"Daily" Race Discussion [Archive]

[MIE1992]

I had an idea. What if more races (that weren't one-makes) allowed the tuning of just the top speed? That first tab under the transmission options. I think we'd see a lot more diversity in the fields of cars per race if that one setting were able to be tuned more often. You wouldn't need need to have the final gear ratio be available for tuning, or anything else, tbh. Maybe the anti-roll bars to help cars with oversteer/understeer, but that'd be it. I think it'd be a good way to have some tuning available to even out the cars in ways BoP cannot (as the best top speed to have is on a track-by-track basis), but not overwhelming people with all the potential options.

The overall idea would be if the race is effectively a one-make (or effectively a one-make in the specific case that both SF19 cars are permitted), then tuning could generally be disabled, but when there are multiple cars that can be used, then tuning in one or both of these areas (anti-roll bar and top speed) would be available most of the time. BoP would still be on, and settings for any other area would be disabled.

 

[Pigems]

I had an idea. What if more races (that weren't one-makes) allowed the tuning of just the top speed? That first tab under the transmission options. I think we'd see a lot more diversity in the fields of cars per race if that one setting were able to be tuned more often. You wouldn't need need to have the final gear ratio be available for tuning, or anything else, tbh. Maybe the anti-roll bars to help cars with oversteer/understeer, but that'd be it. I think it'd be a good way to have some tuning available to even out the cars in ways BoP cannot (as the best top speed to have is on a track-by-track basis), but not overwhelming people with all the potential options.

The overall idea would be if the race is effectively a one-make (or effectively a one-make in the specific case that both SF19 cars are permitted), then tuning could generally be disabled, but when there are multiple cars that can be used, then tuning in one or both of these areas (anti-roll bar and top speed) would be available most of the time. BoP would still be on, and settings for any other area would be disabled.

Tuning of any kind would ruin Sport Mode for most players, the great part about SM is that you’re racing other drivers, not racing their tunes in any way, shape or form. If they are faster it’s ALWAYS going to be because of their their driving and never the car, unless they are using a different car, in which case it’s a simple fix, use the same car as them.

There is a reason why the non tuning TT’s have had higher participation levels so far.

 

[MIE1992]

Tuning of any kind would ruin Sport Mode for most players, the great part about SM is that you’re racing other drivers, not racing their tunes in any way, shape or form. If they are faster it’s ALWAYS going to be because of their their driving and never the car, unless they are using a different car, in which case it’s a simple fix, use the same car as them.

There is a reason why the non tuning TT’s have had higher participation levels so far.

I see. So you don't think some cars are overused? And unlike the TTs, I wouldn't be allowing all settings to be tuned, just one or two, namely the transmission top speed and maybe the anti-roll bars.

Alternatively, I propose that there should be more options for lobbies, namely the following:
-Ability to enable/disable specific settings within the menu, rather than only allowing either all or none.
-Being able to set the maximum power as low as 30hp. (It only goes down to around 98 at the moment.)
-The ability to automate when the next race will begin, rather than have it be done manually. It would be in the form of specifying how much time will elapse between when the players are returned to the menu after finishing a race, and when the next race will start. (And for endurance races, you could account for the length of the qualifying and the race, and how much time will allow players to finish after the leader to have a further automated time for when events begin. It could be something posted within the lobby's preview, too.)
-On that subject, being able to see the lapcount of a currently-running race. I can't stand it when I can see how many laps the race will be in total, but how many laps have been run so far.

 

[6BK]

I see. So you don't think some cars are overused? And unlike the TTs, I wouldn't be allowing all settings to be tuned, just one or two, namely the transmission top speed and maybe the anti-roll bars.

Alternatively, I propose that there should be more options for lobbies, namely the following:
-Ability to enable/disable specific settings within the menu, rather than only allowing either all or none.
-Being able to set the maximum power as low as 30hp. (It only goes down to around 98 at the moment.)
-The ability to automate when the next race will begin, rather than have it be done manually. It would be in the form of specifying how much time will elapse between when the players are returned to the menu after finishing a race, and when the next race will start. (And for endurance races, you could account for the length of the qualifying and the race, and how much time will allow players to finish after the leader to have a further automated time for when events begin. It could be something posted within the lobby's preview, too.)
-On that subject, being able to see the lapcount of a currently-running race. I can't stand it when I can see how many laps the race will be in total, but how many laps have been run so far.

The question of cars being "over used" is debatable. FWD cars are definitely over the top. They are easy to control, are quick out of corners and great top speeds. All-in-all this is not realistic and could be solved easily. However, ONE car is not the META at all tracks. The Megane and F-Type are doing well at Bathurst this week but the 4C and Megane Trophy were META at Brands. There are some cars that never get a look in at any track because they are not META anywhere but as the tracks rotate so too do the cars.

If there were more races than 3 on the "Daily" slot I could understand more options being given. For example, one could be a rally track, one could be wet weather, one with car tuning, another with reverse order grids so fastest last. I could add a dozen other "options" and I'm sure the other members here would add to it. It's a bit like "The Homer" though, you can't add every option so you have aim for the lowest common denominator (but not Suzuka every week please). There are not enough players to populate that many race options in my opinion which is why PD limit it to 3 weekly. Given that we have only 3 races and it is not likely to increase I don't think giving one over to "with tuning" would be justified.

As to why "with tuning" would not justify, you'll see a lot of guys here posting that they are jumping on for only a couple of races and they are players interested enough in GTS to be posting here. What about the hundreds (thousands?) that are not as interested as we are, that play other games too, that also have busy real lives and hardly have enough time to learn a track and discover what car they like most on it. Will they also have time to figure which car, on which track, with which amount of what tuning they need to run in order to just start having fun? Pure and simple, I wouldn't have the time and would probably not bother joining in.

 

[Pigems]

I see. So you don't think some cars are overused? And unlike the TTs, I wouldn't be allowing all settings to be tuned, just one or two, namely the transmission top speed and maybe the anti-roll bars.

Alternatively, I propose that there should be more options for lobbies, namely the following:
-Ability to enable/disable specific settings within the menu, rather than only allowing either all or none.
-Being able to set the maximum power as low as 30hp. (It only goes down to around 98 at the moment.)
-The ability to automate when the next race will begin, rather than have it be done manually. It would be in the form of specifying how much time will elapse between when the players are returned to the menu after finishing a race, and when the next race will start. (And for endurance races, you could account for the length of the qualifying and the race, and how much time will allow players to finish after the leader to have a further automated time for when events begin. It could be something posted within the lobby's preview, too.)
-On that subject, being able to see the lapcount of a currently-running race. I can't stand it when I can see how many laps the race will be in total, but how many laps have been run so far.

I use bumper cam, so for me I don’t ever see any part of my car. I personally don’t care what car I’m using, it’s just a tool, it just needs to be the best tool for the job. I look at each car as if it is it’s own “tune”. Any bit of tweaking to any of the BoP’d cars will throw the BoP off way worse than it is now.

I’m all for having more options in lobbies though.

 

[larrybr07n]

The question of cars being "over used" is debatable. FWD cars are definitely over the top. They are easy to control, are quick out of corners and great top speeds. All-in-all this is not realistic and could be solved easily. However, ONE car is not the META at all tracks. The Megane and F-Type are doing well at Bathurst this week but the 4C and Megane Trophy were META at Brands. There are some cars that never get a look in at any track because they are not META anywhere but as the tracks rotate so too do the cars.

If there were more races than 3 on the "Daily" slot I could understand more options being given. For example, one could be a rally track, one could be wet weather, one with car tuning, another with reverse order grids so fastest last. I could add a dozen other "options" and I'm sure the other members here would add to it. It's a bit like "The Homer" though, you can't add every option so you have aim for the lowest common denominator (but not Suzuka every week please). There are not enough players to populate that many race options in my opinion which is why PD limit it to 3 weekly. Given that we have only 3 races and it is not likely to increase I don't think giving one over to "with tuning" would be justified.

As to why "with tuning" would not justify, you'll see a lot of guys here posting that they are jumping on for only a couple of races and they are players interested enough in GTS to be posting here. What about the hundreds (thousands?) that are not as interested as we are, that play other games too, that also have busy real lives and hardly have enough time to learn a track and discover what car they like most on it. Will they also have time to figure which car, on which track, with which amount of what tuning they need to run in order to just start having fun? Pure and simple, I wouldn't have the time and would probably not bother joining in.

100% agree. Back in the day I tried to do a single player career on F1 2017 and man, it was overwhelming, all the settings, practice, qualify, race and upgrade the car, cool but what a mess if you don't have time.

When I come home from work I don't want to waste time, BoP on and off I go. Having to race against people able to spend hours on their setup when I'm not would pretty much kill GTS for me.

 

[Redsea666]

100% agree. Back in the day I tried to do a single player career on F1 2017 and man, it was overwhelming, all the settings, practice, qualify, race and upgrade the car, cool but what a mess if you don't have time.

When I come home from work I don't want to waste time, BoP on and off I go. Having to race against people able to spend hours on their setup when I'm not would pretty much kill GTS for me.

That's what Project Cars can be like. In single player I'd spend a full gaming session just getting my tune down and practicing, and then race the next day or so if it still felt good. It's a lot of fun, but only if you're interested in doing all that crap.

 

[GTP_TO Blue]

hey, i was in a couple of your races yesterday on my US account 'GT-Fred-West'... i think i've got worse as the weeks gone on.. now, rather than concentrating on my own line and pace, i'm more concerned about the people around me. And i'm also just hearing splashing water and rain in my sleep

Thought you were a Brit (Scouser or North West?) when I saw your greeting to another race. Plus, that name gives it away too. Can't imagine a Canuck or Yank really knowing the infamous West.

 

[RacingGrandpa]

I use bumper cam, so for me I don’t ever see any part of my car. I personally don’t care what car I’m using, it’s just a tool, it just needs to be the best tool for the job. I look at each car as if it is it’s own “tune”. Any bit of tweaking to any of the BoP’d cars will throw the BoP off way worse than it is now.

I’m all for having more options in lobbies though.

100% agree. Back in the day I tried to do a single player career on F1 2017 and man, it was overwhelming, all the settings, practice, qualify, race and upgrade the car, cool but what a mess if you don't have time.

When I come home from work I don't want to waste time, BoP on and off I go. Having to race against people able to spend hours on their setup when I'm not would pretty much kill GTS for me.

This. This is the very reason GTS is so much bigger than the"hardcore Sims". And it's the very reason why GTS is such a moneymaker, anyone can race and it's only your own ability that decide where you finish.

 

[sturk0167]

After spending days working on this, it's a bit frustrating to not be able to take it to race A. I never really understood why they won't let us bring our own cars.

You'd fear this thing. Cause you know that guy aint gonna give a damn about dents and scratches.

 

[6BK]

I use bumper cam, so for me I don’t ever see any part of my car. I personally don’t care what car I’m using, it’s just a tool, it just needs to be the best tool for the job. I look at each car as if it is it’s own “tune”. Any bit of tweaking to any of the BoP’d cars will throw the BoP off way worse than it is now.

I’m all for having more options in lobbies though.

100% same - bumper cam & best tool for job, tuning is down to car choice.

I prefer bumper because but even if 3rd person worked better I just don’t get it. How can you engage in an immersive SIM (visually as opposed to mechanically) and then look at it like you’re having an outer body experience?

 

[Pigems]

100% same - bumper cam & best tool for job, tuning is down to car choice.

I prefer bumper because but even if 3rd person worked better I just don’t get it. How can you engage in an immersive SIM (visually as opposed to mechanically) and then look at it like you’re having an outer body experience?

Agreed. I used chase cam when I used to use a DS4, it was only after getting a wheel that I switched to bumper cam. I found bumper cam a little to twitchy with a DS4.

 

[sturk0167]

I had an idea. What if more races (that weren't one-makes) allowed the tuning of just the top speed? That first tab under the transmission options. I think we'd see a lot more diversity in the fields of cars per race if that one setting were able to be tuned more often. You wouldn't need need to have the final gear ratio be available for tuning, or anything else, tbh. Maybe the anti-roll bars to help cars with oversteer/understeer, but that'd be it. I think it'd be a good way to have some tuning available to even out the cars in ways BoP cannot (as the best top speed to have is on a track-by-track basis), but not overwhelming people with all the potential options.

The overall idea would be if the race is effectively a one-make (or effectively a one-make in the specific case that both SF19 cars are permitted), then tuning could generally be disabled, but when there are multiple cars that can be used, then tuning in one or both of these areas (anti-roll bar and top speed) would be available most of the time. BoP would still be on, and settings for any other area would be disabled.

I remember a race back when the "daily" races were actually daily, where all types of tuning were allowed. It was an open garage N400 race. That meant that you could use any of your cars that were N400, or de-tune a higher class car to meet the N400 guidelines. It was held at Circuit de la Sarthe No Chicane. It quickly turned into a one-make race.
If you weren't driving the Ferrari F40, you had no chance of winning. I won it 5 or 6 times that day. 👍
Although, Sven notoriously entered one of the races in his Raptor.

 

[RacingGrandpa]

Agreed. I used chase cam when I used to use a DS4, it was only after getting a wheel that I switched to bumper cam. I found bumper cam a little to twitchy with a DS4.

I'm using a ds4, always in bumper cam or in cockpit. Chase cam makes me feel like I'm back in the first Test Drive.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

I use bumper cam, so for me I don’t ever see any part of my car. I personally don’t care what car I’m using, it’s just a tool, it just needs to be the best tool for the job. I look at each car as if it is it’s own “tune”. Any bit of tweaking to any of the BoP’d cars will throw the BoP off way worse than it is now.

I’m all for having more options in lobbies though.

I would say, move brake balance to the settings page as well and lock it with bop. TCS is an aid, but remove it from changing it during the race, set before like other aids. Then keep the radar and fuel map together on the screen, permanently. I don't want to hear the excuses anymore, I didn 't have the radar on cause BB, TCS, FM.

I remember a race back when the "daily" races were actually daily, where all types of tuning were allowed. It was an open garage N400 race. That meant that you could use any of your cars that were N400, or de-tune a higher class car to meet the N400 guidelines. It was held at Circuit de la Sarthe No Chicane. It quickly turned into a one-make race.
If you weren't driving the Ferrari F40, you had no chance of winning. I won it 5 or 6 times that day. 👍
Although, Sven notoriously entered one of the races in his Raptor.

Thanks for the reminder, it's been a while since I watched that video. I wasn't the only Raptor, we had them F40s surrounded


There was a Sarthe GR.1 race as well with tuning. It turned into the R18 one make, no chance with any other car.

 

[Illum_Concept]

After spending days working on this, it's a bit frustrating to not be able to take it to race A. I never really understood why they won't let us bring our own cars.

You'd fear this thing. Cause you know that guy aint gonna give a damn about dents and scratches.

That is superb. I do not have the first clue about how you have managed that, but the result is incredible.

 

[Pigems]

After spending days working on this, it's a bit frustrating to not be able to take it to race A. I never really understood why they won't let us bring our own cars.

You'd fear this thing. Cause you know that guy aint gonna give a damn about dents and scratches.

Dude, that thing is effin awesome!!

 

[MIE1992]

It's just that all I had to do to my Hyundai Genesis Gr.3 to get similar times to the leaderboards was to set the top speed to 180mph. (EDIT: It was just a matter of moving that first bar under the transmission tab a few notches to the right.) I don't really like how, in the context of Gr.1/Gr.2/Gr.3/Gr.4/Gr.B, everyone picks the same car depending on the track, even if the optimal car may differ from track to track. At that point, it still may as well be a series of one-make races. And I'm not asking to allow for all settings to be available, just top speed, and I'm not even sure about the anti-roll bar.

I don't think it's fair to use an N-series race for comparison, either.

I mean, I did have the idea of having PD do it with BoP, but I fear that'd take too long as we'd be referring to tons of different car/track combinations. But then again, I'm mostly thinking of the groups aside from the N-Series, which I would address entirely differently.

I suppose the most practical idea would be to have BoP account for final gearing and downforce, but instead of making different BoP values on a track-by-track basis, it'd be uniform. So all cars would have identical values for downforce and top speed gearing. Again, this would be for Gr.1/Gr.2/Gr.3/Gr.4/Gr.B.

But otherwise, I do fully agree that a massive facet of GT's popularity is its accessibility. I think there's a way to balance that - in that players shouldn't need to think too much about tuning - and making it so that races that permit all cars in a group don't effectively turn into one-makes, even if said one-make car may differ per course. I would prefer it if the Manufacturer's Series wasn't the only place where I'd see more variety of cars in the field.

 

[250Cal]

I would say, move brake balance to the settings page as well and lock it with bop. TCS is an aid, but remove it from changing it during the race, set before like other aids. Then keep the radar and fuel map together on the screen, permanently. I don't want to hear the excuses anymore, I didn 't have the radar on cause BB, TCS, FM.

Brake balance is important to have IMO. It just gives a small amount of adjustability in the car. I've even used different BB on different sections on certain tracks. It also allows for some adjustment as fuel burns off and tyres wear out.

If I want to get embroiled in battles of car setup I'd go and get into iRacing. And I say that as someone who racked up a lot of wins thanks to tuning back in the early days of GTSport. I can remember a Gr.4 Kyoto daily where I racked up about a dozen consecutive poles/wins in a Nissan GTR, mainly due to how well I had it dialled in.

It's just that all I had to do to my Hyundai Genesis Gr.3 to get similar times to the leaderboards was to set the top speed to 180mph. I don't really like how, in the context of Gr.1/Gr.2/Gr.3/Gr.4/Gr.B, everyone picks the same car depending on the track, even if the optimal car may differ from track to track. At that point, it still may as well be a series of one-make races. And I'm not asking to allow for all settings to be available, just top speed, and I'm not even sure about the anti-roll bar.

I don't think it's fair to use an N-series race for comparison, either.

I mean, I did have the idea of having PD do it with BoP, but I fear that'd take too long as we'd be referring to tons of different car/track combinations. But then again, I'm mostly thinking of the groups aside from the N-Series, which I would address entirely differently.

I suppose the most practical idea would be to have BoP account for final gearing and downforce, but instead of making different BoP values on a track-by-track basis, it'd be uniform. So all cars would have identical values for downforce and top speed gearing. Again, this would be for Gr.1/Gr.2/Gr.3/Gr.4/Gr.B.

But otherwise, I do fully agree that a massive facet of GT's popularity is its accessibility. I think there's a way to balance that - in that players shouldn't need to think too much about tuning - and making it so that races that permit all cars in a group don't effectively turn into one-makes, even if said one-make car may differ per course. I would prefer it if the Manufacturer's Series wasn't the only place where I'd see more variety of cars in the field.

Has your testing extended to tweaking the gearing in other cars and measuring the difference?

There are many variables being taken into account with BOP that PD try to equalise using the big levers of Power and Weight. Unlocking the settings won't equalised the performance the way you think it will IMO.

 

[Mistah_MCA]

When I was on DS4, I was using chase cam.

When I started using the wheel, and to this day... I am still on chase cam.

 

[250Cal]

When I was on DS4, I was using chase cam.

When I started using the wheel, and to this day... I am still on chase cam.

Bumper cam and DS4 FTW!

 

[stpatty]

ST. CROIX B. GROUP 3. NEXT WEEK. MY PRAYERS HAVE BEEN ANSWERED.

thank you based Hideo Turismo

Just realised it's only a 3 lap race

Six and a half minutes ffs

 

[Sven Jurgens]

Brake balance is important to have IMO. It just gives a small amount of adjustability in the car. I've even used different BB on different sections on certain tracks. It also allows for some adjustment as fuel burns off and tyres wear out.

If I want to get embroiled in battles of car setup I'd go and get into iRacing. And I say that as someone who racked up a lot of wins thanks to tuning back in the early days of GTSport. I can remember a Gr.4 Kyoto daily where I racked up about a dozen consecutive poles/wins in a Nissan GTR, mainly due to how well I had it dialled in.

Don't text and drive imo. The more paying attention to settings, the less situational awareness. You're likely used to it and have no problem with it, but I've heard the excuse too many times. I had the brake balance up instead of the radar, oops sorry. The fuel map is a necessary evil with PD's fetish for fuel saving and no other choice with AT. But you can easily fit both radar and FM on the screen in the corner.

Actually if left and right arrow adjust BB and up and down FM, all 3 on screen, that would be fine with me. You still need the fuel map up when short shifting to see how many laps you have left. Driving without radar is usually fine but does help with the blind spots and incoming torpedos.

 

[JoeyLeonine]

Yay finally some game time...

Noooo another update...

Seriously not picking these right at the moment!

 

[Supergtp]

Don't text and drive imo. The more paying attention to settings, the less situational awareness. You're likely used to it and have no problem with it, but I've heard the excuse too many times. I had the brake balance up instead of the radar, oops sorry. The fuel map is a necessary evil with PD's fetish for fuel saving and no other choice with AT. But you can easily fit both radar and FM on the screen in the corner.

Actually if left and right arrow adjust BB and up and down FM, all 3 on screen, that would be fine with me. You still need the fuel map up when short shifting to see how many laps you have left. Driving without radar is usually fine but does help with the blind spots and incoming torpedos.

Maybe I'm weird but I prefer the track map to the radar. Since I race in third person with a DS4, awareness when going wheel to wheel is fine. Track map is more useful for the torpedoes because it gives you less zoom than the radar, giving ample time to avoid them on tracks like the wet courses.

 

[sturk0167]

That is superb. I do not have the first clue about how you have managed that, but the result is incredible.

Thanks, but I think it's something that just about anybody can do, if they're willing to take the time to apply about 4 or 5 hundred decals.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

Maybe I'm weird but I prefer the track map to the radar. Since I race in third person with a DS4, awareness when going wheel to wheel is fine. Track map is more useful for the torpedoes because it gives you less zoom than the radar, giving ample time to avoid them on tracks like the wet courses.

I guess you have no rear view mirror in 3rd person? I see them coming in the mirror first to start avoiding, then the radar to fine tune dodging. No clue why PD doesn't allow mirror in roof cam and 3rd person. You don't actually look at it, but any sudden suspect movement is easily caught from the corner of your eye. I would not want to drive without a mirror.

 

[Supergtp]

I guess you have no rear view mirror in 3rd person? I see them coming in the mirror first to start avoiding, then the radar to fine tune dodging. No clue why PD doesn't allow mirror in roof cam and 3rd person. You don't actually look at it, but any sudden suspect movement is easily caught from the corner of your eye. I would not want to drive without a mirror.

Nope, no mirror in 3rd person. None of the GT games have that for whatever stupid reason. Would be super useful and yet it's never been even an option

 

[Mistah_MCA]

2.11:719 on wet Tokyo Expressway with the Huracan GT3. Optimal is .5. I lost count how long it took me to bring it down to here from 2:12.1.

I am going to stop here. I am so done with this track.

 

[Redneckchef]

I guess you have no rear view mirror in 3rd person? I see them coming in the mirror first to start avoiding, then the radar to fine tune dodging. No clue why PD doesn't allow mirror in roof cam and 3rd person. You don't actually look at it, but any sudden suspect movement is easily caught from the corner of your eye. I would not want to drive without a mirror.

Not having the mirror in roof cam drives me nuts. I relearned the controls when starting GT Sport and switched to roof cam instead of chase or 3rd person. Now after watching much other stuff I want my rearview but don't want to learn a new camera.