WTF! GT4 is NOT online

[Dave A]

Get it into you rbloody head, we are not missing out, were just getting the offline mode BEFORE the online, if we got it all together we wouldnt get any of it till next year. I personally would rather play the single player game this year, and get the online whne it's ready than have to wait until next year when the online is ready to play any of it.

 

[RyosukeFCDS]

forget the fact they've been working on it for years, and constantly pushing the release date further and further back, now they're just cutting corners, yay, let's have a half arsed product,

forget it. i'm over it, it's not like i'm not going to buy the stuff

 

[PjotrStroganov]

GT1,2 and 3 all did very well without online. KY has always said he's not keen on taking GT online at this stage since the connections arn't fast enough, thats old news too. How the idea got into Ryosuke's head that online was the main attraction is beyond me, sure I was looking forward to it, and I still am. It's just thanks to KY I'll be able to play GT4 instead of next which is when I'll be able to play online.

Some seemingly respectable members have really come out of their shell over te last days and showed that they are really morons, thick as a sack of potatoes and have high blood pressure.

Well, Sony has boasted about the online mode for some time now, and the main reason for the delay of a year, according to Yamauchi, was online mode. Of course it's not the main attraction, but for many gamers it's the main new attraction. Not difficult to imagine that people are somewhat angry.

And BTW, we are we are missing out on something: Money. I doubt we will get both versions for the price of one. It's not that I'm not going to buy both versions,, it's more a principle matter.

 

[Dave A]

Well GT4 is the biggest racing game ever by a large margin so if we have to pay an extra 20 bucks fo the online mid 05 then so be it. And Ryosuke, the whole idea of then releasingthe online when it's ready is to prevent it being a half arsed product. Not too smart are you.

 

[avenger]

I can understand if people are angry about missing online mode, but think about this for a minute.

PD says technical difficulties are what caused it to be cut out of this release. There are sources saying an online release will come out later.

My questions:

1. Would you rather have a great offline game now and a great online game soon, OR have a great offline game with a lame, bug ridden online game now, OR have no game now and wait 6-12 months to get the same great offline game that you could have now, as well as the same great online game you'd have in six or so months anyway. It's not as if they've said "No online ever..."

2. It sounds like many of you have forked out good money for GT4.
Considering that it's basically a demo of GT4, was it worth the money?
If GT4 is that good offline, and the online release promises to be just as good, wouldn't you buy it? You've got six months to save the pennies.

Complain about PD double dipping, ripping you off, whatever floats your boat. The simple truth according to PD is that they don't want to dump us with a crap program, but they don't want to hold off the nearly finished offline mode either. I think it's a wise decision.

Besides, who says the online release will be expensive. It may be simply an addon CD that enables onlnine mode for your current game. Nobody has said that it will be a complete GT4 game itself.

Yeah, you might be upset. Yeah, you might think PD sucks. None of it is going to make 9 months of software tweaking happen by December. Live with it.
If you don't like it, wait until they do release it.
Until then, I'll be enjoying single player mode to my heart's content!

 

[Dave A]

Well put avenger.

 

[Soman]

Nobody is saying GT4 will suck, it is just management and incompetence that after years of gloryfying the NetCode we get such news.

 

[Dave A]

No one at any time gloryfied GT4's net code, KY never praised it, he regularly said it was becoming a problem though.

 

[avenger]

Nobody is saying GT4 will suck, it is just management and incompetence that after years of gloryfying the NetCode we get such news.

Not necessarily... I don't know what you are talking about regarding NetCode, but I doubt setting up software to link up GT4 is going to be easy. Apart from i-Link, there is no real network play for GT3, so this is pretty much a first for PD.

GT4 is going to be fairly complicated as well, considering (if I hear right) things like fuel consumption etc are involved. That's a lot of parameters to be trading across a long connection. If they released it now, what would the latency be like. I've played some laggy network games before, and it is the most frustrating thing there is.

I think it's a bit on the brazen side to cry incompetence. After all, PD is not a netware manufacturer, or an expert online game company.

What they are, however, is one of the best driving simulation game companies in existence. In 2 1/2 months or so, we'll find out. I'm game to say the GT4 won't disappoint.

Considering the sheer amount of programming that goes into games these days, I'm not surprised something might have been delayed. Think about this - how much programming could they fit onto a PS1 CD? GT2 needed 2 CDs!

Now think about GT3 - on a DVD medium, which is many times the size of a CD.
I can only imagine just how much programming and code is going to be on the GT4 disk(s).

Flame me if you must, but I personally think delayed online play is insignificant. We'll get it soon enough, and when we do it will be heaps better.

Now if PD said that they weren't doing online mode at all... that would be different.

 

[GTXLR]

The removal appears to be due to a problem with Net and servers in parts of ASIA and Europe though, no mention of U.S, so did it work there fine?
If it did the problem is not the code, Its the servers and the broadband network.
This is Something PD are not in control of.
And if they are not in any way able to directly change this, How can you be sure that PD will ever release Online, what will they wait for?
unless of course they could possibly be having to scrap what they have got now and write a complete new set of code with a downgraded online element that works with all the faults of Euro/Asia Net problems.

 

[Dev_Zero]

I don't know why PD has problems with the European broadband network though. As far as I know it's better than the US. And if not, it certainly disappoints me, because the network here in Holland is excellent.
Being "part of Europe" doesn't work out for us I guess.

 

[Soman]

Its not the users BroadBand penetration but the servers Sony has set up for European users.

 

[The359]

I've read the whole thread. I am somewhat pacified.

I'm still irritated by their constant excuses, but that's small potatoes.

For those making excuses on TOP of PD's excuses, just go play previous Gran Turismos if they're so airtight.

Oh wait... they're not. That's why you're waiting for GT4 with fingers crossed.

What makes a good sequel is innovation. Innovation includes new ideas and features, not just more of the same. If the inherent core gameplay is not ideal to begin with (people, there are many threads concerning the shortcomings of previous GT's, some that actually contain positive suggestions. Just look at the first 5 pages.), you cannot rest on your laurels creatively and just create new content. If you can't see that, you are too far gone to reason with.

Sorry, I'm just pissed at the abuse of the term "perfectionist."

Who here was waiting for GT4 to be airtight, and who claimed any previous GT was airtight?

 

[GTXLR]

Question:
Will you still enjoy GT4 offline fully if the AI isnt improved massively?
If so what aspect do you think you will enjoy? (describe)

 

[Dave A]

I'll enjoy GT4 offline more than I enjoyed GT3, so yes I'll enjoy it a lot, more than pretty much any other sim out there, however I'll enjoy it even more with online support, provided it's not very laggy and poor quality ect. The fact that GT3 took me a few months to complete leaves me feeling okay about waiting till mid 2005 for the online game sinc I'll still be very much hooked on the single player game.

 

[The359]

Question:
Will you still enjoy GT4 offline fully if the AI isnt improved massively?
If so what aspect do you think you will enjoy? (describe)

Yes, and because of the same reasons I completely enjoyed GT1, GT2, and GT3.

 

[GTXLR]

Yes, and because of the same reasons I completely enjoyed GT1, GT2, and GT3.

I can concur with your sentiments about GT1 and 2 ground breaking games for the time.
GT3 however once I got over the wow factor of the looks, and winning some decent cars, Soon became old real fast in single player mode, still now only at 57%. the only real thrill came from OLR after becoming to bored with the challenge of single player SIM mode.
But if 3 floated your boat then all good for you 359.

 

[Cosmic]

Question:
Will you still enjoy GT4 offline fully if the AI isnt improved massively?
If so what aspect do you think you will enjoy? (describe)

I'll! Why? I did enjoy GT2 with that crapy AI but who cares?
Either have carpy AI then a really good AI which is impossible to win the race.
The easier the better

 

[GTXLR]

I'll! Why? I did enjoy GT2 with that crapy AI but who cares?
Either have carpy AI then a really good AI which is impossible to win the race.
The easier the better

I guess B spec mode will suit you down to the ground.
You wont even have to race and youll be able to accelerate time and beat it quicker.

 

[Cosmic]

I guess B spec mode will suit you down to the ground.
You wont even have to race and youll be able to accelerate time and beat it quicker.

Do you know what?
Buy nfs:hp2 and beat it on hard
And then you can start complaining about the AI

 

[Rapidone]

The way I see GT4, it will have much more longevity than GT3, which makes up for the loss of online play. Even when 100% is reached, there is always going to be the challenge of getting a higher score each race buy using a slower car. Hopefully the highscores for each race will be added to give a GT4 total high score which can be compared with other people in these forums. I can't wait, should be fun.

It's a real shame there will be no online play, I'll just have to satisfy myself with playing 'Netkar' on the PC, until the GT4 online addon is released. Although I doubt I'll be playing anything else than GT4 over the Chistmass holidays.

 

[GTXLR]

Do you know what?
Buy nfs:hp2 and beat it on hard
And then you can start complaining about the AI

Almost completed that Task already, And in general im not really that interested in Arcade racers, with the unrealistic game play including unrealistic AI.
Although GT4 seems to be setting up Arcade type challenges to make up for its deficiencies.

In A sim with tough AI, you can learn through practice and experience how to race harder and faster, until you reach a parallel, at which point you will be able to win.

 

[Cosmic]

Almost completed that Task already, And in general im not really that interested in Arcade racers, with the unrealistic game play including unrealistic AI.

In A sim with tough AI, you can learn through practice and experience how to race harder and faster, until you reach a parallel, at which point you will be able to win.

You were complaining about the AI and I gave a opinion what you should do if didn't liked GT4's AI

 

[GTXLR]

You were complaining about the AI and I gave a opinion what you should do if didn't liked GT4's AI

Yes the AI was easy, were you really happy about that?
Would you be happy if the AI was still easy?
Whats the point of a realistic sim if you dont have to work hard to beat your opponents?

The point is there are dozens of Arcade racers, good bd and ugly.
GT4 is meant to be the definative PS2 sim, however having superb physics, tuning and choice of cars, is all rather pointless in a sim if you have no challenge from your opponents, seeming as Online is dropped (for now) and if the AI isnt any good you will be able to still drive arcade style and still win.

 

[Cosmic]

Yes the AI was easy, were you really happy about that?
Would you be happy if the AI was still easy?
Whats the point of a realistic sim if you dont have to work hard to beat your opponents?

That's why you get points...less hp more points , more hp less points.

 

[GTXLR]

That's why you get points...less hp more points , more hp less points.

BYE BYE Sim,
Hello another Arcade racer.
See the addition i made to my previous post.

 

[Dave A]

Doesn't replace good AI though, I'm with GTXLR on this, good AI is a good thing, I hope it's good in GT4, if not I'll enjoy the game as I have previouse GT's but better AI would be a good thing.

 

[SaintKamus]

I'll! Why? I did enjoy GT2 with that crapy AI but who cares?
Either have carpy AI then a really good AI which is impossible to win the race.
The easier the better

that's why there's level of dificulty even for newbies like you ^_^.
if this was AI simulation we'd have a VERY hard time wining most of the time. and that would be just FINE with me, as long as it doesn't stop you from finishing the game, but really, it's the other way around, the more challenging, the most fun, and the better you get.
as long as those challenges come from genuine AI and not cheating like in evry other game, where their cars would just be faster all around.
Forza promises to have REAL AI, that's suposedly bound to the same laws of physics the player is.. so that means the AI driver has to be just as good as you.. this is the way to go, not just following a perfect line 100% of the time, and not by making their cars faster and ignore the laws physics in the game. hopefully GT4 went this route... but it looks to me that instead of improving the MUCH needed AI (specially now that they fukced us over with no onilne play).
so lets get this straight:
no online play means no good oponents, so unless they have genuine AI (more like AI for the first time in their games) the game will get boring fast... there's no fun in beating 100% predictable oponents, and this has always been the case in the GT series. if they didn't get AI right, all they'll have in the end is an extremley nice looking game with great playability but no fun to go with it.

 

[Cosmic]

BYE BYE Sim,
Hello another Arcade racer.
See the addition i made to my previous post.

Hey hey! To clear it up ...
I like good/better AI's but PD can't make good AI.
GT2 : easy as hell - GT3 : Still easy.
I mean , what do you except from GT4? 10x better AI then before?
I don't , the AI will be the same. We can't help it.
Btw...I like sim , that's why I sold my "shox" from EA beacuse of the unrealistic AI. I don't like arcade games so much just to tell you , I prefer sim instead.

 

[PjotrStroganov]

I can live with the online mode being delayed, but I certainly hope the crappy AI, reward system, restriction system to enter a race, will be improved.