Virgin Australia Supercars Championship - Archive

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Holden or Ford

  • Holden

    Votes: 209 36.2%
  • Ford

    Votes: 175 30.3%
  • Ford and Holden

    Votes: 64 11.1%
  • Nismo

    Votes: 74 12.8%
  • Erebus

    Votes: 7 1.2%
  • Nismo and Erebus

    Votes: 6 1.0%
  • Volvo

    Votes: 43 7.4%

  • Total voters
    578
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Yeah, leave the commentary to the ex-drivers. Skaife, Neil and Larko really bounce of each other very well.
Dunno how much sheet metal gets dented and bented between the 3 each race weekend, any idea? :D ;)

Well, now that they've gotten they fill of Adel-ade(like lemonade ;)), it's on to Hamilton, NZ with a weekend stopover at Melbourne for 3 non-championship races beforehand.
 
Clipsal 500 on SPEED right now!! (-6:00 US) Murray is surrounded by 20 beautiful women lol i love him
 
The sunday race was very interesting for the 2010 clipsal. I had to attend even with chronic tonsilitis. Bugger about Lowndes and Whincup though
 
Yesterday, I was finally able to watch the V8Supercar race from Adelaide on Speed Channel.

Great race on a great track in my opinion!

It would be great fun to see the race in person.

I wish they would televise the entire race though, instead of about half.

Jamie Wincup is surely going to be tough to beat this year. Once again he was running up front all race long. And might have won both races without the seemingly poor pit strategy of not replacing all four tires on the last stop.

Does anyone else feel that the "black flag" should have been rescinded once the offending part fell off Wincup's car?

Initially, I think that the black flag was warranted since there was a loose bumper cover, but once it fell off there should have been no reason to make Wincup pit. Now if Wincup had already driven past the pit entrance once while the black flag was flying, then I'm sure the rules would still require a pit. Does anyone remember if Wincup drove past the pit while the black flag was flying?

GTsail
 
AFAIK, Once a Black Flag is Issued, it has to be fulfilled, it is a safety issue.

It was great to see the race in person, (I did in 2005) but you are extremely view limited, although it was great atmosphere, I probably won't go again.
 
.....It was great to see the race in person, (I did in 2005) but you are extremely view limited, although it was great atmosphere, I probably won't go again.

On TV it looks like a nice tight track with plenty of action over the 3.2 km. Do trees/buildings and grandstands get in the way of seeing the track?

Turn eight looks like a great place to pick up a spare left side mirror for your own Holden or Ford.

GTsail
 
On TV it looks like a nice tight track with plenty of action over the 3.2 km. Do trees/buildings and grandstands get in the way of seeing the track?
all depends on where you stand / sit. However most of the track has giant screens you can see the rest of the action on.

Turn eight looks like a great place to pick up a spare left side mirror for your own Holden or Ford.
Turn eight, i think they say is one of the best corners on the Supercar Calender. Pesonally I like the kink at the end of conrod at bathurst leading in to the chase. But Turn 8 does catch some fantastic vision of how close drivers are to the wall every lap.

This weekene see's the little stop over for the Aussie F1 grand prix. Holden definately have the advantage over Ford this year, (because it goes on Holden v's Ford). Cars are like 19 Holden and 10 Fords.
 
Cars are like 19 Holden and 10 Fords.
It's not really a major advantage. If you look at the final results for the races, you'll see the bottom places are usually occupied by the likes of Daniel Gaunt, Tony Ricciardello and so on. There's like four or five Holdens who are usually at the very back, so to say Holden has an advantage because they have more cars is wrong.
 
This weekene see's the little stop over for the Aussie F1 grand prix. Holden definately have the advantage over Ford this year, (because it goes on Holden v's Ford). Cars are like 19 Holden and 10 Fords.
I can just see Ford supporters holding up sign or wearing t-shirts that say "Give the poor little birdies a chance". :dopey:

Also, they'll be revealing their "Car of the Future" next week. So I'm wondering what expectation do you have of what they'll be showing?
 
It's not really a major advantage. If you look at the final results for the races, you'll see the bottom places are usually occupied by the likes of Daniel Gaunt, Tony Ricciardello and so on. There's like four or five Holdens who are usually at the very back, so to say Holden has an advantage because they have more cars is wrong.
Just because my opinion does not match yours, does not mean it is wrong.
I know the likes of Gaunt, Ricciardello and so on drive Holdens and that they are usually at the back.
But It is (IMO) still an advantage unless Holdens take themselves out.
If it was 15 Ford and 14 Holden, then Ford would have an advantage.

I can just see Ford supporters holding up sign or wearing t-shirts that say "Give the poor little birdies a chance". :dopey:
Rolling on the floor with that one.


Also, they'll be revealing their "Car of the Future" next week. So I'm wondering what expectation do you have of what they'll be showing?
My expectation is that it will win, Would not that be the expectiation of all Ford Supporters :sly:
 
Just because my opinion does not match yours, does not mean it is wrong.
I'm not saying you're wrong simply because you disagree with me. I'm saying Holden don't have an advantage because while they might have more cars, a fair number of them are at the back. If there were thirty cars on the grid and twenty-nine of them were Holden, but the Ford was the only car that ever won, would Holden still have an advantage? Holden's advantage doesn't come from its overall numbers, but from the number of cars they have at the front.

Also, they'll be revealing their "Car of the Future" next week. So I'm wondering what expectation do you have of what they'll be showing?
I'm not expecting much. I've heard they might be looking at running smaller cars so that the Falcon vs. Commodore line-up would become Focus vs. Cruze, but to be perfectly honest, I expect most of the changes would be internal. The objective of the Car of the Future program is to minimise the costs associated with building a car to make it easier for smaller teams to get their foot in their door and be competitive sooner.
 
I'm not saying you're wrong simply because you disagree with me. I'm saying Holden don't have an advantage because while they might have more cars, a fair number of them are at the back. If there were thirty cars on the grid and twenty-nine of them were Holden, but the Ford was the only car that ever won, would Holden still have an advantage? Holden's advantage doesn't come from its overall numbers, but from the number of cars they have at the front.

point taken :)
 
Isn't Melbourne Red vs Blue on the grid anyway? I.e. If a Ford qualifies on pole then all the Fords start on that side of the track and all the Holdens start on the other side of the track? That'd force the bottom 10 cars to be Holdens regardless of how who qualifies where.
 
Car of the Future has been released!
Car of the Future released

With the release of Car of the Future today (Monday), the future of V8 Supercars has been secured while the door has been left open for more manufacturers to join the category.

At Melbourne’s Crown Casino this morning, V8 Supercar Executive Chairman Tony Cochrane and head of the Car of the Future plan, Mark Skaife, unveiled what is set to ensure the sport continues its impressive growth.

An outline of the primary targeted areas under Car of the Future (CoF) was released, covering chassis, engine, suspension and steering, wheels, tyres, brakes, cooling, fuel system, electronics, aero and safety.

The CoF will consist of a control floor plan and roll cage with minor variation to accommodate various bodywork. It will be easier to produce and come in a flat pack kit form.

As V8SA has stated numerous times in the past, powerplants must be normally aspirated V8 configurations.

V8SA is currently finalising the details of an Engine Equalisation Program for any variant from manufacturers that could co-exist with the current V8 Ford and Holden engines.

While front suspension and steering is generally unchanged from Project Blueprint, CoF features control independent rear suspension and uprights and 18 inch wheels.

The Holinger mid mounted gearbox remains unchanged but the move from a spool to Detroit locker rear differential will be investigated.

Brakes, cooling and fuel system will all be controlled along with the chassis loom, control engine looms control ECU and logger.

The control ECU will allow for reduced fuel consumption during pitstops and yellow flag periods which is in line with new technology in road cars.

Body work must be substantially representative of the production car model, with aero parity maintained and bio composites will be introduced.

In terms of safety, V8SA is working with the FIA on improving the driver seat and position, glass will be banned and polycarbonate windscreens used instead, the fuel tank will be shifted from the car boot to in front of the rear axle for improved safety and fire resistant coatings on selected composites items has been flagged. The target vehicle mass sits at 1200 to 1250 kilograms.

Cochrane described this morning’s launch as a “history making moment”.

“For a long time V8 Supercars has been regarded as the most prestigious and admired touring car category in the world,” he said.

“The motorsport and motoring worlds have been watching this announcement very closely as it a massive opportunity for our sport to step up on several levels and attract a wider audience.

”Mark’s plan is a collaboration of future building, business analysis, SWOT planning, common sense and a serious look at how we make the sport more cost effective for our major stakeholders, teams, but retain the very core of our success – terrific and exciting V8 Supercar racing.”

Skaife said CoF was about protecting the DNA of the current competition as well as expanding horizons in a changing industry landscape.

“This means redefining regulations to promote what we believe is Australia’s greatest motorsport category in ensuring that our drivers and teams continue to excel and provide a competitive and entertaining Championship Series,” he said.

“Our open shopfront policy will be based on potentially attracting additional manufacturers. We want to open the door to genuine high volume production, four-door sedans which will be configured as V8 rear wheel drive race cars under strict parity arrangements to compete equally against Falcons and Commodores.

“Any V8 engine can potentially be used where a manufacturer can modify one of its family V8 power-plants or utilise an existing category V8 Supercar engine. Who knows, this may open the door to teams fielding Nissans, Toyotas, Hyundais, Mazdas … whatever!”

Skaife’s master plan compliments the Project Blueprint parity system designed to maintain equality amongst the current Ford and Holden-based Series but also enables numerous other manufacturers to consider using the V8 Supercar Championship Series as a racing and marketing platform.

“This is evolution, not revolution,” Skaife said.

“Parity is something we are very good at in V8 land to ensure technical equivalency between vehicles and it has not been an issue with our Ford and Holden teams.

“The Triple Eight team’s successful switch between makes from last year to this year with minimum fuss is a classic example.”

Skaife said like NASCAR and Formula One, cost containment is also a vital aspect to ensure the future health of the category.

“We now have in place a plan to reduce the cost of a rolling chassis by around 25 per cent and further control costs of vehicle running, repair and engine development,” he said.

“Everybody knows that motorsport is an expensive business but we can’t afford to price ourselves out of our own market.

“The nature of motorsport has long been that if the money is there it can, and will, be spent. Controlling those costs is a critical path forward.

“As such, a comprehensive component evaluation matrix has been formulated for implementation over specific target dates.

“We have applied a proper business case analysis in an effort to curb dollars spent, as the cost of winning a Championship has roughly doubled in the last 15 years.

“The big picture here is that we already have a very successful sporting product that nonetheless must make headway in the future by remaining relevant to stakeholders, the car industry, team sponsors and our legion of fans – as well as do what we do best, put on a great show for the fans and our worldwide viewers.”

All teams and the V8 Supercars Australia Board have rubber stamped the Car of the Future plan, with the majority of the component changes to be introduced either by or in 2012.

And not only that, but there's an ambitious plan for 2012 and beyond:
V8’s future plans

Two new races in Australia and events in Korea, Hong Kong, Singapore, India and South Africa, are to be considered as the V8 Supercars Australia Board decides on the future shape of the sport.

V8 Supercars Australia will discuss its plans at a board meeting to be held on Monday following the Clipsal 500 in Adelaide.

Chairman Tony Cochrane told BigPond Sport that the Car of the Future has occupied the minds of Board members for the past year and now it will be able to focus clearly on the future direction of the category over the next five years.

The Car of the Future regulations will be announced in Melbourne in a fortnight (see separate story).

“Now that we have got Car of the Future virtually put to bed, the Board is now looking at where we can take the Championship over the next five years and we want to make sure that vision fits in with the Car of the Future vision,” Cochrane said.

He said that he hopes the Board will be in a position to reveal those future plans at the Sydney Telstra 500 in December.

“I am presenting a paper on that on Monday and we will move forward on that with a view to have a decision on that by Sydney this year,” he said.

Cochrane said the international expansion of the Championship would be high on the agenda in Board discussions.

“We have got people speaking to us about two new venues in Australia, (and events in) Korea, Hong Kong, Singapore, India, South Africa,” he said.

“We have six months to work out as a sport how we are going to go forward beyond Car of the Future.”
 
Cool, the cars are even getting lighter by some 100kg or more, I wonder what the new Bathurst lap record will drop to.:sly: I also wonder how they'll compare to GT2 and GT1 cars now.:drool: This is interesting, Greg Murphy could, if the record doesn't drop this or next year, hold the lap record for V8 Supercars as they are now for ever and a day.:eek: It's a shame we don't know which manufacturers might enter. I don't think Mazda will, they don't have a sedan big enough to stretch over the control chassis and roll cage.;) And would Nissan really enter with a Maxima? I doubt it, maybe a Skyline sedan though.
 
Well, the artwork on the offical V8 Supercars website shows a mock-up of a Nissan and what looks like a Toyota.

I think the biggest challenge the sport will face will be getting the new teams in. The cars might be cheaper, but they're not going to enter if only one or two drivers elect to use it. And they're also probably going to want a big team to run with them. I doubt they'd be keen on the Dean Fiores and Tony Ricciardellos of the grid being their flagship drivers (I think I've made this point before). The only possible solutions that I can think of would be to a) open the grid up to more than thirty cars and/or b) limit the number of cars that a manufacturer can enter.
 
I also wonder how they'll compare to GT2 and GT1 cars now.
I'd imagine the CoF would not be anywhere near GT1 (perhaps somewhat near GT2 class) pace, the current V8 Supercar is barely faster than the GT3 cars (fairly equal on some circuits). Even with 100kg less, the CoF probably wont produce downforce levels anywhere near the GT class cars, but this is all assumption as there's no mention of larger/more advanced aero than today.

limit the number of cars that a manufacturer can enter.
Yeah, that's what I was going to suggest, the same case in FIA GT1 and GT3.
 
I'd imagine the CoF would not be anywhere near GT1 (perhaps somewhat near GT2 class) pace, the current V8 Supercar is barely faster than the GT3 cars (fairly equal on some circuits). Even with 100kg less, the CoF probably wont produce downforce levels anywhere near the GT class cars, but this is all assumption as there's no mention of larger/more advanced aero than today.

I would tend to agree on the ultimate pace, but if you read the article again there is a mention of revised aero capabilities. Since we're actually talking IRS and less weight now, it's possible to have a huge leap in pace. My other line of thinking involves that in order to help cut costs power may drop a little? But then they talk about parity matching to existing engines, so perhaps it will stay the same.:)
 
Yeah, that's what I was going to suggest, the same case in FIA GT1 and GT3.
It's the most logical solution. They're looking to expand the championship to include races in India and Korea in particular, and the only circuits I can think of that fit the profile would be the new Jaypee Group Circuit and the Korean International Circuit. They're also looking to races in Hong Kong, Singapore and two new ones in Australia. I'm guessing that means that some of the smaller domestic circuits will be phased out, espeically if they're being built from scratch. I've heard rumours the Supercars may be a support act for the Singapore Grand Prix (except that the weekend falls between the V8 SuperCARnivale and Bathurst), but also that they're building a circuit at Changi specifically for the V8s and MotoGP. The only unknown is Kyalami, though I know the new Superstars Series had a race with a very full grid there recently. So it could be possible to expand the grid beyond thirty cars without putting strain on the pits. Yu might be able to get as many as forty cars, though that is wishful thinking on my part.

What I wouldn't mind seeing is a "V8 Supercars World Championship" with a similar system to the English Premier League. You'd have national or regional championships run to the V8 Supercar two-marque formula - Australia would be Ford vs. Holden, Asia would have Nissan vs. Toyota, Europe could have Mercedes vs. Vauxhall (rebadged Commodres), South Africa could have whaever is available in those markets (ie Nissan vs. Toyota) - each with their own championship. At the end of the year, the top teams from each regional series are promoted to the top tier, an international championship, with new teams allowed to fill the void left by the departing teams. At the end of each international season, the top team from each region would be allowed entry to the international series, at the expense of one of the established teams, who get demoted to their regional championship and have to fight their way back in, kind of like the Divisions in football. But in order for that to work, you'd have to get Asian and European and African teams into the game. The problem is that you'd be directly competing with SuperGT and DTM, and both of those have advanced to the point of silhouette series.
 
Gotta love V8 Supercar fans live at the track. ;) I remember similiar moments to this at Oran Park on the final corner hill (The hill of atmosphere that one was). This is the sort of thing you don't hear on TV.



You'll notice as soon as Ingall locks the rears, you hear the crowd, I think it's awesome. :lol:
 
Best atmosphere Ive experienced was the first year the V8s came to Pukekohe (2001) it was the first year of TKR when they were going up the field being in the TKR supporters area (outside the hairpin) and the whole grandstand going nuts when either car went past still got the autographed hat somewhere and my HRT shirt that was also signed by Jason Richards, Angus Fogg (least said about him in V8 supercars the better, though does well in NZV8s) and rare on a Holden Shirt Paul Radisch (stating to fade badly but still ledgible), Craig Lowndes (00 Falcon) and Dick Johnson.
 
So another Hamilhole round went past and yet again its a Whingecup Double victory, with Tander the best of the rest yet again. Why is it Whingecup drives off into the distance time after time? Engine Horsepower with the Cripple 8 engines a full 25kw more than the rest of the field. It's a case of whoever has the biggest chequebook wins as is the case in F1 and WRC when the only way another team can win is if the leader has a problem (less of a case in F1).

Anyway back to the racing a bad time for the kiwis on home soil with Van Gisbergen after being quick in practice has a shocker Qual 1 and ends up in 20th then gets taken out at turn 3 even worse for him as it started to rain and he is THE driver in the rain. Murphy after topping the timesheets when downhill as soon as the track rubbered up ie more grip with results out of the top ten more was expected of NZs favorite son

Drives of the weekend ( & winner of the nearly mentioned award) was both of the GRM boys Caruso and Holdsfield getting 3rd and 4th in the 2nd race of the weekend. If either Cripple 8 or Tander falter look for these two to fill in the gap

Hard Luck of the weekend went to Craig Lowndes his teammate goes out and wipes the floor with everyone with a 75% sucess rate (6 out of 8) he's driving the absolute wheels off that car and ends up nowhere, if they do have equal cars then they would both have to be Whincups cars setup for him

N.B Not president of Jamie Whingecups or Cripple 8's fanclub
 
Gotta love V8 Supercar fans live at the track. ;) I remember similiar moments to this at Oran Park on the final corner hill (The hill of atmosphere that one was). This is the sort of thing you don't hear on TV.



You'll notice as soon as Ingall locks the rears, you hear the crowd, I think it's awesome. :lol:


The funniest thing of all of that Madison is those same fans who were booing Rusty would now be kissing his arse because he's back in a Holden. Thats how fickle the Supercar crowd is. Hell, one of my mates who has supported Ford for the best part of a decade has now gone to Holden with 888...... me? I'll stick with the Fords and DJR now thanks.... was a 888 fan, but they can bite me now. But all of this doesn't mean that i can't respect the way Whincup is going about his business at the moment, he's just on another planet at the moment. Like him or hate on him, you gotta respect skills.
 
It's certainly turning into the much lauded prospect of a Holden white-wash this season. After the Middle East I thought Winterbottom may have been able to keep the pressure on Whincup, but alas back on home turf he's died out. Ironically the only guy who has shown any possible chance of challenging Buttercup, err, Whincup, already has his championship in ruins. (Tander for those who haven't figured that out). If he didn't receive that lame arsed penalty, followed by a wheel nut falling off in the next race, he would have done well in Dubai, coming 2nd or 3rd in both races. *Sigh* I still just don't feel right about 888, I'd much prefer it be HRT winning, and GRM as well.
At least the enduros will be interesting, with main drivers not allowed to pair together. I also have to wonder what has happened to Will Davison in the off season, from 2nd place in the championship to unable to challenge anyone for anything.:(

I think it will be more interesting to see if anyone other than Tander or Whincup wins a race, and even more interesting if a Ford wins.
 
My moneys on PD to pull off the upset ford win
 
Hmm, I don't know, I think Polyphony Digital usually stick to Japanese cars, especially Nissan.:lol:
My bet is on Courtney or Winterbottom, but probably Courtney.......on a street circuit too.
 
If it rains then Van Gisbergen is hard to beat BUT that is if it does rain
 
WOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!
GO GARTH TANDER!
Hes on pole.
 
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