*Rumor* Gran Turismo 7 Prologue headed to PS4?

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PS4 is not capable of 4k gaming. Haven't we been over this months ago? Also considering how likely it is PD are going to push the graphics to the limit of the console just as they did with PS3 120fps seems highly unlikely. Many graphics heavy games on PS4 aren't even doing 1080p @ 60fps.
 
Is there really a noticeable difference between 60fps and 120fps? That seems like a waste of resources.
 
ildd
Is there really a noticeable difference between 60fps and 120fps? That seems like a waste of resources.
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Depends on how the game is rendered and the degree of motion blur that is used. In general, yes, 120fps will look better to the average observer but if the frames are too detailed your brain may interpret stuttering as it picks out details that may not be visible at a lower framerate with more motion blur.
 
Samus
PS4 is not capable of 4k gaming. Haven't we been over this months ago? Also considering how likely it is PD are going to push the graphics to the limit of the console just as they did with PS3 120fps seems highly unlikely. Many graphics heavy games on PS4 aren't even doing 1080p @ 60fps.
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That is what you still think, I am very confident there will be games outputting at 4K. I think it makes more sense for PD to make a 4K replay mode instead though than gameplay (Due to 30FPS limit) but it will be good option to have both. Even better would be if there is a way to use two consoles to achieve it, then something better will be able to achieved and should work with other games if there is a way and should make this generation last a bit longer and make things easier for developers.

PD like pushing the standards and with the PS4 they have a lot of headroom and with HDMI limitations, they probably will be kept to sensible targets instead of 1080p 240fps and 4K 60fps (They already done this on 4 PS3s) unless it is possible to update to HDMI 2.0 with firmware update . With 3D and VR, I imagine they will need to target 120FPS to get a decent experience.
 
Confident based on what exactly? We know the hardware inside the PS4, even with typical console optimisation it just isn't going to be powerful enough to do a game like GT in 4k. What would be the point anyway, to show off at game shows? 4k TV owners are still a tiny minority and will remain so for several years. They might as well just use multiple consoles, as they've done in the past.
 
Samus
Confident based on what exactly? We know the hardware inside the PS4, even with typical console optimisation it just isn't going to be powerful enough to do a game like GT in 4k. What would be the point anyway, to show off at game shows? 4k TV owners are still a tiny minority and will remain so for several years. They might as well just use multiple consoles, as they've done in the past.
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I'm confident due to hardware inside PS4. Concerns are current resource allocation on console but Sony will likely free some of it up over time. Something to sell 4K TVs with like similar package Sony did with 3D TVs and GT5. It will probably be one of the the most photorealistic games ever made at time of release I imagine and great way to advertise the power of PS4 and show off on their new TVs.
 
Saidur_Ali
I'm confident due to hardware inside PS4. Concerns are current resource allocation on console but Sony will likely free some of it up over time. Something to sell 4K TVs with like similar package Sony did with 3D TVs and GT5. It will probably be one of the the most photorealistic games ever made at time of release I imagine and great way to advertise the power of PS4 and show off on their new TVs.
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The hardware in the PS4 barely equals a midrange PC these days. The last time Sony tried to show off their 4K UHDTV they invited over a dozen professional cinematographers that work with UHDTV every day to view their $20000, 80 inch screen at a show and not a single one of them could tell the difference between that and 1080 on the same screen! Like I said, 4K is a complete waste of time for the screen the size you find in a typical home. Which, of course, probably means Kaz will be all over it. I can hear it now "screw game play, I don't care if it is 5fps, it's 4K" :rolleyes: He does seem to be all about the numbers more so than the game play these days.
 
MustangManiac
Like I said, 4K is a complete waste of time for the screen the size you find in a typical home. Which, of course, probably means Kaz will be all over it. I can hear it now "screw game play, I don't care if it is 5fps, it's 4K" :rolleyes: He does seem to be all about the numbers more so than the game play these days.
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Multi-screen support for GT6 being an example of this. Vast, gigantic, overwhelming, cripplingly huge majority of players will never be able to afford multi-screen setup both money- and space-wise...
 
Saidur_Ali
I'm confident due to hardware inside PS4. Concerns are current resource allocation on console but Sony will likely free some of it up over time. Something to sell 4K TVs with like similar package Sony did with 3D TVs and GT5. It will probably be one of the the most photorealistic games ever made at time of release I imagine and great way to advertise the power of PS4 and show off on their new TVs.
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Are you aware of some hardware in there nobody else is? Because last I checked the GPU was rated at under 2TFLOPS, not something capable of photorealistic, high quality textures in a game like Gran Turismo displayed at 4k resolution or even 1080p at 120fps.
 
I'm out. Just sold GT6.

GT7 will be more of the same. Maybe with an idiotic mission to drive a robot on Mars, more arcadish gameplay structure and more idiotic game design choices. And I simply don't care. PD alienate me with GT6, it's not my "favourite game" anymore.
 
MustangManiac
The hardware in the PS4 barely equals a midrange PC these days. The last time Sony tried to show off their 4K UHDTV they invited over a dozen professional cinematographers that work with UHDTV every day to view their $20000, 80 inch screen at a show and not a single one of them could tell the difference between that and 1080 on the same screen! Like I said, 4K is a complete waste of time for the screen the size you find in a typical home. Which, of course, probably means Kaz will be all over it. I can hear it now "screw game play, I don't care if it is 5fps, it's 4K" :rolleyes: He does seem to be all about the numbers more so than the game play these days.
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Mid-range PCs can play games in 4K resolution. 4K screens will become similar price to current 1080p screens quite quickly I imagine. I don't think it will be a waste of time as I don't it will require that much work to get it in as an added option at a decent standard if they are target something like 120FPS at 1080p. The in-game assets are of a very high quality.

Samus
Are you aware of some hardware in there nobody else is? Because last I checked the GPU was rated at under 2TFLOPS, not something capable of photorealistic, high quality textures in a game like Gran Turismo displayed at 4k resolution or even 1080p at 120fps.
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It is how you use the power that counts, Gran Turismo has historically had an highly efficient game engine regarding graphics. At time of release I think it will be one of the most photorealistic although PS5 and on will go on to do a much better job of achieving it. PC has a lot of power but at the moment I doubt there will be many to make full use of it anytime soon.

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Something like the above I will be fine with on the PS4.
 
Saidur_Ali
Mid-range PCs can play games in 4K resolution. 4K screens will become similar price to current 1080p screens quite quickly I imagine. I don't think it will be a waste of time as I don't it will require that much work to get it in as an added option at a decent standard if they are target something like 120FPS at 1080p. The in-game assets are of a very high quality.
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There is a big difference between simply "playing a game at 4k" and playing a game at 4k with textures designed for that resolution and look good at that size. Yes you can play something like Dirt 3 at 4k with a mid range PC because the textures aren't designed for that scale. You wouldn't expect GT7 to look like those sort of games would you? Playing a game with textures created for 4k resolution and graphics generally well in advanced of PS3/PC ports is not going to be possible at 4k on PS4. Well optimised PC games with high res textures won't run at 4k/30fps using a Titan, what makes you think a PS4 will?

Here are some game benchmarks at 4k - http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/pq321q-4k-gaming,review-32782-6.html

A single Titan can barely manage 30fps on most of those and again, they're pretty much all old games with textures not optimised for 4k. Yet you think the PS4 GPU can do better?

Targeting 120fps at 60fps would be monumentally stupid, and making the exact same mistake as they did on PS3, trying to get the hardware to do more than it can. Nobody else on PS4 is targeting anything like that and whilst PD are a first party dev they can't suddenly do more with the console than anyone else. True 1080p/60fps would be what any sensible person would aim for on PS4. Why aim for more, to satisfy the tiny minority with a 4k TV or those for who 60fps just isn't enough? 120fps is nice if you can do it but not necessary. You're not going to find many people except the most diehard PC player who says "60fps? Pfft, not enough".

It is how you use the power that counts, Gran Turismo has historically had an highly efficient game engine regarding graphics. At time of release I think it will be one of the most photorealistic although PS5 and on will go on to do a much better job of achieving it. PC has a lot of power but at the moment I doubt there will be many to make full use of it anytime soon.
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Correct, but there is only so far you can go with what you've got. PD did a great job of making use of the 256Mb PS3 RAM but there was only so far they could take it, as we've seen with various drawbacks and limitations in the game. Trying to push "the most photorealistic" game to 1080p/120fps or 4k is frankly a stupid idea.
 
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Samus
There is a big difference between simply "playing a game at 4k" and playing a game at 4k with textures designed for that resolution and look good at that size. Yes you can play something like Dirt 3 at 4k with a mid range PC because the textures aren't designed for that scale. You wouldn't expect GT7 to look like those sort of games would you? Playing a game with textures created for 4k resolution and graphics generally well in advanced of PS3/PC ports is not going to be possible at 4k on PS4. Well optimised PC games with high res textures won't run at 4k/30fps using a Titan, what makes you think a PS4 will?

Targeting 120fps at 60fps would be monumentally stupid, and making the exact same mistake as they did on PS3, trying to get the hardware to do more than it can. Nobody else on PS4 is targeting anything like that and whilst PD are a first party dev they can't suddenly do more with the console than anyone else. True 1080p/60fps would be what any sensible person would aim for on PS4. Why aim for more, to satisfy the tiny minority with a 4k TV or those for who 60fps just isn't enough? 120fps is nice if you can do it but not necessary. You're not going to find many people except the most diehard PC player who says "60fps? Pfft, not enough".



Correct, but there is only so far you can go with what you've got. PD did a great job of making use of the 256Mb PS3 RAM but there was only so far they could take it, as we've seen with various drawbacks and limitations in the game. Trying to push "the most photorealistic" game to 1080p/120fps or 4k is frankly a stupid idea.
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Good job PS4 has a good memory setup if you are concerned with textures. Also making it optimised for 4K should help it run better than just raw power making a game run at such a high resolution.

If VR is something Sony will push, then I don't see how having some games at 120FPS will be a stupid idea. Also if they have 3D effect games again.

Having the other resolutions and frame rates does not mean they can't push 1080p 60FPS graphics levels too.
 
I see the ps4 and xbone as small jumps from ps3 and xbox360, much smaller than ps2/xbox to ps3/xbox360...you see them as giant leaps.
Who is more wrong?
 
Mustangmiha
Probably because the inexperienced devs haven't mastered the new architecture yet.
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You mean the simple, "turbocharged PC" architecture? The same architecture they were all saying it's much easier to get to grips with? Yes I fully expect games to get better as time goes on but to go from many devs not managing 1080p at 60fps to one dev pushing 4k @ 30fps? I highly doubt it, based on the hardware, just like previous gen devs didn't advance from 720p30 to 1080p60 once they got to grips with it. There is still a hardware limit. But as above, we can only wait and see. I'm not going to keep arguing on it.
 
Samus
Well I can't be bothered to argue this over again, I did it enough months ago and before the PS4 came out. Let's just see who is right when it happens.
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Will see what happens, just think it is too normal for PD to target 1080p 60FPS.
 
Samus
You mean the simple, "turbocharged PC" architecture? The same architecture they were all saying it's much easier to get to grips with? Yes I fully expect games to get better as time goes on but to go from many devs not managing 1080p at 60fps to one dev pushing 4k @ 30fps? I highly doubt it, based on the hardware, just like previous gen devs didn't advance from 720p30 to 1080p60 once they got to grips with it. There is still a hardware limit. But as above, we can only wait and see. I'm not going to keep arguing on it.
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It's always like this with any console. Remember the PS2, how simple the games looked like, and after some years, some of the best games ever have been released. I'm going to be patient and if there's something interesting I might buy PS4 in a few years (crossed fingers for Siren), buying the console at the launch day is plain ridiculous.
 
MustangManiac
The hardware in the PS4 barely equals a midrange PC these days. The last time Sony tried to show off their 4K UHDTV they invited over a dozen professional cinematographers that work with UHDTV every day to view their $20000, 80 inch screen at a show and not a single one of them could tell the difference between that and 1080 on the same screen! Like I said, 4K is a complete waste of time for the screen the size you find in a typical home. Which, of course, probably means Kaz will be all over it. I can hear it now "screw game play, I don't care if it is 5fps, it's 4K" :rolleyes: He does seem to be all about the numbers more so than the game play these days.
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Anecdotal stories, there are more that say 4k is amazing on tablet sized screen and very different to 1080p.

4k @30fps would be relatively easy for GT on the PS4, but they might not offer it as an option as the game would be better at 60fps. So they might give a 4k 60fps option (if the hdmi socket can be firmware upgraded). It would look like PS3 low detail track and background though. And would they want that, I doubt it. Everything needs to look great on the PS4 version.
I think they could do a high detail VR version though thats 1080p and 95fps or however is fast enough for good VR.
 
PD cares about resolution, but they also care about graphics. To achieve 4k, it would have to be worst looking than GT5, and I doubt they would go that option. 60fps also seems to be priority as well, knowing they were wiling to sacrifice a.i count in GTPSP from 6 to 4, so there goes another possibility of 4k even happening. Seriously, the franchise is known to push the boundaries in terms of visuals, not resolution. There's just no way 4K GT will be happening, unless they're willing to sacrifice a huge amount of graphic fidelity.

Yoshida himself talked down the possibility of 4K gaming and he knows the console's hardware more than any of us do.

So yea, it took 4 PS3s to run 4K, but that's using GT5's visuals. To expect a single PS4 to run 4K and while attempting to up the textures, lighting, dynamic weather, or whatever else graphically, is just crazy. DriveClub, as good as it looks, is attempting 1080p/30fps. Are we expecting the PS4 to nearly quadruple in power overtime?
 
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