600pp superGT

[JohnBM01]

I was 2-4 using the EPSON NSX. I am currently undefeated (2-0) with the XANAVI NISMO Z. I am not leading by 10 seconds by the 75% point of a race or anything, but I run a fairly good pace with the NISMO Z. It probably is worth noting that I even went from Racing Hard tires to Racing Medium tires for a little better grip. This car has won at both Tokyo R246 and Special Stage Route 5. I haven't yet done the final race of the Super GT lineup. If you do use the 2006 XANAVI NISMO Z, remember to downtune its power so it can qualify for the Entry Requirements.

 

[Dalone]

Ah, I see. I have all driving aids turned off, except ABS set at 2.

If you can win with all aids turned off you are doing better than most.

'Most' use ABS at 1 though as far as I know.

 

[Dalone]

I was 2-4 using the EPSON NSX. I am currently undefeated (2-0) with the XANAVI NISMO Z. I am not leading by 10 seconds by the 75% point of a race or anything, but I run a fairly good pace with the NISMO Z. It probably is worth noting that I even went from Racing Hard tires to Racing Medium tires for a little better grip. This car has won at both Tokyo R246 and Special Stage Route 5. I haven't yet done the final race of the Super GT lineup. If you do use the 2006 XANAVI NISMO Z, remember to downtune its power so it can qualify for the Entry Requirements.

You were able to use Medium Racing tyres?

How did you manage that as only Hard are allowed?

 

[Dalone]

Just won at Tsukuba on the 1st try @ 540PP, (358hp, no turbo) took the lead 1/2 way through lap 7 and won by 9.4 secs over the Nismo GTR 08, $1,830,400, exp 205040. Best lap 54.3.

That was still using Lewis's tune.

Heading down now to 530PP, and beyond?

Won @ 530PP (321hp 65.1% power) easily, over the same Nismo 08. Took the lead 1st corner lap 8. Best lap 55.03, won by 5.5 sec's. $1,996,800.......exp 223680.

Next will try 520 PP.

Won at 520PP (300hp, 60.9% power) over the same Nismo 08. Best lap 55.5, won by just .470 sec.
$2,163,200...exp 242319.
It was a scrappy race on my part so think I could go lower yet, maybe. 515PP?

 

[basswerks1]

Just won at Tsukuba on the 1st try @ 540PP, (358hp, no turbo) took the lead 1/2 way through lap 7 and won by 9.4 secs over the Nismo Z. $1,830,400, exp 205040. Best lap 54.3.

That was still using Lewis's tune.

Heading down now to 530PP, and beyond?

Very nice indeed.

 

[Adrenaline]

Just won at Tsukuba on the 1st try @ 540PP, (358hp, no turbo) took the lead 1/2 way through lap 7 and won by 9.4 secs over the Nismo GTR 08, $1,830,400, exp 205040. Best lap 54.3.

That was still using Lewis's tune.

Heading down now to 530PP, and beyond?

Won @ 530PP (321hp 65.1% power) easily, over the same Nismo 08. Took the lead 1st corner lap 8. Best lap 55.03, won by 5.5 sec's. $1,996,800.......exp 223680.

Next will try 520 PP.

I assume this is without SRF... correct?

 

[Dalone]

-

I assume this is without SRF... correct?

Surely you jest Adrenaline.

Anyway, have had 3 tries at 515PP 288hp, 58.6% power and have only made 2nd spot so far. But it's all due to my mistakes, even hitting the divider near the starting area.

Ha ha, was going OK until the boys came up, shot my game to hell not long after. Will try later.

Regarding SRF, I have been stating I use SRF for some time now, have never suggested I don't here.

I have said I often don't use it in other cars in other races though.

 

[Adrenaline]

-

Surely you jest Adrenaline.

Anyway, have had 3 tries at 515PP 288hp, 58.6% power and have only made 2nd spot so far. But it's all due to my mistakes, even hitting the divider near the starting area.

Ha ha, was going OK until the boys came up, shot my game to hell not long after. Will try later.

Regarding SRF, I have been stating I use SRF for some time now, have never suggested I don't here.

I have said I often don't use it in other cars in other races though.

I assumed you were, but wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt, because I don't understand the point of posting lap times, or successful victories that rely solely on the use of SRF, yet alone the point of using a lower PP to create a challenge, while using SRF to completely remove any challenge.

 

[Endless-Wilso]

Even good drivers can be improved by SRF.

If your just getting money and need to get it done with a really low PP than for most people aids is well worth it .
There's not many people in GT5 that are faster without it when your looking at already very quick drivers that may use it for that little extra advantage .

 

[Dalone]

I assumed you were, but wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt, because I don't understand the point of posting lap times, or successful victories that rely solely on the use of SRF, yet alone the point of using a lower PP to create a challenge, while using SRF to completely remove any challenge.

In the Time Trials best laps are posted automatically regardless of whether one uses SRF (if allowed), or whether one uses a wheel or a controller.

The best racers mostly use a wheel, so obviously a wheel is a huge advantage.

Points are not deducted because they race against players without that advantage.

If one posts their best lap when not using SRF and it is one using a very low PP, I for one am impressed, knowing I would be unlikely to be able to match it. However there are many players who use the very LEGAL, SRF when it is allowed. I cannot see why they should be demeaned in any way shape or form because of it.

If someone beats a players lap time or achieves a lower PP than another who does not use SRF, good bloody on them. Players can use SRF if they want to maintain their advantage (in skills, a wheel or waiting for a specific line up of slower cars before they race etc) and no one will look down on them.

Finally, I would suggest that claiming that SRF is the sole reason one could better another who doesn't use it seems a tad green eyed.

 

[SirAlanClive]

Even good drivers can be improved by SRF.

If your just getting money and need to get it done with a really low PP than for most people aids is well worth it .
There's not many people in GT5 that are faster without it when your looking at already very quick drivers that may use it for that little extra advantage .

I had the impression that SRF worked a bit like TC: My take on TC is that when the wheels start to spin because of too much power, the power is reduced slightly until wheel spin stops. Like the opposite of ABS I guess. I thought that SRF also did this, reducing power slightly, but suddenly, to stop lateral slip.

My point being that I thought both of them involved reduction of power and thus slower lap times. Please enlighten me if I'm 'out to lunch' here.

 

[iainoflo85]

I had the impression that SRF worked a bit like TC: My take on TC is that when the wheels start to spin because of too much power, the power is reduced slightly until wheel spin stops. Like the opposite of ABS I guess. I thought that SRF also did this, reducing power slightly, but suddenly, to stop lateral slip.

My point being that I thought both of them involved reduction of power and thus slower lap times. Please enlighten me if I'm 'out to lunch' here.

Too much TC does lower top speed, so lowers lap times. SRF adds grip so this increases lap times.

But I'm sure Adrenaline or someone else will go into more detail.

 

[SirAlanClive]

I tried to find some useful info before i posted but most of the previous threads discussing this were full of childish banter. I did however find this here:

SRF however is a totally different story.
SRF imho is a cheat.
What it does is: give you 30% more grip, by increasing the programmed grip setting of the game. It's not something that exists in real life.
Example: you steer into a corner, driving waayyy too fast. Lets say the car understeers.
Lets say you could corner at 100km/h, but you try it at 120 km/h.
You will not make the corner. But with SRF on you gain 30% more grip the moment you loose grip, so you can corner it at 120km/h.

As far as I can tell it's about equivalent to increasing tire compont 1 set 'better.
So, if you use Sports Hard, without SRF you can turn at 100km/h. With SRF you manage to do it at 110 km/h.
But, if you turn SRF off and use better tires, in this case Sports MEdium, you're also be able to corner at 110km/h.
However, if you turn SRF on you can do it at 120km/h (equal to Sports Soft without SRF)

I drive the BMW M5, max tuned with Sports Soft and all driving aids off around the Nordschleife in 6:45:xxx
With Active steering on, I'm not getting faster. Stays at 6:45:xxx
With SRF on, I can suddenly do it in 6:35:xxx.

Conclusion:
SRF does not exist in real life, it alters programmed physics of the PS3.

Enlightened. Thanks, but I think I'm glad I've harbored this misconception for just over 2 years. I'm sure I'm a better driver for it.

 

[iainoflo85]

I tried to find some useful info before i posted but most of the previous threads discussing this were full of childish banter. I did however find this here:

Enlightened. Thanks, but I think I'm glad I've harbored this misconception for just over 2 years. I'm sure I'm a better driver for it.

Thank you, this puts a definite figure on it. I'm now more enlightened also. That's quite a dramatic increase in lap times on the ring.

1 tire component softer with SRF was also my reckoning. This just proves it.

 

[byegad]

My two pennorth.

SRF makes you faster, but can make the car behave strangely at the limit.
ABS at 1 or 2 makes braking more certain.
ASM slows you down but makes the car easy to drive.
Traction control (At more than 1 or 2 INHO.) does the same as ASM, but not as much!

And while the last 3 are real and available, but not always fitted, on road and race cars. SRF is not!

 

[Dalone]

Sir Allen posted (not his words);

SRF however is a totally different story.
SRF imho is a cheat.
What it does is: give you 30% more grip, by increasing the programmed grip setting of the game. It's not something that exists in real life.

I drive the BMW M5, max tuned with Sports Soft and all driving aids off around the Nordschleife in 6:45:xxx
With Active steering on, I'm not getting faster. Stays at 6:45:xxx
With SRF on, I can suddenly do it in 6:35:xxx.

~~

Are we to believe that the poster would, in his own BMW M5, drive as fast as he possibly could around 'The Ring' just to see how fast he could do it. Taking chances like one does here, hoping not to crash?

I do not believe it for the briefest second. He can drive as fast as he likes here because it is a GAME, not real life. There is no connection whatsoever between how one drives here and how one would drive in real life. It is silly to compare them.

SRF is NOT cheating any more than using a wheel is, or waiting for the weakest line up is, as long as one is honest and says they use it.

"1 tire component softer with SRF was also my reckoning. This just proves it. "

Proves it? I beg to differ. I'm sure it could be worked out but I'm not gullible enough to believe what any poster out of the blue says to 'prove their argument'.

 

[Adrenaline]

I had the impression that SRF worked a bit like TC: My take on TC is that when the wheels start to spin because of too much power, the power is reduced slightly until wheel spin stops.

TC reads tire slip, and cuts power to compensate.
SRF, reads tire slip, and artificially increases grip by means that are physically impossible in the real world. The tire upgrade is a good example, but the tire upgrade only occurs when slip is detected.

However there are many players who use the very LEGAL, SRF when it is allowed. I cannot see why they should be demeaned in any way shape or form because of it.

If you want to use SRF, then sobeit, you're only hindering yourself. But if you want to make post after post about how you beat the seasonal with SRF, then people are just going to laugh at you, because no one is impressed nor proud.

Players can use SRF if they want to maintain their advantage (in skills, a wheel or waiting for a specific line up of slower cars before they race etc) and no one will look down on them.

I'll always look down upon it's use, and I look even further down upon those who use it while trying to justify it with an excuse.

My initial point was, you have 75PP of advantage to play with, why limit your PP and then cheat anyways? It's counter intuitive. It's literally no different than tuning your car down to 500PP, but cutting the track every chance you get. It makes no sense, you either want a challenge or you don't. If all you care about is winning, best laps, and leader gaps, then use SRF, use 600PP and go have fun.

Finally, I would suggest that claiming that SRF is the sole reason one could better another who doesn't use it seems a tad green eyed.

Word twisting won't work here. I didn't say SRF was the sole reason that someone could beat my lap times, there's thousands that can do that without any aids needed, and the lap time and PP I posted aren't even impressive to begin with.
I said that your successful victories rely solely on SRF. If you think you can prove me wrong, then simply win the race, with the exact same car, same tune, same driver, same track, same field, at 520pp withOUT SRF. If you can't do it, then guess what? Your victory relied solely on the use of SRF. You can argue with logic all you want, you'll still be wrong.

 

[Dalone]

Notwithstanding the above, I have just won Tsukuba at 515PP (292hp, 1100kg 59.3% power) with the same Nismo on pole. Best lap 55.6 sec and won by .62 sec. $2,246,400..exp 251640.

Adrenaline said;
""I don't understand the point of posting lap times, or successful victories that rely solely on the use of SRF,............."""

If you can't beat my PP reductions and win, that's fine. There are plenty of players here who use SRF regularly, lets just pretend that it is to them I post.

Just as you are posting to those who don't, presumably as those of us who do are 'cheating', according to you. Maybe you should inform GT5 of all us cheats.

I wonder if 510PP is possible?

Adrenaline ""doesnt play well w/others"" ...........'nuff said.

 

[SirAlanClive]

Are we to believe that the poster would, in his own BMW M5, drive as fast as he possibly could around 'The Ring' just to see how fast he could do it. Taking chances like one does here, hoping not to crash?

I do not believe it for the briefest second. He can drive as fast as he likes here because it is a GAME, not real life. There is no connection whatsoever between how one drives here and how one would drive in real life. It is silly to compare them.

I think you misunderstood. He was driving 'in-game' which is obvious due to his reference to using SRF, which does not exist in real life...

well actually....I live in Norway and use studded tires for 4-6 months of the year. When you buy a new set, you are told not to drive over 80 kph for the first 200 km, because it takes that long for the studs to set in the rubber. If you drive too fast you risk losing your studs prematurely as they will work their way out. However we aficionados like to think we're smart and we drive at 90-ish for a wee while at the very beginning to make the studs protrude a little more than stock. We then return to the under 80 regime until they're set. The ones I'm using now (Nokian Hakkapelitta 5) are perfect. As I go into a lateral slide, the studs get drawn out a bit by the friction increasing my grip and reducing the slide.
Perhaps, one day, nano-tech will let us surface tires with salamander-like protrusions which will let SRF really happen?

 

[Stotty]

No problems if someone wants to use SRF, but any results done with it enabled are only relvent when chasing cash or to other laps run with it on - by any other measure the achievement is meaningless.

SRF isn't an aid like ABS, TC or ASM, as it increases the amount of grip the car has and as such makes it faster everywhere with no penalty for using it.

Yesterday I was running laps in the HSV at Suzuka. 1'51.2 off line, 1'51.5 on line. Just for a laugh I decided to try it with SRF... 1.50.5 on line. A full second advantage and I only ran 5 laps with SRF on - I reckon I could probably get down as far as a high 1'50 with more laps. Coming out of the Hairpin in 2nd gear I could use full throttle from before the apex and the car would hold it's line and grip. With no SRF the car would initially push, then spin up if I applied gas in the same way.

Saying SRF is similar to some people using a wheel vs others using a controller isn't accurate IMO. There are people who are pretty much as fast as all bar the super aliens with a pad, so using one is not a barrier to being quick - I have a guy on my friends list who's run a 1'26.1xx in the SLS TT with the pad. OK, that's .8 off Amo, but it was a top 10 time last time I looked and super fast by any measure.

Comparing SRF to using a better grade of tyre is a decent analogy IMO. And you would laugh at anyone coming in to a TT dicussion and claiming they were fast when they'd used a better tyre.

 

[Dalone]

Yes, 510PP is possible (won by .67 sec's, best lap 55.6) and you win $2,329,600...exp 260,960. And that is with no corner cutting, thank you Adrenaline for bringing it up.

510PP is 281hp and 57.1% power, for those who are interested. And of course I post these figures so anyone can check them for accuracy against the times/PP etc.

Interesting post Sir Alan about the tyres. I have never driven on snow or ice and never actually want to (be somewhere where you have to) however I have spent quite a bit of time in the scrub chasing wild buffalo with a Toyota with no roof or windshield, and very ordinary tyres as they are constantly holed, so no good fat ones thanks. There is plenty of sliding around etc although mostly in low gears. I don't drive like that on bitumen.

I understood that the BMW driver was only referring to the game, and that was my point, it is a game where he can do things and take chances (with SRF on) that he would never attempt in real life. So it's irrelevant even comparing SRF to real life. If you get my drift.

Stotty said;

"No problems if someone wants to use SRF, but any results done with it enabled are only relvent when chasing cash or to other laps run with it on - by any other measure the achievement is meaningless."

I would argue that it may well be meaningless to drivers here who never use it, however there are a number who do at times.
As long as one states they are using it it is, in my opinion, as valid as not using it, and many have done so since I arrived here when chasing lower PP numbers on these type of Seasonals. And these aren't TT's, they are fun races, that's all.

 

[SirAlanClive]

... If you get my drift....

Lol, that was quite good

 

[Stotty]

Stotty said;

"No problems if someone wants to use SRF, but any results done with it enabled are only relvent when chasing cash or to other laps run with it on - by any other measure the achievement is meaningless."

I would argue that it may well be meaningless to drivers here who never use it, however there are a number who do at times.
As long as one states they are using it it is, in my opinion, as valid as not using it, and many have done so since I arrived here when chasing lower PP numbers on these type of Seasonals. And these aren't TT's, they are fun races, that's all.

As I said, I don't have any issue with people using it... it's your game, you can play it however you want.

But I'll put it my point above in another way... there's no relevence between laps run with SRF on and laps run with SRF off.

 

[GTP_CargoRatt]

TC reads tire slip, and cuts power to compensate.
SRF, reads tire slip, and artificially increases grip by means that are physically impossible in the real world. The tire upgrade is a good example, but the tire upgrade only occurs when slip is detected.


If you want to use SRF, then sobeit, you're only hindering yourself. But if you want to make post after post about how you beat the seasonal with SRF, then people are just going to laugh at you, because no one is impressed nor proud.


I'll always look down upon it's use, and I look even further down upon those who use it while trying to justify it with an excuse.

My initial point was, you have 75PP of advantage to play with, why limit your PP and then cheat anyways? It's counter intuitive. It's literally no different than tuning your car down to 500PP, but cutting the track every chance you get. It makes no sense, you either want a challenge or you don't. If all you care about is winning, best laps, and leader gaps, then use SRF, use 600PP and go have fun.


Word twisting won't work here. I didn't say SRF was the sole reason that someone could beat my lap times, there's thousands that can do that without any aids needed, and the lap time and PP I posted aren't even impressive to begin with.
I said that your successful victories rely solely on SRF. If you think you can prove me wrong, then simply win the race, with the exact same car, same tune, same driver, same track, same field, at 520pp withOUT SRF. If you can't do it, then guess what? Your victory relied solely on the use of SRF. You can argue with logic all you want, you'll still be wrong.

Completely agree with everything you've said here Adrenalin and I share your views on SRF 100%. People can use SRF if they want, but I am not impressed with any lap times done with it on. The way I see it, once you turn it on, the "Real Driving Simulator" becomes the "Real Arcade Racer." Again, I don't look down on people that use it, but don't come on here bragging that you got such and such time with it on because my reply to you will be, "Ok, now take off the training wheels and then see how good you are." It is not a realistic aid, which is why it is banned in TT's and also in the WRS. SRF just gives you a false sense of security and turns you into Superman.

 

[freerizzy]

With so much discussion on SRF, I think I will turn it on and see what's what. I turned it off the first day I played the game a year back and never have driven with it on, except in the Holiday Seasonal and I have only done the rainy Spa so far. I wanna see whats it like on dry tarmac.

 

[freerizzy]

EDIT: Triggers for gas/brake, X and square for shifting here... when I am using DS3. I was reluctant to switch to triggers at first but after playing enough games that forced me to use them I got used to it.

Throttle response on the DS3 is not linear which makes controlling it very difficult without a lot of practice. Some people say it is better on the analog stick, but I found it to react the same uneven way as it does with the trigger, so I switched back to L2/R2 for easier access to the brake. It might seem a little unusual at first, but some people use the stick for gas and a trigger for the brake, which lets you use both if you need to while still having the old standard stick-throttle.

Brake response is perfectly linear and so braking even without ABS is no problem on the DS3 with only a little practice.

I have been looking around on the forum to see what button layout people are using on the DS3.

I use the square for braking and the X for throttle. Left Analog Stick for steering and L1 and R1 for gear shifts. I manage to modulate the throttle a bit with the X button but I do have some problems. Guess I will give your button layout a try and see if it works better for me.

 

[freerizzy]

Back on topic, DS3 drivers; with TC and SRF turned off, what do you guys use for controls to make the car more controllable when you exit a corner?

First of, I know the right tune, especially LSD and aero are important. Less important is the transmission and ridehight from what im getting. After you have everything perfectly tuned, what method do you think is the best suited for when you exit corners?

I for one am one of the few probably that uses the right analog stick for accelerating and braking, it works good but definitely not even close to a real pedal. The triggers might be even better controllable but i use them for shifting (thinking about switching actually, without aids the analog is much harder to properly balance imo). Does anybody manage top times with the buttons? I used this method back in the gt1/2 days, tapping is the answer obviously but that seems to much of a hassle for me personally.

Anyway I am decent in gt5 but I hardly ever play the game, trying it with no aids on a DS3 woke me up just how much I suck (and just how much the DS3 sucks without the proper training). I will be trying oinks tune to see just how much it helps, if it's not enough I might change my controls accelerating and braking from analog to triggers. If that doesn't help I'll either put TC or SRF on till I actually buy a wheel.

I use a DS3 and my setup is different then yours. I use the X for throttle, square for brakes, R1 and L1 for up shift and down shifts. Left analog stick for steering. I find it comfortable this way but I will try your setup also and see if it makes any difference though it will be tough getting used to it. I will also give Morgoth_666 setup a try also. You should try his layout as well.

Throttle modulation is tough on DS3 but it can be done using the triggers much better than the sticks, in my opinion.

 

[JohnBM01]

You know, I goofed! I never put on Racing Medium tires! I only just bought Racing Mediums and not install them. So I'm sorry for bringing that up.

 

[GTP_CargoRatt]

With so much discussion on SRF, I think I will turn it on and see what's what. I turned it off the first day I played the game a year back and never have driven with it on, except in the Holiday Seasonal and I have only done the rainy Spa so far. I wanna see whats it like on dry tarmac.

Get ready to feel like Superman.

 

[machinist1976]

Sorry for the off thread title post but...

Get ready to feel like Superman.

No lie there. I just turned it on and wow! I tried it on a grind race I have done 100 times and 2.6 seconds a lap faster at Laguna Seca in a 650PP Audi R10.