Gran Turismo Sport: General Discussion

[Mike_grpA]

Settling into console sim-racer visual mediocrity purely to achieve parity in technical simulation terms with some distinctly average games wouldn't be refreshing, it would be a disaster, and I, for one, would certainly not rejoice.

So you consider Pcars and AC "distinctly average games", but GT games aren't? Having great graphics with bland, shallow gameplay and basic physics doesn't make for a great, standout game, it makes for a "distinctly average" game with pretty graphics. There are plenty of boring, shallow games with great graphics this gen, a good example would be The Order 1886. AC has depth because of it's physics, and Pcars has depth because of it's gameplay. Both of those games look good, they don't have terrible graphics.

Being beautiful is hardly a unique way of distinguishing a game. It's basically the lowest common denominator when a game can't distinguish itself in any other way.



How about if each generation was worth it for the expansion of gameplay that it allowed? More computing power allowing deformable/destructable objects and terrain, realistic weather and physics models, great AI, and all the other things that might make you feel like you were racing in a real, vibrant, evolving world.

That'd sure be interesting as opposed to a beautiful but shallow game where cars bounce off walls and each other without any serious interaction.



You make it sound like the choice is between being a mediocre simulation that looks pretty and an average simulation that doesn't.

What if someone made a good simulation that was FUN? Graphics be damned, just make it so enjoyable that the graphics don't actually matter. Revolutionary thought, I know.

Exactly this ^

My preference for GT is for visuals first. And I stick to the idea that it is a big part of the appeal of GT, broadly-speaking. I think I've spent an age in photomode, purely because it's so damn gorgeous.

There are other games for other things. That's OK, I think.

So you don't want GT to have a gameplay and simulation focus, because you don't want it to be like other racing sims on console, but you want it to focus on visuals first, so that you can spend ages taking photos of the cars, despite the fact that the PS4 already has a racing game with gorgeous visuals, a great car list, and a brilliant photomode, which is also PS4 exclusive? Yeah, that makes sense.

 

[SlimCharles]

Graphics is something you enjoy for the first week. After that, only gameplay matters. Maybe sometimes you deliberately focus on the graphics and enjoy them for a moment. But a game that looks pretty and has dull gameplay, is condemned to fail.

Assetto Corsa is far, very far from looking bad

Driveclub looks spectacular... but unrealistic.
GT (old build) looks very good too... but you know is a little too videogamish
PCars looks very pure but also there is some kind of filter thet make it less realistic.
Assetto corsa looks very natural, and the colors are the closest to the real picture. It has poor textures and 2d trees, but Assetto corsa graphics is the way to get the most realistic picture.

In my opinion.

 

[fortbo]

Graphics is something you enjoy for the first week. After that, only gameplay matters. Maybe sometimes you deliberately focus on the graphics and enjoy them for a moment. But a game that looks pretty and has dull gameplay, is condemned to fail.

Assetto Corsa is far, very far from looking bad

Driveclub looks spectacular... but unrealistic.
GT (old build) looks very good too... but you know is a little too videogamish
PCars looks very pure but also there is some kind of filter thet make it less realistic.
Assetto corsa looks very natural, and the colors are the closest to the real picture. It has poor textures and 2d trees, but Assetto corsa graphics is the way to get the most realistic picture.

In my opinion.

That's AC from a console??

 

[SlimCharles]

That's AC from a console??

The first picture, yes (PS4).

 

[TS050]

Am I the only one that thinks AC really doesn't compare to the other 3? I mean, it still looks good, but compared to the others?


...nah...

 

[SVX]

Am I the only one that thinks AC really doesn't compare to the other 3? I mean, it still looks good, but compared to the others?


...nah...

It looks natural. It's not looking to portray some ultra fantasy day where the sun is perfect and the conditions are of absolute optimal - it's trying to accurately simulate what you'd be most likely get if you went to the Nürburging on a good day, which really is what a simulator should be setting out to achieve.

 

[Ameer67]

It looks natural. It's not looking to portray some ultra fantasy day where the sun is perfect and the conditions are of absolute optimal - it's trying to accurately simulate what you'd be most likely get if you went to the Nürburging on a good day, which really is what a simulator should be setting out to achieve.

I disagree with this. I have AC on PC running at mostly high settings but I'm assuming the console version looks mostly similar. (Can't really expect the consoles to be above the PC version in terms of graphics anyways.) Even at the least optimal time of day/weather conditions, Assetto Corsa doesn't give me that natural feeling. Same thing for the most optimal settings: 99% of the time, you can tell it's a game.

Gran Turismo, on the other hand, has a very natural look. I'd say this is partially due to the color pallet Polyhpony has chosen for their games as it works great most of the time.

Of course, all of the above is just my opinion and people's eyes are different so come to your own conclusions.

 

[mister dog]

Am I the only one that thinks AC really doesn't compare to the other 3? I mean, it still looks good, but compared to the others?


...nah...

Like @SlimCharles says; tarmac, kerbs and the car models look very good in AC, only letdown is the 2D trees and the clouds + that there isn't much ambiance around their tracks in general.

On consoles with certain cloudy conditions it tends to looks too dark too, luckily on PC we have PP filters for that (and we can mod the clouds). The screenshot above illustrates quite good how the game looks like in clear conditions.

I disagree with this. I have AC on PC running at mostly high settings but I'm assuming the console version looks mostly similar. (Can't really expect the consoles to be above the PC version in terms of graphics anyways.) Even at the least optimal time of day/weather conditions, Assetto Corsa doesn't give me that natural feeling. Same thing for the most optimal settings: 99% of the time, you can tell it's a game.

Gran Turismo, on the other hand, has a very natural look. I'd say this is partially due to the color pallet Polyhpony has chosen for their games as it works great most of the time.

Of course, all of the above is just my opinion and people's eyes are different so come to your own conclusions.

Check this out :

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/assetto-corsa-pc-mod-discussion.307899/page-38#post-11599119

 

[Johnnypenso]

Agreed, GT Sport shouldn't have dumb down physics, but it also shouldn't be so complicated that it becomes intimidating to average user. I just don't see any acceptable reason to pursue the realism any further and to me, what GT does is good enough.

As far as options go, where does it stop? I remember Shift 2 for the PS3 and all of it's options. I had to search the internet for a system that "worked" for me and even after all that work, it left me frustrated. I have no problem with options but I really think having to much can overwhelm the typical player.

It's not that complicated. AC has three options IIRC for overall settings. I don't even know what they are called because I never use them but it could be something like Easy, Gamer, Pro or something similar. Easy stuff, pick a setting and go play the game. If you want to tinker later, you can always take that preset and make your custom changes to it. Any one that's played games in the past would be familiar with the concept of difficulty presets. Anyone that doesn't want to tinker with various settings need never touch anything after their initial difficulty level choice. The game could even have a series of preset prompts that can push you in the right direction. Crashing too much? Maybe the game could advise you to turn damage down or off. Spinning too much? Maybe the game could advise you to turn on this or that assist.

Adding depth to the physics doesn't necessarily make driving any harder but it can add a lot of depth to the simulation which translates into longevity and replayability along with credibility in the e-Sports world.

 

[syntex123]

good thing come when you have the best in thing and GT is the BEST for playstation
if look back when GT came out 25 year ago it was 5 year from GT 1 TO GT2 TO GT3
and how long do it make a car on GT5 will here what i was told SIX MONTH
THANK YOU

Gran Turismo came out 25 years ago?
@Nico_Ble99, congratulations, you're not turning 18 next year because appearantly you're older than me, you're 27!

Seriously though, what? GT1 came out in 1997. Two years after, GT2 came out. Not five. I don't have energy to respond to the rest.

 

[jm79]

Didn't mean to start a thing there, haha.

Interesting to see the priorities you guys have, there are certainly moments in all those games. But for consistency, for me*, GT still comes out on top. Also, as mentioned before a good few times in the last few hundred pages (!) the lighting model (+PBR or whatever, and the accurate Ferrari red, lol) also helps a lot.





*those italics were for you, @Mike_grpA

 

[Mike_grpA]

Driveclub looks spectacular... but unrealistic.

Driveclub looks very realistic IMO. Significantly more so than AC or Pcars, but I think those two games are both better, because of much deeper, much more realistic physics, and in the case of Pcars, much better gameplay.

That was my point. Pretty and realistic graphics are great in a racing game like Driveclub, but in a racing simulator I would prefer the focus to be on realistic physics. Until we have computers with enough processing power to enable graphics like this in sims at least as realistic as AC, I'd prefer the physics to take priority. That way I can buy sims for the driving feel and realism when playing with my wheel, and arcade racers for photo-realistic graphics and messing about in photo mode.

Edit: These photos are all un-edited, straight from the game. They also look significantly better on my PS4 on my big TV, before I transferred them to my laptop.

 

[glassjaw]

I can't speak for everyone, but I for one would applaud PD if they finally stopped prioritising graphics over gameplay. From a lot of what I read on this forum, I imagine a lot of people would rejoice if PD stopped focusing so much on graphics and put their focus on the gameplay and physics. It would make a refreshing change, and would, I imagine, help PD regain the console sim crown. As it is, they've fallen behind Turn 10, and now have to also compete against SMS and Kunos in the future of console sim racing devs.

As someone who really appreciates Polyphony's attention to graphical detail and believes it separates them from the rest of the pack, I admit they could (and probably should) scale back the obsessiveness. That said, Polyphony proved in the PS1 and PS2 generation (and, I'd argue, with GT5 Prologue on the PS3 before they lost their way), that they can make a game that's visually one of the best on the platform and plays well. Hopefully they still have some of that magic. Honestly, if GT Sport wasn't quite as great-looking as I come to expect from the franchise I would not be too upset. But if it looked like Project Cars on PS4, I'd be pretty disappointed.

 

[05XR8]

But if it looked like Project Cars on PS4, I'd be pretty disappointed.

Not that it will, but that's how most objectors of graphics over gameplay, come across when someone says they prefer gameplay over graphics.

When GTS comes out. I'm going to compare it directly with GT1(even though a better comparison is with GT5P). Graphics, physics, gameplay, features, car count, tracks, track ambience, sounds, offline, online, replays, re-playability, sound tracks. All that. For some reason, I don't think GT1 will be far off GTS.

 

[Dusky1103]

Driveclub looks very realistic IMO. Significantly more so than AC or Pcars, but I think those two games are both better, because of much deeper, much more realistic physics, and in the case of Pcars, much better gameplay.

That was my point. Pretty and realistic graphics are great in a racing game like Driveclub, but in a racing simulator I would prefer the focus to be on realistic physics. Until we have computers with enough processing power to enable graphics like this in sims at least as realistic as AC, I'd prefer the physics to take priority. That way I can buy sims for the driving feel and realism when playing with my wheel, and arcade racers for photo-realistic graphics and messing about in photo mode.

Edit: These photos are all un-edited, straight from the game. They also look significantly better on my PS4 on my big TV, before I transferred them to my laptop.

I agree with you, Driveclub is just out of this world. If GT is supposed to be the pinnacle of graphical capabilities on the PS4/Pro, im pretty sure they are going to have a very hard time topping Driveclub's graphics. Now if GT can incorporate Driveclub's graphics with an awesome physics engine its going to be simply amazing.

Btw, whoever says AC has good graphics must be out of their mind. I have AC on PS4 and it looks the most bland,most dry and most boring game i've seen in my life. And no, its not just the color palette itself, the graphics are very poor. I would say almost PS2 poor. In before "PS2 LOL, an exaggeration", im back on GT6 now on PS3 and the lighting engine as well as graphics are miles above the newer gen console that runs AC. There is simply no excuse for AC giving out such shoddy graphics that looks worse than a 10 year old console. I dont care how you put it, there is no excuse at all.

Anyway, it still fuddles me to this day why PC sims (apart from PCARS) just cannot seem to make a game look graphically stunning. Aren't PCs supposed to be "the most powerful" masterace "9 tflops gtx 1080". Yet Driveclub (with 1.8tflops remember) destroys them? LOL. IMO Sim Racing isnt just all about ffb/feel to me, a large part of it is IMMERSION. And for me to be completely immersed, the graphics shown has to be as photo realistic as in real life as possible for me to feel like im on the damn track. PCARS comes close i'll give them that, but rfactor and the rest of the pc games honestly need to wake up their idea. I hear rfactor is moving to DX12 as well as automobilista so theres hope but they really do have to do alot better IMO

 

[glassjaw]

Not that it will, but that's how most objectors of graphics over gameplay, come across when someone says they prefer gameplay over graphics.

When GTS comes out. I'm going to compare it directly with GT1(even though a better comparison is with GT5P). Graphics, physics, gameplay, features, car count, tracks, track ambience, sounds, offline, online, replays, re-playability, sound tracks. All that. For some reason, I don't think GT1 will be far off GTS.

Well in that particular example I'd argue Project Cars' somewhat lacking visuals aren't made up for with stellar gameplay. But thats just my personal opinion. I also can't help but have greater expectations for a AAA-title from a first-party studio than I would for a relatively small team spread thin over multiple platforms.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

It looks natural. It's not looking to portray some ultra fantasy day where the sun is perfect and the conditions are of absolute optimal - it's trying to accurately simulate what you'd be most likely get if you went to the Nürburging on a good day, which really is what a simulator should be setting out to achieve.

Meanwhile, GT Sport has seemingly cribbed from the FM5 book, and thrown epic amounts of bloom at every even-remotely-reflective surface.

Though, with footage from the PS4 Pro event, I do wonder how much of that is from phone cameras not being able to accurately capture what an HDR screen is doing. Not that it's the first time the game has been shown with an abundance of glare, but still — as ever, HDR needs to be seen first-hand.

 

[RandomCarGuy17]

Why did PD decide to change their lighting style with this game anyway? I thought the lighting in GT6 was quite good and they decided to just drop it for the FM5 style bloom. pffft, PD you silly people.

 

[azrilnazli]

rFactor2 FFB datarate at 500hz
Automobilista FFB datarate at 360hz
iRacing FFB datarate at 60hz

And those top 3 PC sim titles makes every different cars felt different due to physics amount sent to user's PC

Don't you guys want GT Sport feels more Sim than Arcade ? Just make the graphics 60 fps stable and more headroom for physics

 

[Dusky1103]

Well in that particular example I'd argue Project Cars' somewhat lacking visuals aren't made up for with stellar gameplay. But thats just my personal opinion. I also can't help but have greater expectations for a AAA-title from a first-party studio than I would for a relatively small team spread thin over multiple platforms.

Lol, you have no idea what you are talking about. From a pure racing sim point of view, the gameplay in PCARS is excellent, especially for a first player. The career progression in PCARS is exactly what you will find in real life, starting your way out from karts to the Gran Touring series. With standing starts, practice rounds, qualifying rounds and even second races, everything is as it is in real life. There is also no gameification like in the Gran Turismo series, where you have to hit top 3 to gain "stars".

In fact, you fight for every race, and it doesnt even matter if you are fighting for 10th position that race. Because even 10 gives you a score which will be tabulated at the end of the series. Sounds familiar? Because that's what you get in real life.

The gameplay is 100% fantastic, especially for single player. You are not going to find another "sim" that comes close what PCARS is offering atm when it comes to gameplay.

Unless, you are looking for a "game", where you feel happy with your progression of stars instead of actually racing. If thats what you consider "stellar gameplay", well thats GT then.

 

[mister dog]

Unless, you are looking for a "game", where you feel happy with your progression of stars instead of actually racing. If thats what you consider "stellar gameplay", well thats GT then.

Actually I think the old race for credit, buy cars with said credits was a good formula to keep you engaged as there were always cars to go after. But seeing they have thrown that overboard now I wonder how they will keep their players hooked. In Sims everything is unlocked from the start nowadays but at least experiencing the cars themselves is a good enough incentive due to their physics and unique handling.

 

[trustjab]

Those driveclub pics look nice, almost too nice if you know what I'm saying. The cars are modeled great, I'm thinking more along the lines of they all have this perfect shine to them. I haven't played it, but is there a dirt and grime accumulation? Maybe those pics on the previous page aren't showing that. Anyway, they look amazing. Hopefully GTS can match that or come close. So far with the demo vids, they look really nice.

 

[ScottPuss20]

Lots of big posts... Boy oh boy, what are you people on about?
As we all know, PD prides itself on the best graphics - they were bragging about GT4's eye candy on the PS2 for crying out loud. I don't think they are willing to sacrifice that at the hands of their reputation, you know. Physics come second it seems, which is a shame for hardcore players, but thankfully, most people are NOT hardcore about their gaming.

 

[Dusky1103]

Actually I think the old race for credit, buy cars with said credits was a good formula to keep you engaged as there were always cars to go after. But seeing they have thrown that overboard now I wonder how they will keep their players hooked. In Sims everything is unlocked from the start nowadays but at least experiencing the cars themselves is a good enough incentive due to their physics and unique handling.

Tbh, I do not prefer the whole "unlocked from the beginning" style from modern sims. Like you, i enjoy the sense of progression. Nevertheless, GT could make the series more "professional" if you will by unlocking cars after you successfully move up the ranks in the racing world etc, get more famous, people like a personal element to a game. Rather than just flat out accumulating stars everywhere.

I feel if PCARS didnt have everything unlocked from the beginning I would be enjoying it alot more right now. After seeing the Huayra in my garage i've just never been bothered to drive it. Now if i had to be a successfully work my way through my career (i.e. from carting champion to GT chamption to F1 champion) and only in the later stages afford a Huarya i'll definitely be more engaged.

 

[Dusky1103]

Lots of big posts... Boy oh boy, what are you people on about?
As we all know, PD prides itself on the best graphics - they were bragging about GT4's eye candy on the PS2 for crying out loud. I don't think they are willing to sacrifice that at the hands of their reputation, you know. Physics come second it seems, which is a shame for hardcore players, but thankfully, most people are NOT hardcore about their gaming.

Whatever we post is irrelevant anyway. PD doesnt listen to us. The GT planet forum is just for people who have too much time on their hands, who are acting as though we are discussing things that are extremely important. Lol

 

[ToyGTone]

As someone else said on the Status box...

Today is the day where North America (and Japan i believe) supposed to see the launch of the title we've been waiting for, only to get delayed and pushed into another year. Gran Turismo everyone!

It's seems that ether PDI releases the game with most of it's content in the disc but with number of delays (GT5) or they release it without any delays but the game is more buggy and missing some of it's content (GT6)..

 

[Imari]

It's just priorities. With the genre spread across multiple generations and multiple platforms, the 'ideal' racing game will always be elusive, so you merely have preferences. My preference for GT is for visuals first. And I stick to the idea that it is a big part of the appeal of GT, broadly-speaking. I think I've spent an age in photomode, purely because it's so damn gorgeous.

There are other games for other things. That's OK, I think.

Of course everyone has their own preferences, but GT is a game that is presumably attempting to appeal to a wide audience. You don't get 10 million sales by being super niche. Visuals are nice for marketing, but it's very rare that they're actually essential to the game.

Photomode is something of an exception. Graphics are essential to that mode. But I'd argue that a game whose primary focus and differentiating feature is photomode is extremely niche. Particularly in the case of GTS, where the new photomode appears to offer far less freedom to create to those enthusiasts that would buy such a game. Why throw away those beautifully crafted photo stages from GT5P, GT5 and GT6 in favour of pretty but static 2D backgrounds?

From what I've seen, GT6 is a better photography simulator, even if the images might not look quite as flash.

Honestly, photomode is fine. It's not my kettle of fish, but I've got nothing against those that like it. It's a somewhat cynical attempt to work around the "all images from in-game" tagging in marketing, but it has it's moments and is pretty cool regardless of intent. But if that's all the game has to offer to set itself apart then it's going to go down like a ton of bricks. Because no matter how we spin it, to Joe Casual photomode isn't real gameplay.

 

[syntex123]

When GTS comes out. I'm going to compare it directly with GT1(even though a better comparison is with GT5P). Graphics, physics, gameplay, features, car count, tracks, track ambience, sounds, offline, online, replays, re-playability, sound tracks. All that. For some reason, I don't think GT1 will be far off GTS.

If I read you correctly. You're literally taking Kaz on his words saying GTS will be "very Gran Turismo, having features older Gran Turismos had" - I'm paraphrasing of course. I love the idea of a modern classic GT1. Except it won't happen. Not with GTS anyway. Where's the deep and rich GT Mode we all learned to love? Instead we get this "tutorial on how to drive like a race driver" sort of career. I do get it, fun for all, 7-77 and everything. But that + the racing etiquette should be in a tutorial section. It shouldn't be the only career mode. This is a slight disappointment.

 

[AKps3]

How GT Sport is making the most of PS4 Pro and PlayStation VR
https://blog.eu.playstation.com/201...id=798526340093747200&adbpl=tw&adbpr=36969785
https://blog.eu.playstation.com/201...id=798526340093747200&adbpl=tw&adbpr=36969785

 

[queleuleu]

How GT Sport is making the most of PS4 Pro and PlayStation VR
https://blog.eu.playstation.com/201...id=798526340093747200&adbpl=tw&adbpr=36969785

Not a single new screenshot... Nothing new, concrete.