Veyron: Disappointment?

  • Thread starter Thread starter zachthemaniac
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Well, to be honest the original Veyron was kind of shonky to drive. Yes, it was fast and luxurious (something that should have been shown to the player by making only the most complicated, technical, odds-beating automotive engineering feat of the new century a Premium, damn it) and even when going at top speed it is as stable as if it were a slot car. However, the engine noise was too detached from the occupants inside, the ride was bad and it handled as if it felt as heavy as it was. Physics dictated that these were the sacrifices that had to be made so the car wasn't unreliable or not worth its price at best and an unmanagable death trap at worst.

Yes, it has no racing history or anything outside of its technical achievements, its notoriety and its staggering costs, but I find that ironically it's because race car technology is now being surpassed by road car technology. Here is a car you could probably drive for hours in sumptuous comfort, then drive at a top speed higher than that of any racing machine designed today. There are people who make Bonneville streamliners to get up to these speeds but you wouldn't be able to drive a streamliner very far down your local streets would you?

What they should do sometime is introduce the Super Sports in a download with all those changes made to fix these things, and made it a Premium car to boot so we can really connect with all that artistry inside and out. Thing is, in GT5 we are not presented with the real car but a simulation on a television screen, so we can only judge on the details we're given. For all the Veyron's real-world accomplishments and accolades we can't really experience it and we can't even get as close as the Premium cars do. In GT5 there are Standards that simply drive better, put out faster laps and are genuine objects of desire, not things to have fanboyish fights about. It's the same reason I don't care about this X2010 vs FGT crap because both are just exercises designed to push the limits of what's supposed to be possible in motorsport and driver skill in general due to sheer capability. The fact that these kinds of discussions are so prevalent that people are now apparently codifying these things as stuff like "Gayron" threads seriously makes me want to hang up my keys and quit since I feel like we can't experience cars anymore for the sole reason of just because we can. Cars are what they are in GT5: they could have been more of this or that, but what we got is kind of all we can measure them by, and for that reason alone I can't come down on one side of the fence or the other.

Of course the Veyron isn't a perfect car, and what car truly is? However, given all that, if you want me to get to a conclusion that makes sense in this thread, I consider merely the fact it's a Standard and not a Premium a disappointment. It needed better representation in this game. Even if it performed exactly the same way the player should have been introduced to its world. Ferdinand Piesch had an absolutely insane vision for a supercar that probably should not have been physically or economically possible, but here it is, and its name is the Bugatti Veyron.
 
I guess most people who play GT5 online are children and annoy you then?

Yes they are, and yes they do. But it's not limited to GT5. That's my opinion of pretty much the majority of players I meed online in ANY game.

The rest of your comment seems to be based upon you thinking that I believethe Veyron is a good car. It's not. Not really. But it CAN win the Daytone Like the Wind race.

My opinion of kids who use "gay" as a perjorative has nothing to do with my thoughts on the Veyron. Other than them being roughly equivalent. :)
 
All of the other cars you win are useless, why not this one? I found that out early on with the Shelby Cobra.

On the other hand, I used the Cobra to win several races in both A & B Spec and find it incredibly fun (and demanding) to drive.

Everyone's mileage will vary.

That being said, yeah, 90% of the cars you win are useless in other races and/or just no fun to drive.
 
Yes they are, and yes they do. But it's not limited to GT5. That's my opinion of pretty much the majority of players I meed online in ANY game.

The rest of your comment seems to be based upon you thinking that I believethe Veyron is a good car. It's not. Not really. But it CAN win the Daytone Like the Wind race.

My opinion of kids who use "gay" as a perjorative has nothing to do with my thoughts on the Veyron. Other than them being roughly equivalent. :)

If something annoys you then leave. I could careless on what you think about others. Quit thinking you know peoples ages because they use a word. No one wants a stuck up like you around anyways. The rest about the car in my post wasn't for you anyways. Just the first part about you being annoyed by small things in life.
 
Veyron a big car

It may be the fastest car out there, but it most certainly isn't the best.
Speed isn't everything, especially when this car weighs a lot.
 
On the other hand, I used the Cobra to win several races in both A & B Spec and find it incredibly fun (and demanding) to drive.

Everyone's mileage will vary.

That being said, yeah, 90% of the cars you win are useless in other races and/or just no fun to drive.

Don't get me wrong. The Cobra has always been a favorite car of mine and I love it to death, but for every race you can win with it, there are five cars that can do it better. If you completely trick out the '07 GT Mustang, it will kick the Cobra's ass.

I got to ride in a real Cobra once and it scared the crap out of me. That was a 289 Cobra; I can only imagine what a beast the 427 is...
 
Exactly and the topgear track is setup more for the faster accelerating cars. Which is why I said the Veyron did good as it did on that track. It didn't really show how good it does in the corners at all really. Though the topgear america test track only has one really one long straight.

Show me what race track, other than a large oval or similar that doesn't suit a car that accelerates well.
 
Anyone read this yet?

Gordon Murray, designer of the McLaren F1 (which for many years was the fastest production car ever built) said the following about the Bugatti Veyron in UK auto magazine evo during its development period:
The most pointless exercise on the planet has got to be this four-wheel-drive thousand-horsepower Bugatti. I think it's incredibly childish this thing people have about just one element—top speed or standing kilometre or 0–60. It's about as narrow minded as you can get as a car designer to pick on one element. It's like saying we're going to beat the original Mini because we're going to make a car 10mph faster on its top speed—but it's two foot longer and 200 kilos heavier. That's not car designing—that just reeks of a company who are paranoid...
Murray later brought up and criticized Volkswagen for "scamming" car buyers in the 90s for buying the cheapest parts possible for the production of Jettas and Golfs, allowing Volkswagen to make a larger profit off their car sales, funding the construction of the Bugatti Veyron. However, Murray was impressed with the Veyron's engine and transmission after he test drove one for Road and Track magazine.

I mean he clearly says the car is only good for straight line top speed. He has a point as well. Without the Veyron holding the top speed record, its just nothing. When the new SSC car comes out makes me wonder what VW would do.

Someone said early in the forums that he liked the car. Which it doesn't seem like he liked it so much at all.
I said that:
"The real disappointment is it doesn't feel that quick in a normal road situation. Oh, once you're going there's loads of torque then power and the acceleration that goes with it, but there's turbo lag and far too much rotating mass. But they've done some amazing things with it. On the track, the chuckability, steering, and braking shine."

"Bugatti says it's not a track car but a road car. But I enjoyed it more on the track than in the mountains. If I had one, that's all I'd do with it--take mates to the track and give them rides, show them what 1001 horsepower feels like when the turbos get going--and what the brakes are like. It's brilliant at that."
Source: http://www.motortrend.com/future/sp...i_veyron_concept/gordon_murray_interview.html


The actual "problem" with the Veyron is this: you don't feel the speed. People say it's a slouch in corners - it isn't. If you go round a corner in GT5 and look at your speedo, you'll notice you're actually going pretty fast. This fact is cloaked however by the staight line acceleration which also includes that you arrive at corners with a much higher speed than with other cars. This gives you the feeling that you're basically just nursing it around the corner, rolling slowly. But you aren't. Take another high performance street car, go around the same corner and compare the cornering speed. You might be in for a surprise.

2nd problem: too many people hate the Veyron. That means that they will talk it down no matter what and are not willing to accept or even try for themselves in GT5 what it is capable of. Prejudice unfortunately is a typical attribute of a human being - sad, but true.
 
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Hi all :) Yes, the Veyron is way to heavy to do anything other than straight lines well, and
i was disappointed that it wasn't a premium in GT5

But when you get out of a turn, get it pointing straight and open it up...

Whoooeee, sure feels good! :cool:
 
An undriveable heap? You are all complaining and talking as if you drive one for real. On the contrary, even purist motoring magazines are captivated by the Veyron and it's immense capabilities. They of course acknowledge the fundamental facts, (it's great weight) but then, the GT-R is not so different in philosophy - high weight offset by high traction.

You can weight-reduce it to ~1300kg and it becomes a little more suitable for racing :lol: Far from perfect, obviously, but spectacular and challenging to drive well. The perception of understeer is far greater than the actual understeer, due to the epic speed it gathers.

In short, if you can't enjoy this car for what it is, and expect it to stop and switch directions as fast as it goes forwards, you need a physics lesson. It's pretty incredible for what it is IMO.
 
There's another thing regarding the Veyron in GT5. In my experience, GT5 makes the most extreme difference in high speed downforce (or lack thereof) in the history of the series yet. This means that race cars with their downforce-optimized bodywork and huge wings will have an excellent roadholding at high speeds, while street vehicles without any of those things will suffer greatly. Of course this is realistic, but I never felt this difference as intense as I feel it in GT5.

One car that suffers specifically from this is the Veyron. The reasons are obvious: you reach very high speeds very fast, and you can't fit any aerodynamic parts to it. You can of course increase the mechanical grip by using softer tire compounds, but they only work when the tires have a good connection to the road surface. This is exactly the thing which suffers when you do high speeds, and this will introduce extreme differences in grip. One moment you have the perfect grip of a soft racing tire, then there's a minor bump, and suddenly you have no more control over the car whatsoever. This means that by fitting a better tire, you're spreading the difference between "drivable" and "undrivable" even wider.

A racecar doesn't have this problem because the downforce pushes it and its tires down onto the road, and other road cars don't have this problem because they simply don't go as fast as quickly as the Veyron does.
 
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When they demo'd the veyron at le mans last year the car ran out of brakes by the end o the mulsanne straight. So it wasn't designed for track use but to be the ultimate road car. This was the philosophy of the f1.
 
When they demo'd the veyron at le mans last year the car ran out of brakes by the end o the mulsanne straight. So it wasn't designed for track use but to be the ultimate road car. This was the philosophy of the f1.

The Veyron follows a completely different philosophy than the F1. The F1 was designed to be the fastest road car arpund a track, the ultimate, road going driving machine.
The Veyron, on the other ahdn, was designed to be as fast as a luxurious car can be. An engineering masterpiece in and of itself, but vastly different from the philosophy of the F1. That car doesn't know luxury at all :lol:
 
The Veyron follows a completely different philosophy than the F1. The F1 was designed to be the fastest road car arpund a track, the ultimate, road going driving machine.
The Veyron, on the other ahdn, was designed to be as fast as a luxurious car can be. An engineering masterpiece in and of itself, but vastly different from the philosophy of the F1. That car doesn't know luxury at all :lol:

lol. yeah. :lol:

i remember seeing a vid of tiff having to wear a headset and mic just so you can hear him (and talk with your other 2 passengers).
 
I tried this car a bit with a DS3 when I first got it, fully modded, and hated it, but kept it. Christmas I got a DFGT, and today I tried driving this monster for the first time since those irritating test runs with the controller. The wheel makes this car more than drivable. 3:00 Sarthe (no chicane) times I can improve on a bit and 8:00 at the 24hr Nurburgring, crash free. Not bad. Stock suspension setting but lowered it a little, front toe -.30, locked rear LSD (60) and 2 degrees camber for those times. TCS1, ABS 3 at 5/5 brake. Im not sure how good they are but they felt good and the Nurburg time got me the win online with 10 on track, they were surprised a Veyron did so well, so was I. I'll be using this more an more now.
 
I have used my (admittedly fully upgraded) Veyron a lot. Mostly on the Extreme Euro Rome race for some quick money (and the car was quick). Admittedly the handling was terrible at one point but a Chassis Overhaul (also did the Engine to be consistent) sorted that (it had only done about 1400 miles) and it was back to its normal self again!
 
The perception of understeer is far greater than the actual understeer...
It does understeer a tad on the power, but no doubt the adjustable vcd would cure this with something like a 15/85 front/rear split?
 
I really enjoy driving the Veyron. I painted mine brilliant white, and performed all modifications as well as installing race mediums. It's a great car to drive now.
 
The Veyron follows a completely different philosophy than the F1. The F1 was designed to be the fastest road car arpund a track, the ultimate, road going driving machine.
The Veyron, on the other ahdn, was designed to be as fast as a luxurious car can be. An engineering masterpiece in and of itself, but vastly different from the philosophy of the F1. That car doesn't know luxury at all :lol:

The F1 was designed to be both the ultimate performance road car and a luxury day to day car, that is why it has luggage space and is smaller than the other supercars of the time (XJ220 and Lamborghini Diablo were massive beasts, wide and long), though not obviously taking the luxury road car part quite as litteral as Bugatti did with the Veyron. But it was for those design reasons that when racing they eventually had to redesign the car to compete with its rivals which had been designed specifically as race cars, longer for better aerodynamics, the Longtail version is the result and i think its a bit of a monstrosity and i am glad that Mclaren did not go down that route with the initial design.

. To say though that it was not aimed for top speed and that it was aimed as a track performance road car.... Exactly what track would you need a car that is geared to do 231mph, or 240mph with the limiter off?

You gotta ask yourself this, if it was the ultimate track car it would have been geared a lot shorter, you can kid yourself all you want but im pretty sure Mclaren had its eyes set on being the fastest top speed road car, and dont get me wrong I think that is fine, when i was a kid i thought it was the best thing in the world being the fastest car and it was one of the things that got me so interested in it.


Back on the Veyron, i think for what it is.. a 2 tonne car, it is nothing short of amazing, the fact that it is actually good on a track and that it can accelerate so fast while being one of the fattest cars on the road is just mind boggling. In the game it doesnt feel great to drive, but it has so much traction and power that it really is quite fast around a track, if you time it you will see that for yourself. Sure there are cars that have less power that will outperform it, but you gotta go back to thinkin about what it is.... Imagine the fattest kid in your school as a child, now imagine that kid also being one of the fastest runners.. Thats what the Veyron is, its the fat kid who really can shift his weight.

The Super Sport Veyron, now that thing is a lot better, obviously the extra 200bhp is a part of that, and to be honest it is a ridiculous ammount of power, but they have improved the performance of that even further and that was evident with its top gear lap time. Sure again it has a massive power advantage over the other cars on the list, but its still a fatty, id put a bet if the car lost some weight and dropped some power with it, it would be a beast of a track car.
 
The Veyron follows a completely different philosophy than the F1. The F1 was designed to be the fastest road car arpund a track, the ultimate, road going driving machine.
The Veyron, on the other ahdn, was designed to be as fast as a luxurious car can be. An engineering masterpiece in and of itself, but vastly different from the philosophy of the F1. That car doesn't know luxury at all :lol:

Name me a Supercar that comes with bespoke luggage made by Louis Vitton. A custom made entertainment system by Kenwood. and come with space for more than 1 passenger? Other than the Mclaren F1 there isn't. Both are the ultimate car not ultimate sports or touring car just the best car.
 
Veyron and Mclaren arent the best car, they are Maximum speed cars for me, just shiny toy for overrich people. I value a lot more a Porsche GT3 RS or a NSX type-R than a Mclaren F1 or a Veyron, which will never be on track, just on bilionaire garage. They are designed to be the fastest street legal cars, not the fastest around a track, just the fastest on straight line. So for me they aren the best at all, just the most powerfull which is not that impressive or important for me. And they arent ultimate at all. Mclaren F1 could be argue because it did very well in racing and was the only GT1 cars that could match the crazy Aero of the SuperGT cars when it was on track.

Veyron is just a toy for rich people. Wont ever see it in a race or something.
 
Mine has 1100 (and something) bhp, problem was that it wouldn't corner properly, But fixed this with various technical settings, that basically make it rear wheel drive and stick to the road 👍

Edit: How come no one has thought of tuning this thing? It can handles great when you do
 
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I won the Veyron a couple of weeks ago and never bothered to even check it. It's sitting in my garage with 0 Kms.

That's how big my expectations are.
 
Not surprised at the bad handling considering it weighs the best part of 2 tonnes! It's really fast in a straight line but cornering is a big fail!
 
I'm not disappointed at all, it behaves exactly how I expected an over weight over powered 4wd car to behave. If the topgear test track is anything to go by it should be expected, as the veyron needs around 400 hp extra to beat real super cars.
 
I think I'm going to do some testing on actual corner speeds to demonstrate where the Veyron really stands. I doubt that it's going to ultimately shut up the haters, but one's gotta do something, right?
 
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