Zeta News 2.0: New VF Commodore and Chevrolet SS

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YSSMAN
Actually, when I saw the 'Shopped photo on the side I was thinking "huh, that reminds me a bit of the GT-R..."

Technically speaking, a Camaro with 500 BHP would compete with the GT-R, obviously, at thousands less.

(ha!)
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Ha indeed. You've forgotten that's impossible without the Corvette becoming even faster than it is. Overlap is bad! *fingerwag*
 
Of course back in the late 60's, wasn't the Vette just as powerful as a few other GM cars? Actually, it's funny because the Chevelle was more powerful than the Vette in 1970!
 
From year-to-year the cars changed power figures and such, but pretty much every Chevrolet model shared an engine with another, so there was a wide assortment of models that could have been created. That being said, at the same time, there were often three variants of the same engine made available in every different car... It was messy to say the least.

The Camaro won't start to approach regular Z51 performance levels until the SS car gets something in the neighborhood of 500 BHP, and my guess is, they'd cost about the same at that point (ie, about $40K for the Camaro, about $5K short of the Vette).
 
* Awkward Bump*

So I had my first experience with an Aussie-built G8 GT today. This was the first one, as far as I can tell, that was delivered to the Grand Rapids area. I first noted it at the dealer about a week ago, since then, it had been moved inside.

The first impression of the car certainly is "muscle!" It isn't quite as extravagant as the "concept" was last year in Chicago, but it certainly didn't lost much of its flavor in the process. The strong lines look good, European with a hint of American style mixed in. That being said, I was disappointed that the hood scoops are non-functional. They look so damn good, I don't see why they shouldn't be (leave it to the after market?)



Heading out back, its a bit more boring I suppose. A small spoiler would be really nice, I think, but thats just me. I was impressed by the quad-tiped dual exhaust, good to see that on an otherwise "standard" car. The wheels were the perfect size (I thought), and that slightly forward leaning stance just looks good. White is a boring color though, they had a black one there, it looked infinitely better.



Although I know Joey (and Phil?) have said that they were a bit disappointed in the interior, I'm quite the opposite. I thought it looked and felt absolutely brilliant, particularly for a GM model. I mean sure, there are some cheap bits here and there, but compared to the rest of the cars that they make, I'd maybe rate this second only to the CTS, which is a tough act to follow. Especially with the VUE out there too.



The fancy startup on the radio is cool, the way that the Pontiac badge flashes before everything clicks on. I liked the menu system too, really neat. Although I too am disappointed that the navigation doesn't come standard (damn OnStar!!!). The thing is, the overall quality seems quite good, and furthermore, its something that goes from the front of the car all the way to the back... In some GM products, its only the front thats "nice" on occasion. The seats were quite comfortable and there were oodles of legroom, which I loved.

At $32K fully-loaded, its an absolute steal. My only issues, honestly, are on the fuel economy (they could fix it easily), the stupid non-functional hood scoops, and otherwise boring color choices. We need the exciting stuff they offer down under.
 
lool, non-functional? wow... still haven't learned eh. Idiots.

@ riced out Camaro. lool, that didn't take long. What? No 24 in dub chromies? Lame...

In other news... I saw a new Impala (I think?) it looks just as cheap as the last gen.
 
I was disappointed with the interior as well. I sat in it at NYIAS and it just didn't seem to be as tight as I wanted it to be. Maybe it was because it was the floor model, whatev.
 
I think the interior on the G8 looks awesome. Can't wait to see it in person and make a real judgment, though.
 
The production-like Camaro kind of loses the charm of the concept, imo. :indiff:

And who the hell made that red thing? Looks they were playing Prostreet and thought, "Hey guys! Let's use the blueprint option in this to make our own Camaro, and then build it for realz!"
 
Why are people always so nit-picky on cheap materials in the interior? They keep costs down, they can look just as good, and are often lighter. I don't mind the materials, just the layout, and it looks good on the Commodore IMO. I take it YSSMAN didn't get to drive it then, oh well.
 
nd 4 holden spd
Why are people always so nit-picky on cheap materials in the interior? They keep costs down, they can look just as good, and are often lighter. I don't mind the materials, just the layout, and it looks good on the Commodore IMO. I take it YSSMAN didn't get to drive it then, oh well.
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Yes, they can do all that, but these manufacturers need to put more effort into it. It may be plastic, but I don't want to be paying $25,000 to actually get what looks like plastic. I want it to look like something else.
 
nd 4 holden spd
Why are people always so nit-picky on cheap materials in the interior? They keep costs down, they can look just as good, and are often lighter.
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I don't have a problem with it, but put a little effort into it... If you want good examples of cheap materials done well look at Mazda and Scion.
 
nd 4 holden spd
Why are people always so nit-picky on cheap materials in the interior? They keep costs down, they can look just as good, and are often lighter. I don't mind the materials, just the layout, and it looks good on the Commodore IMO. I take it YSSMAN didn't get to drive it then, oh well.
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If I'm buying a $30k car I want an interior that goes with it.
 
nd 4 holden spd
Why are people always so nit-picky on cheap materials in the interior? They keep costs down, they can look just as good, and are often lighter. I don't mind the materials, just the layout, and it looks good on the Commodore IMO. I take it YSSMAN didn't get to drive it then, oh well.
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Anybody can make a good layout if they put time into it. It doesn't cost anything to make the interior look good; that's just a styling issue. I would expect almost every car to have a good looking interior because of this. There will be exceptions, just like how there are cars with quite ugly exteriors.

The materials is where the effort really shows. If VW can build a $25k sports car with a full leather interior that is comfortable, stylish, feels good while still being a very fast car, why should a car costing $5k more, that isn't designed to be sporty have plastic seats, a hard plastic dash and other poor materials? And if other cars in the same price area have leather and better plastics, then it is something to complain about, because I would choose leather over no leather if they were in the same price area. For seats, I'm thinking they might even be better off with a cloth and leather option. Can you get the G8 with leather, or is it just fake leather that feels cheap?
 
Joey D
If I'm buying a $30k car I want an interior that goes with it.
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Heres the thing, I don't think the interior of the G8 is really all that disappointing for $30K. I'm not exactly sure what you're comparing it to, but its leagues ahead of the Charger and Taurus that would be its main competition, and I'd care to argue that its good enough to at least be compared to some of the "low-level luxury" models from Germany and Japan. For $32K, the car is an absolute steal, and while there certainly are a few interior pieces of plastic that I don't care for (that plastic piece that surrounds the radio and goes up to the high-level display bothers me), it overall FEELS and LOOKS good, so I'm not sure where the problem is.

Per driving it; Ha! They only had two at the dealer, the first one inside, the other outside on a concrete display. Furthermore, they're not going to let me take out a GT for any particular reason. I know my Grandpa is considering buying a car sometime, I may try to get him out to the Pontiac dealer so I can lay a few patches as well.
 
My around $30K car is always the BMW 3-series which starts at $32k. I think the interior in that it quite good. However, the G8 is better then anything else America has to offer. Don't get me wrong I think it's good GM built an affordable sporty sedan to offer to the world that isn't a complete joke. I would be curious to see how one drives, I've been meaning to pop down to the local Pontiac dealer and talk my way into one.
 
Holden have been doing sporty sedans that aren't jokes for years apparently :p
GM needs only to learn one thing, weight reduction. Their engines are good, their gearboxes are good, their chassis are capable, they look good, but they're just too heavy.

You know how their killing RWD in favour of the 1mpg better FWD? Why not just make a heap of cars Mid-engined RWD? It'd do the same thing by removing the weighty driveshaft, even improve performance handling, and if they did it mass-production scale I'm sure it would be cheap. VW did it for the original Bug, so why not GM on just about half of their cars? Obiously it wouldn't work for sedans, I'm talking small hatch backs and everything. And maybe some Coupes.
 
The Malibu, CTS, SRX, and Enclave have a better interior than the G8. I was slightly disappointed in it actually. I had to seek out a Malibu just to feel better about GM. Oh sure it's nice, but just not as nice as I thought it would be.... Though the Fit-and-Finish was very good.
 
TopHat
The Malibu, CTS, SRX, and Enclave have a better interior than the G8. I was slightly disappointed in it actually. I had to seek out a Malibu just to feel better about GM. Oh sure it's nice, but just not as nice as I thought it would be.... Though the Fit-and-Finish was very good.
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-> Yes, these vehicles interiors are better than the G8, fit and finish isn't. The G8 I should say is the pinnacle of GM's aggresive-yet-blunt engineering, and I cheer for them for doing that. Infact the interior of the GTO/Monaro is in fact better than that of the new Malibu that everyone that goes nuts off. Its all about the photos and color combination that only stands out of the Malibu's 'gorgeous' interior, nothing to be excited about. :indiff:
 
nd 4 holden spd
You know how their killing RWD in favour of the 1mpg better FWD?
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I think we put up a big fuss about it a little while ago. Too bad about the Impala.

Why not just make a heap of cars Mid-engined RWD? It'd do the same thing by removing the weighty driveshaft, even improve performance handling, and if they did it mass-production scale I'm sure it would be cheap. VW did it for the original Bug, so why not GM on just about half of their cars? Obiously it wouldn't work for sedans, I'm talking small hatch backs and everything. And maybe some Coupes.
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Surely you can't be serious. Mid engined? We're talking about a mainstream, people hauling car builder here. MR has to be the single least practical drive setup, followed closely by RR. Getting more than two seats would be nearly impossible and they would probably have terrible issues with handling. There are reasons that almost every car build is front engined.
 
This promotional video made me giggle:

 
Just don't go racing M5s. It's not THAT kind of car...

((There was an AMC ad for the Rebel Machine that went like that...))
 
I wish it was the M3 instead, since thats what it's competing with. But the comments in that are so god damn annoying :crazy: Personally, I don't see how they like a normal 5 series over the G8, give me the Pontiac any day.
1. The G8 isn't ugly like every modern BMW
2. The quality in German car manufacterers are going down, other the Audi who are greatly improving
3. Someone of there mentioned leaf springs, but you know, the fact is, it isn't the first GM car without them, but them saying leaf springs suck and make it handle worse. Tsk tsk, look at the C6 Z06.
Their are other reasons but you get my point. Don't judge a car on the badge, or region.
 
Why are they comparing the G8 to a 5 series? Other then being similar size I can't see to many people cross shopping these vehicles.
 
Joey D
Why are they comparing the G8 to a 5 series? Other then being similar size I can't see to many people cross shopping these vehicles.
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What other vehicles could they compare it with? In the cheap, midsize sedan RWD segment you are really only looking at the G8 and the Charger, in which case the G8 would win before you have to do much comparing. They are probably comparing them not to show how the G8 stacks up against the 5 series, but to show just how good the G8 is.

But you're right. If I was looking at a G8, I wouldn't be looking at a BMW. And if I wanted a BMW, I certainly wouldn't be looking at anything with a "Made in USA" plaque. I guess it'll just show the lower end of the market that "Hey look! You too can get a car almost as good as a BMW."
 
The Vanishing Boy
-> Yes, these vehicles interiors are better than the G8, fit and finish isn't. The G8 I should say is the pinnacle of GM's aggresive-yet-blunt engineering, and I cheer for them for doing that. Infact the interior of the GTO/Monaro is in fact better than that of the new Malibu that everyone that goes nuts off. Its all about the photos and color combination that only stands out of the Malibu's 'gorgeous' interior, nothing to be excited about. :indiff:
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The GTO was a RHD drive interior in a LHD drive market, so the ergonomics were all wonky. Not to mention it was boring. I don't see a problem in the 2 Tone tan interior. The Fit and Finish is top notch in all the models I have sat in (~10 of them).
 
Joey D
Why are they comparing the G8 to a 5 series? Other then being similar size I can't see to many people cross shopping these vehicles.
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Why does Hyundai compare the Azera to the 7-series and the S-class? No one in their right mind is going to cross shop those either...

They do it so that there is a recognizable car to be seen/heard/benchmarked, and showing that you can get all that (and more) for less money, they hope to lure in other buyers. Or better yet, convince people who dream of a BMW to get a Pontiac instead.

Its just simple marketing. I think its funny that the minor difference in size between the CTS and the G8 make the CTS the 3-er competitor and the G8 the 5-er competitor.
 
Prosthetic
I wish it was the M3 instead, since thats what it's competing with. But the comments in that are so god damn annoying :crazy: Personally, I don't see how they like a normal 5 series over the G8, give me the Pontiac any day.
1. The G8 isn't ugly like every modern BMW
2. The quality in German car manufacterers are going down, other the Audi who are greatly improving
3. Someone of there mentioned leaf springs, but you know, the fact is, it isn't the first GM car without them, but them saying leaf springs suck and make it handle worse. Tsk tsk, look at the C6 Z06.
Their are other reasons but you get my point. Don't judge a car on the badge, or region.
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While your first point is merely an opinion, what does the 2nd have to do with this topic?
The Germans might be losing a bit of quality, but I know for a fact the 5 Series still beats whatever the hell GM is trying to push, bar Cadillac who are still a bit behind in this area (not far though).

The G8 though, is a laugh next to it in terms of quality. Its dash makes my car look like a Ferrari 612.
 
Doesn't the G8 offer similar skid pan numbers to a 5-series? Plus it's roomier, more muscular in style (yes I know that's opinion, but tell me I'm wrong), and it's far cheaper. People should cross-shop the G8 and 5-series, I think the G8 can win.
 
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