2011 Formula One Grand Prix de Monaco

[Anghammarad]

No surprises in the BBC viewers' Driver of the Day poll...

And Button was the only one of these three that actually finished lower than their starting position.

 

[Ardius]

There is making an effort to overtake and then there is just chucking it down the inside hoping the other guy is just going to move out of the way. To then not even admit any blame for rediculous diving overtakes like that is just disgusting.
I think it puts Kobayashi in a good light that he doesn't just chuck his car around in every space he sees and only seems to pick moments he thinks he can pull off, though he was very very optimistic today with Sutil and at Suzuka last year.

I'm not sure I would praise Lewis for trying today.

 

[Rossticles]

He did once or twice, but Hamilton only needed 1 chance to get Vettel in China.

The track is probably three times wider in China as well.

 

[designate-19L]

People set too much store by what people say. Both in F1 interviews, and on forum sites. Give the intellectual one-up-manship a rest!

If Lewis believed he was at fault, he'd have said so. He's made mistakes before, and held his hand up for them. My anger is directed at those who think they are so high and holy that they are beyond such accusations of being not completely impartial in sporting matters, and also at those who are so quick to damn an individual for no more than being brutally honest.

Let the drivers "whinge" and "whine". Let them say what they like, because they don't always mean it 100%. Let them change their tunes. F1 is an emotional business, like it or not. Just don't get all angry at the anger. Stop whinging about a driver's whinging - because you're no better a person. I know that might sound a bit paradoxical, but you get my drift.

None of you have just gone through quite what these drivers have gone through. You can never appreciate how emotionally exhausting it can be.

 

[UK-Gamer]

I'm not sure who this remark was directed at, but it's pretty unfair in any case. I think that most people here didn't like the tire change business because it wrecked what might have been a nail-biting race to the finish, and it has nothing whatsoever to do with hating Vettel or any other driver.

After that red flag, tyres or not, Vettel was winning. What got Alonso and Button so close was momentum and motivation. After such a lay off, you lose all of that.

The track is probably three times wider in China as well.

Yeah, but with Alonso's determination it was either he takes 1st or crashes both of them out.

 

[F1 fan]

I can't believe you're suggesting someone who referenced Ali G was being serious. Take a reality check there. Ali G. Serious. C'mon

He was hinting at racial prejudice. Unacceptable behaviour. He can turn it into a joke all he wants, but he's using very dangerous words.

 

[designate-19L]

He was hinting at racial prejudice. Unacceptable behaviour. He can turn it into a joke all he wants, but he's using very dangerous words.

And why might they be "dangerous words" anyway? Because there are some in positions of authority who have a genuine fear of what those words could lead to, if spoken by enough people. By the questions they could lead to. And why might they be fearful, I wonder...?

 

[TenEightyOne]

[If Lewis believed he was at fault, he'd have said so.

I remember Brundle once saying that when you get your Super Licence you have the part of your brain that recognises 'fault' removed.

I struggle to believe that Lewis would take the blame in all but the most clear-cut of cases, and the same goes for most of the drivers out there. It's not in their mentality to give way and that's why they're at the top of an insanely difficult and dangerous sport.

 

[designate-19L]

I remember Brundle once saying that when you get your Super Licence you have the part of your brain that recognises 'fault' removed.

I struggle to believe that Lewis would take the blame in all but the most clear-cut of cases, and the same goes for most of the drivers out there. It's not in their mentality to give way and that's why they're at the top of an insanely difficult and dangerous sport.

Amen.

But some people still like to make a big thing about what's said afterwards, eh...

 

[F1 fan]

He did once or twice, but Hamilton only needed 1 chance to get Vettel in China.

Totally different tracks.

It seems we'll never agree on this one lol.
He was trying to blame everyone for his poor weekend, but in the end, I think McLaren (and himself) were to blame. Their decisions cost them dearly.

I agree with you on this.

People look too much into this role model thing, a good parent should be able to distinguish their children from right and wrong. Hamilton needs a kick up where it hurts though.

Parents can stop this kind of behaviour. A lot of them don't.

There is making an effort to overtake and then there is just chucking it down the inside hoping the other guy is just going to move out of the way. To then not even admit any blame for rediculous diving overtakes like that is just disgusting.
I think it puts Kobayashi in a good light that he doesn't just chuck his car around in every space he sees and only seems to pick moments he thinks he can pull off, though he was very very optimistic today with Sutil and at Suzuka last year.

I'm not sure I would praise Lewis for trying today.

👍

The track is probably three times wider in China as well.

This.

And why might they be "dangerous words" anyway? Because there are some in positions of authority who have a genuine fear of what those words could lead to, if spoken by enough people. By the questions they could lead to. And why might they be fearful, I wonder...?

If you don't know why words like these are dangerous then I can't help you. Hamilton's colour has never been an issue before. Suddenly he starts having some problems and that's what he (jokingly or not) blames it on.

But some people still like to make a big thing about what's said afterwards, eh...

I'm sorry, but if someone hints that they are a victim of racial prejudice, that is a big thing in my book. If he's joking about it, then he's crying wolf trying to get sympathy. One of my friends is Japanese and is currently getting harrassed because of this, so I don't take this kind of thing lightly.

 

[Ardius]

If Lewis believed he was at fault, he'd have said so. He's made mistakes before, and held his hand up for them. My anger is directed at those who think they are so high and holy that they are beyond such accusations of being not completely impartial in sporting matters, and also at those who are so quick to damn an individual for no more than being brutally honest.

None of you have just gone through quite what these drivers have gone through. You can never appreciate how emotionally exhausting it can be.

Thats my problem - he doesn't believe he is at fault when its painfully clear he was at least partly at fault. He seems to think that if a driver doesn't move clear out of his way as soon as he is nearby, its all their fault that he tried an extremely optimistic move that was very rarely going to work.
The end result was that he ruined two other driver's races with his actions and he seems to think he is being victimised for this. Utter nonsense. If Lewis was in Massa or Maldanado's position, he would hardly say he was 100% at fault, he would then be moaning about their "freaking" driving still.

Quite a claim to say none of us have gone though any of this. And completely irrelevant. I don't think anyone is saying its wrong for him to be frustrated after the race - I think its clear everyone understands why he is frustrated.

Are you really suggesting that people shouldn't be held accountable for what they say or do as its "only natural"? And that we shouldn't criticise him just because we haven't driven an F1 car in the Monaco GP? In that sense, we should all give up talking about anything to do with F1 as we apparently know nothing.
We shouldn't praise Vettel or Alonso or Button either then, if we can't appreciate Hamilton's frustration then we can't appreciate the others' elation.

 

[designate-19L]

If you don't know why words like these are dangerous then I can't help you. Hamilton's colour has never been an issue before. Suddenly he starts having some problems and that's what he (jokingly or not) blames it on.

Rhetorical question. *Abstains from being as unnecessarily patronising as 95% of forum posters would have been just there.*

 

[ExigeEvan]

There is making an effort to overtake and then there is just chucking it down the inside hoping the other guy is just going to move out of the way. To then not even admit any blame for rediculous diving overtakes like that is just disgusting.
I think it puts Kobayashi in a good light that he doesn't just chuck his car around in every space he sees and only seems to pick moments he thinks he can pull off, though he was very very optimistic today with Sutil and at Suzuka last year.

I'm not sure I would praise Lewis for trying today.

IMO Lewis drove in an appropriately aggressive manner for someone who was trying to overtake at Monaco. He certainly didn't torpedo into the side of anyone or nail anyone on the inside of Nouvelle chicane! He, though I haven't seen unbroken footage of it, got Massa to the outside of the tunnel and hung him out to dry, entirely appropriate at any other track.

He passed Schumacher aggressively, took classic Monaco contact against Massa at Grand hotel and Maldonado, IMO, did turn in early. Look how much kerb he took himself.

He was hinting at racial prejudice. Unacceptable behaviour. He can turn it into a joke all he wants, but he's using very dangerous words.

He didn't hint at all. He out-right suggested it as part of the joke. And I never thought "black" was a dangerous word.

 

[Dravonic]

None of you have just gone through quite what these drivers have gone through. You can never appreciate how emotionally exhausting it can be.

I didn't but many other drivers did. Most of them acted in a much more mature way. Why should I or anyone give Lewis a free pass? I hold him to the same standards I do any other driver, or person for that matter. He is the only F1 driver failing to meet those standards this badly.

 

[Touring Mars]

Hamilton is given a 20 second penalty for his collision with Maldonado, but keeps 6th place...

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91858

 

[Rossticles]

I hate when they hand out a penalty that does nothing. Do they not realize it? It reminds me of the time Hamilton had a drive-thru penalty in Spa I think it was and he came out in the same position on-track. I remember Alonso talking to his crew over the radio and being unhappy about it.

Yeah, but with Alonso's determination it was either he takes 1st or crashes both of them out.

You're still drawing comparisons in driver skill and overtaking skill between Alonso and Hamilton based on Alonso not being able to make a pass for the lead in Monaco. IN MONACO!!!

 

[F1 fan]

Thats my problem - he doesn't believe he is at fault when its painfully clear he was at least partly at fault. He seems to think that if a driver doesn't move clear out of his way as soon as he is nearby, its all their fault that he tried an extremely optimistic move that was very rarely going to work.

This goes back to my comments about his ego. He clearly thinks that it's "The Lewis Hamilton Show". He think's he's innocent, and the other drivers were 100% to blame. He also thinks that if someone takes his toys away from him (i.e penalizes him) that it's okay to "joke" about them being racially prejudice... It has nothing to do with the fact that he was outclassed by Pastor Maldonado today....

 

[designate-19L]

Are you really suggesting...

I suggest no such thing, and you know it really.

Some people just love slippery slopes...

 

[Ardius]

IMO Lewis drove in an appropriately aggressive manner for someone who was trying to overtake at Monaco. He certainly didn't torpedo into the side of anyone or nail anyone on the inside of Nouvelle chicane! He, though I haven't seen unbroken footage of it, got Massa to the outside of the tunnel and hung him out to dry, entirely appropriate at any other track.

He passed Schumacher aggressively, took classic Monaco contact against Massa at Grand hotel and Maldonado, IMO, did turn in early. Look how much kerb he took himself.

Yes, but you can't expect to overtake at Monaco and have contact and just blame everyone else.
In the same argument, why should Massa and Maldanado expect him to make such optimistic passes?

My problem isn't with the overtakes themselves or the incidents. My problem is with his attitude and him basically just blaming them.

I suggest no such thing, and you know it really.

Some people just love slippery slopes...

By saying its only normal for a driver to be frustrated and emotional and that his comments shouldn't be taken literally, you imply that he shouldn't be held accountable or that we shouldn't criticise him for it.

Your comment about how none of us know what it feels like is very presumptious and completely irrelevant to the criticism. As I said, I think we all appreciate Lewis being emotional, but it doesn't justify what he said.

 

[designate-19L]

Hamilton is given a 20 second penalty for his collision with Maldonado, but keeps 6th place...

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91858

"Too lenient. He should be excluded from the championship and have his super licence revoked."

 

[UK-Gamer]

The track is probably three times wider in China as well.

You're still drawing comparisons in driver skill and overtaking skill based on Alonso not being able to make a pass for the lead in Monaco. IN MONACO!!!

No, no, no... I was not comparing driver skill but someone said that even without the Red Flag, Vettel would've won. I was disagreeing with that fact with the point that Alonso had multiple lunges at Vettel who was on frail tyres and that Hamilton only needed 1 go to take Vettel, so I expected Fernando to overtake him soon as well.

 

[F1 fan]

He didn't hint at all. He out-right suggested it as part of the joke. And I never thought "black" was a dangerous word.

It's not. Suggesting the stewards are victimising him because he's black is dangerous. Whether it was meant as a joke or not.

 

[MitchZ06]

No, no, no... I was not comparing driver skill but someone said that even without the Red Flag, Vettel would've won. I was disagreeing with that fact with the point that Alonso had multiple lunges at Vettel who was on frail tyres and that Hamilton only needed 1 go to take Vettel, so I expected Fernando to overtake him soon as well.

Take Vettel as in pass him or take Vettel as in take him out of the race?

 

[Rossticles]

Let's not forget Alonso wasn't in the ideal tire wear window either. Button was the only one with tires that still had good speed in them.

 

[UK-Gamer]

Take Vettel as in pass him or take Vettel as in take him out of the race?

Pass of course
@Rossticles: But his tires were a hell of a lot better than Seb's!

 

[The Outlaw]

People set too much store by what people say. Both in F1 interviews, and on forum sites. Give the intellectual one-up-manship a rest!

If Lewis believed he was at fault, he'd have said so. He's made mistakes before, and held his hand up for them. My anger is directed at those who think they are so high and holy that they are beyond such accusations of being not completely impartial in sporting matters, and also at those who are so quick to damn an individual for no more than being brutally honest.

Let the drivers "whinge" and "whine". Let them say what they like, because they don't always mean it 100%. Let them change their tunes. F1 is an emotional business, like it or not. Just don't get all angry at the anger. Stop whinging about a driver's whinging - because you're no better a person. I know that might sound a bit paradoxical, but you get my drift.

None of you have just gone through quite what these drivers have gone through. You can never appreciate how emotionally exhausting it can be.

I agree. I've always found it quite annoying how so many followers of the sport always find the need (or get off on doing so) to scrutinize and critique every little thing that comes out of a drivers mouth (especially one they are not a fan of) I guess that's just part of being in the spotlight though..

 

[zippy_the_cat]

Take Vettel as in pass him or take Vettel as in take him out of the race?

Alonso has already told interviewers he was going to have a go, and that he thought it was going to be a pass-or-crash situation.

 

[Ardius]

I agree. I've always found it quite annoying how so many followers of the sport always find the need (or get off on doing so) to scrutinize and critique every little thing that comes out of a drivers mouth (especially one they are not a fan of) I guess that's just part of being in the spotlight though..

By the same logic we should not be praising anyone either and merely noting the statistics.
Thats boring, we're here to discuss and give our opinions.

 

[The Outlaw]

By the same logic we should not be praising anyone either and merely noting the statistics.
Thats boring, we're here to discuss and give our opinions.

Yes...and that fact that people have little else to talk about (other than what Hamilton said), is IMO rather sad quite frankly.

 

[Dravonic]

"Too lenient. He should be excluded from the championship and have his super licence revoked."

Come on. It is a pointless penalty and you know it. FIA is letting him get away with it while pretending to do something. Politics as usual. But I guess that after watching F1 this many years I'm actually the one to blame for expecting any kind of seriousness from FIA.

By the way, being a fan doesn't mean that you should support your idol's every bonehead move.