1.04 update - Physics changes - Your impressions?
- Thread starter SillyBillyP
- 389 comments
- 40,095 views
- 541
- Santa Catarina
- rafaelfagundes
Yeah, cars feels way better with those settings, more life like.Try the same car in arcade raceRun a front bias brake balance like a real car would, say 9/3.
- 589
- United States
Lads and Gals,
Please remember to keep in mind the possibility of placebo with these updates. With every new update, people rush into the game to see how it runs and post changes of things they have noticed, while others don't see those changes in effect. I, for one, am one of these people. It would be nice if PD released a detailed changelog with every release, but please keep in mind the possibility of noticing things that you only think are different, but actually aren't, before you jump the gun and start arguments with other members. I've seen this happen too many times.
Thank You
Please remember to keep in mind the possibility of placebo with these updates. With every new update, people rush into the game to see how it runs and post changes of things they have noticed, while others don't see those changes in effect. I, for one, am one of these people. It would be nice if PD released a detailed changelog with every release, but please keep in mind the possibility of noticing things that you only think are different, but actually aren't, before you jump the gun and start arguments with other members. I've seen this happen too many times.
Thank You
- 546
- Northeast :(
- z06fun
That is would be true for a wheel spinning in the air, but normally they are in contact with the ground
Normally the torque it takes to lock a wheel is almost completely based on the weight of the car and the grip of the given tire at that moment (for a car with no downforce). A spinning wheel has a very small amount of energy compared to the car itself. Bottom line is, braking creates opposite force along the outer edge of the tire. It takes a certain force along the outter edge of the tire to cause it to have large slip (lock up), this force needed really has nothing to do with how fast the tire is spinning, but rather is based on the weight on the tire and its grip (coefficent of friction).
- 394
- NL
- Morphisorius
@VBR Here's an idea actually. Since you used the KTM and say it's a lot faster, maybe the current KTM seasonal TT should see some faster times as well?
I only just got around to doing it so I have no reference point from before the patch, but my time fit in well with my expectancy, after reviewing the respective thread here on GTP.
I only just got around to doing it so I have no reference point from before the patch, but my time fit in well with my expectancy, after reviewing the respective thread here on GTP.
- 2,643
- Finland
- OdeFinn
@Rafael F, you don't get point of my message.
ABS is not for stopping, its for steering during braking, and "casusal" driver get benefits also on stopping if he/she doesn't know what makes car stop.
Don't want any more updates from PD what are made just to please those "casusal" drivers.
Edit: casual.. Android helps a lot lol..
ABS is not for stopping, its for steering during braking, and "casusal" driver get benefits also on stopping if he/she doesn't know what makes car stop.
Don't want any more updates from PD what are made just to please those "casusal" drivers.
Edit: casual.. Android helps a lot lol..
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I'm on G25. Braking model is definitely changed. I no longer have to baby the brake without ABS. I like it a whole lot more than 1.03. What's more I can nicely steer the car with brake during drifting which was almost impossible in previous version (car just understeered). It's closer to PC sims where you don't need the ABS to modulate the braking. Tyre model has been changed as well. For me drifting stock M4 and C7 was almost masochistic. Now it's a lot nicer, calmer, stable - even on SH. I agree it's closer to GT5 but not quite the same. Also MR cars are more fun to drive now because there is less tank slappers. NSX was a b* to drive.
I bought GT6 two weeks ago and for me physics model for driving was interesting, but not for drifting. Too many tank slappers, very inconsistent feeling, brakes locking all the freaking time. For these reasons I had no pleasure from playing sixth GT. Now it's changed thanks to the 1.04.
I bought GT6 two weeks ago and for me physics model for driving was interesting, but not for drifting. Too many tank slappers, very inconsistent feeling, brakes locking all the freaking time. For these reasons I had no pleasure from playing sixth GT. Now it's changed thanks to the 1.04.
ItsHim
Premium
- 1,315
- Bavaria/Germany
Claiming not being able to lock up wheels at speeds around 160 km/h is bollocks. That or the brakes are shot. I had the pleasure twice in the last couple of years to do emergency braking from around 180 km/h to about 90 (Autobahn and a bleeding lorry pulled out) and both times the brake assist kicked in (meaning the brakes went to full lock automagically) and both time ABS kicked in instantly. That's what saved my live both times.
Anyone who claims he's better at braking without assists IRL (brake assistant, brake force distribution, ABS) is either Walter Röhrl or a delusional hooligan that'll sooner or later gets himself killed.
Racing ABS and TCS are specifically tailored to the needs of Motorsport. They are not perfectly modelled in GT6 though. Anyone who saw last year's 24 hours of the Nürburgring should know what these systems are capable of achieving in the rain.
On a different note: 1.04 way better than 1.03 yet still a bit more tame than 1.02. Overall i love it (again).
Anyone who claims he's better at braking without assists IRL (brake assistant, brake force distribution, ABS) is either Walter Röhrl or a delusional hooligan that'll sooner or later gets himself killed.
Racing ABS and TCS are specifically tailored to the needs of Motorsport. They are not perfectly modelled in GT6 though. Anyone who saw last year's 24 hours of the Nürburgring should know what these systems are capable of achieving in the rain.
On a different note: 1.04 way better than 1.03 yet still a bit more tame than 1.02. Overall i love it (again).
From my first trackday in an RWD car, heavy rain, raggedy driving and a spin at 120kph.
Instructor: What is wrong? Is the ABS off?
Me: Yeah, I pulled the fuse.
I: Pull in, put it back on.
*fuse is replaced*
I: Now slam on the brakes as hard as you can on the next straight, go.
M: *kicks the pedal in*
I: Think you can stop better or faster with ABS off? Exactly.
In real life I don't race/track with ABS off for a couple of reasons:
1. I do not think I have enough pedal feel with the brake servo pump working and using a stock seat belt which always lets your body shift a bit.
2. I am poor and don't want to flat spot my tires.
3. I am poor and prefer my only car as un-crunched as possible.
I did race a car without ABS before and I also raced an ABS car before which simply did NOT work with ABS off, the brake force balancing being done 100% by ECU. In GT6 I tend to run ABS1 on cars that do have ABS in real life, and ABS off on those that do not. I am now pondering using TC on some cars like modern GT race cars but I stay off stability control and the dreaded SRF.
- 28,471
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
The other side of the coin is, some people have run dozens upon dozens of laps in a single car on a single track looking for every edge they can find and have a firmly established limit. I can tell you within a couple of tenths my lap time limits on a dozen cars on Mount Panorama, Tsukuba, and Brands Hatch because that's where I test and tune. You don't dozens of laps and not reach your limit. So if I download 1.04 and notice a significant change in that limit, one way or the other, it's safe to say something has changed. I know there are some that do this with the full Nurb.
Yes, a lot of what is reported is hyperbole and bogus. But not all of it:tup:👍
- 315
- Washington
- ace004
I know that's why i prefaced with "there are people out there that can." And I know you are part of that group, you have been in my tuning lobby before a few times, and I have raced against you. But on average most people can't and when you compare lap times with small changes and without accurate telemetry it's always in the back of my head as to why exactly I picked up that extra tenth or so.
dsgerbc
Premium
- 2,577
- dsgerbc
Means nothing w/o knowing which car it was. Modern cars w/o proportioning valve (with EBD working instead of it) will tend to lose EBD function with ABS fuse pulled. Which makes rear tires lock-up quick and sends the car into a spin. Means squat about how the car would behave with ABS off but EBD on.
- 7,755
- Yorkshire
- ScapeGoat4U
- WhippingBoy
My GT6 version 1.03 time was a 1'09.378, & my version 1.04 time is now a 1'08.611. Exact same settings used; stock, Sports Hard, all aids off except ABS 1. By the way my Nurburgring 24 Hour times are as follows; v 1.03 was a 9'48.438, & v 1.04 is now a 9.43.120. The time difference on the KTM Seasonal is 0.767, & the on The Ring 24 Hour it's 5.318.
Interestingly, 0.767 x 8 = 6.136, & 5.318 ÷ by 8 = 0.664. It's just a rough calculation, but not miles off if you think about it. Either way, the car is definitely a little faster.
Cue the naysayers!
- 858
- United Kingdom
- 1,689
- NY
- SavageEvil
Aren't ABS and EBD nearly synonymous on modern cars these days as they both help panicked brake smashers and keep the car from spinning by distributing braking force among the wheels to keep the car relatively straight.
I might be wrong about this, but I was certain that they are pretty much a package since they offer such great control.
dsgerbc
Premium
- 2,577
- dsgerbc
Of course not. EBD is just there to shift brake pressure based on Gs. Older cars w/o ABS also had devices to do that.
- 461
- Dornsife, PA
- Camaro69427
Has the tire glitch been fixed?
- 1,689
- NY
- SavageEvil
Are you sure? EBD is a sub system of ABS so you cannot have a car with EBD without ABS as EBD reads the speed of wheels and if it detects locking at one end of the car it will reduce brake force to prevent the wheel from slipping. EBD works by reducing or increasing brake power to each wheel so as to prevent spins when braking in a straight line. Think straight line braking from 60 mph, weight shifts to the front the ABS kicks in to keep the front brakes from locking but the rear has less weight on the wheels and will lock; EBD takes care of that to prevent this from happening. EBD has a YAW sensor that will prevent lock up in different situations like a swerve while braking as the weight will go from front wheels to rear wheels depending on the direction of the swerve the weight shifts to the opposite wheel EBD will apply more on the loaded wheel and less on the unloaded wheel based on their speed in relation to the car speed and speed of the wheels.
nasanu
(Banned)
- 1,429
- Australia
- nasanu
- nasanu
That is would be true for a wheel spinning in the air, but normally they are in contact with the ground
Bottom line is, braking creates opposite force along the outer edge of the tire. It takes a certain force along the outter edge of the tire to cause it to have large slip (lock up), this force needed really has nothing to do with how fast the tire is spinning, but rather is based on the weight on the tire and its grip (coefficent of friction).
If that were true then all cars if they were capable of locking the wheel would lock at all speeds. Unless you think that weight and grip change with speed (seriously what were you thinking)?
It is very clear that most cars won't lock at high speeds, there is enough first hand evidence of that in this thread. The only difference speed produces when braking is the angular momentum. And as I said (but you chose to ignore), friction would be the major player but the mass of the wheel does play a part. That part is stopping the wheels locking at higher speeds.
- 2,006
- Port Washington
- GTP_skeeter23
All I know is that I can now drive my IROC Concept "Z28 replica" of my real one, like I can irl. Feels almost just like it. Suddenly a car I can massively powerslide at will and almost drift lol.
If it stays like this for at least this car I'm a happy camper.
If it stays like this for at least this car I'm a happy camper.
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- 1,210
- Sydney
I went over a friends place that still has 1.01 and here are my thoughts.
The update rate or car response time to stimuli of 1.01 is much faster than 1.04. What I mean is the cars seem to respond to inputs, road angle, grip, direction etc at a faster rate.
I played around with some lightweight stiff cars and the difference is obvious.
For example the Susuki GSX-R 4. In 1.01 the car very rapidly responds to stimulus where as in 1.04 its more lazy and mellowed out. It was difficult to flip the car just by turning a corner in 1.01 with racing soft as it would jitter and loose traction before the flip happened, but in 1.04 it is very easy to do so.
The update rate or car response time to stimuli of 1.01 is much faster than 1.04. What I mean is the cars seem to respond to inputs, road angle, grip, direction etc at a faster rate.
I played around with some lightweight stiff cars and the difference is obvious.
For example the Susuki GSX-R 4. In 1.01 the car very rapidly responds to stimulus where as in 1.04 its more lazy and mellowed out. It was difficult to flip the car just by turning a corner in 1.01 with racing soft as it would jitter and loose traction before the flip happened, but in 1.04 it is very easy to do so.
- 243
- France
- SillyBillyP
