Driving Experience or skidmarks?

  • Thread starter Thread starter FlareKR
  • 114 comments
  • 9,454 views

Choose

  • I want the experience

    Votes: 106 37.9%

  • Skid-marks!

    Votes: 11 3.9%

  • Umm...why not both?

    Votes: 163 58.2%
  • Total voters
    280
Its 2009 is it not possible to have physics and skidmarks or do we have to wait another generation.
 
Ridiculous. The choices in this poll and the whole thread itself. Let's start another nonsensical one while we're at it, shall we?
Should PD sacrifice the fine tuning of the car's mechanical systems for the fancy-schmancy-accurate-high-quality-engine-sounds?
I guess you know my position.
DOH!
Move on please, there's nothing to see here. Thank you.
 
Only on GTP can a bunch of nerds have a daily intellectual bitch fight over ****ing skidmarks. Honestly people, get a life. I came to GTP to read actual discussion about the game, no pointless and random threads whining about god knows what that has no value unless you count wastefully taking up internet storage good.
 
i wonder why pd with all of its money couldnt figure out a way to get skidmarks into gt5 :p.
 
R1600Turbo
I'm surprised and disappointed by the voting results.

I'm sorry, but I would take the driving experience over skid marks any day of the week.
Click to expand...

Me too. I discussed this with Strittan once. I seriously can't give a 🤬 about skidmarks, I'm racing in cockpit view, trying to be precise, careful, fast, not to crash, I'm not looking at the road to say "Look at that black line of rubber the guy in front of me just left!". If they're in, well it'd be cool, but I don't want them to sacrifice other things like Graphics/Physics/Sound/Release date for something as petty as skidmarks (Especially the frist three since skidmarks take memory space). And if they aren't in I wouldn't even notice until I see someone whinning on this forums.
 
Skid marks are part of the driving experience, so not having them detracts from the experience. Gt games have always felt incomplete because of little things like this. I don't understand how people wanted damage so much, but think skidmarks are irrelevent.
 
I was going to post this in the other skid mark thread before I noticed it was locked.

(in reply to the skidmarks being part of the road texture in the TT demo)
I'm pretty sure they're not part of the road texture, the memory usage for the number of textures needed for that at the res of the track would be huge

It looks to me like the skidmarks are low res maps with some AA and applied with filtering (sometimes regular but smoothed out jaggies are visible) and maybe applied to temporary road textures created as they're required so the skidmarks don't need to be applied with the track texture in realtime.

[total speculation]
If that's the case then it would be pretty easy to modify the skidmark maps to add skidmarks dynamically and it'd be possible to have a build up of rubber on the racing line which could be taken into account by the physics so it wouldn't just be cosmetic.

Also, it wouldn't be out of the question to save the skidmark maps to the HDD and if you race a lot on a track the rubber and marks build up or the longer you've not raced on a track the cleaner it could get.
[/speculation]
Click to expand...
 
In answer to some of your replies which dismiss skid marks as an important part in the overall realism of a simulator (which happens to brand itself as "the real driving simulator"), gentlemen, here's what I think are probably the most important reasons why this feature SHOULD be there.

On any real racing circuit with cars driving at the limit, skid marks add up and form the racing groove. The racing groove, althogh already pretextured to some extent in all of the GT games, I think is a much more realistic indicator of the ideal line than a dotted coloured (red/blue) virtual line on the track that some of you and PD may deem more important, for obvious reasons nonetheless. Furthermore, in real life, skid marks can considerably aid any driver interested in improving his or her lap times by noticing their braking points, and gradually build on or correct the turn in and turn exit lines on the previous lap. World's best drivers, irrespective of the motorsport discipline they drove in, were invariably artists at time gaining during a turn, second to driving in a straight line.

That's why I think skid marks are an essential part of any driving simulator. And as a sidenote, Grand Prix Legends, a title which many sim enthusiasts consider to be the best PC driving simulator of all time, launched in 1998, does an excellent job at depicting skid marks. So do all the Papyrus and ISI later created simulators. On much lesser hardware than a PS3.
 
Considering the realism of the graphics, watching those replays of drift action with no rubber getting put down does cheapen the visuals and make it less real. Clearly he has a problem with it somewhere. If it was 'easy' then KY would have done it a long time ago, just to shut us up.

KY did say "Exceed all expectations" if I remember correctly. With all these delays the more I expect him to deliver.

my 2 cents
 
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If lessor quality games can have dynamic skid marks, there is no excuse for PD to not have them in GT5. On top of that, Kaz obviously knows they should be there, otherwise, there would not be static skid marks entering and exiting turns! Kaz needs to get over himself concerning this.
 
Things like functioning lights and skid marks on the track are so remedial that they should be included without any second thought. OK, it takes effort to make the skid marks look authentic, and their persistence would need some thought, but not having them at all is unforgivable. It doesn't matter how unimportant they are to the actual gameplay. If you want to get pedantic about it, none of the trackside scenery is needed for the actual gameplay either, but I'm sure there would be a lot of upset people if it were left out.
 
That is exactly the problem, most other games have skidmarks and everyone expects GT5 to be better than other racing games. I wouldn't say they are crucial when racing but they definitely add to the realism of replays. Imagine being on the starting grid with a big 600hp car and smoking the tyres and seeing long black marks off your grid space that stay there on the track during your whole race, it just makes the whole thing seem more real. But I guess if it was that easy then they would have been done by now.
 
This poll is silly really, there is going to be a driving experience anyway.Why would you choose to do away with that ?.Surely skid marks are part of driving aren't they ?.
 
My 1/50 of a dollar:
I don't mind if skidmarks aren't in. Yes, there's probably a lot of people who wanna do donuts, and that's fine, but what if the AI follows those skidmarks? Absolute lmfao moment. :lol:
 
Smoke&Slide
If tyre marks aren't in, it's not the end of the world.
Click to expand...
True, but then again, if the game never had damage, time of day, and varying weather, it wouldn't be the end of the world either. Where do you draw the line, because no element of this game is going to result in the end of the world? As I've said, it's such a remedial thing that not including them is ridiculous these days. For me it's got nothing to do with affecting gameplay - it's simply a visual element that adds to the realism, just like the trackside scenery.
 
I think this skidmark discussion is blown out of proportion, just like the reverse lights one. But surprisingly, the ones doing so are not those who want it in, but those who don't. The fact that this subject has been brought up again and again over years shows that there is a certain amount of interest in such things. I think there will be only very few people who would refuse to buy GT5 because skidmarks didn't make it. Yet, in a million-selling game that is supposed to be the pinnacle of driving simulations on consoles, asking the question must be valid without being told off.

I personally wonder why skidmarks and reverse lights are not in the game, along with a proper implementation of a reverse gear. I can not imagine that noone in the PD staff has ever brought this up, and if anyone has, how it can just be brushed off as being "unimportant". I mean yes, it is unimportant in the grand scheme of things, but then, GT is and has always been about the details. They hone every small piece to perfection, yet, they refuse to program skidmarks and reverse lights. And I can only assume that they refuse, because technically, this is not really a challenge.

I do understand that the repeated discussion of these things gets heated quite quickly. But if everyone just approaches with an open mind, refrains from throwing around insults or brushing off things as "totally irrelevant", there will be no fuss to get worked up about in the first place.
 
the Interceptor
along with a proper implementation of a reverse gear.
Click to expand...

I imagine they chose to do this on purpose to avoid people selecting reverse by accident when they flick down the gears.
After all, you shouldn't need to use reverse at all, so when you do I hardly think its a big issue that you have to press a different button for it.
A simple design choice that I don't think needs to be changed.
 
Ardius
I imagine they chose to do this on purpose to avoid people selecting reverse by accident when they flick down the gears.
After all, you shouldn't need to use reverse at all, so when you do I hardly think its a big issue that you have to press a different button for it.
A simple design choice that I don't think needs to be changed.
Click to expand...

I'd never really thought much about it but it is annoying when it happens, I only recently got myself a wheel and have been finding barirers that I never knew existed when driving with a pad and to get back on the track I find myself having to reverse away from barriers while turning quite a lot and it can be a bit fiddly trying to press a button on the wheel to reverse while turning.
 
Why not have both?? Real Driving Simulator.... then the Skid Marks should be simulated too. If everyone wants there to be Damage in GT5 and Wheather changes with rain and all that then it makes sense to put Skid marks in the game. Whats the point of making something that simulates A Real Driving Experience with all extra's if a few things are going to be left out. It's all about being the best Driving/Race Simulator isn't it?? Well then I think it should be in there.

Just Change your shorts if you hit the wall at 300km.....:eek:
 
I can't understand why skidmarks would ever be picked over the driving experience, It doesn't make sense to me as I'm sure we would all rather play GT than Burnout.

I can however understand picking both but then doesn't that defeat the point of the poll?
 
TrievelA7X
Do you know how much memory it would take to keep skid marks?
I can imagine 24 hrs of Le Sarthe trying to recall skid marks from the past 20 hours coming up on every turn...

You can't be suggesting they only last a few seconds, God know the rambling that would take place about that.
Click to expand...

They said GT5 uses 80% of PS3 power. Yo still have a 20% for skidmarks. Enough?
I think skidmarks should be in. Of course, I can live without them, but I don't think it's a useless thing: When you are behind a car it can be an indicative that the driver in front of you is near losing control, then you can atack...
And is a nice visual indicative for tune your car when you see your own replay: You can see exactly when you're losing grip...
 
I wonder how many real life drivers use other peoples or even their own, skid marks to judge braking distance.

I must say, in all the books on the subject I have ever read, in all the interviews I have ever watched or read about the subject of racing, not once have I ever heard of a professional driver using a skidmark as a marker for judging where one should apply the brakes.

And anyway, when you apply the brakes going into the corner and your wheels lock and maybe produce a skidmark, how the hell is this going to help you decide where to brake on the next lap? I mean, did your brakes lock up half way into the braking zone? or right at the start? And what if the guy behind you left a skidmark in a completely different place.

I can just see it now, two skidmarks, oh no ! which one should I choose as my braking marker? OH NO ! too late ! Crash !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Skid marks my arse.
 

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