Gran Turismo 7 Physics

[Greycap]

It’s pretty poor of PD’s own QC and house keeping if they don’t have a default config file they can just revert to for wheel traits and settings in cases like this. I’d have expected each car to have a set config per input device (dead zones and basic calibrations) they can go back to if some one put the wrong config in the gold version of the update.

Probably not a case of a bad config, that car has always been noticably subpar what comes to the FFB. It's just that the current physics amplify the issue even more.

On fanatec dd+ i dropped my nfr to zero snd found the wheel went lightish and the tire alignment was easier to feel. Did it on the Honda in the TT though.

That's very likely caused in part by the tyres used. Nobody else than me runs it on comforts but still, racing tyres are so wrong for it that I simply refuse to take that route.

The tyre selection may even be a big reason for the entire problem, it feels like the fronts don't generate enough lateral grip to give proper alignment forces but it's still wrong. Admittedly the front of the car is very light and the tyres have next to no grip, but then the steering should be without feel and extremely light instead of the weird "fine grain sand in all ball joints" feel it has now. Or has always had, more or less.

 

[venancio]

If anyone is having trouble or wonky FFB on the T598 after the 1.71 update try BLUE mode on the base.
After some testing and fiddling with settings turns out RED mode is no bueno, the wheel was very heavy and lazy regardless of how much torque I was using and it was not self centering like a car would do if you let go of the wheel during a turn.
Hope a fix will come soon either from PD or TM.

 

[BradleyLove]

Using a pad I’ve found some cars now feel horrific, some now feel great. One of my favourites, the F430 Scuderia feels wallowy, yet my 98 Civic now feels even better. It’s really hard to work out whether it’s physics at play, or changed stock set-ups.

 

[Iso Octane]

This may play a large part in our findings. On a wheel the self aligning torque is just about non-existant, it's not a common problem but this car suffers from it a lot. To the extent that it needs nearly as much force to countersteer than to actually steer, thus the mushy feeling in which it feels like you're just turning a shovel in a bucket full of loose mud without much if any actual feedback from the car. When the tail steps out the wheel doesn't go light or begin turning the other way like it should almost at all, making catching slides unpleasant guesswork as it doesn't communicate through the wheel when the tyres are tracking straight again.

But, I took it for a spin too. Otherwise a full stock car but the tyres and a livery, no doubt it could benefit from a few setup changes but this is how PD intended it to handle - with the exception of the tyres. I actually think comfort softs are still far too grippy considering what kind of plastic they used in the sixties, it's worth noting that it was common to do more than one race on one set.

Gave it a try. Just finished a few laps with the RA272 all stock except CS tires around Suzuka.

Firstly, what are you talking about?? I didn't sense anything dramatically strange with the car. I did notice that in heavy braking the resistance of the wheel lessons a little bit, but returns once easing off the brakes. I had no problem at all anticipating and catching oversteer and the counter steering felt totally natural. In fact this car responds so beautifully to trail braking, you can hold a nice long oversteer into turn 1, "backing it in" just like you see vintage race cars do around Goodwood IRL. It's actually fabulous.

Maybe because I'm using a G29, which is well known that it can never countersteer for you so I'm used to it. Is it an issue you're discovering with higher end wheels?

Secondly, this car is so much fun with these physics! See above about backing it into a corner.

 

[Haitauer]

Have these people ever driven a performance car on a track at high speed? Or is the only experience they have is behind a sim rig?

The physics are objectively light years better compared to what we had.

Most e-sports players prefere learnable high accuracy demands, that they can learn and master. Prefarrably things staying the way they have already mastered. Things changing from proactive to reactive is never their preference. So few grains of salt is always needed with their opinions.

That said - the fast seem to still be fast.. adapt and overcome.

 

[CinnamonOD]

I agree that something is very wrong with racing tires, the amount of grip they have and the steering angle I have to input to use it all just feels wrong.

 

[RS60NR]

Gave it a try. Just finished a few laps with the RA272 all stock except CS tires around Suzuka.

Firstly, what are you talking about?? I didn't sense anything dramatically strange with the car. I did notice that in heavy braking the resistance of the wheel lessons a little bit, but returns once easing off the brakes. I had no problem at all anticipating and catching oversteer and the counter steering felt totally natural. In fact this car responds so beautifully to trail braking, you can hold a nice long oversteer into turn 1, "backing it in" just like you see vintage race cars do around Goodwood IRL. It's actually fabulous.

Maybe because I'm using a G29, which is well known that it can never countersteer for you so I'm used to it. Is it an issue you're discovering with higher end wheels?

Secondly, this car is so much fun with these physics! See above about backing it into a corner.

Same here - I’ve been testing out various and saw the post so was curious. On CS tires I was having a lot of fun - it really felt like those were appropriate to the car and also very natural. The grip limit was easy to balance using the throttle

Tried the SH as well and they add additional grip but not overpowering and a bit less fun

DD+ running the auto setup at the moment

Really happy w this update, but the Race tires could be a bit narrower in the slip angle and a bit less grippy longitudely, but not by much - just some tweaks

 

[Bojador]

I haven't tested it extensively and I haven't been playing gt7 much. That said, in gr3 no TCS seems like tcs2 in the previous version, but in gr2 doesn't seem that different. Curbs unsettle the cars more than before and you can turn the wheel a lot more. That's what I was able to notice using my g29.

I still think the ffb in the g29 is not very good, the cars are still on rails and it lacks nuance. Not much different than before. Based on what people were saying I was expecting something like the jump with the 1.49 update before they reverted it.

I'm glad they keep iterating to try and make it better. And I hope they keep on doing it and do it with other aspects of the game (like bigger grids, more sophy, new UI, cof cof).

 

[Pie O My]

While the positives outweigh the negatives (although I'm biased towards road cars with non racing tyres) the ability to steer beyond the understeer limit is really immersion breaking.

 

[Ale350z]

So, has anyone experienced this with the new physics?

I was driving a stock FTO with a few power upgrades - no tuning. And, hitting the brakes not only lifted the rear, it almost got me airborne...

yes, the same here

 

[SD70Racing]

So far I'm finding that my brake pressure during trail braking has to be more intense. I used to apply 80% brake on corner entry and just gradually drag it down to 20-10% to the apex. Now I have to stab at 100% and hold around 30% brake pressure to finish corner rotation into the apex. Without this adjustment the cars are crazy understeery and won't rotate all the way into the apex. Every now and then I'll still under press the throttle on corner entry and then understeer off the track.

This is actually a really good example of why I started working on BrakeMaster. When the braking pattern changes from something like 80% → gradual release to 20–10%, to 100% → hold around 30% → release, your braking foot basically has to learn a new pattern. I built a browser-based tool where you can practice exactly this kind of pedal control separately – hitting a target pressure, holding it, releasing progressively and repeating the movement until it becomes more natural. I originally made it for my son who races karts, but I've been developing it for sim racing as well. If you want to play around with it, it's at https://brakemaster.live. I'd actually be curious whether practicing that 100% → 30% → release pattern separately makes adapting to the new GT7 physics any easier.

 

[BigSarj]

This guy uses charts to explain why the new physics are better.

 

[rheinaoi]

Does anyone have any trouble with their cars struggling/surging under throttle?

My 69 corvette is surges a lot in the higher rev ranges, rpm dropping and rising so strongly that the car is bucking. This is regardless of the flywheel or supercharger fitted. It didn't do this post 1.71.

Yes! I've been having this bucking problem for a week. It affected my Pontiac Trans Am, Toyota Alphard, Toyota Tundra, Alpine A110 '72, Toyota Hiace and a bunch of others. Basically all my aggressive time attack cars.

It feels to me like a soft rev limit going half way up the rev range. Setting the Top Speed Auto setting to 320 or higher (then adjusting the gears normally) fixed the problem on my end.

 

[PlanetJanet]

This wiggling re-centering problem that controller players have reported, does it affect all cars or just a handful? Is it affected by changing setups, driver aids, or steering sensitivity? Or is it the same regardless? Curious simply because I was too lazy to get the rig out yesterday so played a few races on controller and I didn't notice anything unusual, but I've seen the visual evidence!

 

[SoulSilvera]

This wiggling re-centering problem that controller players have reported, does it affect all cars or just a handful? Is it affected by changing setups, driver aids, or steering sensitivity? Or is it the same regardless? Curious simply because I was too lazy to get the rig out yesterday so played a few races on controller and I didn't notice anything unusual, but I've seen the visual evidence!

It probably affects most, but there are certain cars that are more affected by this "wiggling problem" than others, I would say.

For the past few days I've been testing most of GT7's classic cars (stock), and there are some that drive like a dream and don't have it (Shelby Daytona), while others do. The Ferrari 500 Mondial, which was already a terrible car before the update, has the most amount of wiggling out of the cars I tested.

However, I was able to fix the wiggling on the 500 Mondial by adjusting the diff and suspension, and now it's fine to drive. So I assume the wiggling on most cars can be somewhat "fixed" with setup changes.

 

[GBalao888]

So I had another go with the Ferrari 499P around the Nurburgring and managed to shave off around half a second off of my previous lap time. It might feel slower around the straights but with the new physics, I feel more confident around the corners at higher speeds, whereas compared to before, it was quite understeery and can have a bit of a sting to its tail if you overdo it.

1.70 physics - 5:44.083
New physics - 5:43.531

Controller, stock, no changes to tuning setup, and Racing: Soft tires.

After some getting used to, I can say that I'm liking the new physics so far.

 

[Kriptical]

This guy uses charts to explain why the new physics are better.

this was interesting. Really helped explain why things feel more natural now. Particularly with the grip, and slip, margins. Because i drive on country roads, much more often thsn highway etc.., i think i spend most of my time cornering on the ‘other,’ side of that grip arc which makes so much sense, and explains why i thought grip was artificially slippery, with too much hair trigger sliding, in the previous physics model.

Also very interesting, was that pd reached in and messed with so many tunes across the game. Thats got to be ruining so many people’s heads, who are still unaware that their tunes have been tweaked. I almost think that’s worth an article just to get everyone on the same page.

 

[Mumster]

this was interesting. Really helped explain why things feel more natural now. Particularly with the grip, and slip, margins. Because i drive on country roads, much more often thsn highway etc.., i think i spend most of my time cornering on the ‘other,’ side of that grip arc which makes so much sense, and explains why i thought grip was artificially slippery, with too much hair trigger sliding, in the previous physics model.

Also very interesting, was that pd reached in and messed with so many tunes across the game. Thats got to be ruining so many people’s heads, who are still unaware that their tunes have been tweaked. I almost think that’s worth an article just to get everyone on the same page.

Video basically proves weak ABS is better now and maybe with enough skill off is faster. I did 10 laps at at Catalunya GP no chicane in the WRX GR.3 and once I got used to it, it was fairly easy to not lock up. I would wager for an F1 driver it would be.

 

[Kriptical]

Video basically proves weak ABS is better now and maybe with enough skill off is faster. I did 10 laps at at Catalunya GP no chicane in the WRX GR.3 and once I got used to it, it was fairly easy to not lock up. I would wager for an F1 driver it would be.

Ooo. Before the update, it felt as if abs off provided better FFB, and an improved feeling of connection with the road. Haven’t tried it post update but will today. My default, for years, has been weak. I would say the current ‘weak,’ setting feels close enough to what i expect a normal car irl to perform like.

 

[Mumster]

Ooo. Before the update, it felt as if abs off provided better FFB, and an improved feeling of connection with the road. Haven’t tried it post update but will today. My default, for years, has been weak. I would say the current ‘weak,’ setting feels close enough to what i expect a normal car irl to perform like.

What it felt like, and I have not looked at my telemetry data I capture with a tool I made, was faster stopping in the not full hard braking zones and shorter distances when not locking up in the hard braking zones. Also the grip felt more predictable when grip loss and lockup were about to happen you get a low hz vibration on the wheel. I’m on the Logitech Pro. Grip on exit for some reason felt better, maybe the tires are warming more before exit maybe I was imagining it. I was using -1 BB.

 

[snc]

Video basically proves weak ABS is better now and maybe with enough skill off is faster.

Nope, here gtws driver, default and weak are close, off is slower.

 

[Mumster]

Nope, here gtws driver, default and weak are close, off is slower.

I’m sure that person is a good driver but I would wager they don’t have enough seat time with abs off to know. You need an F1 driver for a proper test lol 😂

 

[Voodoovaj]

Nope, here gtws driver, default and weak are close, off is slower.

I know it's been a debate for a long while, but weak seems WAY better now. Before, I was on default and didn't see any benefit to weak.

As for off, I find that in some cases, I can brake better, but there's so much inconsistency (granted, probably my fault) that it's super challenging to be as fast or faster.

 

[Kriptical]

I know it's been a debate for a long while, but weak seems WAY better now. Before, I was on default and didn't see any benefit to weak.

As for off, I find that in some cases, I can brake better, but there's so much inconsistency (granted, probably my fault) that it's super challenging to be as fast or faster.

Off can be challenging. But if you stick with it a few days there are some interesting ffb details which seemed to conveyed a bit clearer. At least with fanatec. It is one aspect of the game where i think it will be easier to suck less, when my pedals are better

 

[RCKakashi14]

I find braking without ABS much better than before, lock ups are not all too sudden. But if I am chasing times, Weak is my new preferred option, even for road cars.

And I also use a 3dRap Brake Pedal mod for my T598 pedals.

Oh, Gr.1 cars now have a massive boost in downforce adjustment, especially the VGTs.

The LM55 VGT (the base version; not the Gr.1) has gotten even more menacing.