Gran Turismo 7 Physics

[PirovacBoy]

I don’t understand then mine’s stock as well, tested on SSRX in the tunnel (no wind). I tried with both TC0 and TC1 and fastest I got was 3.8

TC1 is useless in this high HP/Torque Car.
I used TC 3 and ASM activated on Monza.
Worst result was a 3.2sec 0-100 😉
As far as I know the F8 has a Launch Control in real life which we obviously don’t have in GT7 but nevertheless my results pretty much match its Real World stats…give TC3 a try and trust me you’ll see that I’m 100% right 😁

 

[Boxster]

It seems that tire physics have changed with update 1.36.
IMs now last noticeably longer on a dry track (2 full laps on Le Mans 30 minute race).
Also, it seems TC is slightly stronger than earlier, I can now use TC2 where I used TC3 earlier. This may be related to changed tire physics.

 

[MonoTonouS]

Just for context, I've been playing GT since 1998 when the first game came out. I only played AC since 2016. I would be the first person to congratulate PD when they get physics/FFB right. But right now, it's still far off AC/ACC, and even vintage sims like LFS (and RBR if you count rallying). Even rFactor with RealFeel FFB still feels better to drive than GT, and that base game came out in 2004.

Everything you said feels backward to me. Current GT physics has too much understeer compared to AC. I can drive a car with the throttle in AC (old cars on bias ply tyres especially). I just drove the 250 GTO in GT yesterday and there's no feeling of tyre squidge, the suspension feels tied down, no body roll, 4 wheel drifting feels very unnatural. You lose the back end coming off the brakes (which IRL would transfer more weight to the rear and reduce oversteer). It's backwards and unnatural. Drive the same car in AC and everything just flows as it should.

Drifting in GT also feels unnatural. It's hard to drift anything other than CH tyres. AC meanwhile is basically a drifting game if you look at online lobbies.

I have like 2600 cars in AC atm. Yes there are loads of crappy built mods, but the real good ones and the base Kunos cars are way beyond anything in GT in terms of feel. I mean if you look at the Bugatti Chiron in GT7, it has front downforce only and zero rear downforce. This is a car that's supposed to be ultra stable at high speeds and the high speed balance is opposite what it should be. They can't even get something like that right and you want me to believe PD makes good physics/FFB?

I'm playing AC on a laptop from 2014 with Logitech G25 just so you know. I spent more money on my PS4 Pro, TV, T-GT, GT7 25th Edition and PS+ subscription. So no, if I'm elitist I would be defending GT instead. And I would never call GT arcade or simcade. It's a sim, but one with flaws (whether intentional or non intentional, is up for debate) because it's aimed at mass market.

Ironically, AC is like the second most popular car game on Steam after Forza Horizon 5, despite being an "elitist hardcore sim". Why? Because the driving physics and FFB is second to none. It's got decent graphics, and you can virtually drive anything anywhere. This is what GT could've been if PD didn't get sidetracked with WipeOut VGTs and music rally.

https://steamdb.info/app/1551360/charts/

https://steamdb.info/app/244210/charts/

If I really hated Gran Turismo, I wouldn't have grinded 1 billion credits and raced in almost every FIA season since 2019. I love the quirky cars, presentation, graphics, menu music, creativity of the community with photomode/liver editor. I love the convenience of online racing and accessible physics while still maintaining some semblance of realism. But if I want to know what a car really feels like to drive, I boot up AC. I never done a single career mode or online race in AC. It's basically my test drive sandbox game. They both occupy different niches for my needs. But in terms of physics/FFB, GT is not as good as AC. At least not yet. Nothing to do with elitism, just saying it like it is. There are people in the forum who race extensively IRL and have engineering degrees who will tell you the same.

I'm not trying to convert you into an AC fan either, just sharing my POV and clearing up things for others reading this thread.

Now I go back to lurking until the next physics update in 6 months

Second most popular , but it doesn't even have half the player base , at its peak it had 17k .. Forza horizon 5 has 25k people playing RIGHT NOW. AT its peak it was wayyy more than whatever AC is. GT7 probably sells more copies a day than AC has people playing.

 

[P-Courty]

It seems that tire physics have changed with update 1.36.
IMs now last noticeably longer on a dry track (2 full laps on Le Mans 30 minute race).
Also, it seems TC is slightly stronger than earlier, I can now use TC2 where I used TC3 earlier. This may be related to changed tire physics.

I've noticed TC seems to have got stronger.

In the Nissan / Red Bull time trial I had TC1 but found it cutting my pace on turn one and especially the hairpin.

Instead, I did something I never do (as it used to be restrictive and cut my pace) and tried ASM on, and it felt much better, which showed on my first attempt as I was 1.2sec faster so was definitely a noticeable difference.

The last time I used ASM was near the start of GT7 when rwd cars had physics like they were driving on ice at every corner.

 

[GNR1987]

Slip angle window feels too narrow.

 

[LeGeNd-1]

Second most popular , but it doesn't even have half the player base , at its peak it had 17k .. Forza horizon 5 has 25k people playing RIGHT NOW. AT its peak it was wayyy more than whatever AC is. GT7 probably sells more copies a day than AC has people playing.

Considering FH5 is an arcade racer with a wider mass market appeal, half the player base for a hardcore sim with barebones single player is pretty good. Just look at how many people play all the other sims like rFactor 2/AMS/Raceroom/PCARS. FH5 is also a newer game, and still has a growing fanbase, and recent discounts brings more player to the game. If you look at the stats a from a few months ago (when my post was written) the numbers were closer. Also despite being 7 years old, if you look at the lifetime player graph AC is actually GAINING players instead of losing or staying stable like most other games. Let's compare FH5 in 7 years time if you want a like for like comparison.

https://steamdb.info/app/244210/charts/

https://steamdb.info/app/1551360/charts/

GT is also a console racer with a wider appeal, and it has 25 years of brand recognition. Don't know about daily sales, but looking at Kudosprime stats for GT Sport it had around 100k weekly active players in Sport mode (during its stable phase around covid era), so roughly 15k a day. Let's say GT7 is double that so 30k a day (newer game plus better offline component, but less good Sport mode and non covid times, so there and thereabouts unless we get official data from PD). AC being 1/3 that despite being a much older game, more hardcore and on PC is pretty good IMO. If we have moddable AC on consoles I can bet you it would be even closer.

Stats | Gran Turismo Sport | kudosprime.com

<anything below this line is just general comment and not replying to you specifically>

Anyway, my view on the latest physics have softened somewhat as I get used to it. The less crazy weight transfer is definitely better, but still a bit exaggerated on MR cars (and even 4WD like the latest GR Corolla). I got used to the weird understeer on braking too and actually it suits my driving style better now. Downforce and dirty air is definitely less dominant which is good. It's definitely the best it has been since release, but still like 5% off AC (which in turn is around 5% off reality). The latest MC20 at Bathurst TT really highlights a lot of the physics deficiencies (and PD needs to do something against the downshift abuse to slow down the car).

My main issue now is the throttle not being linear, but this is a problem with many other sims, even AC. I just never noticed it till now because most sims do the same (wrong) thing. You can see most top drivers jump to 90% throttle immediately on corner exits in GT. There is no power in the first 90% travel and you only have the last 10% of travel for modulation. In real life, it's always more progressive. 25% throttle IRL is equivalent to 90% throttle in GT and it makes for some really bad habits if you drive powerful RWD cars IRL.



It really sounds like I'm just nitpicking GT but let me just remind everyone again that my GT playtime is like 5x higher than AC. So definitely not biased

 

[sonnyboychris]

It seems that tire physics have changed with update 1.36.
IMs now last noticeably longer on a dry track (2 full laps on Le Mans 30 minute race).
Also, it seems TC is slightly stronger than earlier, I can now use TC2 where I used TC3 earlier. This may be related to changed tire physics.

Yeah... I've been wondering if something changed as well. I feel like my wheel (DD-Pro) is bit more communicative. Specifically, I'm sensing that I can feel tired adhesion better (similar to what I feel in ACC).

I played Sport and GT7 (up until recently) with zero assists. Recently I turned on ASM and found myself enjoying the game more because it allowed enough reaction time for me to "catch" the car.

 

[MonoTonouS]

Considering FH5 is an arcade racer with a wider mass market appeal, half the player base for a hardcore sim with barebones single player is pretty good. Just look at how many people play all the other sims like rFactor 2/AMS/Raceroom/PCARS. FH5 is also a newer game, and still has a growing fanbase, and recent discounts brings more player to the game. If you look at the stats a from a few months ago (when my post was written) the numbers were closer. Also despite being 7 years old, if you look at the lifetime player graph AC is actually GAINING players instead of losing or staying stable like most other games. Let's compare FH5 in 7 years time if you want a like for like comparison.

https://steamdb.info/app/244210/charts/

https://steamdb.info/app/1551360/charts/

GT is also a console racer with a wider appeal, and it has 25 years of brand recognition. Don't know about daily sales, but looking at Kudosprime stats for GT Sport it had around 100k weekly active players in Sport mode (during its stable phase around covid era), so roughly 15k a day. Let's say GT7 is double that so 30k a day (newer game plus better offline component, but less good Sport mode and non covid times, so there and thereabouts unless we get official data from PD). AC being 1/3 that despite being a much older game, more hardcore and on PC is pretty good IMO. If we have moddable AC on consoles I can bet you it would be even closer.

Stats | Gran Turismo Sport | kudosprime.com

<anything below this line is just general comment and not replying to you specifically>

Anyway, my view on the latest physics have softened somewhat as I get used to it. The less crazy weight transfer is definitely better, but still a bit exaggerated on MR cars (and even 4WD like the latest GR Corolla). I got used to the weird understeer on braking too and actually it suits my driving style better now. Downforce and dirty air is definitely less dominant which is good. It's definitely the best it has been since release, but still like 5% off AC (which in turn is around 5% off reality). The latest MC20 at Bathurst TT really highlights a lot of the physics deficiencies (and PD needs to do something against the downshift abuse to slow down the car).

My main issue now is the throttle not being linear, but this is a problem with many other sims, even AC. I just never noticed it till now because most sims do the same (wrong) thing. You can see most top drivers jump to 90% throttle immediately on corner exits in GT. There is no power in the first 90% travel and you only have the last 10% of travel for modulation. In real life, it's always more progressive. 25% throttle IRL is equivalent to 90% throttle in GT and it makes for some really bad habits if you drive powerful RWD cars IRL.



It really sounds like I'm just nitpicking GT but let me just remind everyone again that my GT playtime is like 5x higher than AC. So definitely not biased

I agree but sport mode numbers are not the same as current players playing . I stopped playing sport mode after 3 months . Most of the hours I Played were single player

 

[TheGTGuy]

Hi guys, I have a question, recently I purchased the Maserati A6GCS Spyder from Legendary dealership, I’ve fully tuned the car but any time the tale steps out I can’t correct it and the car ends up spinning, it’s as if there’s some sort of auto correction going on, the wheels simply don’t turn fully even when I’ve pushed the analog stick fully in the opposite direction to catch the slide. Is this a physics problem or is there a setting in the menu. I use the Duelsense and I have it set to max sensitivity.

 

[Meythia]

Hi guys, I have a question, recently I purchased the Maserati A6GCS Spyder from Legendary dealership, I’ve fully tuned the car but any time the tale steps out I can’t correct it and the car ends up spinning, it’s as if there’s some sort of auto correction going on, the wheels simply don’t turn fully even when I’ve pushed the analog stick fully in the opposite direction to catch the slide. Is this a physics problem or is there a setting in the menu. I use the Duelsense and I have it set to max sensitivity.

This may be the occasional "ride height ist set too low" issue, that some cars can produce easily.

 

[bigmull]

Hi guys, I have a question, recently I purchased the Maserati A6GCS Spyder from Legendary dealership, I’ve fully tuned the car but any time the tale steps out I can’t correct it and the car ends up spinning, it’s as if there’s some sort of auto correction going on, the wheels simply don’t turn fully even when I’ve pushed the analog stick fully in the opposite direction to catch the slide. Is this a physics problem or is there a setting in the menu. I use the Duelsense and I have it set to max sensitivity.

I have done a tune for this car,check it out.All my tunes are done on a gamepad.

 

[Bendough]

It seems that tire physics have changed with update 1.36.
IMs now last noticeably longer on a dry track (2 full laps on Le Mans 30 minute race).
Also, it seems TC is slightly stronger than earlier, I can now use TC2 where I used TC3 earlier. This may be related to changed tire physics.

I confirm that IMs last longer. Did you have a sensation that your speed was faster than before? Like your surroundings moved faster in the straight starting at around 270 km/h

 

[LSFDRX]

Slip angle window feels too narrow.

Absolutely. This is one of the core things about the game that I dislike. There should be a much wider area at/just beyond the limit where you can make adjustments to throttle and steering to modulate under/oversteer, and oversteer should be much easier to stay in, lock, and manage.

The new TT with the DB5 at Goodwood is a perfect example of why this is such a nuisance. If you ever watch classic racing at Goodwood you can see that the primary driving style for many of these older cars is feint drifting. They pitch these things into low angle, measured oversteer and ride it out with minimal steering inputs and usually a bunch of throttle. This is a very common way to drive an older racing car on tall, skinny, hard tires, and part of the reason these drivers are seen as so ballsy or heroic because the vehicles are constantly over the limits of traction, yet still well within the bounds of control for many.

In GT7, this just doesn't work. It's goes like this:

1. push into oversteer
2. correct "too much" (almost impossible to rest in opposite lock zone) trying to maintain/reduce oversteer
3. snap back
4. steer back towards grip to prevent loss of control
5. repeat.
6. continue wiggling back and forth for eternity

I can drift fairly well in real life, yet have put a LOT of practice into doing the same in GT7 and have never found a place to be comfortable with it with any car or setup. As has been mentioned in another post, CH tires help, but IRL me and others around me are often drifting on R compound NT01s, 615Ks, and many other high performance street tires with no issues.

This all just doesn't make sense, isn't realistic, and it would be awesome if this is ever corrected for. I am not hopeful that it will be, and try my best to work with what we've got as I still love the game.

 

[Bimmy540]

Yeah... I've been wondering if something changed as well. I feel like my wheel (DD-Pro) is bit more communicative. Specifically, I'm sensing that I can feel tired adhesion better (similar to what I feel in ACC).

I played Sport and GT7 (up until recently) with zero assists. Recently I turned on ASM and found myself enjoying the game more because it allowed enough reaction time for me to "catch" the car.

I'm finding it easier and easier with each physics update to quickly correct my car from oversteer. It's hard to explain, but the quick motions I do with the wheel to straighten out again feel more like in a real car now where you can tell it's about to happen. Before I might be able to correct it like 2 out of 5 times maybe if I was lucky. Now I feel in control of those situations. I find you can fight more in corners with this without fear of totally losing it or ruining someone else's race online. I find a lot of whats difficult about GT7 is not being confident in the consistency of the controls.

What I find weird sometimes is when you get off kilter and your car wobbles and you fix the wobble. Except the car seems to still have some stored energy in the springs, somehow.... even after a straight away.... and when you turn the car said stored energy presents itself and your car then decides to skid or do something stupid. That makes absolutely zero sense physically. It's like a ball of springs sometimes or feels like maybe you have Inspector Gadgets car and the wheels are fully extended. 🤔

 

[Wannablackbee]

Since 1.38, depending on which car / track / tires combo I use, I feel more information coming from road surface to my t300. I also feel the curbs more. It gets me more confident in the car with the vibrations coming mostly from understeer or overdriving it. I feel the differences in the stiffness of the wheel depending on the car so it is easier to compare how one car behaves to another which is the core fun of the game for me.

I found the curbs seem to unsettle the car more than previously and that landing from hitting the sausage curbs feels better even though it was updated for the best in a previous version.

There is now lift off understeer you get from all the cars but I can feel it more from FF cars. It seems that you can get better traction while cornering with foot on accelerator halfway. During a curve, I clearly get understeer from off throttle or full throttle. It is like the differential is only working on acceleration and not on deceleration. Nothing you cannot fix with a momentary downshift to rotate the car before quickly upshifting again exiting corner. I base my opinion mostly on the civic type r Nurburgring time trial and the Mazda 3 gr4 daily at Laguna Seca which both felt really great to drive.

From my point of view, it is not perfect but the game gets better every update. The more I drive it, the more I sense details in the physics. There is more than meets the eye. I say the game simulates half the driving and your brain does the rest of the simulation. I love driving.

 

[Sir Crashalot]

Since 1.38, depending on which car / track / tires combo I use, I feel more information coming from road surface to my t300. I also feel the curbs more. It gets me more confident in the car with the vibrations coming mostly from understeer or overdriving it. I feel the differences in the stiffness of the wheel depending on the car so it is easier to compare how one car behaves to another which is the core fun of the game for me.

I found the curbs seem to unsettle the car more than previously and that landing from hitting the sausage curbs feels better even though it was updated for the best in a previous version.

There is now lift off understeer you get from all the cars but I can feel it more from FF cars. It seems that you can get better traction while cornering with foot on accelerator halfway. During a curve, I clearly get understeer from off throttle or full throttle. It is like the differential is only working on acceleration and not on deceleration. Nothing you cannot fix with a momentary downshift to rotate the car before quickly upshifting again exiting corner. I base my opinion mostly on the civic type r Nurburgring time trial and the Mazda 3 gr4 daily at Laguna Seca which both felt really great to drive.

From my point of view, it is not perfect but the game gets better every update. The more I drive it, the more I sense details in the physics. There is more than meets the eye. I say the game simulates half the driving and your brain does the rest of the simulation. I love driving.

Do you also play AC? If so, how would you say it compares on a wheel? There's no comparison on controller, AC is so much harder to drive. But that may be because GT is much better optimized for controller.

 

[Wannablackbee]

Do you also play AC? If so, how would you say it compares on a wheel? There's no comparison on controller, AC is so much harder to drive. But that may be because GT is much better optimized for controller.

I tried a little bit of ps5 version of ACC so I can't say much about that game. I also have never tried AC. I never use a controller when I play racing games. I only use a wheel.

I do not compare ACC to GT7 because GT7 has a lot more car categories to offer other than gt3, which I think makes physics more complicated for GT7 and makes it harder to develop as a game. That is why I do not put them on the same level.

Honestly, ACC on a ps5 with a wheel without fiddling any setups menus was not harder to drive than the Gr3 in GT7. All I remember is that ACC was boring to drive and I did not get the same level of thrill and satisfaction as lets say driving the GT7 Nurburgring circuit experience at the limit with the bmw gr3 car. So I quickly came back to GT7.

 

[Sir Crashalot]

I tried a little bit of ps5 version of ACC so I can't say much about that game. I also have never tried AC. I never use a controller when I play racing games. I only use a wheel.

I do not compare ACC to GT7 because GT7 has a lot more car categories to offer other than gt3, which I think makes physics more complicated for GT7 and makes it harder to develop as a game. That is why I do not put them on the same level.

Honestly, ACC on a ps5 with a wheel without fiddling any setups menus was not harder to drive than the Gr3 in GT7. All I remember is that ACC was boring to drive and I did not get the same level of thrill and satisfaction as lets say driving the GT7 Nurburgring circuit experience at the limit with the bmw gr3 car. So I quickly came back to GT7.

Thx! I guess it's indeed the bad optimization for controller then on AC. When I got the game the first thing I tried was driving the 312t on Nordschleife and it was....quite an interesting experience😁

 

[KaYibE]

Absolutely. This is one of the core things about the game that I dislike. There should be a much wider area at/just beyond the limit where you can make adjustments to throttle and steering to modulate under/oversteer, and oversteer should be much easier to stay in, lock, and manage.

The new TT with the DB5 at Goodwood is a perfect example of why this is such a nuisance. If you ever watch classic racing at Goodwood you can see that the primary driving style for many of these older cars is feint drifting. They pitch these things into low angle, measured oversteer and ride it out with minimal steering inputs and usually a bunch of throttle. This is a very common way to drive an older racing car on tall, skinny, hard tires, and part of the reason these drivers are seen as so ballsy or heroic because the vehicles are constantly over the limits of traction, yet still well within the bounds of control for many.

In GT7, this just doesn't work. It's goes like this:

1. push into oversteer
2. correct "too much" (almost impossible to rest in opposite lock zone) trying to maintain/reduce oversteer
3. snap back
4. steer back towards grip to prevent loss of control
5. repeat.
6. continue wiggling back and forth for eternity

I can drift fairly well in real life, yet have put a LOT of practice into doing the same in GT7 and have never found a place to be comfortable with it with any car or setup. As has been mentioned in another post, CH tires help, but IRL me and others around me are often drifting on R compound NT01s, 615Ks, and many other high performance street tires with no issues.

This all just doesn't make sense, isn't realistic, and it would be awesome if this is ever corrected for. I am not hopeful that it will be, and try my best to work with what we've got as I still love the game.

I dont agree at all, in race cars that window its pretty short when you get a strong snap, they way to catch them its to turn the oposite direction and than turn in the same direction the car have de front pointed, you have to do that 2 corrections below half a second or less other wise the forces will make you lose control.

Its easier to catch them in VR cause the cockpit moves in every little bump and over/understeer moments.., every little movement that the cars do you see it, in 2D you only see the road moving you dont the see what the entyre body of the car its doing...
Anyway if you play ACC or any other SIM you know when you get violent snaps you need to react in the moment and do what i mentioned above in a very narrow window...

 

[LSFDRX]

I dont agree at all, in race cars that window its pretty short when you get a strong snap, they way to catch them its to turn the oposite direction and than turn in the same direction the car have de front pointed, you have to do that 2 corrections below half a second or less other wise the forces will make you lose control.

Its easier to catch them in VR cause the cockpit moves in every little bump and over/understeer moments.., every little movement that the cars do you see it, in 2D you only see the road moving you dont the see what the entyre body of the car its doing...
Anyway if you play ACC or any other SIM you know when you get violent snaps you need to react in the moment and do what i mentioned above in a very narrow window...

I specifically mentioned a road car on road tires in my example for good reason.

Yes, in race cars on slicks oversteer is not something to comfortably deal with normally, but in most road cars it is, and that's where my issues lie. I want to be able to drift cars in game like I've (and pretty much anyone else who knows car control) done in real life, but this tire model does lend itself well to slick tire physics. That said, some GR3 cars can pretty comfortably slide and fall back into traction on throttle without issue.

I don't think anyone who knows even a little about cars is expecting to be able to drift a GR3 car on RH-RS tires. But road cars on CS-SS tires should be held in a drift easily, not snap about like crazy when they should be settling, and not "store energy" when coming back in line and all of the sudden spring into looseness again. These are unrealistic traits.

 

[MicVic10]

I specifically mentioned a road car on road tires in my example for good reason.

Yes, in race cars on slicks oversteer is not something to comfortably deal with normally, but in most road cars it is, and that's where my issues lie. I want to be able to drift cars in game like I've (and pretty much anyone else who knows car control) done in real life, but this tire model does lend itself well to slick tire physics. That said, some GR3 cars can pretty comfortably slide and fall back into traction on throttle without issue.

I don't think anyone who knows even a little about cars is expecting to be able to drift a GR3 car on RH-RS tires. But road cars on CS-SS tires should be held in a drift easily, not snap about like crazy when they should be settling, and not "store energy" when coming back in line and all of the sudden spring into looseness again. These are unrealistic traits.

I find CM tyres to be better at what you expect from road cars, but I agree that street legal tyres are "weird". CH on the other hand should not even exist, maybe to be used in 1950-1960 cars but other than than they're *****, way too understeery.

 

[Gregormeister]

I dont agree at all, in race cars that window its pretty short when you get a strong snap, they way to catch them its to turn the oposite direction and than turn in the same direction the car have de front pointed, you have to do that 2 corrections below half a second or less other wise the forces will make you lose control.

Its easier to catch them in VR cause the cockpit moves in every little bump and over/understeer moments.., every little movement that the cars do you see it, in 2D you only see the road moving you dont the see what the entyre body of the car its doing...
Anyway if you play ACC or any other SIM you know when you get violent snaps you need to react in the moment and do what i mentioned above in a very narrow window...

In terms of having more visual feedback on 3D (via PSVR2), you know that there's a second camera mode for the cockpit view? It makes the entire body much more vivid, but also is a bit too wild and wobbly for me. But I think it's the same amount of visual car moving as in VR mode.

You can enter those settings in the pause settings while being on track, sitting in any car. Give it a try! 😉

 

[KaYibE]

In terms of having more visual feedback on 3D (via PSVR2), you know that there's a second camera mode for the cockpit view? It makes the entire body much more vivid, but also is a bit too wild and wobbly for me. But I think it's the same amount of visual car moving as in VR mode.

You can enter those settings in the pause settings while being on track, sitting in any car. Give it a try! 😉

I play GT for over 20 years i know each camera available and also hate the fact that GT its very limited in that department, its time to add more options for 2D gameplay.

Its not he same, in VR your "inside" the car and you see things arround you moving, in 2D you see an image in front of you moving not the same...

@LSFDRX im not a drift guy, but i bet that in VR its easier to control/predict, when i did the challenges i hated to do the drift challenges, must give it a try in VR but i found road cars more intuitive to drive in VR.

 

[Meythia]

I do not compare ACC to GT7 because GT7 has a lot more car categories to offer other than gt3, which I think makes physics more complicated for GT7

Physics dont care which car you drive.
All the wind wands to know is how fast you go and how flat you are.
All the tarmac wants to know is how much rubber contact there is.
If the physics are done correctly, a car simply is putting in variables and they are on basis the same between a Dodge Tomahawk or a Mazda Demio.

 

[LSFDRX]

@LSFDRX im not a drift guy, but i bet that in VR its easier to control/predict, when i did the challenges i hated to do the drift challenges, must give it a try in VR but i found road cars more intuitive to drive in VR.

You know, it is a little better than 2D, especially in the way you can look to the sides while sideways and the way the car moves around you. You're somewhat a part of it even though there's almost no physical feel for it. The feedback from the wheel does move my rig around enough to provide good sensation, but it's nothing like having an actual car around you when it comes to predicting when certain cars are nearing their traction limits. Those drift missions were HARD, and I'm positive that I would have done much better in real life than I did in the game.

Still in GT it comes down to fine tuning the feel for tire grip and weight transfer, and that's more of a wheel thing than a view thing. For the time being, there just isn't a natural way to drift in the game for me. I can hold steep angle slides occasionally, but most times it's an ugly mess of over/under/over/under steer.

When it comes to staying within the bounds of grip, the game is still pretty amazing though. It's only when you're really trying to exploit cars like in the real world where it becomes a let down.

 

[LSFDRX]

Physics dont care which car you drive.
All the wind wands to know is how fast you go and how flat you are.
All the tarmac wants to know is how much rubber contact there is.
If the physics are done correctly, a car simply is putting in variables and they are on basis the same between a Dodge Tomahawk or a Mazda Demio.

That's a very simplified way to interpret it, and I do ultimately agree with your point, but translating that through people into 1s and 0s is where the magic is. And that's a hard thing to pin down.

 

[Wannablackbee]

You know, it is a little better than 2D, especially in the way you can look to the sides while sideways and the way the car moves around you. You're somewhat a part of it even though there's almost no physical feel for it. The feedback from the wheel does move my rig around enough to provide good sensation, but it's nothing like having an actual car around you when it comes to predicting when certain cars are nearing their traction limits. Those drift missions were HARD, and I'm positive that I would have done much better in real life than I did in the game.

Still in GT it comes down to fine tuning the feel for tire grip and weight transfer, and that's more of a wheel thing than a view thing. For the time being, there just isn't a natural way to drift in the game for me. I can hold steep angle slides occasionally, but most times it's an ugly mess of over/under/over/under steer.

When it comes to staying within the bounds of grip, the game is still pretty amazing though. It's only when you're really trying to exploit cars like in the real world where it becomes a let down.

I get what you mean. As much as I love GT7, I miss GT4 days especially for the drifting learning curve you could get from a stock s13 on confort soft to the D1 s15 or Nomukens' Blitz r34 at full blast on sport tires that had a lot of traction with very fast but controllable snap or switchback. I think the d1 spec cars came with sport soft in GT4. Correct me if I am wrong.

 

[Firestone]

I found the curbs seem to unsettle the car more than previously and that landing from hitting the sausage curbs feels better even though it was updated for the best in a previous version.

I noticed this also. Also, instability with the car is a bit harder to catch now, especially with going off on the grass and trying to recover. Before you can just power through it and be fine. Now you need to take real care of power application since trying to be 100% on throttle, the car will keep trying to vector one way or the other.

Also the feeling of the loss of df when trailing behind another car's slipstream is magnified. Steering weight unloads and the rack gets a bit more upset with bumps on the road surface. It's a lot more immersive. These changes make the racing a bit more intense.

 

[Wannablackbee]

I noticed this also. Also, instability with the car is a bit harder to catch now, especially with going off on the grass and trying to recover. Before you can just power through it and be fine. Now you need to take real care of power application since trying to be 100% on throttle, the car will keep trying to vector one way or the other.

Also the feeling of the loss of df when trailing behind another car's slipstream is magnified. Steering weight unloads and the rack gets a bit more upset with bumps on the road surface. It's a lot more immersive. These changes make the racing a bit more intense.

I think you are right. For an example, just take a look at the most recent SuperGT video posted on You tube this October 19th. He is coming back to gt7 after a while not playing it. Although he does not mention 1.38 September update, you can see at the beginning that he has to adjust his driving habits to stay on track. Sure you have to practice a bit when you do not drive GT7 for a while but seeing him struggle to relearn made me think there might be significant changes to the physics since update 1.38. Changes of the likes you just mentioned. Like harder to catch or have to be careful with power application. I can see that in his video, like he had to get used to it, used to something new.

 

[Meythia]

I think you are right. For an example, just take a look at the most recent SuperGT video posted on You tube this October 19th. He is coming back to gt7 after a while not playing it. Although he does not mention 1.38 September update, you can see at the beginning that he has to adjust his driving habits to stay on track. Sure you have to practice a bit when you do not drive GT7 for a while but seeing him struggle to relearn made me think there might be significant changes to the physics since update 1.38. Changes of the likes you just mentioned. Like harder to catch or have to be careful with power application. I can see that in his video, like he had to get used to it, used to something new.

Different cars have different habits when taking curbs or having situational weight transfers.
He didnt use the BMW Gr.3 too much before if I remember correct, so maybe this just adds to the problem.