- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
2012 Belgian Grand Prix
- Thread starter That90sGuy
- 826 comments
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- 2,435
- Fuji
- NissmanR34
Won't be long till he does. But this wasn't my point, the problem is his racing behaviour, he doesn't have any!
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
- 10,373
- Manchester
- Ardius_
Er, but its about punishing his behaviour with a view to what can happen if he continues it. How is that being punished for a future crime? Its punishing a current crime to prevent/reduce the potential for much more serious consequences of that crime.
- 1,818
- Rossell2
Not sure if serious.
I do hope however that Grosjeans race ban puts the jeebies up Maldonado and makes him think a bit more. Although if past performance is an indication he might not have taken a blind bit of notice. We shall see.
In the midst of it all, its easy to get wound up in this stuff without noting finer things such as Raikkonens Eau Rouge overtake on Schuey. How freaking awesome was that?
mister dog
(Banned)
- 8,396
- Spain
- misterdog
- misterdog7
+1 👍, both of these cowboys should be treated equally harsh; having Maldonado fly past everyone with his jump start probably distracted Grosjean to not watch his mirrors...
I hope D'ambrosio get's the oppurtunity to drive @ Monza, finally a Belgian in a competitive car again
Ps i also tought Fingerboy steered a little to much towards his opponents, trying to make them back off in the middle of the chicane before the start-finish straight. I know it's an allowed move but it's not very gentlemanish.
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
Because it assumes that he will do it.
There's a big difference between a grid penalty and a race ban. The stewards specifically called Grosjean's crash "as an extremely serious breach of the regulations, which had the potential to cause injury to others". As I said, he did cause a crash that resulted in three cars becoming airborne. It's much more serious than Maldonado's scrapes by a whole order of magnitude. The stewards are probably very reluctant to hand down a race ban for Maldonado, because Williams could probably challenge it.
- 10,373
- Manchester
- Ardius_
^No you don't understand. He is already doing it. He's constantly involved in contact in most races and continues to learn nothing from it. He's already had several incidents where it could even be argued he had malicious intent.
I think it goes without saying that if he doesn't change his behaviour he will eventually be involved in a very serious accident as a result of his crash-happy approach.
He hasn't showed any signs of even trying to improve this area and to me it stinks of someone who is willing to ignore the warnings and still take risks that cause accidents.
Hmm, yeah if after lots of penalties for himself he ignores it all and still crashes into people..I'm pretty sure a penalty for someone else isn't going to bother Maldo the least bit.
I think it goes without saying that if he doesn't change his behaviour he will eventually be involved in a very serious accident as a result of his crash-happy approach.
He hasn't showed any signs of even trying to improve this area and to me it stinks of someone who is willing to ignore the warnings and still take risks that cause accidents.
Hmm, yeah if after lots of penalties for himself he ignores it all and still crashes into people..I'm pretty sure a penalty for someone else isn't going to bother Maldo the least bit.
- 311
- Newcastle
- rabbit_9-8
RadracingCentura
I still wonder why Hamilton carried that piece of carbon back to the pits...
I think he wanted to use it to chop Romain into a toss salad.
Hahaha probably
- 311
- Newcastle
- rabbit_9-8
Bye Ya
Yes, visions of Senna and Ratzenburger flashed back
- 5,916
- Finland
One of those "scrapes" by Maldonado was purposely driving into a competitor in retaliation. Remember Spa 2011? That is what I'd call serious yet no ban was given.
Yes, Grosjean caused a serious crash. Then again if his contact with Hamilton had resulted in the two of them spinning out and the rest of the grip keeping going we wouldn't be having this debate at all - it seems that he was penalized because of the aftermath of the collision and not the collision itself. The penalty should be for the action and not the result of the action.
Hamilton have been very mature this season. However, he have been acting weird the whole weekend in Spa. It definitely feels like something is going on.
One thing I thought was weird was that Hamilton said he hadn't thought of F1 during the whole break. I thought that they would at least do some simulation work during that time? Maybe he's too good for that these days. He's probably busy hanging out with celebrities, anyway.
I'm sure that specific piece of the interview was taking out of context to stir **** up.
Anyway, you shouldn't believe anything Bernie says, in any circumstance.
EDIT: I re-watched the the short the interview. I forgot how Bernie said it, so it couldn't be taken out of context, I think.
But my second point applies.
One thing I thought was weird was that Hamilton said he hadn't thought of F1 during the whole break. I thought that they would at least do some simulation work during that time? Maybe he's too good for that these days. He's probably busy hanging out with celebrities, anyway.
I'm sure that specific piece of the interview was taking out of context to stir **** up.
Anyway, you shouldn't believe anything Bernie says, in any circumstance.
EDIT: I re-watched the the short the interview. I forgot how Bernie said it, so it couldn't be taken out of context, I think.
But my second point applies.
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- 44,184
- Blackburn
- Furinkazen_54
Yes, I read that above. What a shame. I know that can be hard, but he need to learn to keep his professional life separate from his normal life.
IIRC, Alonso had a close family member die recently. Didn't affect him in his professional life.
- 44,184
- Blackburn
- Furinkazen_54
But you cannot deny that would have an impact. It's just if they show it or not..
Anyone else sick of media asking over and over about contracts, mainly Hamilton and Schumacher? They just don't get it, but that's nothing new with media.
They'll will announce it when it's time and not anytime before, no matter what you ask.
Of course I can't.
They'll will announce it when it's time and not anytime before, no matter what you ask.
Of course I can't.
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- Furinkazen_54
ROAD_DOGG33J
Premium
- 13,898
- IL, USA
- holyc0w1
- holyc0w
Okay race but ruined by Grosjean. Why is nobody talking about Massa finishing ahead of Alonso?
Yep. It seems like a question just to waste time. I'm sure the driver will reveal their negotiations and which team they really want to be at...
Sometimes I wonder whether he actually means the things he says or he's putting on his 2012 face for the cameras.
By taking a 3 place grid drop he reshuffled the qualifying order and contributed to the accident.
Yep. It seems like a question just to waste time. I'm sure the driver will reveal their negotiations and which team they really want to be at...
Sometimes I wonder whether he actually means the things he says or he's putting on his 2012 face for the cameras.
By taking a 3 place grid drop he reshuffled the qualifying order and contributed to the accident.
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- 23,800
- Philippines
Next thing you know, Maldonado will sneeze wrong... and...
Not hard when Alonso does not...
Waaaaaahhhh!!!! My date night! My dinner! My one day a week out! Ruined! Waaaaaahhh!!!!
Grosjean ban... harsh... but in light of what happened... an example needs to be made.
Like an example needed to be made of Schumi when he nearly pushed Barrichelo into the wall a few years back.
Just because they don't always give out the penalty, doesn't mean it's not necessary... and I concur... Maldonado should have been given it a number of times, already... and maybe Hamilton, (on Kobayashi)... and maybe...
Not hard when Alonso does not...
Waaaaaahhhh!!!! My date night! My dinner! My one day a week out! Ruined! Waaaaaahhh!!!!
Grosjean ban... harsh... but in light of what happened... an example needs to be made.
Like an example needed to be made of Schumi when he nearly pushed Barrichelo into the wall a few years back.
Just because they don't always give out the penalty, doesn't mean it's not necessary... and I concur... Maldonado should have been given it a number of times, already... and maybe Hamilton, (on Kobayashi)... and maybe...
ROAD_DOGG33J
Premium
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- GTP_ZippyCat
Just watched the race on DVR. Quick reactions:
1). McLaren absolutely nailed the setup on Button's car. Even without reference to timing and scoring he was visibly quicker than anyone else on track both Saturday and Sunday. (But it's worth noting the field as a whole was slower than it's been at Spa in years past.) Good work on Button's one and only stop also. So their much-maligned pitwall can go to Monza with heads held high.
2). The penalties for the lap 1 fracas are just about right. As I watched I was thinking 10 grid spots for Grosjean for causing the wreck and a suspension for Maldonado for the jumpstart and being a several-times-over repeat offender. But the actual result does feel like justice.
3). Maldonado's jumpstart no doubt influenced the way a lot of the drivers were approaching La Source. As such I think it's a contributing factor to the accident.
4). Raikkonen on Schumacher at Eau Rouge was the pass of the year, to date. Not quite as ballsy as Webber's on Alonso last year, but even better thought-out as he was able to put DRS to use on Kemmel while in front of the train. Genius driving.
5). Alonso is a very lucky guy -- and in his post-race reactions, a very classy one. I missed the 2007 and 2008 contretemps for having stopped following F1 after the Prost-Senna era, so I only have the last couple seasons to go on. But I suspect that, whatever his standing in the points, his standing in the drivers' meetings and discussions is clearly #1 and he's consistently a voice of reason who walks it like he talks it. Alonso, Webber and Raikkonen pretty much are the state of the art in present day F1 when it comes to race craft.
6). Speaking of race craft, Vettel continues to get stick for being a non-passer when he seems able to pass very well. The pit-entry encounter with Schumi could have got messy, but he showed nice car control. Vettel was lucky not to get caught up in the Lap 1 mess or cut down a tire passing through it, but he made the absolute most of the opportunity.
Edit:
7). Bummer for Sauber. If it wasn't for bad luck they'd have no luck at all.
Another edit:
8). God knows where Hamilton's head was all weekend. Yes, he's fast, but Dennis and Whitmarsh have to be wondering if he's worth the headache.
1). McLaren absolutely nailed the setup on Button's car. Even without reference to timing and scoring he was visibly quicker than anyone else on track both Saturday and Sunday. (But it's worth noting the field as a whole was slower than it's been at Spa in years past.) Good work on Button's one and only stop also. So their much-maligned pitwall can go to Monza with heads held high.
2). The penalties for the lap 1 fracas are just about right. As I watched I was thinking 10 grid spots for Grosjean for causing the wreck and a suspension for Maldonado for the jumpstart and being a several-times-over repeat offender. But the actual result does feel like justice.
3). Maldonado's jumpstart no doubt influenced the way a lot of the drivers were approaching La Source. As such I think it's a contributing factor to the accident.
4). Raikkonen on Schumacher at Eau Rouge was the pass of the year, to date. Not quite as ballsy as Webber's on Alonso last year, but even better thought-out as he was able to put DRS to use on Kemmel while in front of the train. Genius driving.
5). Alonso is a very lucky guy -- and in his post-race reactions, a very classy one. I missed the 2007 and 2008 contretemps for having stopped following F1 after the Prost-Senna era, so I only have the last couple seasons to go on. But I suspect that, whatever his standing in the points, his standing in the drivers' meetings and discussions is clearly #1 and he's consistently a voice of reason who walks it like he talks it. Alonso, Webber and Raikkonen pretty much are the state of the art in present day F1 when it comes to race craft.
6). Speaking of race craft, Vettel continues to get stick for being a non-passer when he seems able to pass very well. The pit-entry encounter with Schumi could have got messy, but he showed nice car control. Vettel was lucky not to get caught up in the Lap 1 mess or cut down a tire passing through it, but he made the absolute most of the opportunity.
Edit:
7). Bummer for Sauber. If it wasn't for bad luck they'd have no luck at all.
Another edit:
8). God knows where Hamilton's head was all weekend. Yes, he's fast, but Dennis and Whitmarsh have to be wondering if he's worth the headache.
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- 202
- HeXoSKEL3t0n
http://m.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/283314/grosjean-accepts-ban-and-apologises-to-rivals/
Good to see Grosjean acknowledging (and apologising for) his mistake. 👍
Unlike a certain Maldonado... 👎
Romain Grosjean
Good to see Grosjean acknowledging (and apologising for) his mistake. 👍
Unlike a certain Maldonado... 👎
- 1,978
- Ohio
- IceManPJN
- IceMan PJN
I've been aware for some years that whether contact results in a penalty or not is influenced by the outcome of the contact rather than by the fact that there was contact. If everybody comes out unscathed, it gets dismissed, but if someone suffers then it might get a penalty.
As was already mentioned, there was the deal with his aunt. I want to note, however, that it did seem to preoccupy him quite a bit. He kept Tweeting about it over and over during the break, which left me worried that it was and would distract him from his job.
I quickly labeled it a jump start until Speed shown a slow-mo replay wherein we could clearly see that the lights had already went out at the moment Crashtor started moving, so technically he should've been fine. The only way I could see it argued that it's a true jump start is if it's argued that he'd have had to go for the throttle early enough that the lights were still lit at the instant he made the decision to go for the gas and then the lights being out at the moment his car actually began to move.
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- United States
- GTP_Sam48
I think banning Romain from racing in Italy was far too harsh of a penalty. I mean for goodness sake it was the start of a race! It's not as if everyone's frantically checking to make sure they're totally clear before turning into the first corner. Not only that, but Hamilton could have backed off a bit when he began to go off, not that he would (Nor would I expect anyone else in that position to either). The point being, it's simply a racing incident. I feel as if the stewards banned Romain due to the end result of his mistake, not the mistake itself. Had the same thing happened further back in the pack with cars of lesser importance, you might say, I would bet there would have been no action taken.
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- TayTheDay
- TayTheDay
Interesting ...Maybe he's got Whiting in his pocket and knew the count 💡 (Maldonado: think the worst!)
