Anyone planning to drop GT5?

[ocalot2k5]

Hell to the No. Now why would i want to drop the best driving simulator this gen. I'll check out F4. Turn 10 had some inspiration for their new photomode, top gear, varying times of day, Imaged based lighting etc etc. Competition is healthy for everybody.

 

[GTOne2Three]

speak for yourself

60 million copies sold suggests to me they know what they are doing. flagging? in your dreams. most sold exclusive ps3 game and most sold car racing game not called mario kart. A prologue version of the game outsold the 'HIGHLY RATED' forza 3 game.

More sales just says that the game is running on past glory and the only reason it sells is for the name alone. Doesn't mean that the game has all it's issues sorted out.

The game meant to dethrone Gran turismo. when it comes to sales there is no comparison between both games. One is a brand. Well known throughout the world. The other has to pay the top motor programme on the bbc to gain some relevance. (won't make a difference though)

One is well known, and one came out and swiftly took the spotlight because PD fell asleep at the top. Forza gaining recognition from Top Gear is not good for GT because Forza will be better known. GT took top gear and squandered it like a hobo squandering his change for booze. 3 events, no standing start and invisible walls? Seriously? Or even when they squander licenses, they get these big car companies that everyone wanted and only have like 1 or 2 cars while they make 30 skylines for another company. Forza has covered just about every complaint we had with GT. The only thing missing is a wheel that rivals the DFGT.

Also go and enjoy painting your banged up astra for the millioneth time buddy. me? i will be crusing at the ring at night. when it comes to the core experience, Gran turismo is in a league of it's own. And that my friends is what matters.

It's called variety. No one is pointing a gun to your head and making you put decals on your car. It's something to have to make you car unique. GT is in a league of it's own, and that league is lagging behind. GT has the core driving done right, but that's about it. A few tracks with their own weather and time features, and the only customization being the stupid paint chip system and a few body pieces and only like 13 cars that can be race modded. While GT stays there, Forza is going all out.

Not standard cars.

90% of GT5's cars are standard PS2 cars

not livery ********

No, we got a lousy paint chip system.. Such good tools for making your car "you".

not friggin top gear either.

No, we got the watered down version. It's actually pretty embarrassing. Wasting a license like that really hurt GT5's potential.

The gameplay. That'is what matters.

True, and not spending 5 years on making weld marks on premium models. Weld marks that no one will ever see unless one of the replay cameras go through the geometry of the car..

And the more varies it is, the better.

And that's where Forza is winning.


---------------------------------

Sry for sounding harsh towards the game, but take the fanboy goggles off..


GT5 isn't bad when it comes to the core gameplay which is the actual driving. But everything else is missing or is half a**ed.

Both games may be on 2 different platforms, but both games are the big guns for their respective platform. If Forza4 really does well, everyone will turn their heads and pick up the platform with the better choice.

I'm still playing GT5, but my hype for any sequel is diminished because I cant trust what they say anymore until it's released.

 

[ocalot2k5]

More sales just says that the game is running on past glory and the only reason it sells is for the name alone. Doesn't mean that the game has all it's issues sorted out.


One is well known, and one came out and swiftly took the spotlight because PD fell asleep at the top. Forza gaining recognition from Top Gear is not good for GT because Forza will be better known. GT took top gear and squandered it like a hobo squandering his change for booze. 3 events, no standing start and invisible walls? Seriously? Or even when they squander licenses, they get these big car companies that everyone wanted and only have like 1 or 2 cars while they make 30 skylines for another company. Forza has covered just about every complaint we had with GT. The only thing missing is a wheel that rivals the DFGT.

It's called variety. No one is pointing a gun to your head and making you put decals on your car. It's something to have to make you car unique. GT is in a league of it's own, and that league is lagging behind. GT has the core driving done right, but that's about it. A few tracks with their own weather and time features, and the only customization being the stupid paint chip system and a few body pieces and only like 13 cars that can be race modded. While GT stays there, Forza is going all out.


90% of GT5's cars are standard PS2 cars


No, we got a lousy paint chip system.. Such good tools for making your car "you".


No, we got the watered down version. It's actually pretty embarrassing. Wasting a license like that really hurt GT5's potential.





And that's where Forza is winning.


---------------------------------

Sry for sounding harsh towards the game, but take the fanboy goggles off..


GT5 isn't bad when it comes to the core gameplay which is the actual driving. But everything else is missing or is half a**ed.

Both games may be on 2 different platforms, but both games are the big guns for their respective platform. If Forza4 really does well, everyone will turn their heads and pick up the platform with the better choice.

I'm still playing GT5, but my hype for any sequel is diminished because I cant trust what they say anymore until it's released.

Driving isn't half assed aye....And Gran turismo 5 is the master of varied types gameplay. It might not be perfect but it has them all. I think this is what turn is failing to see. GT5 continues to sell because it truely provides something for everyone.

 

[Nokkien]

2500+ cars atm, think I will play more when I reach my goal at 4000+ unique cars.

 

[ocalot2k5]

2500+ cars atm, think I will play more when I reach my goal at 4000+ unique cars.

LOL. If my expectations were for GT5 to be perfect? I would have dropped it like a stone. But alas,polyphony is staffed by mere mortals

 

[CSLACR]

👍

Sorry but the game has a Christmas Tree (drag racing lights) now unless I've not played GT enough along with other racing games...I haven't seen a single stretch of 1/4 mile with a functional tree. Also I've never played Forza online due to not wanting to pay for XBOX live so I don't know how it functions online, but offline there is a tree that you can run two player on. It also gives you an E/T at the end.

Also what makes you think a game has to have a nice area that says "Drag Race"? Cause you say so? I also recall GT4 having a Drag strip that players could run single player on to see their times. If you could please do a little more research instead of just trying so hard to be right over everyone else, this debate would be more intellectual. And who knows you might learn what you to refuse for being right. I'm glad you've started that at the end of your quote...learning to say your wrong is a good step:tup:

What you describe sounds good enough for me, if GT5 would have a simple 1/4 mile stretch with a tree at the beginning and ET at the end, to use online, some fun could be had. Quite a bit.

it takes 3-6 months to render a car

Let's be honest. No. No it doesn't take 3-6 months for the company to render a car, it takes 3-6 months of man hours to model a car. Meaning 6 months turns to 1 if 6 men work. So if PD has 40 car modelers, (just example, irrelevant to the point)) But if PD has 40 modelers, it would take each group one to two weeks a car if divided into 10 man groups.

Well, don't get so defensive. I know there's interest in drag racing, but it's in very darn few racing games. It has never been in Forza, and I think the last Gran Turismo it might have been in is GT2. In the real world it's very popular, but every dedicated drag racing game has sold poorly compared to every other genre. I think you're one of those guys who think most people feel the same way you do about any given subject. Any additional draw from a drag racing feature will no doubt be paltry.

As for Gran Turismo's car list vs Forza's, you're talking to the wrong guy here, because I have several hundred Standard cars. And to be honest, without the livery editor, Forza is just another racer as far as I'm concerned, kind of like NFS refined.

I would expect drag racing games to sell poorly. A perfect example I sit, never having played a single second, let alone bought a drag racing game, I much prefer road racing games, but when drag racing is included (like NFS PS) it can be very fun for something different to do.
I particularly like the way they had shift points in NFS, while an unrealistic advantage from getting "perfect" it added drama to the races.

As someone who never even saw a drag racing suggestion in the page Jordan set up specifically for GT5 suggestions, complete with voting, I really don't think the overall interest is there among the videogame racing crowd. Yes, there is a GT5 drag racing subforum, and it has a few people hopping in through the day, but I've never seen all that much.

PD is completing a huge move of the studio across hundreds of miles, so considering everything on their to-do list is going to have to be severely prioritized for a while, I have a feeling that dragging is going to be pretty low on the ladder.

I expect you're right about what will happen (or not in this case) but I don't believe that's a smart move by PD.
I saw the 5 threads a day, and constant new names popping up in the tuning forum looking for drag tunes, and people setting up drag races afterwards. In this small corner of the GT5 world that is GTPlanet, there are plenty of people that can be found enjoying drag racing, even without anything proper to use as markers.

There are quite a bit of "drag" rooms online as well, start searching at Indy and SSR7 to find most of them. (not that I recommend actually doing it with the cheating typically found, and lack of proper starts and markers kills it for me.)

 

[analog]

Once again sir, you've basically said what's on my mind. With the one exception being I am making the plunge and buying the "other" system this time. I've played GT since July '98, it has always been my standard-bearer for the console racing genre, but GT5 just hasn't lived up to my expectations, mostly down to the quality divide that is Standards/Premiums, the lack of customization, and the relative lack of community features compared to Forza. I always saw the FM series as an imitator too, and while sure, it did start out as very similar to GT, I think it has it's own style and feel now. I like racing games in general, and while I'm not completely off the GT series (I'm very curious about GT6), I realize this time, unlike the wait for GT5, I'm not going to miss out on other series.

Oh how much easier would this all be if both games were multi-platform instead of exclusives, then this whole discussion would be more like COD vs Battlefield or FIFA vs PES or.....The Rolling Stones vs The Beatles.
And relying on exclusive game titles to shift consoles seems to be an increasingly risky strategy if one of your stalwart titles ends up disappointing even the most loyal longtime customers, that Sony recently went on a shopping spree to ensure more exclusive titles might illustrate this.

You'd think, with the combined sales of both series, there's a huge potential market for a 3rd party to persuade gamers to invest in a sim equal in scope but available on more than one console but since it requires so much money for a newcomer to threathen these 2 behemoths (both backed hugely by Sony and Microsoft) might be the answer why that still isn't the case.

With the arrival of the X-Box it was only a matter of time that they would offer a game similar to GT (which only makes sense businesswise, especially since GT was a hugely succesful exclusive) so any game that would have arisen had the unthankful job of being considered a 'copy' or indeed rip-off but like you mentioned it probably has by now acquired its own identity.
Creativity usually starts by copying other artists before finding your own niche which brings me back to the example of The Rolling Stones vs The Beatles I gave earlier, the first single ever released by The Rolling Stones was a cover of a Beatles song.....

 

[kimi123]

If this thread is to remain open, I think the same policies as the FM vs GT thread will need to be adopted:

• Opinion is not fact - don't present it as such
• Argue the point don't attack the person making it
• The term 'fanboy' (including any and all derivations) is banned
• Accusations of 'Troll' simply because you don't like what someone says are also out
• If you make a claim back it up with sources - fail to do so and you will be asked to provide them

Once again sir, you've basically said what's on my mind. With the one exception being I am making the plunge and buying the "other" system this time. I've played GT since July '98, it has always been my standard-bearer for the console racing genre, but GT5 just hasn't lived up to my expectations, mostly down to the quality divide that is Standards/Premiums, the lack of customization, and the relative lack of community features compared to Forza. I always saw the FM series as an imitator too, and while sure, it did start out as very similar to GT, I think it has it's own style and feel now. I like racing games in general, and while I'm not completely off the GT series (I'm very curious about GT6), I realize this time, unlike the wait for GT5, I'm not going to miss out on other series.



Well, that depends on your criteria. FM3 has generally higher ratings than GT5 on most gaming sites, so FM4 doesn't need to do much to remain the higher-rated series. Some of the big criticisms of FM3 have already been addressed too; we'll need to wait and see about other ones (the AWD superiority of FM3, the misaligning liveries), or if any new ones pop up, of course. But there hasn't been a time since FM1 that both series have had new iterations so close together, nor has their been a time they've been so close, competition-wise.

lol what. Why does anyone have to look at review score to determine the purchase for sim racers. Rfactor2, GTR3 may get 60 or 70 according to reviews but no one cares. People will still get it.

OP is lost. It is like saying why play anything else if MW3 is releasing or BF3, any other game for that matter.

 

[Sselecta]

Dropping it? Personally, not for a while. I just got GT5 after being hugely dissapointed what they deliverd us on the release date. It gradually got better with the seasonal events and whatnot updates PD made, which was highly doubtful at first sight.

But I can see where those with both consoles are getting at. Forza 4 is up to date with regarding to the car list, graphics and the endless tuning and customization options. Whereas GT5 is - in lack of a better word - sterile.

 

[CSLACR]

Once again sir, you've basically said what's on my mind. With the one exception being I am making the plunge and buying the "other" system this time. I've played GT since July '98, it has always been my standard-bearer for the console racing genre, but GT5 just hasn't lived up to my expectations, mostly down to the quality divide that is Standards/Premiums, the lack of customization, and the relative lack of community features compared to Forza. I always saw the FM series as an imitator too, and while sure, it did start out as very similar to GT, I think it has it's own style and feel now. I like racing games in general, and while I'm not completely off the GT series (I'm very curious about GT6), I realize this time, unlike the wait for GT5, I'm not going to miss out on other series.

It sounds like my racing game history and thoughts/feelings myself, down to the T.

You'd think, with the combined sales of both series, there's a huge potential market for a 3rd party to persuade gamers to invest in a sim equal in scope but available on more than one console but since it requires so much money for a newcomer to threathen these 2 behemoths (both backed hugely by Sony and Microsoft) might be the answer why that still isn't the case.

Something I'd never considered, but an interesting point.
I have to wonder what would happen if SHIFT became more sim-like then it already is...

With the arrival of the X-Box it was only a matter of time that they would offer a game similar to GT (which only makes sense businesswise, especially since GT was a hugely succesful exclusive) so any game that would have arisen had the unthankful job of being considered a 'copy' or indeed rip-off but like you mentioned it probably has by now acquired its own identity.
Creativity usually starts by copying other artists before finding your own niche which brings me back to the example of The Rolling Stones vs The Beatles I gave earlier, the first single ever released by The Rolling Stones was a cover of a Beatles song.....

They're not going to like hearing that.

"God needs ze Devil
Ze Beatles needed ze Rolling Stones
Diane Sawyer needed Katie Couric
Will you be my, Katie Couric?"

And Jean Girard needed Ricky Booby.

 

[analog]

They're not going to like hearing that.

Yep, unfortunately I made a mistake, it wasn't their first but their second single apparantly...

 

[Bushby_23]

60 million copies sold...

That is a gross ecxageration of 1000%

90% of GT5's cars are standard PS2 cars

I thought we had 200 odd premiums, or in other words near enough 20%


I thought we were supposed to provide proof for figures and such, not use random numbers off the top of our heads...

"God needs ze Devil
Ze Beatles needed ze Rolling Stones
Diane Sawyer needed Katie Couric
Will you be my, Katie Couric?"

Winner

 

[CSLACR]

Yep, unfortunately I made a mistake, it wasn't their first but their second single apparantly...

Even though you pointed it out, someone will believe that changes everything.

That is a gross ecxageration of 1000%

I don't agree with a word he said, but series total would be around 60-65 million right now.

I thought we had 200 odd premiums, or in other words near enough 20%

Proba...

I thought we were supposed to provide proof for figures and such, not use random numbers off the top of our heads...

Probably should...

Winner

Thanks, I love that movie.

 

[GTOne2Three]

That is a gross ecxageration of 1000%



I thought we had 200 odd premiums, or in other words near enough 20%


I thought we were supposed to provide proof for figures and such, not use random numbers off the top of our heads...

It was just an exaggeration. Him calling Forza's cars standard was so off compared to GT5's situation. Atleast all the cars are fully modeled.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Oh how much easier would this all be if both games were multi-platform instead of exclusives, then this whole discussion would be more like COD vs Battlefield or FIFA vs PES or.....The Rolling Stones vs The Beatles.
And relying on exclusive game titles to shift consoles seems to be an increasingly risky strategy if one of your stalwart titles ends up disappointing even the most loyal longtime customers, that Sony recently went on a shopping spree to ensure more exclusive titles might illustrate this.

You'd think, with the combined sales of both series, there's a huge potential market for a 3rd party to persuade gamers to invest in a sim equal in scope but available on more than one console but since it requires so much money for a newcomer to threathen these 2 behemoths (both backed hugely by Sony and Microsoft) might be the answer why that still isn't the case.

With the arrival of the X-Box it was only a matter of time that they would offer a game similar to GT (which only makes sense businesswise, especially since GT was a hugely succesful exclusive) so any game that would have arisen had the unthankful job of being considered a 'copy' or indeed rip-off but like you mentioned it probably has by now acquired its own identity.
Creativity usually starts by copying other artists before finding your own niche which brings me back to the example of The Rolling Stones vs The Beatles I gave earlier, the first single ever released by The Rolling Stones was a cover of a Beatles song.....

^ Damn someone is good! Great comment. I never thought GT vs FM would be on teh same scale as COD vs BF but shouldn't be too surprised.

 

[MoGoSpeed]

Im pretty sure the Rolling Stones are not on the same legendary level as the Beetles though

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Im pretty sure the Rolling Stones are not on the same legendary level as the Beetles though

Radiohead, Queen, Led Zepplin, Joy Division or Pink Floyd...these bands are all great to go up against Beetles, lets not get carried away

 

[MoGoSpeed]

Radiohead, Queen, Led Zepplin, Joy Division or Pink Floyd...these bands are all great to go up against Beetles, lets not get carried away

That wasn't the correlation though.

 

[CSLACR]

Im pretty sure the Rolling Stones are not on the same legendary level as the Beetles though

Radiohead, Queen, Led Zepplin, Joy Division or Pink Floyd...these bands are all great to go up against Beetles, lets not get carried away

That wasn't the correlation though.

Yes, let's throw personal taste into the example, just like we do for our FM/GT debates.

I expected better LMS
Radiohead? I know they have a cult like fan base, but comparing them to any major artists like the others (except joy div, who?) is laughable.
Just saying, even with personal taste and my possible ignorance hearing of Joy Division, if everyone doesn't know their name, they're not on the same level. Similar to comparing Bow-Wow to Michael Jackson.

 

[GTOne2Three]

Creation is not without influence..

If Forza ripped off GT, then GT ripped off Top Gear for SNES..

 

[MoGoSpeed]

I'm talking about the originality level and also who created what Pop music is on a world level. Rolling stones didn't do that.

Those facts, justify my opinion. despite musical taste.

 

[CSLACR]

Creation is not without influence..

If Forza ripped off GT, then GT ripped off Top Gear for SNES..

Please explain what Top Gear SNES is, I don't know what SNES even stands for.

I'm talking about the originality level and also who created what Pop music is on a world level. Rolling stones didn't do that.

And none of it matters to this discussion, does it?
We can bicker about pop music and what defines "greatness" for the next 200 pages, but if we read the thread title, this is actually about video games.💡

Try not to get caught up in semantics of examples, it won't prove your case for the actual discussion at hand, only the "perfectness" of the example. Then the actual discussion falls by the wayside until you stop arguing pop music.💡

 

[MoGoSpeed]

^Don't act like that.

It was just a comparison that Analog had brought up , and I was just playing with the fact that the Rolling Stones even though influenced by the beetles, are not the same Legendary.

 

[CSLACR]

^Don't act like that.

It was just a comparison that Analog had brought up , and I was just playing with the fact that the Rolling Stones even though influenced by the beetles, are not the same Legendary.

It's not a fact.
You need to learn proper use of the word, "opinion".

And Analog did not bring it up for discussion, they brought it up for reference, as an example., now to quote myself.

Try not to get caught up in semantics of examples, it won't prove your case for the actual discussion at hand, only the "perfectness" of the example. Then the actual discussion falls by the wayside until you stop arguing pop music.

You can argue pop music until a moderator steps in, but it cannot prove anything in relation to this thread. (which makes it off-topic)

 

[another_jakhole]

I thought we had 200 odd premiums, or in other words near enough 20%

206, at least. Or, definitely.

It was just an exaggeration. Him calling Forza's cars standard was so off compared to GT5's situation. Atleast all the cars are fully modeled.

60 million is under selling it, but...

Same Genre, Any Platform

Name - Genre - Worldwide
Mario Kart Wii (Wii) - Racer - 28.33
Mario Kart DS (DS) - Racer - 22.26
Gran Turismo 3: A-Spec (PS2) - Racer - 14.89
Gran Turismo (PS) - Racer - 10.85
Gran Turismo 4 (PS2) - Racer - 10.62
Mario Kart 64 (N64) - Racer - 9.87
Gran Turismo 2 (PS) - Racer - 9.37
Super Mario Kart (SNES) - Racer - 8.76
Mario Kart: Double Dash!! (GC) - Racer - 6.96
Gran Turismo 5 (PS3) - Racer - 6.50
Figures in the above tables are millions of units sold.

The whole series is over 65 million, not including the other games Kaz was in control of.
GT5 will have to get knocked off by the alternate. Not going to happen. Notice anything funny, or superb, going on with that Top 10 chart?

Looking at the standards in GT5 isn't nearly as painful as looking at the not fully modeled cars in FM3. Their forms were usually, always off. No car really matched to the shape of their real life car. Gameplay

Fully modeled? FM3 didn't have fully modeled cars. Even with the standards in GT5, they have their undersides detailed to an extent. Standard cars aren't just a copy and paste thing.

I saw the 300c I had my car changed to IN a photo travel location (Kyoto Gion) and during gameplay (and replay). I can honestly say that it looked really good. How can you say that all of the standards look like crap or are just useless?
Not asking the person I quoted but to everybody. Is every standard bad looking? I sit close enough to my tv to notice most details and the standards (a lot of the old ones) are just amazing looking, especially for what they've been branded. 800 to choose from isn't so bad. At least, we have the choice to choose unique cars or duplicates.

Creation is not without influence..

If Forza ripped off GT, then GT ripped off Top Gear for SNES..

Actually no. Top Gear was released in Japan the earliest in 1992, and by that time, Kaz and 14 others were working on GT1 for the next 4 years.
I would have loved it if Kaz got his inspiration from Top Gear SNES (one of my favorite games). But truth is, Kaz said he, let's say envisioned, something like GT when he was 15. By that time he had a couple of years of programming under his belt (not sure if it was 2, 3 or 4 years before then when he started programming).

People who think Kaz is a problem, stop being silly.

 

[MoGoSpeed]

@CSL
It's a fact that Rolling Stones didn't have the same or as great of an influence on Pop Music that the Beetles did, all it takes is understanding the history and evolution of music through that time period. The relation to Analogs comparison and the discussion is that the ORIGINAL is mostly always greater, I was merely adding on to his Metaphor.

Relax CSLACR.


EDIT: Heres's the Rolling Stones Greatest List for humor
http://www.rollingstone.com/music/l...sts-of-all-time-19691231/the-beatles-19691231

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

@CSL
It's a fact that Rolling Stones didn't have the same or as great of an influence on Pop Music that the Beetles did, all it takes is understanding the history and evolution of music through that time period. The relation to Analogs comparison and the discussion is that the ORIGINAL is mostly always greater, I was merely adding on to his Metaphor.

Relax CSLACR.

Just cause a tune is catchy doesn't mean it's good, beetles made it work because for their time frame they were different. Kinda like what Jimi Hendrix did for Rock, yet he actually sounds good (subjective) but either way put rock on the map and pushed it to a place that was insane for the time period.

Yes, let's throw personal taste into the example, just like we do for our FM/GT debates.

I expected better LMS
Radiohead? I know they have a cult like fan base, but comparing them to any major artists like the others (except joy div, who?) is laughable.
Just saying, even with personal taste and my possible ignorance hearing of Joy Division, if everyone doesn't know their name, they're not on the same level. Similar to comparing Bow-Wow to Michael Jackson.

Sorry buddy to dissapoint you, I'm a massive Radiohead fan, I just can't stand the Beetles and don't understand the love. You're right though if the name isn't well known or mainstream people wont know, which is all too sad. However, I digress and apologize to you again and will go back to the topic for the sake of the mods and myself as well as everyone else.

 

[CSLACR]

206, at least. Or, definitely.


60 million is under selling it, but...

Same Genre, Any Platform

Name - Genre - Worldwide
Mario Kart Wii (Wii) - Racer - 28.33
Mario Kart DS (DS) - Racer - 22.26
Gran Turismo 3: A-Spec (PS2) - Racer - 14.89
Gran Turismo (PS) - Racer - 10.85
Gran Turismo 4 (PS2) - Racer - 10.62
Mario Kart 64 (N64) - Racer - 9.87
Gran Turismo 2 (PS) - Racer - 9.37
Super Mario Kart (SNES) - Racer - 8.76
Mario Kart: Double Dash!! (GC) - Racer - 6.96
Gran Turismo 5 (PS3) - Racer - 6.50
Figures in the above tables are millions of units sold.

The whole series is over 65 million, not including the other games Kaz was in control of.
GT5 will have to get knocked off by the alternate. Not going to happen. Notice anything funny, or superb, going on with that Top 10 chart?

Looking at the standards in GT5 isn't nearly as painful as looking at the not fully modeled cars in FM3. Their forms were usually, always off. No car really matched to the shape of their real life car. Gameplay

Fully modeled? FM3 didn't have fully modeled cars. Even with the standards in GT5, they have their undersides detailed to an extent. Standard cars aren't just a copy and paste thing.

I saw the 300c I had my car changed to IN a photo travel location (Kyoto Gion) and during gameplay (and replay). I can honestly say that it looked really good. How can you say that all of the standards look like crap or are just useless?
Not asking the person I quoted but to everybody. Is every standard bad looking? I sit close enough to my tv to notice most details and the standards (a lot of the old ones) are just amazing looking, especially for what they've been branded. 800 to choose from isn't so bad. At least, we have the choice to choose unique cars or duplicates.



Actually no. Top Gear was released in Japan the earliest in 1992, and by that time, Kaz and 14 others were working on GT1 for the next 4 years.
I would have loved it if Kaz got his inspiration from Top Gear SNES (one of my favorite games). But truth is, Kaz said he, let's say envisioned, something like GT when he was 15. By that time he had a couple of years of programming under his belt (not sure if it was 2, 3 or 4 years before then when he started programming).

People who think Kaz is a problem, stop being silly.

On my 480i TV running simple component connection I can see a major difference between any standard and any premium.
And you should know, not everyone's problem with standards is just in the way they look, but in the physics that sometimes come along with them.
See this thread to get an idea of what I mean.

@CSL
It's a fact that Rolling Stones didn't have the same or as great of an influence on Pop Music that the Beetles did, all it takes is understanding the history and evolution of music through that time period. The relation to Analogs comparison and the discussion is that the ORIGINAL is mostly always greater, I was merely adding on to his Metaphor.

Relax CSLACR.


EDIT: Heres's the Rolling Stones Greatest List for humor
http://www.rollingstone.com/music/l...sts-of-all-time-19691231/the-beatles-19691231

And here's a link to the AUP.
Not a pop culture thread, I canot stress enough to you how much I do not care about discussing pop culture in a video game thread.

As for your "the original is always better", I'll raise you a Godfather II.
That doesn't mean we're going to go through history and try and "prove" each thing that is subjective to opinion and personal taste, just a glimpse of where it goes.
You see? We start talking about GT5 and FM4, and next thing you know, Beatles and Rolling Stones, then Godfather movies, who knows what's next?
Anyone can agree that from time to time, somebody comes along and makes something better than before, it's called "evolution", Mitsubishi have kindly been naming their cars this for quite some time now. And what it shows is they've kept improving it.
Shall we start arguing Impreza vs EVO? Firebird and Camaro? Corvette and Viper? BMW, Audi, Mercedes?

Hopefully you understand now why the side subject is irrelevant here, it's all subjective, and there is no "correct answer", in any case.
If not, I refer you back to the AUP on topics.

Sorry buddy to dissapoint you, I'm a massive Radiohead fan, I just can't stand the Beetles and don't understand the love. You're right though if the name isn't well known or mainstream people wont know, which is all too sad. However, I digress and apologize to you again and will go back to the topic for the sake of the mods and myself as well as everyone else.

It's ok bud, jus sayin it's all subjective.
I'm not a big fan of any of the bands listed, one of the prime examples for me of how subjective it can actually be. I could make a great argument for Korn to be listed alongside Jimi Hendrix, or anyone other greats for that matter, but we're just doing GT5 and FM4 now.👍

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Quite true ^

 

[photonrider]

As soon as the reviews of Forza 4 come out? If it turns out to be as good as all the hype?

Drop GT as soon as the reviews of Forza 4 come out?

Nope. Though I will not hesitate to purchase Forza 4 when the real thing arrives on the shelf. Simply: I collect racing/driving/simulation of wheeled transport games.
I did start up Forza 3 - but left off after around 3 - 4 hours of gameplay (got it after GT5) to bury my head in GT5/GT4 again. Nothing wrong with Forza - it has its own shtick.

As for GT, in fact I have spare copies of GT5/GT4 in case my present disc fails, to prevent withdrawal symptoms.

The only thing that pulls me away from GT is TT.
Oh, hold on . . .

I guess we all live in different worlds.

But no. No dropping anything GT from PD for neither competitive reviews nor competitive games - however loudly the ex-Sony/PD employees, or sales reps, or anti-marketing people around here (if they are) may holler.

Leave me my right to purchase what I want and enjoy it in the way I think fit.

I guess now I'll toodle off to the Feedback Forum and look around for the Complaints Department.