Why do front wheel drive cars swerve?

[T51R]

Anyone like to shed some light on why front wheel drives seem to get all squirrelly when drag racing? What is it in the tune that makes this happen if anyone knows?

 

[huhobanut]

Torque steer ....

 

[Trybal]

Toe. If you ever read/knew anything about cars.

 

[T51R]

Toe. If you ever read/knew anything about cars.

On GT5 this is the cause?

 

[Trybal]

Yes. If using conventional FF toe, it causes the car to be unable to drive in a straight line. As that is what toe is used for in real life.

 

[ITCC_Andrew]

Yes. If using conventional FF toe, it causes the car to be unable to drive in a straight line. As that is what toe is used for in real life.

I think that's way too over-simplified, but, that's a valid answer.


Problem is, that's not the only usage for toe. It also is used to make cars more stable in a straight line (albeit by a hundredth or two of a degree) on street cars, to make them that tidbit safer (in case someone, ummm, falls asleep while texting and driving while drunk, on a slippery, icy road.) The toe adds a tiny bit of "deadzone" to the steering of a street car, that helps keep the street car in its lane.

On race cars, it's a tuning adjustment that makes the car handle better.

 

[Trybal]

Very true. Which is why I limited it to FF drag cars on GT5 like he asked. But true, its proper use is to become stable and help turn in.

 

[ITCC_Andrew]

Very true. Which is why I limited it to FF drag cars on GT5 like he asked. But true, its proper use is to become stable and help turn in.

Yeah, I'm not planning on arguing, just adding some more helpful info. Just because it's the drag racing forum, doesn't mean that all of the info must be strictly relevant to drag racing, at the cost of saying something that's not 100% correct in regards to a different form of motorsport. That's all I'm getting at.

 

[Mikeybc]

I just figured it was all of that negative rear toe, never noticed squirlyness on the speed test though, guess physics are still a little different there ?

 

[AngelsDemon]

I just figured it was all of that negative rear toe, never noticed squirlyness on the speed test though, guess physics are still a little different there ?

It does swerve on SSRX after the 500 M mark if you keep it floored, not as bad as Indy but it still does it. This is just my experience though.

 

[dr_slump]

I just figured it was all of that negative rear toe, never noticed squirlyness on the speed test though, guess physics are still a little different there ?

Steer once and it will.

 

[cgg]

I thought you were a top class FWD tuner? You don't even know why they get squirrelly? That's rather funny.

 

[T51R]

I thought you were a top class FWD tuner? You don't even know why they get squirrelly? That's rather funny.

Better than you and your friends mate. What's the problem?

 

[cgg]

It's just a bit odd. Tuners normally know about the cause of problems etc. Considering you say your so fast, I would expect you to know.

Oh by the way, I don't think that I have ever stated that I'm a good tuner, or that I'm better than you. I used to have 2 fast tunes and the rest were quite good.

 

[T51R]

It's just a bit odd. Tuners normally know about the cause of problems etc. Considering you say your so fast, I would expect you to know.

Oh by the way, I don't think that I have ever stated that I'm a good tuner, or that I'm better than you. I used to have 2 fast tunes and the rest were quite good.

No. Ignorant 'noobs' who think they are good tuners normally think they know the causes when in reality they are totally wrong. Maybe this is the problem, nobody trying new things or just too much copying others?

Don't make assumptions and insult me by saying it's funny I do not know the cause, I simply asked a question.

 

[cgg]

No assumptions were made. O and I'm not a ignorant noob. I just thought because you're so fast (apparently) you should know. That's all.

 

[T51R]

No assumptions were made. O and I'm not a ignorant noob. I just thought because you're so fast (apparently) you should know. That's all.

I'm as fast as I say I am, what's your issue with apparently?

Forget it, all will be revealed soon enough.

 

[cgg]

Just because of everyones uncertainty.

Nice post edit.

 

[ChevyManDan]

Couple of guys at my local track have mid 10 second 1/4 mile hondas. Seen their incar videos and looks like there holding a v8 powered sawzall off the line! Too bad we don't have real life drag physics in this game such as a christmas tree, bracket racing etc.. Nice dreams

 

[Slash]

No. Ignorant 'noobs' who think they are good tuners normally think they know the causes when in reality they are totally wrong. Maybe this is the problem, nobody trying new things or just too much copying others?

Don't make assumptions and insult me by saying it's funny I do not know the cause, I simply asked a question.

I'm as fast as I say I am, what's your issue with apparently?

Forget it, all will be revealed soon enough.

WTF is your problem? If you really are as fast as you say you are then let it go and start beating people online. Then we will know. No one cares how fast you think you are. It's pretty common knowledge amongest FWD tuners what causes this.

 

[Mikeybc]

It does swerve on SSRX after the 500 M mark if you keep it floored, not as bad as Indy but it still does it. This is just my experience though.

Steer once and it will.

Oh yeah, I rarely touch steering while testing, also I only really tuned 1 ff car that was fast enough to be hard to handle.

 

[T51R]

WTF is your problem? If you really are as fast as you say you are then let it go and start beating people online. Then we will know. No one cares how fast you think you are. It's pretty common knowledge amongest FWD tuners what causes this.

Because I have fast times means I should beat people online? If that's what you think good on ya!

 

[Slash]

Because I have fast times means I should beat people online? If that's what you think good on ya!

More so than if you didn't. Tree is still heavily involved but yes for the most part.

 

[T51R]

More so than if you didn't. Tree is still heavily involved but yes for the most part.

Open your eyes and stop being ignorant. So if I came into your American lobby and raced you of your ghost system I should win because of my slightly faster times?

 

[saxplayer1998]

What happens is if the wheels are exactly straight and not offset at all, any tine change in torque will push one wheel harder than the other and cause the car to suddenly turn. It's called torque steer, the reason it doesn't happen in RWD cars is the rear wheels can't turn and the front don't get any torque from the diff. Check this out:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque_steering
Go wiki!

Torque steer does however happen in RWD and 4WD cars because of driver error. When 2/4 wheels are on the road and the other 2 are on the grass, the wheels on the road have more grip and throw the car into the wall (or invisible wall; God Bless GT5). This is a variation of torque steer.

 

[Slash]

Open your eyes and stop being ignorant. So if I came into your American lobby and raced you of your ghost system I should win because of my slightly faster times?

You're times that you post should be able to keep up even if I tree you then. Shouldn't be a problem.

 

[T51R]

You're times that you post should be able to keep up even if I tree you then. Shouldn't be a problem.

What's a lag difference worth between our countries genius?

 

[saxplayer1998]

You're times that you post should be able to keep up even if I tree you then. Shouldn't be a problem.

What's a lag difference worth between our countries genius?

Is this really the place to argue about something like this?

 

[Slash]

What's a lag difference worth between our countries genius?

Who cares about lag difference when supposedly your cars are faster enough to make up for that difference?

 

[T51R]

Who cares about lag difference when supposedly your cars are faster enough to make up for that difference?

My cars can make up for almost half a second? Stop making yourself sound like a fool.