Hamilton to Mercedes Move

[King1982]

So after ten races how would you rate the Lewis Hamilton to Mercedes move?

 

[Liquid]

Everyone thought it was a mistake, but he's proving us wrong.

/thread

 

[Imari]

In terms of 2012 pace it would have been a mistake, but a bit of luck and probably a bit of strategy got him on the better team in 2013. He rolled the dice and won.

Hindsight being 20/20 and all that, it's clear he made the right call. I'm not sure anyone could have known that for sure at the time he made the decision though.

 

[Danny]

Hindsight is a beautiful thing. One of the smartest moves I've seen in the sport.

 

[Pezzarinho17]

In regards to just 2013, he has done the right thing - or has he? Some would put the Mercedes upheaval to his input, and the McLaren downturn due to the missing development and feedback he would provide. Current McLaren was probably designed more to his liking even.

Scored 8, purely as his contract (and therefore consideration given to the decision to move) exceeds this season. If McLaren return to the front next year onwards as Mercedes slide, the decision to move would become "shortsighted" with that great hindsight tool again.

 

[Peasantslayer]

9 and if Mercedes are dominant with the next generation of power units then 10. I honestly thought best case scenario 4/5 podiums over the course of the 2013 season, I wasn't that surprised to see Mclaren off the pace when they unveiled their completely new car. I've found F1 much more enjoyable this year, when supporting a Mclaren driver there is a sense that whatever can go wrong will go wrong.

 

[Seismica]

Nobody expected Mercedes to be where they are now pace wise. Not Lewis, not Nico, not Ross Brawn nor any of their engineers etc. So there must have been an amount of luck involved. Likewise, nobody expected Mclaren to be as far back as they are considering they had the quickest car last year, which makes Lewis' move stand out more.

Mercedes has taken Mclaren's place from last year at the front on pace. If they can keep it up for the rest of the season, Hamilton should be able to put Vettel in his place for the championship. It's going to be an exciting close to the season, that is for sure.

But for Hamilton's move to be right, they need to be in line or ahead of Mclaren in 2014. It's no good if Mercedes come second to Red Bull this year if Button and Perez dominate next year. They have to keep it up long term.

 

[zippy_the_cat]

But for Hamilton's move to be right, they need to be in line or ahead of Mclaren in 2014. It's no good if Mercedes come second to Red Bull this year if Button and Perez dominate next year.

There is precisely no chance of McLaren beating Merc in McLaren's lame-duck year with Merc engines. There will be little to no technical cooperation coming to Woking from the Germans to cope with the new plants' inevitable teething problems.

 

[Carbonox]

"I hope Hamilton thinks he's made an awful mistake"

 

[King1982]

"I hope Hamilton thinks he's made an awful mistake"

I guess he done a lot of headscraching this season.

 

[Ardius]

Hindsight is a beautiful thing. One of the smartest moves I've seen in the sport.

Same as Button's from Brawn to McLaren. A lot of people said that was stupid at the time.

 

[Furinkazen]

The same Brawn that ironically grew into Mercedes that Lewis drives for. I got to admit, I was sceptical at first but Lewis really looks at home in the team now.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

I wonder if Lewis didn't like the direction McLaren were going with the new car.

 

[BHRxRacer]

He only moved for the money, so he can keep his wanna-be rapper lifestyle and girlfriend. I don't care what the results are this season, I'm only going to judge the move based on his reasons. Go back and listen to Whitmarsh' and Lewis' interviews last season. There was an interview where Whitmarsh clearly said Lewis told him he was going to stay if they paid him more the 12m or whatever they pay their drivers.

He just got lucky Mercedes/Schumacher's car finally started working on heavy fuel, and got even faster on a single lap. The car is handed to him on a silver platter.


-

Been a hectic few weeks since I last posted here. Let the hate begin.

 

[hawkeye122]

He only moved for the money, so he can keep his wanna-be rapper lifestyle and girlfriend. I don't care what the results are this season, I'm only going to judge the move based on his reasons. Go back and listen to Whitmarsh' and Lewis' interviews last season. There was an interview where Whitmarsh clearly said Lewis told him he was going to stay if they paid him more the 12m or whatever they pay their drivers.

He just got lucky Mercedes/Schumacher's car finally started working on heavy fuel, and got even faster on a single lap. The car is handed to him on a silver platter.

-

Been a hectic few weeks since I last posted here. Let the hate begin.

I'm not gonna hate, but I will say that you seem rather bitter.

 

[Peasantslayer]

Who voted 1?

He only moved for the money, so he can keep his wanna-be rapper lifestyle and girlfriend. I don't care what the results are this season, I'm only going to judge the move based on his reasons. Go back and listen to Whitmarsh' and Lewis' interviews last season. There was an interview where Whitmarsh clearly said Lewis told him he was going to stay if they paid him more the 12m or whatever they pay their drivers.

He just got lucky Mercedes/Schumacher's car finally started working on heavy fuel, and got even faster on a single lap. The car is handed to him on a silver platter.

Schumacher's car... If he was so great why didn't he get the car to work before he left? He had plenty of time, the answer is because the driver's have a minimal impact on the ultimate speed of a car and Mercedes have hired lots of very experienced engineers so stop kidding yourself. He may have been one of the best in an F1 car 10 years ago but he isn't now and Nico proved that.

 

[SilverArrow]

Who voted 1?

The Rosberg fanboy.

 

[Furinkazen]

Just enquiring.. is BHR JGreens counterpart at Mercedes>

And Lewis hasn't has it all his way, Rosberg has been rather handy in the Merc as well...

 

[BHRxRacer]

I'm not gonna hate, but I will say that you seem rather bitter.

Care to elaborate?

I am kind of upset that Schumacher was a star in 2012 but never had the car, nor the luck to pierce through the bias and prejudice of the "media" and show it. I am also upset that Lewis is getting so much credit for something he doesn't deserve. It's not like he knew the car was going to be fast. He's just as surprised as everybody else. He made a decision based on money, and got much more than that. Luck. He deserves no credit. I don't quite get the bitter part.

Who voted 1?



Schumacher's car... If he was so great why didn't he get the car to work before he left? He had plenty of time, the answer is because the driver's have a minimal impact on the ultimate speed of a car and Mercedes have hired lots of very experienced engineers so stop kidding yourself. He may have been one of the best in an F1 car 10 years ago but he isn't now and Nico proved that.

First of all, this isn't about Schumacher but I will say that...your post is unbelievable. One day everyone's screaming "OMG SCHUMACHER IS TEH NEW HITLER HE MAKES THE ENGINEERS DESIGN THE CAR TO SUIT HIM ONLY" and when the car actually gets quicker they discredit him from everything.

Second, just calling him "one of the best" and not "THE best" is enough for me to avoid any further discussion with you in this matter. So I guess Coulthard, Barrichelo, Montoya and Ralf were on his level 10 years ago.

Just enquiring.. is BHR JGreens counterpart at Mercedes>

God no.

And Lewis hasn't has it all his way, Rosberg has been rather handy in the Merc as well...

Ok...? What does that have to do with his decision to move to Mercedes last year?

 

[Peasantslayer]

Second, just calling him "one of the best" and not "THE best" is enough for me to avoid any further discussion with you in this matter. So I guess Coulthard, Barrichelo, Montoya and Ralf were on his level 10 years ago.

I'll accept Schumacher was probably the best but how do you know for certain their wasn't another driver on the grid that could have regularly beaten him in the same car? Anyway this thread is about Hamilton's move to Mercedes, if he joins a team which is capable of winning races, taking poles with ease, with the future for the team looking good and he makes a few extra million pounds a year then it can't be a bad one.

 

[BHRxRacer]

I'll accept Schumacher was probably the best but how do you know for certain their wasn't another driver on the grid that could have regularly beaten him in the same car? Anyway this thread is about Hamilton's move to Mercedes, if he joins a team which is capable of winning races, taking poles with ease, with the future for the team looking good and he makes a few extra million pounds a year then it can't be a bad one.

You're looking at nearly a year later. I'm looking at it at the time he made the decision. I don't care what the outcome is.

Suppose you've given two different guys $100 and asked what they'll spend it on, and got these answers:

Person A: I'm going to invest my $100 in a small business which I'll slowly turn into a major one.
Person B: LOL IMA SMOKE SOME WEED AND TAP SOME BOOTY THEN BUY A $1 LOTTERY TICKET

Person B happened to have won the lottery. Does that make him any less of an idiot? Sorry, but no.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

He only moved for the money, so he can keep his wanna-be rapper lifestyle and girlfriend. I don't care what the results are this season, I'm only going to judge the move based on his reasons. Go back and listen to Whitmarsh' and Lewis' interviews last season. There was an interview where Whitmarsh clearly said Lewis told him he was going to stay if they paid him more the 12m or whatever they pay their drivers.

He just got lucky Mercedes/Schumacher's car finally started working on heavy fuel, and got even faster on a single lap. The car is handed to him on a silver platter.


-

Been a hectic few weeks since I last posted here. Let the hate begin.

Can you find the interview where Martin Whitmarsh said if he gets X amount he will stay. Lewis has categorically said that he is getting less money at Mercedes than he would have got at McLaren, Ross has also said this IIRC.

He took a leap of faith after hearing about Mercedes potential and this year, they are walking the talk. Given McLaren history of shooting themselves in the foot, it is looking like a 10 out of 10 move now given position McLaren are in and how competitive Mercedes are. It is amazing that Lewis managed to out qualify the Red Bull by over 6 tenths at Silverstone. McLaren haven't come within 9 tenths of Red Bull on that track in qualifying since 2009.

Lewis also gets to keep his trophies and also has less PR responsibilities and probably less restrictions on what he can do / wear.

Just saw this article on what Martin Whitmarsh said, if taken in different context, it is quite flattering of Lewis: Link . It is after all Lewis who was making the car look superfast while Jenson was way behind in terms of performance like in Singapore and Abu Dhabi. In some races this year McLaren have been in same situtation as last year in terms of competitive order with Jenson who was fighting in midfield while Lewis was fighting out in front for victory. Jenson talked up how car is designed around his style at start of season and also McLaren dismissed Paddy Lowe's contribution to the team for car as well but now it has not gone well, they got someone who is inexperienced and the lead drive is someone who needs the car to work for him to be able to perform at a level as good as the top drivers in F1.

Biggest loser in all this is McLaren, biggest winners in this are Lewis and Mercedes.

 

[Peasantslayer]

You're looking at nearly a year later. I'm looking at it at the time he made the decision. I don't care what the outcome is.

Suppose you've given two different guys $100 and asked what they'll spend it on, and got these answers:

Person A: I'm going to invest my $100 in a small business which I'll slowly turn into a major one.
Person B: LOL IMA SMOKE SOME WEED AND TAP SOME BOOTY THEN BUY A $1 LOTTERY TICKET

Person B happened to have won the lottery. Does that make him any less of an idiot? Sorry, but no.

Good analogy but I doubt the decision was that simple, it's not like he's joined Marussia and picked up a win this is the factory Mercedes team so you can't rule out progress like this.

 

[Akmuq]

Second, just calling him "one of the best" and not "THE best" is enough for me to avoid any further discussion with you in this matter. So I guess Coulthard, Barrichelo, Montoya and Ralf were on his level 10 years ago.

1st off, Montoya was better than him, and secondly, if he was THE best, he'd beat Rosberg.

Anyway, it was a good move from Hamilton.#BackOnTopic

 

[SilverArrow]

This is what Schumacher had to say in January about Merc.

 

[Pupik]

Who voted 1?

The Rosberg fanboy.

Or someone bitterly disappointed that the combo hadn't immediately caused Vettel to fall flat on his face, in terms of results...

I think we all thought that going to one of the least reliable teams was a silly move, but he'd wanted a change. Plenty of drivers leave for the money, but if he knew that the McLaren-Honda deal might take a while to gel, then it couldn't have been considered a completely foolish decision, in terms of staying near the sharp end of the grid.

I guess it was the right move, it will be interesting to see if Mercedes can sustain their pace, improve overall mechanical reliability, and achieve some consistent longevity out of the tires.

I can't credit Schumacher at all for Hamilton's success, unless he was sandbagging that heavily and for so long. Which makes absolutely no sense.

 

[Imari]

You're looking at nearly a year later. I'm looking at it at the time he made the decision. I don't care what the outcome is.

Suppose you've given two different guys $100 and asked what they'll spend it on, and got these answers:

Person A: I'm going to invest my $100 in a small business which I'll slowly turn into a major one.
Person B: LOL IMA SMOKE SOME WEED AND TAP SOME BOOTY THEN BUY A $1 LOTTERY TICKET

Person B happened to have won the lottery. Does that make him any less of an idiot? Sorry, but no.

If you think it was all luck, then sure.

If you consider that McLaren is supplied their engines by Merc, and Merc made major upgrades to their aero program at the start of the year then it starts not looking as dumb. I doubt he expected to be winning this year, but solid results were always on the table. And while McLaren may have (arguably) had the fastest car last year, they sure did their best to shoot themselves in the foot with bad strategy, setup and reliability.

I expect the major benefit to come with the regulation changes in 2014. Being on one of the few teams manufacturing their own engines in the first season of a radical engine change is a big deal.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Let's not let BxR's trademark crazy opinions derail the thread, the reality is that Merc GP have several new members (e.g. engineers) that make this group stronger. With Patty Lowe in place to run the team a year and a half from now that helps Lewis even more. Lowe has been working with the team either way this year and other members also have helped shape the team. Lewis has the experience of the Mercedes engines, and the true aerodynamics understanding of the McLaren cars to help improve the insight along with Rosberg's common knowledge of the cars. It is easy to see why quantum leaps are being made at Brackley.

 

[Seismica]

If you think it was all luck, then sure.

If you consider that McLaren is supplied their engines by Merc, and Merc made major upgrades to their aero program at the start of the year then it starts not looking as dumb. I doubt he expected to be winning this year, but solid results were always on the table. And while McLaren may have (arguably) had the fastest car last year, they sure did their best to shoot themselves in the foot with bad strategy, setup and reliability.

I expect the major benefit to come with the regulation changes in 2014. Being on one of the few teams manufacturing their own engines in the first season of a radical engine change is a big deal.

A good portion of it was luck. Mclaren had the fastest car. Now Mercedes do. Nobody saw that coming. At the end of 2012 Mercedes were nowhere; Force India had a stronger car even though they were only a customer Mercedes team.

Hamilton's decision to move wasn't paced solely on the pace of the car. His decision was based on better financial package, reduced sponsor responsibilities, more freedom (I hear somebody mentioned he gets to keep his own trophies now, if thats true that is a big plus for Mercedes) and a personal desire for a change of scene.

He admitted many times that he only expected to be challenging for the odd podium. He was anticipating the future. There is question over the engines yes, but there is no guarantee at all that Mercedes will be on top in 2014/2015. At the end of the day Hamilton took a risk. It seems to have paid off in the short term, but if Mclaren is ahead of Merc next year and the year after his decision is going to turn out to be pretty bad.

I gave Lewis an 8/10. I believe he has indeed made the right decision, but only time will tell if it's the best move for his career in the longer term.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

It was explained in the article why the 2012 car was off the map.