"Daily" Race Discussion

[NevilleNobody]

You're missing a trick, my optimal is a 2.00.8 and you're usually half a second up on me.

Most of the field is starting medium, the idea being you don't burn the softs in traffic and if you're going to be bottles up best to have the slower tyre anyways. As i said above, i find it is just too big a transition, you go from fresh softs with no wear in qualy to worn mediums after 2 laps and it's a system shock. I started softs and made way less errors.

 

[Timm Sheehan]

View attachment 1070113

Thank you - really needed this.

 

[NevilleNobody]

Thank you - really needed this.

Back in the day, say 20 to 30 years ago, the spectator area from the cutting through to the dipper, man, I swear they eat their young up there. It was utter bedlam at night, sheer carnage.

To give you some idea of the madness, they had to bring in a rule that limits beer to one case (24 cans) per person per day.

 

[Groundfish]

Back in the day, say 20 to 30 years ago, the spectator area from the cutting through to the dipper, man, I swear they eat their young up there. It was utter bedlam at night, sheer carnage.

To give you some idea of the madness, they had to bring in a rule that limits beer to one case (24 cans) per person per day.

A man after my own heart.

 

[sturk0167]

The start is definitely key. I GO TCS 1, hold 3-4K RPM, then try to avoid triggering the TCS with part throttle (with so little power, the clipped throttle during TCS activation slows the car a lot compared to a clean roll-away)

I'm not sure than any of that is necessary. I don't believe that TCS 1 slows down the car at all.
I don't think it slows down any cars, in any way, unless you use TCS 2, or higher.

I wish the game had a drag racing feature, in order to test and compare our launches using different setups/techniques.
I think one of the older GTs had that feature.

 

[87lc2]

I'm not sure than any of that is necessary. I don't believe that TCS 1 slows down the car at all.
I don't think it slows down any cars, in any way, unless you use TCS 2, or higher.

I wish the game had a drag racing feature, in order to test and compare our launches using different setups/techniques.
I think one of the older GTs had that feature.

I believe that was GT5, I loved that test track. I would do 0-60 & 1/4 mile pulls all the time when setting up cars. Not sure why they would have gotten rid of that...

 

[meekrab]

Great lap...But why the short shifting ?

Thanks. Optimal shift point for the Corvette is 6500-6400 depending on gear. https://gt-engine.com/cars/gr3/gr3_upshift.html

For most cars the difference is not huge but the Corvette loses several tenths a lap if you rev it all the way out.

 

[Groundfish]

@sturk0167

 

[OJBrit]

I'm not sure than any of that is necessary. I don't believe that TCS 1 slows down the car at all.
I don't think it slows down any cars, in any way, unless you use TCS 2, or higher.

I wish the game had a drag racing feature, in order to test and compare our launches using different setups/techniques.
I think one of the older GTs had that feature.

@Tidgney has done this for Gr4 and Gr3. You can replicate it yourself on any track with a decent straight.

 

[sturk0167]

View attachment 1070269
@sturk0167

I wasn't implying that you can't drive fast with TCS 2+(obviously, you can).

Just pointing out that the game cuts power to the cars if they skid, or start to spin the tires.
With TCS 1, it will never cut power. It only helps your drive wheels with forward bite (slightly), during straight-line acceleration. 👍
I don't think everyone is aware of that.

Generally, I think there's no good reason to not use TCS 1 all the time, and in every car. Unless you want to do some stunt driving, or you think TCS Off is just a macho thing.

If anyone can provide a factual reason why my idea is wrong, please say so. I'm not positive that I'm completely correct, so if I've misconstrued TCS 1, please fill me in.

 

[meekrab]

With TCS 1, it will never cut power. It only helps your drive wheels with forward bite (slightly), during straight-line acceleration. 👍

I'm not sure how it can "help your drive wheels with forward bite" without cutting power? That's what TCS does, it cuts power.

 

[NevilleNobody]

that's my thought. Though i don' care, TC2 for me, always unless FWD or AWD.

 

[O604]

If anyone can provide a factual reason why my idea is wrong, please say so. I'm not positive that I'm completely correct, so if I've misconstrued TCS 1, please fill me in.

TCS is a game setting. It's not real. Arguing like it's real is pointless and a bit embarrassing to watch.

 

[KosmoKazi]

I'm not sure than any of that is necessary. I don't believe that TCS 1 slows down the car at all.
I don't think it slows down any cars, in any way, unless you use TCS 2, or higher.

I wish the game had a drag racing feature, in order to test and compare our launches using different setups/techniques.
I think one of the older GTs had that feature.

Typically, TCS 1 vs any potential wheel slip... I agree... doesn't slow you down. But I seemed to be losing places to people when 'abusing' the TCS on the start with higher RPM and higher intervention on the launch, with the '65 Mini. I've experimented and when I moderate the throttle, even with TCS on, I seem to get a better launch.

What I mean is if wheel slip might occur at >50% throttle from launch, and I press the throttle at 100%, and expect the TCS to help me, it is doing more work than if I press the throttle at 60%, where the TCS is doing less work and all those little peaks of 'clipped' power and the time it takes to bring the engine power to below wheel slip threshold, is less (by the time the system 'catches' the issue and manages it with the TCS power cut off).

You can study such a thing in an engineering systems course as an engineer (which I have!) and even in a sim/game, the math is the same. And it seemed more pronounced to me with the old Mini, compared to Gr3 race cars, where you can mash the throttle and let the TCS work, and always be ahead.

I agree, I would like to have a test strip to check launch. I've used SSRX to test, measuring time to the line markers or first sector, but it's not as easy as a true test strip would be.

I'm not sure how it can "help your drive wheels with forward bite" without cutting power? That's what TCS does, it cuts power.

Yes, but how it cuts power is to dither the throttle on/off when wheel slip occurs. There is a time factor, and the preciseness of the dithering would affect it. And to @O604 point, yes, but I believe the game models the same behavior as a 'real' car's TCS, dithering the throttle (pulse-width modulated throttle input) and this would for certain have a certain slowing behavior. It's really pronounced with the low power and relatively high final drive ratio (including tire diameter) in the older Mini. IMO

 

[sturk0167]

TCS cuts power in real life cars. In GT Sport, TCS 1 doesn't do it.

 

[Groundfish]

I wasn't implying that you can't drive fast with TCS 2+(obviously, you can).

Just pointing out that the game cuts power to the cars if they skid, or start to spin the tires.
With TCS 1, it will never cut power. It only helps your drive wheels with forward bite (slightly), during straight-line acceleration. 👍
I don't think everyone is aware of that.

Generally, I think there's no good reason to not use TCS 1 all the time, and in every car. Unless you want to do some stunt driving, or you think TCS Off is just a macho thing.

If anyone can provide a factual reason why my idea is wrong, please say so. I'm not positive that I'm completely correct, so if I've misconstrued TCS 1, please fill me in.

Everyone launches with TCS all the time and understands TCS is fastest off the line and yet everyone insists on turning tcs off in race even in gr3. Lol I have no idea why.
I’ve given up on TCS explaining to people lol. My races do the talking.
I will say this…Currently I’m high BS and won my last two lobbies on c race by over ten seconds to second place, and 4th and back 30 plus seconds behind.
I was on TCS3.
Every car behind I looked at was zero on TCS.
Every car was minimum 2 seconds a lap slow from my pace AND higher tire wear.
Imo if the time led a guy runs are way slower with tcs on in any level that means they are making many mistakes.
If the cars that out of balance that tcs cuts in in an unwanted way you’re all boogered up.
TCS on wheel is a fabulous teacher and tool-you can feel in the ffb the EXACT limit of throttle that can be applied AS WELL AS EXACTLY how early it can be done!
FURTHERMORE with TCS you can get ON THROTTLE EARLIER than is possible with zero just having TCS shade that tiny bit early too much throttle OFF.
IM NOT telling anyone HOW to play.
I’m simply pointing out what works for me.
I’m not telling anyone how to drive but I will readily allude to the fact that I am a pretty fast driver and that’s all.

What angers me is the TCS OFF elitist mentality.
People decry the use of a VIDEO GAME SETTING IN A RACING SIM?
Come on people what the heck do you care what anyone else does?
I will readily allude to the FACTS of what is possible using tcs.
I’m not saying do things my way-just pointing out it’s very effective as an alternative to the TCS elitist master race stupid mindset.
I win plenty with my tcs and everyone who is a hater can bugger off!
I’ve seen these tcs master race people EVERY RACE off track, spinning, sliding crashing, slow, and losing.
Don’t get me started on FRONT WHEEL DRIVE CARS and TCS ROFLMAO YEAH TURN IT OFF!!!
HAR HAR HAR

 

[87lc2]

TCS cuts power in real life cars. In GT Sport, TCS 1 doesn't do it.

This is very interesting and news to me. I always run TCS 0 because my lap times are quicker. Sometimes I'll use TCS during a race in higher level cars just as insurance, but in qualifying I always run faster with TCS 0, even in GT2 cars. I could have sworn any level of TCS cut power, but I'll give it a go at TCS 1 and see what happens, would be nice to leave it on 1 all the time just in case.

 

[meekrab]

Everyone launches with TCS all the time and understands TCS is fastest off the line and yet everyone insists on turning tcs off in race even in gr3. Lol I have no idea why.

Launching with TCS isn't the fastest, it's just the simplest and most consistent way to just go racing without losing a bunch of time if you mess up the launch slightly.

 

[sturk0167]

This is very interesting and news to me. I always run TCS 0 because my lap times are quicker. Sometimes I'll use TCS during a race in higher level cars just as insurance, but in qualifying I always run faster with TCS 0, even in GT2 cars. I could have sworn any level of TCS cut power, but I'll give it a go at TCS 1 and see what happens, would be nice to leave it on 1 all the time just in case.

I bet I've done 10,000+ qualifying laps. I'm always switching up the settings to try all possible combinations.
If TCS 0 was faster than 1, I would definitely know by now.

Full disclosure: The majority of my laps are in street cars.

 

[Groundfish]

Shoot at Lemans I was usin AUTOMATIC trans TCS 3 LINE CONES AND MARKERS and crushing A plus all week lmao.
With TCS you can ABUSE curbs.
With TCS you become somewhat IMPERVIOUS to dirty drivers.
I dunno anyone can do whatever they like but hating tcs is DOWNRIGHT DUMB

Launching with TCS isn't the fastest

Don’t take this the wrong way lol. 😎

 

[Tidgney]

@Tidgney has done this for Gr4 and Gr3. You can replicate it yourself on any track with a decent straight.

My driving school on acceleration demonstrates it perfectly

 

[sturk0167]

Typically, TCS 1 vs any potential wheel slip... I agree... doesn't slow you down. But I seemed to be losing places to people when 'abusing' the TCS on the start with higher RPM and higher intervention on the launch, with the '65 Mini. I've experimented and when I moderate the throttle, even with TCS on, I seem to get a better launch.

Don't let the grid starts at Brands Hatch fool you. At the last Brands race A, I realized that the cars lined up on the left get a bit of an advantage over the ones lined up on the right, because they are starting out uphill from them at the start.

I think there's another track with the same issue, but don't remember which.

Pay attention to how your launches compare to the cars in the line next to you. 🤔

 

[KosmoKazi]

...and I do wish we could discuss things here without it devolving into a debate about TCS! I was simply pointing out what I thought I'd learned in this specific race, because the launch is really key to the outcome, and the car is a bit unique compared to so many others (against a car that launches really differently, making it even more critical!)

Good, point, @sturk0167 ...I think you're right. I've been stuck on the inside more often than not, and it does seem to put you on the defense, which is ironic as you do want to be inside heading into paddock, for sure. It's helter skelter some races.

 

[O604]

...and I do wish we could discuss things here without it devolving into a debate about TCS!

There isn't a debate. It's standard info.

The people using TCS are just saying it works for them. And you can't argue with results. But even they acknowledge it's against the norm.

Launch control should be very different for each car. I believe in GTS TCS is more of a counter action to button smashing. Probably why default is 3. And why would you need anything over 3?

 

[Groundfish]

As far as grid start launches go I kinda suck.
I have had my best luck most times either just holding throttle to floor bouncing off rev limiter letting luck do it or (this one I’m unsure about) holding throttle below rev limiter at some rpm below redline and ramping to full but not to limiter at the exact second the flag drops…
It seems like rev limiter might muck me up sometimes because it bounces the revs up and down so starts are kinda like a dice roll.
Some players clearly have a big advantage on grid starts but I haven’t put effort in to figure out the best way.
All I know is sometimes you can pull a big gap other times not.

@0604 re why over 3 or why 3-my opinion is it depends on the car and type of mistakes the driver is making in that car.
My expertise is mostly gr3 or 2 but in those cars let’s say you are at tcs3 and unbalance the car so much tcs cuts power back a large amount-this pitches the cars weight forward more which can result in LESS traction and you end up with a car not spun but partly sideways and zero power.
More TCS allows LESS wheelspin so sometimes more TCS prevents the car from getting upset as badly-again car dependent etc.
Higher setting prevents the car from getting so upset to begin with.
It’s interesting to note the differences in tcs effect per car too.
It’s not a blanket thing it’s effect varies between cars a little too.
But basically lower settings allow more leeway with slide but that also means depending on the mistake made it might end up much slower than a higher setting.
We had a top split FIA at Autopolis in a GTR, and I qualified last but made top five with tire wear because I had tcs3.
Guys were faster OVER ONE LAP, but with my far less wear I easily passed them later in the race…
I see lots of fast players 0 tcs.
I just don’t enjoy racing at zero.
Too easy for a slight bump to fry your tires and cause off, curbs get goofy, etc etc etc.
I’d rather race my competitors than fight my own car…

 

[NevilleNobody]

It's a bit of an each to his own situation. Often in qualy I run TC1 and in races TC2, with tyre wear and a greasy track, say the late lap stints at Bathurst this week, I will even go to 3.

This is a bit like the "what car is faster" argument, one a bit loose or one balanced. For most drivers, balanced is ideal, but the freaks, they be faster with a loose car that they have the skill to tame.

 

[Groundfish]

You're missing a trick, my optimal is a 2.00.8 and you're usually half a second up on me.

Last time I ran 2:00.10.
So this time I’m off, but last time I used Mustang and this time it drives much worse-last time IOF hit 58.3.

 

[sturk0167]

I just figured out how to do a live broadcast on youtube.
Racing from the back at race A. Check it out. 👍

 

[O604]

I haven't figured out streaming yet. Haven't tried too hard. But I'd like to know how.

Plan today was Race B. But I'm not clicking yet. Something is off I couldn't figure it out today.

So I did a Race A instead. Started 2nd/finished 5th. Blew the start again. Down to like 8th or something. But fun. I like it mid pack vs front. I think I just like watching a few cars in front of me.

 

[Groundfish]

I just figured out how to do a live broadcast on youtube.
Racing from the back at race A. Check it out. 👍

Dangit I’m not home or I would join.