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DiRT Rally Thread
- Thread starter The Stig Farmer
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LeGeNd-1
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Makes sense, yeah 👍 Having lots of separate locations with only a few stages each will just make it feel like Gran Turismo's pathetic attempts at "rally" mode.
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LeGeNd-1
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Oh certainly, in terms of track design you can't fault PD. I love everything from Tahiti Dirt Route 3 to Smokey Mt North to Eiger. But they are not rally tracks. Being a closed loop, wider than a car width in most places, and running races with 4 other AI at the same time is just not rally. I just see it as a hybrid between rallycross and Sega Rally
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I remember a review of Colin McRae Rally 2.0 where the reviewer deducted marks for narrow roads because Gran Turismo 2 had wide stages for power-sliding, and he couldn't do it in CMR2.0 ...
- 4,332
Agreed. I'm happy for them to reuse assets from DR for future games (as long as it's in the vanilla game and not as DLC).
If you have to choose though, would you prefer many locations (i.e. countries) with maybe 2-3 unique stages OR fewer locations with more unique stages each (say 5-6)?
I don't think game development works that way. Physics programmer is an entirely separate job from car/track modeller. Gran Turismo only has 1 guy doing all the physics stuff (the same guy from GT1 in fact - Akihiko Tan) for all 1200 cars. But they have lots of car and track modellers - check the credits of GT5/6 if you don't believe me.
DR having few tracks is purely down to the amount of detail each track has and the fact that Codies isn't as big as PD/T10. Keep in mind they also modelled the mammoth Pikes Peak hillclimb in its entirety. AC is an even smaller team (the whole company is just 30 people), which is an even bigger limitation on content-making ability. Again, they only have 1 physics guy - Aristotelis Vasilakos.
I am very happy that developers like Codies and Kunos go with the less is more approach, as that allows them to focus more on simulating unique physics and audio characteristics of each car, not to mention track accuracy. We've all seen how things can be a grand mess when developers tend to focus too much on content richness/variety.
I'm still contemplating getting AC though - not sold on the car sounds or pad control yet.
LeGeNd-1
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If you love driving you will love AC, regardless what the rest of the game is like. A wheel is a must though. You just don't get the same sensations with a pad. Car sounds is adequate. It's not as "brutal" as RRRE or Automobilista, but it's more than adequate in most cases (and certainly much better than GT).
If you need more opinions, you could always drop by the AC subsection here. It's one of the most civilised sections on GTP and we are always happy to help
- 4,332
If you love driving you will love AC, regardless what the rest of the game is like. A wheel is a must though. You just don't get the same sensations with a pad. Car sounds is adequate. It's not as "brutal" as RRRE or Automobilista, but it's more than adequate in most cases (and certainly much better than GT).
If you need more opinions, you could always drop by the AC subsection here. It's one of the most civilised sections on GTP and we are always happy to help
Everybody keeps telling me how fantastic the driving is from a sim perspective! Literally everybody I know who owns the game has said the exact same thing: Physics are spot on. 👍
I don't, however, have any intentions of getting a wheel and that's part of the reason why I'm hesitant to pick it up. CARS just didn't feel right on the pad no matter what kind of adjustment you would make - the moment the car started sliding and you attempted to recover, the control just seemed broken.
Are there adequate adjustment options for the pad? Would you say pad control is as refined or friendly as Forza? Speaking of which, the sounds are not quite as good as the FM games, are they? That's also a bit of a deal breaker for me.
But I will keep checking out the section you mentioned. Maybe, just maybe, if it goes on a generous sale, I'll get it. I wonder when the second one is releasing. If that's in a year or so, might as well get that.
- 2,393
- FLX81
Hey there, it's grumpy, Dirt Rally-hating me again, did you miss me? 
Lately, I found that it took only one simple step to make DR much more enjoyable for me: Use the DS4 instead of my T300 with its useless wet fart FFB.
But tonight, I almost threw my PS4 out of the window thanks to this damn game. First, I crashed out of the monthly event on the 3rd to last event and I still dont know how and why it even happened (1.5 hrs wasted
). Then I tried rallycross. Would be fun, if the opponents werent unbeatable for some reason (that said, I have somehow managed to win an event by using my sexy powers). Every heat I m in is 5+ seconds faster than the next best, I often have the second fastest lap, yet I m almost always dead last?!? What in the everliving hell?!? I m in Clubman, I now have engine upgrade 2 and the other Minis still take off like rocketships while I m puttering along in my seemingly half broken pedal car. Again: What in the everliving hell?!? And you cant even bump the opponents out of the way, they just turn around and leave you standing if you try. Yet, when they want you gone, you re fish food. I was dragged along into a second joker lap because the entry was on the left and my opponent was on the right of me. He just took me with him like a trophy wife grabbing her shopping bags, despite me pulling right harder than Trump behind closed doors and yelling all my neighbors awake.
To summarize my DR rallycross experience: What the everliving 🤬🤬🤬 hell?!?
Lately, I found that it took only one simple step to make DR much more enjoyable for me: Use the DS4 instead of my T300 with its useless wet fart FFB.
But tonight, I almost threw my PS4 out of the window thanks to this damn game. First, I crashed out of the monthly event on the 3rd to last event and I still dont know how and why it even happened (1.5 hrs wasted
). Then I tried rallycross. Would be fun, if the opponents werent unbeatable for some reason (that said, I have somehow managed to win an event by using my sexy powers). Every heat I m in is 5+ seconds faster than the next best, I often have the second fastest lap, yet I m almost always dead last?!? What in the everliving hell?!? I m in Clubman, I now have engine upgrade 2 and the other Minis still take off like rocketships while I m puttering along in my seemingly half broken pedal car. Again: What in the everliving hell?!? And you cant even bump the opponents out of the way, they just turn around and leave you standing if you try. Yet, when they want you gone, you re fish food. I was dragged along into a second joker lap because the entry was on the left and my opponent was on the right of me. He just took me with him like a trophy wife grabbing her shopping bags, despite me pulling right harder than Trump behind closed doors and yelling all my neighbors awake. To summarize my DR rallycross experience: What the everliving 🤬🤬🤬 hell?!?
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There are some areas of Monte Carlo that are instant dead zones - run into them, and the car cannot be recovered. Some are understandable, like if you plough through a guardrail and go over a cliff. But others (and it sounds like you hit one of these) are frustrating, like if you go over a snowy embankment near the top of Pra d'Alart.
LeGeNd-1
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Any particular reason why you don't want to get a wheel? There are a couple of reasonably cheap and capable wheels on the market these days. If you're on PC a used G25 will suffice. If you're on console the Thrustmaster T150 is a good entry level one. Me personally I bought my G25 8 years ago and I have to say I don't regret a single cent that I've spent. It is the best gaming related purchase I ever made.
I have never played AC with a pad because it just seems pointless to me. From what I hear it is better than PCARS, but not as good as GT. Understandable really, because Polyphony only has to focus on 1 platform and they can optimise the pad handling perfectly. GT also isn't as punishing as AC and it has hidden stability assists with pad.
Sounds I'd say on par with Forza, but in a different way. I don't rate Forza that highly in sounds either. The thing with AC sounds is it's very good in cockpit, but not in chase/replay exterior views. Another plus for AC is environmental sounds - you hear chassic flex, suspension creak, dirt bouncing off fenders when you go off track. It's the little details that makes it amazing 👍 Trust me, you won't be disappointed with the sounds.
AC2 is a few years off maybe. Right now Kunos are still laying out plans for updates to AC in 2017. Again, this comes down to what platform you're on. If you're on PC, AC gets sales quite frequently on Steam. Personally I'd go the PC route - mods make it way superior than console version. If you're on PS4, I'd expect prices to come down fairly quickly as well - niche games like AC don't hold their price for too long.
Even if it's $60 though, think of it this way - how much would you think it takes to drive a LaFerrari, P1 and 918 around Nurburgring in real life? Well in AC, you get 95% of the experience for only $60 - and heaps of other cars and tracks on the side 👍
Anyway, I don't want to derail this thread anymore. If you have anymore questions feel free to PM me
- 6,344
- Nantes
- P308R
Dirt 4, PS4
- 1,139
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- calvins48
Actually can't wait! Still progressing through the stellar DiRT Rally on PS4 so probably won't get DiRT 4 at launch but nevertheless -
I really hope it's in the same vain as DiRT Rally. All out sim - no arcade stuff!
The new Your Stage mode sounds inspired the same too we had in GT5 and 6 - create your own courses!
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wow! come on June, where are you?
- 636
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- alexschmidt1995
So here's where I'm at: I play a lot of assetto corsa and pcars, I have played earlier dirt titles and am looking for a new racing game. Does rally feel like a true sim with good force feedback?
- 4,022
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If you want a "True Sim" I'd go get Richard Burns Rally. If you want a arcady sim like PCars or Assetto Corsa then DiRT Rally will be right for you.
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- I_powerslide
Seeing as he's a Lamborghini Super Trofeo champion I think it's fair to say @Kamuifanboy has a better grasp on sim vs arcadey sim than most people on this site.
On the topic of Dirt Rally: It's easily the best rally game since Richard Burns Rally. And what it lacks in variety it more than makes up for in quality. It's realistic and difficult but not to the point of frustration, which is something RBR struggled with. I'd highly recommend Dirt Rally, it's one of my favourite racing games. But if you're looking for a brutally difficult "true sim" you won't find a better rally game than RBR.
@Speedster911 -- About all I can say here is that I've rarely heard DiRT Rally referred to as "arcadey". I haven't played DR, AC, or RBR with any of its third party add-ons, though I can say that Sébastien Loeb Rally Evo is no less a sim than vanilla RBR, at least in terms of physics (damage is very forgiving by comparison). @Scaff seems to regard SLRE and DR about equally, and he knows what he's talking about.
For @notanexpert, SLRE is worth a look in addition to DR; on the most recent page of its main thread there are some impressions and tips about its force feedback.
For @notanexpert, SLRE is worth a look in addition to DR; on the most recent page of its main thread there are some impressions and tips about its force feedback.
Scaff
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I would give the edge in terms of physics to SLRE, particularly for how it responds under braking (DR is a bit too forgiving in that regard). The one non-physics area that is important to a sim that SLRE also bests DR on is the stages, which are closer to the real thing in terms of both width and overall accuracy. Finland is a good example of this, with SLRE being both narrower and far more challenging in regard to the 'yumps'.
Not that I dislike DR, quite the opposite, and in terms of looks and performance of the game engine DR wins out (but the Pro Boost update has improved SLRE in terms of frame rate and overall performance), its also the better of the two in terms of tactile feedback (but that is a quite niche area).
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- skazz-race
- skazzracer
Since both DiRT Rally and SLRE are now old enough to be sold quite cheaply, the question shouldn't be which to buy... If you have any desire to enjoy rally driving in a reasonably realistic way, just get them both, since they both have plenty to offer.
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Since this weekend is Rally Sweden, there's another special event available - all twelve stages in Värmland with a 2010s car.
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I don't really think my real life experience can hugely trump anyone elses. I mean most of the cars in the sim I've never driven before so I don't really have a huge say. But P CARS lacks a lot in the physics department IMO. I think most of the reason is because they have to focus on console as well as PC. Majority of the people playing P Cars will be on a controller, or a low end wheel/pedal combo so they have to focus on making the game the best it can be for their average customer base. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that, but it does make it arcady.
- 4,332
Ah, that's interesting to know.
However, I am somewhat curious - does that make Forza's physics less or more arcadey?
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More. Forza and GT aren't really in the ballpark. I've not played a Forza since 4 but that one was definitely very arcady. GT6 is arcady as well. They're meant for mass audiences. The goal of the game is different.
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- alexschmidt1995
I've always wondered, are these games "close enough" that if I jumped into a real version of one of these cars that I would recognize it and not kill myself trying to go a bit fast? Kind of a "I'm going to assume I can" until I'm proven wrong haha
LeGeNd-1
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People are going to laugh at me because I don't have the credentials of Kamuifanboy, but calling GT or FM arcadey is oversimplifying things by a huge margin. I'm a firm believer that games can be divided into "arcade", "simcade" and "sim", but within each division there are lots of subdivisions. It's a continuous spectrum, not a discrete classification.
If you imagine a "reality" rating from 0-100%, with 0 being least realistic (let's say WipeOut), and 100 being most real (aka real life), then you would encounter games along the line probably like this: WipeOut > Mario Kart > Ridge Racer > NFS > GRID (the 50% mark simcade divider in my opinion) > GT/FM > PCARS > AC/rF2/iRacing > F1 simulators with motion rig > real life.
So while it maybe true that GT/FM are more "arcadey" than PCARS/AC, they are not arcade games by any means. Just slightly less hardcore sims.
If you imagine a "reality" rating from 0-100%, with 0 being least realistic (let's say WipeOut), and 100 being most real (aka real life), then you would encounter games along the line probably like this: WipeOut > Mario Kart > Ridge Racer > NFS > GRID (the 50% mark simcade divider in my opinion) > GT/FM > PCARS > AC/rF2/iRacing > F1 simulators with motion rig > real life.
So while it maybe true that GT/FM are more "arcadey" than PCARS/AC, they are not arcade games by any means. Just slightly less hardcore sims.
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It always amuses me when people criticise games for being too arcadey, especially the Dirt series or anything else in the rally subgenre - because if you put those people in a real rally car, they would be the first (not to mention the loudest) to complain that it doesn't feel realistic enough and/or that it's too difficult.
