track and would even spend £10 for Spa.

Now before many say "im not paying for what should be in the game" what you have to remember is DLC is part of gaming these days. Like you I don't really agree with it and in my opinion EA are the worst offenders for abusing DLC. However it is part of gaming these days and a majority of developers/publishers do it.

I will add that i've paid £40 for video games that have had alot less content than GT5.

That's a good point , and i'm sure we all have title's in our PS3 library that are lacking in content. GT5 Prologue being one of them.... lol

And if i'm honest I would pay maybe £5 for DLC tracks, as long as it is NEW content. as you suggested SPA, that has never been in a GT game before and it would be great to have it, as with many other tracks, Hockenheim , Imola , Rockingham Raceway... the list is long.

But I fail to see how making you pay for OLD content is not in itself a DARN CHEEK, How many times are we going to have to purchase the same stuff over and over and over...

There is the need to regain costs on Sony and PD's part , This I totally get but at what point does it turn into GREED ?

If this sells 10 million copies, which it very well could do, at it's lowest cost of £38... how much do they have to RECOUP ???

IIRC, GT5 is reprted to have cost 80 million in total to make.... they stand to make a WEE bit more than that just in game sales alone. You still feel like putting your hand in your pocket....lol... I don't especially not for old content.

 

[scope72]

If I'm honest, I was a tad disappointed at the exclusion of some of the cars I wanted and also the tracks like Midfield and Test Track. But I'm pretty well over that now and satisfied with what I've seen on the list.

But as I said in the Latest News Thread I really don't believe either list is complete. Someone give me any reason as to why they would exclude Test Course? It lives up to it's name and has been in every Gran Turismo.. so why drop it now? Looking at the list I fail to see any other track that can be used as an alternative apart from SSR7 which.. really isn't an alternative to Test Course actually.

Overall at the moment I'm satisfied. If it turns out that the game has more than the lists say then I'll be even happier, but if not.. then so-be-it.

It does seem odd. There hasn't been a release of GT without some of these tracks.

And it feels like it's totally out of left field for me. Even if they tried to beat me over the head with 20/70.

 

[II IVORBIGUN II]

Ive never really been a fan of DLC for one simple reason. The tracks purchased don't have their part in the single player game so they tend to only be used online. I dont think it would be bad if they released a classic track pack with Apricot Hill, Midfield, New York, Infineon etc. If they were £5 each i sure would pick carefully which ones i get as all the tracks included in the game are equivalent to just under £1 per track.

Good point as I forgot any DLC would be missing from the single player.

Personally im happy with the track list because frankly i've become sick and tired of the tracks on Forza. Only so many times you can race around Maple Valley lol.

 

[TheROADKRAKEN]

Someone give me any reason as to why they would exclude Test Course?

It could be that the extremely basic design and one-dimensional usage was not jiving with the complexity of presentation that GT5 is going for. I do see the Test Track as an obvious choice for a free track download at some point.

Looking at the list I fail to see any other track that can be used as an alternative apart from SSR7 which.. really isn't an alternative to Test Course actually.

SSR7 seems like a much more interesting and engaging way to test top speed. I think it is a GREAT alternative.

 

[dazzi]

The development cost would have been covered by prologue sales as is, all money now is pure profit for Sony.

 

[BORDER323]

The development cost would have been covered by prologue sales as is, all money now is pure profit for Sony.

Ahh good point, I forgot about Prologue..

 

[SlipZtrEm]

SSR7 seems like a much more interesting and engaging way to test top speed. I think it is a GREAT alternative.

Top speed probably will be entertaining to test on SSR7, I'll give you that. My concern about Test Course's absence lies in the other Machine Tests though. 0-400 and 0-1000 metre tests were both great for determining gear tuning, and I liked using them just with stock cars for performance testing, much like you'd find in a magazine. Machine Test has been in every GT and I'd really be surprised if that particular tradition has been dropped.

As for the cost of DLC tracks... it depends. I'd gladly pay a good amount for Spa... but old tracks? On one hand I want them, so I'd want to pay for them. On the other hand, why didn't I get them in the first place? I guess it'd depend on how revamped they are; if I'm paying, they better not be simple port-overs of GT4 tracks (like Standard cars). Some updating would make the purchase far more likely, for me anyways.

 

[marchi]

Ive never really been a fan of DLC for one simple reason. The tracks purchased don't have their part in the single player game so they tend to only be used online. I dont think it would be bad if they released a classic track pack with Apricot Hill, Midfield, New York, Infineon etc. If they were £5 each i sure would pick carefully which ones i get as all the tracks included in the game are equivalent to just under £1 per track.

Maybe, but I don't think it would be that hard to implement new tracks in to GT mode races.

 

[ZZ-II]

It could be that the extremely basic design and one-dimensional usage was not jiving with the complexity of presentation that GT5 is going for. I do see the Test Track as an obvious choice for a free track download at some point.




SSR7 seems like a much more interesting and engaging way to test top speed. I think it is a GREAT alternative.

i really hope it's possible to make Top-Speed tests on SSR7.

And maybe it's possible to create a 10km long straight track in the Course-Maker. Or lets say at least a track with very "light" Curves like in SSR7 .

 

[Spagetti69]

Why can't the track editor thing be used for testing.
Can't be that hard to edit a track with no corners.

 

[BORDER323]

Why can't the track editor thing be used for testing.
Can't be that hard to edit a track with no corners.

I think because it wont have the 400m / 1000m markers on it that some people need to do tests on.

 

[GTR3mh]

I think because it wont have the 400m / 1000m markers on it that some people need to do tests on.

Wait, that reminds me. The very first licence test of the very first licence in every GT game has been a start-stop over 400m. Surely this would not change right? There's bound to be some alternative included in the game.

 

[Smoothherb]

You know that it is confirmed that there will be no dlc? I think as soon as GT5 hits and get it´s patches for some bugs ect. they start immediately to work on GT6.